LCA TEJAS MK1 & MK1A: News and Discussion

[patriots]

Gun firing in Air, will take place on LSP-7/8 first not on SP-21. SP-21 is IAF's property not ADA's so SP-21 have never fired a gun. ADA need to mature gun on LSP First, then it will operationalise on SPs retrospectively.

Bro ..untill they hand over ..after documentation ..it's hals property......
Bdw I am just echoing what @Chinmoy said .....and I will believe him blindly....
Also I will update more you on this...I have asked someone

 

[vishnugupt]

Even SP 21 is undergoing some software update.. as per an article i read yesterday..

There is no special software upgradation going for SP-22 and SP-23. It's already been done on SP-21.
This is just an excuse by HAL for delay to look good and to show how hardworking they are.
Software upgrade is something we can't observe by looking at aircraft so it is a valid excuse.

 

[vishnugupt]

Bro ..untill they hand over ..after documentation ..it's hals property......
Bdw I am just echoing what @Chinmoy said .....and I will believe him blindly....
Also I will update more you on this...I have asked someone

May be @Chinmoy is right. But Gun firing is a major milestone for Tejas which should have been mentioned somewhere by now if it's true ( not mentioned in HAL news bulletin)
Secondly, Though HAL manufacturers Tejas but still all SPs are IAF property even before proper handover. You can't use it without IAF approval. Infact SP-21 hurriedly delivered to Flying bullet squadron. Apply your logic on Rafale, do you believe France/Dassault can use same Jets which are intended for IAF for their own purpose?? Never

 

[patriots]

May be @Chinmoy is right. But Gun firing is a major milestone for Tejas which should have been mentioned somewhere by now if it's true ( not mentioned in HAL news bulletin)
Secondly, Though HAL manufacturers Tejas but still all SPs are IAF property even before proper handover. You can't use it without IAF approval. Infact SP-21 hurriedly delivered to Flying bullet squadron. Apply your logic on Rafale, do you believe France/Dassault can use same Jets which are intended for IAF for their own purpose?? Never

Bro isn't all new missile s and bombs tested from iaf sukhois....

The upgraded Mirage 2000 which was crashed ....was Hal's... clearly said by then iaf chief dhanoa........
Ok I will update more you on the gun trial...once I get it

 

[Flying Dagger]

Why are you panicking?? You just need a one word to justify import. It will operationalise in near future so don't worry.
Nobody is going to fight at border on behalf of IAF, neither you nor me but if IAF not good enough against enemies then what the harm in buying more Tejas mk1?? It will eventually increase IAF's capability.

It was you who were panicked... Regarding an article not me..

So IAF didnt have fighter jet because people like you were abusing them day in day out and stopped the import of Rafale.

and you wanted them to waste money on 100+ Tejas mk1 IOC without gun or even a BVR in 2010 to satisfy your shallow ego. While you yourself indulge in imported stuff like the phone you use or the laptop tv fridge you have in your home.

 

[Flying Dagger]

Yeah well, neither J-20 nor F-35 has operational guns... What's so complicated about it? Earlier little jets used to have 6-8 30mm cannons!

F-35 still outmatch anything flying on the planet even in IOC configuration.

While Tejas is flying since 2 decades and if even FOC version don't have gun despite the promise made to IAF... Then IAF have all the right to squeeze balls of ADA.

 

[vishnugupt]

So IAF didnt have fighter jet because people like you were abusing them day in day out and stopped the import of Rafale

Show me a one person on this forum who were opposing Rafale deal?? Are you Hallucinating?
Only thing people opposes here, is IAF's partial attitude towards indigenous project and stupid GSQR. Indigenization can't happen in isolation so yes, Tejas must be ordered by IAF in large numbers. We can afford relatively inferior local product but can't afford dependence on others for strategic weapons.

. While you yourself indulge in imported stuff like the phone you use or the laptop tv fridge you have in your home.

Are you a "Mohalla ki Aunty" ?? Who gives such logics?? How can you compare a less important private affair with highly important institutional ethics?? IAF is a private property of nobody, not even chief or defence minister.
GET THIS STRAIGHT, Indigenization is a responsibility of Armed forces and they can't run away from it by giving a small excuse everytime.

