LCA TEJAS MK1 & MK1A: News and Discussion

Narasimh

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1st batch of 20 x Tejas was ordered Mar 2006, delivery to be competed before 2012.
2nd batch of 20 x Tejas was ordered Dec 2010, delivery to be completed before 2016.
3rd batch of 83 x Tejas was ordered Feb 2021, delivery to be completed before 2029.

HAL were 7+ years late delivering 1st batch.
HAL are currently 5+ years late delivering 2nd batch.

HAL's production of 2 Tejas a year over the 2010-2019 decade hardly inspires confidence in their abilities as a fighter aircraft manufacturer.

Who got sacked as the 1st batch fell further and further behind? Who got sacked as the 2nd batch fell further and further behind? Has HAL been shaken up to transform it into a dynamic organisation able to adhere to schedules in the future? If it has not been transformed, would it not be sensible to approach other companies to set up production of MWF/AMCA?
HAL like any other PSU has large land area with huge campuses with employee quarters, hospitals, school etc. They don't utilize their assets well and dont cut expenditure on non-essential stuff, rather they cant, as it's all unionized.
I am not even talking of the work culture and competence but at least they should be trying to cut their revenue exp and save for capital exp including for R&D. If India is to have any hope of exporting fighters, HAL has to transform.
 

Spitfire9

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HAL like any other PSU has large land area with huge campuses with employee quarters, hospitals, school etc. They don't utilize their assets well and dont cut expenditure on non-essential stuff, rather they cant, as it's all unionized.
I am not even talking of the work culture and competence but at least they should be trying to cut their revenue exp and save for capital exp including for R&D. If India is to have any hope of exporting fighters, HAL has to transform.
Change in industrial plants owned by governments tends to lag behind the more competitive private sector. I suggest that India should build up an alternative production entity. It should be more efficient and responsive than a PSU. With the number of fighter aircraft India intends to manufacture up to 2040 (say 80 LCA, 200 MWF, 60 TEDBF, ? 100 ORCA, 120 AMCA) + any exports thereof, another manufacturer would be a definite advantage.
 

Lonewolf

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Change in industrial plants owned by governments tends to lag behind the more competitive private sector. I suggest that India should build up an alternative production entity. It should be more efficient and responsive than a PSU. With the number of fighter aircraft India intends to manufacture up to 2040 (say 80 LCA, 200 MWF, 60 TEDBF, ? 100 ORCA, 120 AMCA) + any exports thereof, another manufacturer would be a definite advantage.
Amca is supposed to be a jv with hal being minority partner , well priblem is multi strata one , from small vendor to hal , it was theur first time ever , also some company involved in initial days were closed down .

Air force changed requirements , sometimes hal fucked up , sometimes vendor , lot of chaos.

But ut is being cleared now , mk 1a would.mark new era.in production for us , we are keeping it realistic this time , learned harder way but at least we know how to do it .

Mk 2 , is a program not just being a advanced version but a much sorted out approach .

Tedbf is away , maybe hal will be corporatized by then , amca is jv , things are less riskier as of now
 

Bleh

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I find that a bit distasteful even when I myself believe he was at fault to take the bait (CC instructions jammed or not is not confirmed). But agree with ur point that burn to get to chase with high machs and then jettison the damn thing to have cleaner fighter.
I meant "you'll have to enter a dogfight with your tanks still attached & half-filled with fuel"..
 

Ghost hale

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I meant "you'll have to enter a dogfight with your tanks still attached & half-filled with fuel"..
I got that and agree with it as mentioned. Any source of this info that he had half filled fuel tanks?
And just to add, I know clean frame is most preferable for dog fight but it doesn't seems to be the rule that before entering dog fights, jets jettison their DTs. Haven't heard that anywhere.
 

Bleh

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The HD image was uploaded..
IMG_20210415_220718.jpg


...it doesn't seems to be the rule that before entering dog fights, jets jettison their DTs. Haven't heard that anywhere.
It is. You jettisson everything before entering dogfight. You even get rid of any BVRs, oe else you'll end up with several hundred kilos of draggy payload.

Actually it's an imperative requirement that the aircraft has to pass.. Dropping everything otger than CCMs.
IMG_20210415_222156.jpg
 

Rajaraja Chola

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1st batch of 20 x Tejas was ordered Mar 2006, delivery to be competed before 2012.
2nd batch of 20 x Tejas was ordered Dec 2010, delivery to be completed before 2016.
3rd batch of 83 x Tejas was ordered Feb 2021, delivery to be completed before 2029.

HAL were 7+ years late delivering 1st batch.
HAL are currently 5+ years late delivering 2nd batch.

HAL's production of 2 Tejas a year over the 2010-2019 decade hardly inspires confidence in their abilities as a fighter aircraft manufacturer.

Who got sacked as the 1st batch fell further and further behind? Who got sacked as the 2nd batch fell further and further behind? Has HAL been shaken up to transform it into a dynamic organisation able to adhere to schedules in the future? If it has not been transformed, would it not be sensible to approach other companies to set up production of MWF/AMCA?
Are you for real? Or just an munch sitting in IT with no idea of industrial production. Will you manufacture an product without the approval of the customer. In this case IAF. Pray tell me if you are so intellectual, how the hell will HAL manufacture the aircraft in 2009, when the ADA even hasn't finished dev and testing and IAF hasn't approved the product.

Will you manufacture the unapproved product and expect the IAF to accept it? Gosh.
 

Ghost hale

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The HD image was uploaded.. View attachment 85470



It is. You jettisson everything before entering dogfight. You even get rid of any BVRs, oe else you'll end up with several hundred kilos of draggy payload.

Actually it's an imperative requirement that the aircraft has to pass.. Dropping everything otger than CCMs. View attachment 85469
What u are telling i can see that strategy employed by US in Vietnam war. Tried searching for pattern in this strategy but can't find one. So, basically its 2 CCM then gun.
Seems bit out there but can't find occurrences so can't argue on this.
 

Narasimh

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Change in industrial plants owned by governments tends to lag behind the more competitive private sector. I suggest that India should build up an alternative production entity. It should be more efficient and responsive than a PSU. With the number of fighter aircraft India intends to manufacture up to 2040 (say 80 LCA, 200 MWF, 60 TEDBF, ? 100 ORCA, 120 AMCA) + any exports thereof, another manufacturer would be a definite advantage.
Till now not even the strategic partnership model has taken shape. Policy framing to involve private entity is not easy with our bureaucracy. So fully off loading to private industry will be huge problem. Once private company gets the order, First, the opposition will start shouting and claim corruption on whoever is selected to manufacture. Rival private entities will also start their own schemes to derail. Then HAL itself with its union workers might start agitating. Govt has to have the will and vision to frame a proper policy. I think I will believe that Tejas can be manufactured by private entity only when the c295 manufacturing is started by tata.
 

Bleh

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What u are telling i can see that strategy employed by US in Vietnam war. Tried searching for pattern in this strategy but can't find one. So, basically its 2 CCM then gun.
Seems bit out there but can't find occurrences so can't argue on this.
It's pretty much basic now.. Any extra, unnecessary payload will be suicidal in WVR. That's why only 2-4 CCMs are usually carried.
 

WahmanRespector

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The HD image was uploaded.. View attachment 85470



It is. You jettisson everything before entering dogfight. You even get rid of any BVRs, oe else you'll end up with several hundred kilos of draggy payload.

Actually it's an imperative requirement that the aircraft has to pass.. Dropping everything otger than CCMs. View attachment 85469
I hope the interior also gets good details with all the buttons and screens....that is more challenging in my opinion
 

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