LCA TEJAS MK1 & MK1A: News and Discussion

[Bleh]

Plus Bradley performed superb due to the very reason as shown in that film.

Massive misconception.

The guy who was shown as hero in the film was actually a nutjob, who wrote his own book glorifying himself. You can tell...
Here's an example, remember the part where he wanted to check if Bradleys could stop RPGs?.. It can't. It's not supposed to. Everybody knew it and that's why Army wasn't too interested in such pointless trial & unsurprisingly it didn't pass. He didn't uncover shit.

Another... remember the part where they filled the fuel tanks with water (& he "caught them red-handed")?.. Yeah, no. The test was supposed to check if the aluminium gives off toxic fumes on being penetrated by HEAT jet or molten FSAPDS & if it would kill the passengers. In that case you don't want burning fuel to pollute your test results. He insisted on full fuel tanks so they used water!

Hell even the whole idea of Bradley changing form from APC to IFV is not true!.. It started as an IFV & day try to make it a regular scout vehicle out of it which was not practical. That's it.

The Bradley was just a much maligned project which faced certain problems like Arjun did. But when fieldednit performed well, because it was a well developed & had superior tech. It's better in every way we compared to BMPs.

 

[Maharaj samudragupt]

Massive misconception.

The guy who was shown as hero in the film was actually a nutjob, who wrote his own book glorifying himself. You can tell...
Here's an example, remember the part where he wanted to check if Bradleys could stop RPGs?.. It can't. It's not supposed to. Everybody knew it and that's why Army wasn't too interested in such pointless trial & unsurprisingly it didn't pass. He didn't uncover shit.

Another... remember the part where they filled the fuel tanks with water (& he "caught them red-handed")?.. Yeah, no. The test was supposed to check if the aluminium gives off toxic fumes on being penetrated by HEAT jet or molten FSAPDS & if it would kill the passengers. In that case you don't want burning fuel to pollute your test results. He insisted on full fuel tanks so they used water!

Hell even the whole idea of Bradley changing form from APC to IFV is not true!.. It started as an IFV & day try to make it a regular scout vehicle out of it which was not practical. That's it.

The Bradley was just a much maligned project which faced certain problems like Arjun did. But when fieldednit performed well, because it was a well developed & had superior tech. It's better in every way we compared to BMPs.

Oh bmp is nowhere near Bradley .

 

[Tactical Doge]

Identify the weaponary...

View attachment 78184

Bro
These are rendered beautifully
The reflections are on point

Although I'm a noob and much unaware of what going into these renderings

Ever considered doing "surface imperfections"....that shit dials the realistic look to a hundred percent

 

[Bleh]

Ever considered doing "surface imperfections"....that shit dials the realistic look to a hundred percent

That's @Kuntal's decision. Plus, look at photos of new Seroes Production jets rolling out of Bangalore... What imperfections?

 

[fire starter]

Sp 17.

 

[Chandragupt Maurya]

How many FOC Tejas has been delivered so far ?

 

[flanker99]

A good interview tho lot of idle talk but everything u need to know about mk1a production is in it.

 

[AMCA]

 

[Spitfire9]

Those old fake claims being written over and over.

"For example, the LCA has endurance of 59 minutes per sortie versus two hours for the Swedish Gripen Jas-39 or the U.S. F-16. The payload of LCA is three tons versus six tons for Gripen and seven tons for the F-16. Worst of all LCA was found to be less reliable and required twenty hours of maintenance for each flight hour versus six hours for the Gripen and 3.5 hours for the F-16. "

1. Comparing Tejas mk1's endurance with internal fuel, vs Gripen E's and F-16s endurance using drop tanks.

2. Tejas mk1 has already demonstrated external payload over 4 tons+. Now if you look at Gripen E on wiki - Empty weight - 8 tons, internal fuel 3.4 tons and max take off 16.5 tons. That leaves external payload at around 16.5 - (8+3.4) = 5.1 tons. Infact it would be even lower by another 300-400 kgs considering the pilot and his equipment also take up weight.

3. Tejas 20 hours of maintaince after each flight? During ex Gagan Shakti 2018, EACH Tejas was doing 6 sorties a day. So unless each day has 120 hours, thats not correct.

Agreed, that article is inaccurate and oozes a great dislike of Tejas. If your point 1. is correct, that shows a definite desire to mislead.