 

[Bleh]

F-35 still outmatch anything flying on the planet even in IOC configuration.

While Tejas is flying since 2 decades and if even FOC version don't have gun despite the promise made to IAF... Then IAF have all the right to squeeze balls of ADA.

Well India should have invested $1trillion then!.. but that's beside the point I asked why the gun is so complicated, when almost all smaller jets in the past had multiple larger cannons.

 

[vishnugupt]

F-35 still outmatch anything flying on the planet even in IOC configuration.

While Tejas is flying since 2 decades and if even FOC version don't have gun despite the promise made to IAF... Then IAF have all the right to squeeze balls of ADA.

Gone those days. Now begger can't be chooser. List is being upgraded for you

 

[Flying Dagger]

Show me a one person on this forum who were opposing Rafale deal?? Are you Hallucinating?
Only thing people opposes here, is IAF's partial attitude towards indigenous project and stupid GSQR. Indigenization can't happen in isolation so yes, Tejas must be ordered by IAF in large numbers. We can afford relatively inferior local product but can't afford dependence on others for strategic weapons.


Are you a "Mohalla ki Aunty" ?? Who gives such logics?? How can you compare a less important private affair with highly important institutional ethics?? IAF is a private property of nobody, not even chief or defence minister.
GET THIS STRAIGHT, Indigenization is a responsibility of Armed forces and they can't run away from it by giving a small excuse everytime.

GSQR is stupid ? Having a gun or BVR capability is stupid ?

It is you who is acting like the phony housewives who want jewellery for themselves to hide the ugliness and the hubby has to keep footing the bill .

While you show off your imported stuff to other housewives and aunty around you... there is problem if IAF ask for a necessary requirement and get abused by beggars who are nobody.

And Get this straight Indigenization isn't sole responsibility of armed forces /IAF for that purpose we have DRDO OFBs HAL ADA etc who are getting fat paycheck.. for the purpose.

Instead of calling Army IAF and Gov beggar better stop whining and begging for attention like Pappu Gandhi

 

[Flying Dagger]

Well India should have invested $1trillion then!.. but that's beside the point I asked why the gun is so complicated, when almost all smaller jets in the past had multiple larger cannons.

Well you brought F-35 in picture so you can answer that better

Older jets were never meant to survive for 40 years and the only weapon they had was cannon for air to air fight and then some rocket pods and they were designed simply to carry those cannons and fire even manually doing so.

Modern jets are very sophisticated machine in comparison to those. And probably the work started late as Tejas had to prove its main BVR capability first and as chinmoy said FOC are going to gen guns so I guess it's almost done deal.

 

[Dessert Storm]

Chill. FOC has gun and its been fired and tested. SP-22 and 23 has undergone software tweaks based on the tests.

Tejas SP-21 flew with the gun but hasn't fired it in air. Live firing has been done on ground only. Live trials in air are expected to be completed by December 2020.

 

[vishnugupt]

GSQR is stupid ? Having a gun or BVR capability is stupid ?

It is you who is acting like the phony housewives who want jewellery for themselves to hide the ugliness and the hubby has to keep footing the bill .

While you show off your imported stuff to other housewives and aunty around you... there is problem if IAF ask for a necessary requirement and get abused by beggars who are nobody.

And Get this straight Indigenization isn't sole responsibility of armed forces /IAF for that purpose we have DRDO OFBs HAL ADA etc who are getting fat paycheck.. for the purpose.

Instead of calling Army IAF and Gov beggar better stop whining and begging for attention like Pappu Gandhi

Arey Bhai, if you not getting kick back then why are you shouting on me. I never said asking for gun or BVR missiles was a stupid GSQR. I can understand your frustration being a Dallal of import. People like you who want our Armed forces begger for centuries just to get kick back. More bad days ahead for you.

 

[Flying Dagger]

Arey Bhai, if you not getting kick back then why are you shouting on me. I never said asking for gun or BVR missiles was a stupid GSQR. I can understand your frustration being a Dallal of import. People like you who want our Armed forces begger for centuries just to get kick back. More bad days ahead for you.

Stop pimping for OFB babus and begging and whining for attention.

