LCA TEJAS MK1 & MK1A: News and Discussion

[Corvus Splendens]

Some one should answer this !

Please don't compare the PhantomStrike to Uttam. Raytheon made a cheap, air cooled, low power, lightweight radar to allow the FA-50 to sling medium range A2A missiles. It's an export only product that Americans themselves do not use a derivative nor a development of. Was originally developed for UAVs. Uttam is specwise more complex and far superior.

 

[Satish Sharma]

I was also saying that the size of nose of fa50.is very less so couldn't it be like the TR modules it will be using be smaller in size.
the esr has made a esr 500a radar with 500trms.
Which look practical looking the size of nose of fa50.
But when we hear number of 900trms of raytheons fantom strike it look kind of piculiar also it is just 70kg. Looks like even with GaN it wouldn't surpass uttam of Tejas mk1A it could be better than baseline uttam which was initially said to be used as it has some 750trms View attachment 239438

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Please don't compare the PhantomStrike to Uttam. Raytheon made a cheap, air cooled, low power, lightweight radar to allow the FA-50 to sling medium range A2A missiles. It's an export only product that Americans themselves do not use a derivative nor a development of. Was originally developed for UAVs. Uttam is specwise more complex and far superior.

Yeah it's a cheap knock off initially I thought it could be great radar as it was made by raytheon but looking at it's nose size and it's weight it is not match for a uttam of mk1A. Probably they are compensating the performance with GaN. It's very small aircraft even smaller than Tejas in length probably it couldn't accomodate liquid cooling to squize out all performance.. the ta50 uses elm 2032 ta50 further advanced for multirole into fa50 with this radar.. we can say it will be better than elm2032...(any idea about its performance)
Talking about its weight which is just 70kg ,whereas some years ago I read somewhere the 736 trms baseline uttam weights 120kg ,, it also mentioned it was 40kg heavier compared to now I don't wheather they were talking about elm 2032 or 2052...
968trms Uttam will be better..
Maybe Tejas mk2s radar could be used in 97 Tejas orders.. GaN based,
mk2 has smaller nose cone than mk1a.

Although I m kind of have jealous with fa50 it is just getting better and better although in radar & missiles. And A2G capabilities it wouldn't surpass Tejas , but it kind of threatens Tejas potential sells.
Now they have added a CFTs to it fa50 has 2655litres fuel now CFTs have additional 1135litres this total is 3145kg ,550kg more than Tejas's 3000litres or 2600kg...
Hope out babus think of improving Tejas more
better they add a bigger spine CFT.

 

[NutCracker]

Its funny how you guys are talking about "WEZ jamming" (not my words), without discussing how these aircrafts can merge at such proximity. (also min WEZ being just 300m for IR missiles like R73 and ASRAAM)
Very shallow discussion offered. Cant be bothered with it anymore.

 

[Satish Sharma]

Its funny how you guys are talking about "WEZ jamming" (not my words), without discussing how these aircrafts can merge at such proximity. (also min WEZ being just 300m for IR missiles like R73 and ASRAAM)
Very shallow discussion offered. Cant be bothered with it anymore.

Nutcracker is always fighting with anybody,,why don't u take a day off

 

[Bleh]

Its funny how you guys are talking about "WEZ jamming" (not my words), without discussing how these aircrafts can merge at such proximity. (also min WEZ being just 300m for IR missiles like R73 and ASRAAM)
Very shallow discussion offered. Cant be bothered with it anymore.

Dude... If they don't merge them no issues. But if indeed someone gets jumped, or can't pull back in a scenario, or gets flanked/surrounded etc. then it might happen.

Chances of merge is quite low, but not zero. In such case having the 100kg gun & ammo is better than not. That's their whole point.

 

[Ugra Bhairav]

For Kaveri Thread :

Those who think TOT from foreign vendors are "Holy Grain".

France Really Giving India "All" Its Jet Engine Tech? Sounds Too Good to be True?

The story is scarcely believable. Jawed Ashraf, the Indian ambassador to France, offered insight in January into ongoing

frontierindia.com

 

[Ugra Bhairav]

For Kaveri Thread :

France Really Giving India "All" Its Jet Engine Tech? Sounds Too Good to be True?

The story is scarcely believable. Jawed Ashraf, the Indian ambassador to France, offered insight in January into ongoing

frontierindia.com

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[Azaad]

All well and true. But naval aviation is still a mess. Rafale M even if a deal signed this year will still take 3-4 years to deliver. And again they will mostly be carrier based. They will mostly use exocet for naval missions which is equivalent to harpoons for jaguars.