Re: 3. above, 20 hours of maintenance per flying hour does not mean 20 hours will elapse before the aircraft flies again (unless only 1 mechanic does the 20 man hours of work).

I believe that Tejas Mk1 is not maintenance-friendly and that one of the design considerations for Mk1A was to improve maintainability versus Mk1.

Please do correct me if I am wrong.

 

[sachinsaxena]

Watch Pentagon wars , it's a insightful look inside much positively acclaimed MIC of America .
It's a movie , basically about development of bradly ifv, took 14 billions to develope.

It's one hell of a depiction of bureaucracy in States. This thing exists in every part of the world. But the only difference is that they are pioneers in defence technology and we play catch-up

 

[fire starter]

Mk1A joy stick.

 

[fire starter]

 

[mohitsingh501]

Agreed, that article is inaccurate and oozes a great dislike of Tejas. If your point 1. is correct, that shows a definite desire to mislead.

Re: 3. above, 20 hours of maintenance per flying hour does not mean 20 hours will elapse before the aircraft flies again (unless only 1 mechanic does the 20 man hours of work).

I believe that Tejas Mk1 is not maintenance-friendly and that one of the design considerations for Mk1A was to improve maintainability versus Mk1.

Please do correct me if I am wrong.

My question -- IS tejas mk 1a is better fighter than mirage 2000-5 mk 2 of Indian air force.

Tejas mk 1a cost 75 million dollar per aircraft

Mirage 2000 upgrade to mirage 2000-5 mk 2
in July 2011 cost approx 43 million dollar per
aircraft. 43 million dollar of 2011 equal to 71 million dollar in DEC 2020. very close to brand new tejas mk 1a.

From the Hindu newspaper mirage upgrade 3 billion dollar. 2.1 billion for mirage upgrade and 0.9 billion for MBDA mica missile.

Second question -- An upgrade cost of old aircraft is equal to a brand new aircraft then how a brand new aircraft compete against old one.

 

[Bleh]

Tejas mk 1a cost 75 million dollar per aircraft

Accha? Bhai, go read the posts on the thread. This has more info than BRF now. For what, if noone bothers to read them?
People are talking over how the Mirage upgrades alone are costlier than brand new Tejas & you're saying stuff like these^!

My question -- IS tejas mk 1a is better fighter than mirage 2000-5 mk 2 of Indian air force.

An upgrade cost of old aircraft is equal to a brand new aircraft then how a brand new aircraft compete against old one.

Now the technical question...

Mirage-2000 is obviously larger & has more payload than Tejas. But also has more than 3 times radar cross-section.

Mica is older & inferior than Astra, but it has a IR guided version. However ASRAAM of Tejas Mark1A is superior to Mica-IR.

Mirage-2000 also has Spice-1/2000 series integrated to it. Tejas's CATS Hunter, Nirbhay-ALCM, RudraM-2 aren't ready/operational yet. But Gaurav & Gautham are both superior & waiting integration with Tejas. SAAW is also available to Tejas.

Oh, and Tejas got jam-proof AESA rrada, with longer range & clarity.

 

[Roland55]

Sorry that i didn't answer yesterday, my keyboard got busted and i rushed to get a new one.

I think that there is a massive misconception when it comes to all the tejas criticism. People dont realize what it really is, an LCA... i mean its in the name... pay in mind that in the forum i post mostly people think that because india is getting mig-35s that means that they dont trust the Tejas or that its inferior so they need to get more capable equipment. Thats simply not true, the tejas and other aircraft (lets say the Migs or the Shukois) are made for different purposes and with different requirements. Does that mean that tejas is bad? no!, its different, made for another purpose with different characteristics, armament, etc.

Comparisons are best made "apples to apples", between all the LCAs its probably the best around, thats why most people tend to compare it to other multirole aircraft that are a lot more "armed" or expensive that it.

 

[Emperor Kalki]

STR lesser than that but comparable to F-16 or Gripen.

Ok, i remember the old quarrel we (along with some other members) had on STR of tejas. Keeping that in mind, let me again politely tell you...you can't say that for sure....