Just coz you have spent your life begging don't call IAF IA or IN yours or beggars..

And you did said ASQR ( GSQR) were stupid regarding the post on gun. Now don't change trajectory ..

2 rs chilke like you can keep on whining

 

[cannonfodder]

As I mentioned earlier there is nothing especial going on, except Covid-19 pandemic, due to which production was delayed


It seems, despite of new production line ( claimed several times ), remaining Tejas mk1 delivery will complete by 2023.
2020-2021- 8 jets
2021- 2022- 8 jets
2022- 2023- 8 trainers
From March 2023, Tejas Mk1A delivery will start if we managed to sign deal in 2020.

Why is 2021-2022 and post it has only 8 jets estimation?

 

[mahesh]

Why is 2021-2022 and post it has only 8 jets estimation?
View attachment 60189

there is line 3

 

[vishnugupt]

Why is 2021-2022 and post it has only 8 jets estimation?
View attachment 60189

Line 1. Originally set up for LCA and is producing 5 jets per year.
Line 2. Hawk assembly line which is producing 3 jets per year.
Total capacity 8 jets per year at present. Can produce 9 or 10 jets if HAL get fully finished assemblies from tier-2 and tier -3 vendors.
Line 3. This production line we have been hearing since ages but yet to be operational which is intended to produce 8 jets per year. This line will be active once mK1a delivery start. There is only 2 situations where 3rd line can start production early.
1) IAF order more FOC version, or 2) IAF accept 10 mk1 FOC version trainer as they originally planned for MK1a deal.

 

[cannonfodder]

Line 1. Originally set up for LCA and is producing 5 jets per year.
Line 2. Hawk assembly line which is producing 3 jets per year.
Total capacity 8 jets per year at present. Can produce 9 or 10 jets if HAL get fully finished assemblies from tier-2 and tier -3 vendors.
Line 3. This production line we have been hearing since ages but yet to be operational which is intended to produce 8 jets per year. This line will be active once mK1a delivery start. There is only 2 situations where 3rd line can start production early.
1) IAF order more FOC version, or 2) IAF accept 10 mk1 FOC version trainer as they originally planned for MK1a deal.

It will be bummer if HAL does not deliver 10 or more post 21-22. BR quotes capacity as 16/year but past experience with HAL even I think its bit stretching too far.

If HAL is going to produce 8 per year for next couple of years, we may as well wrap up Tejas and buy some thing else.

//Source is BR

 

[Rajaraja Chola]

It will be bummer if HAL does not deliver 10 or more post 21-22. BR quotes capacity as 16/year but past experience with HAL even I think its bit stretching too far.

If HAL is going to produce 8 per year for next couple of years, we may as well wrap up Tejas and buy some thing else.

//Source is BR
View attachment 60195

What does Hal producing 8 per year has to do with anything? Give orders of 300 totally in one go, Hal will manufacture 48 per year. If you give orders of only 40, they will manufacture only 8. Hal has investors other than the govt as well. They have to take care of productivity of workers and yield improvements. It's not that simple. IAF owns hal more than 20k crores to be paid over last 2-3 years. God only knows of how much of that money is to be paid to vendors hal buys it from.

Hal had/has issues. But in this case, it's thoroughly govt fault, sitting on mk1A contract since 2017. That's going to be 4 damn years and yet no contract.

 

[cannonfodder]

What does Hal producing 8 per year has to do with anything? Give orders of 300 totally in one go, Hal will manufacture 48 per year. If you give orders of only 40, they will manufacture only 8. Hal has investors other than the govt as well. They have to take care of productivity of workers and yield improvements. It's not that simple. IAF owns hal more than 20k crores to be paid over last 2-3 years. God only knows of how much of that money is to be paid to vendors hal buys it from.

Hal had/has issues. But in this case, it's thoroughly govt fault, sitting on mk1A contract since 2017. That's going to be 4 damn years and yet no contract.

How much ever excuses one comes up with, it is HAL claim that they have 8+4 (+4) set up capacity. They have to do close to that, It will be basically running at 50% efficiency and handing over another reason for IAF to boot this project. IAF will operating with Jags and Migs only and everyone from Mod, IAF, ADA, HAL are responsible for this.