Naval aviation has always been problematic in India . Even when we were flying the Hawker Sea Hawks & Alizes which were short legged & later the Sea Harriers which were maintenance intensive primarily because they weren't adapted to warm water conditions & the VTOL mechanism.

Why can't the Rafales like the MKIs & Jaguar IMs we have be modified to use NASM - SR , MR & the to be developed XR ?

Mig29 K are struggling with availablity rates and spares problems we wouldn't need rafale M if they were satisfactory.

Only a few mki can carry brahmos which is too costly a solution against smaller enemy ships.

MKIs don't merely carry the Brahmos exclusively. They're also come equipped with Kh-59MK , Kh-35K & the Kh-31A much before a few squadrons were modified to carry the Brahmos.

These Jags are aesa equipped which makes them technically advanced than both mig29k and mki when it comes to ground terrain mapping and being jamproof .

Are Jaguar IMs equipped with AESA radars ?
Don't get me wrong. I'm not challenging your PoV but back in the day , the only FA THEN over which the IAF had full autonomy to tinker around with , were the Jaguars , later the MiG-21 & now the MKI & Tejas. Both the MiG-23 & MiG-21 didn't age well & were found to be unfit to upgrade. We couldn't touch the MiG-29 & Mirages back then.

I once read an article which documented how the DARIN program came into existence way back in the early 1980s where the IAF fast realised that the Jaguars as they'd received them was a fairly limited FA but with enough scope to show success though limited if they were adapted to IAF tactics which required modifications - from the limited to the extensive.

Unarguably these lessons were learnt while experimenting with the Gnats & other such FAs . Lessons learnt during the extensive modifications on the Jaguars helped us do the same to the MKIs replacing Russian origin components & sub assemblies & now with the Super Sukhoi program. There were other spin offs too which contributed to our upgradation programs in the MiG-29 & now the MiG-29K .

There are only 12 for naval role but with potent harpoon they can sink entire Pakistan Navy with repeated strikes that too from standoff distance ( harpoon range is 220 km + for aur launched varients) thus leaving other platforms to deal with Chinese navy.

Only after we've sanitized the air space above which need not be the case when we deploy the MKIs for anti shipping strikes.

Anyway these Jags will stay with us till 2030 at the very least. MWF was supposed to replace them but now with 100 more mk1a coming they might start replacing few jaguar squadrons but these marine jaguars won't be retired unti lca finds it's own anti ship missile .

DARIN III modified Jaguars estimated to be around 60 nos will be with the IAF till 2035 , possibly even later . The rest will be phased out begining by 2027-28 depending on how fast we churn out the Mk-1a & later the Mk-2.

Nasm - MR might be just the anti ship missile to replace harpoon . And now when lca fleet is expanding to 220 jets it's about time they get a dedicated anti ship missile too.

They will. Eventually. As usual we move at our own pace.

 

[Tejbrahmastra]

 

[SilentlAssassin265]

Naval aviation has always been problematic in India . Even when we were flying the Hawker Sea Hawks & Alizes which were short legged & later the Sea Harriers which were maintenance intensive primarily because they weren't adapted to warm water conditions & the VTOL mechanism.

Why can't the Rafales like the MKIs & Jaguar IMs we have be modified to use NASM - SR , MR & the to be developed XR ?





MKIs don't merely carry the Brahmos exclusively. They're also come equipped with Kh-59MK , Kh-35K & the Kh-31A much before a few squadrons were modified to carry the Brahmos.



Are Jaguar IMs equipped with AESA radars ?
Don't get me wrong. I'm not challenging your PoV but back in the day , the only FA THEN over which the IAF had full autonomy to tinker around with , were the Jaguars , later the MiG-21 & now the MKI & Tejas. Both the MiG-23 & MiG-21 didn't age well & were found to be unfit to upgrade. We couldn't touch the MiG-29 & Mirages back then.

I once read an article which documented how the DARIN program came into existence way back in the early 1980s where the IAF fast realised that the Jaguars as they'd received them was a fairly limited FA but with enough scope to show success though limited if they were adapted to IAF tactics which required modifications - from the limited to the extensive.

Unarguably these lessons were learnt while experimenting with the Gnats & other such FAs . Lessons learnt during the extensive modifications on the Jaguars helped us do the same to the MKIs replacing Russian origin components & sub assemblies & now with the Super Sukhoi program. There were other spin offs too which contributed to our upgradation programs in the MiG-29 & now the MiG-29K .