These parameters change for every aircraft across their flight envelope.
And if you want to c̶a̶l̶c̶u̶l̶a̶t̶e̶ speculate the STR, for the conditions of near ground level flight, with clean pylons, optimal fuel and whatever the conditions at that airshow (all of which mean nothing in a real life), then yeah, you can do it...... but only from a level flight (in the horizontal plane, for more clarity) 360° turn. The last time tejas did that was in bahrain and if you compare airshow performances it is not as same as f 16 or gripen (and it never was meant to be) but i would say its comaprable to the capabilities displayed by f 35, f 18 hornet (not super).
But for meeting that (viper and gripen) kinda performance, wait for mk2.

Let me tell you all once again, these figures that can be deduced from airshow performances mean nothing in real operartional roles.
So everyone,please just stop trying to put tejas on some summit that it was never supposed to climb. It sure is a great product and a very capable (aeridynamically also) one indeed and certainly, touchwood, one of the safest ones too. And it sure has made the country's future in aviation sector (not just military aviaion) bright.
So this is all really unnecesaary.

No Bahrain was a much better show than anything other than this aero india and airforce day shows...

I want to second that but actually imo (and this is just imo) bahrain was the best performance that tejas ever put up.

 

[Bleh]

Ok, i remember the old quarrel we (along with some other members) had on STR of tejas. Keeping that in mind, let me again politely tell you...you can't say that for sure....

No I too remember it. Not much of a quarrel.

I found Tejas sustaining 18°/sec turns for two back-to-back 270° turn in Lima (ie, in 15 seconds). Based on that said I've seen Tejas achieve maximum sustained turn at 18°/sec...You showed a footage of PV-2 doing a square loop & said: "look it is doing minimum radius turn in 28sec". Dafuq!

Sorry. I can't take your word seriously if you make technically incorrect statements for sake of argument... Like, the last time Tejas displayed its Max-rate-turn (not the same thing as minimum radius turn) was in Rafale induction ceremony, not fucking 4 years ago.
More than 20°/sec turn-rate displayed above!

Here's the thing, I dont care whats someone's opinion is. I don't deal with opinions... If I am making a statement that is going to be based on some snippet of information I have found.

I don't need to convince you.

You don't need to convince me.

I have never found Tejas turning slower than F-16 or Gripen (a Qatari Mirage-2000 did a better 270° in 18sec) in a single case of full 360° turn of any sort... Thus my statement of its turn-sustaining being atleast comparable to them, if not superior.

You want to claim otherwise, go get footage.

 

[Emperor Kalki]

In horizontal loops I havent seen Tejas bettering 23 seconds timings, Typhoon ,rafale hv way lower timings than Tejas in his dept,

Only saw this post after i posted the one about STR and all. And after all that bullshit on TEDBF thread, i can't beleive i am agreeing with you on this one......but it is true....and its this manoeuvre that can indicate an ITR for the aircraft at those specific conditions and flight parameters....(not what you would get in real operational conditions)

And for all crybabies screaming 18 STR......sorry, not till mwf....

 

[Emperor Kalki]

No I too remember it. Not much of a quarrel.

I found Tejas sustaining 18°/sec turns for two back-to-back 270° turn in Lima (ie, in 15 seconds). Based on that said I've seen Tejas achieve maximum sustained turn at 18°/sec...You showed a footage of PV-2 doing a square loop & said: "look it is doing minimum radius turn in 28sec". Dafuq!

Sorry. I can't take your word seriously if you make technically incorrect statements for sake of argument... Like, the last time Tejas displayed its Max-rate-turn (not the same thing as minimum radius turn) was in Rafale induction ceremony, not fucking 4 years ago.
More than 20°/sec turn-rate displayed above!

Here's the thing, I dont care whats someone's opinion is. I don't deal with opinions... If I am making a statement that is going to be based on some snippet of information I have found.

I don't need to convince you.

You don't need to convince me.

I have never found Tejas turning slower than F-16 or Gripen (a Qatari Mirage-2000 did a better 270° in 18sec) in a single case of full 360° turn of any sort... Thus my statement of its turn-sustaining being atleast comparable to them, if not superior.

You want to claim otherwise, go get footage.

How many times should I say this.....
You can't get an STR value from a turn that's not complete......
Back then if i remember correctly, @piKacHHu did post a pic or an infographic of sort that showed what i mean.....
I ain't here to correct u every now and then.....but then again its happened too many times now....
There was the STR spat, then there was your 'advantage of supercruise' thing, then there's how dual pulse has some advantages in medium range thing........i am tired....

 

[Emperor Kalki]

What did the writer say that was anti-India? Indeed, he/she was extremely critical but criticism is not propaganda.

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