Only after we've sanitized the air space above which need not be the case when we deploy the MKIs for anti shipping strikes.



DARIN III modified Jaguars estimated to be around 60 nos will be with the IAF till 2035 , possibly even later . The rest will be phased out begining by 2027-28 depending on how fast we churn out the Mk-1a & later the Mk-2.



They will. Eventually. As usual we move at our own pace.

If Jaguar can fit naval aviation role then why not Tejas?
We have already landed them on our AC, something Rafael never did

 

[Satish Sharma]

Very great article to read regarding uttam aesa

Thoughts About the New Uttam AESA RADAR- MK1A (and some other stuff)

Uttam AESA radar upgraded 992 TRM modules, range, RCS, Mk1A

mark20x.blogspot.com

 

[patriots]

The first Tejas mk1a won't have all 43 improvement s....
I have not seen a single pic of twin luncher for asraam

 

[Satish Sharma]

The first Tejas mk1a won't have all 43 improvement s....
I have not seen a single pic of twin luncher for asraam

Who told you that it won't have all improvement? Source ?

Wind Tunnel LCA-Tejas seen featuring a Dual-Rack Pylon for the first time. – Indian Defence Research Wing

idrw.org

The dual pylon wind tunnel testing began some months ago so yeah it will take some time

 

[patriots]

Who told you that it won't have all improvement? Source ?

Wind Tunnel LCA-Tejas seen featuring a Dual-Rack Pylon for the first time. – Indian Defence Research Wing

idrw.org

The dual pylon wind tunnel testing began some months ago so yeah it will take some time

Source - many subsystem s are under testing, many are in tender phase
Refer - to ananth krisnan 's tweet
Refer to tenders

 

[MirageBlue]

The first Tejas mk1a won't have all 43 improvement s....
I have not seen a single pic of twin luncher for asraam

The dual rack pylon is under wind tunnel testing and will eventually be qualified for the Tejas Mk1A. Which will mean that ALL Tejas Mk1A (and Mk1s too most likely) will be capable of carrying the dual rack pylon for the ASRAAM.

 

[Ugra Bhairav]

For Kaveri Thread :

 

[standard snowball]

Very great article to read regarding uttam aesa

Thoughts About the New Uttam AESA RADAR- MK1A (and some other stuff)

Uttam AESA radar upgraded 992 TRM modules, range, RCS, Mk1A

mark20x.blogspot.com

View attachment 239662

Netra 475 km range, is news to me, it always bugged me how can netra's range be so less (250KM as some claimed) when it's AAAU was infact bigger than Eriye (not Erieye ER).

Thankyou for this post

 

[Aniruddha Mulay]

Netra 475 km range, is news to me, it always bugged me how can netra's range be so less (250KM as some claimed) when it's AAAU was infact bigger than Eriye (not Erieye ER).

Thankyou for this post

DRDO's LSTAR, ground based version of the Netra Mk1 AEW&C

 

[Satish Sharma]

Netra 475 km range, is news to me, it always bugged me how can netra's range be so less (250KM as some claimed) when it's AAAU was infact bigger than Eriye (not Erieye ER).

Thankyou for this post

First of all take this out from mind that published figures are real.. secondly range is never FIX. it depends on rcs. More the rcs longer the range.

More the size of object, longer the distance you're eyes can see it

Our radar tech is quite capable we have reached a level we can just upscale most of our radars...
And now we are using GaN on upcoming netra which has 3 radars in 2 on upper side of body and 1 in nose..
The current netra can easily detected Pakistani f16 500-600km if they are carrying weapons & drop tank...
Just look at this a uttam aesa can detect clean Tejas from 151km.. which is said to have least rcs around 0.5m2 (still Don't trust this figures)
The aircraft which has lowest rcs of pak is f16 or jf17..
Both can be easily detected by netra from significant distance...
Even su30 can detect anything of fighter size target at 400km and can track it upto 250km still this number could be under rated just to publish..

Iaf has said it is very happy with netra we should try it to export now it will be better than saab's as we starts using GaN. Based..
We should leverage our influence which is definetely more than swedens countries like indonesia are in need of awacs but out suit buit babus will Never think abt it..

 

[Satish Sharma]

Kyan din a gye bc all because of the delay of mk2.
If it would have gotten funding in 2009 it would have been ready today but it took them 4-5 years to release funds..