Jammu and Kashmir: News and Discussion

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Rage

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ot sure if this would be a reliable source, but:

Indian Army Flee's After Attempt to Slaughter Sikhs in Kashmir

Just to set the record straight, these are images from the actual protests in the aftermath of the Chatti Singhpura incident.

Note, how the alternative media portrays it as a voicing out against state separatists and Pakistani-based militants, whom they believed to have perpetrated the act:

http://www.tribuneindia.com/2000/20000324/index.htm

This issue is from 2000.
 

RPK

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http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-south-asia-11697782

Kashmiri militant groups still recruiting in Pakistan
"There are different types of duties I can now be sent to do," says the man we have come to meet, but whose identity we have to conceal.

"I can be kept here in the reserves, be asked to recruit new members, or they can send me across into Indian-held Kashmir for jihad," he says.

Until the spring, this 25-year-old had been studying engineering; now he is a militant.

As he describes why he left his studies, he quotes from the Koran and repeats justifications for his choice, which have clearly been taught to him.

"While I was at university, I started going to sermons given by preachers and, thank God, I joined a jihadi group," he says.

"I went to a training camp with hundreds of others for three months. Now I'm ready to do whatever they ask me, to win all of Kashmir for Pakistan.

"The Indians are killing our brothers and sisters. If everyone sits around doing nothing, who will bring liberation?

"God willing, our blood will bring change," the young man adds.

He tells me his family are happy about his choice, and that they will be proud if he becomes a martyr and goes to heaven.

But that turns out not to be the case. After much persuasion, he allows us to meet his mother.

'Brainwashed'

"Only over my dead body will my son go for jihad," she says.

She tells us that she thought her son was going for Koranic teaching but that she was horrified to find that he had, in fact, had militant training.


Some Kashmiris want both Pakistan and India to quit the divided region "I pray to God to keep him here and not let him go. I won't let him," she adds.

And the man's brother, we find, is furious.

"He is a different person since he went to the training camp; the way he talks and dresses. They have brainwashed him.

"If Pakistan wants to fight India, why doesn't it do it through its army, why does it have to use boys like my brother?" he says.

The implication being that it is the Pakistani state that is behind the radicalisation and preparation of his brother as a militant.

In 1947, India was partitioned. Muslim-majority Indian states formed the new nation of Pakistan. But in the hastiness of the split, the fate of Kashmir, whose population was more than three-quarters Muslim, was never fully resolved.

In the late 1940s, the United Nations had demanded that India allow a vote in Kashmir so people there could decide upon their future. India said it agreed, but the poll was never held.

The territory is now split between the two regional powers. They have fought wars for its overall control, but in the last 20 years, an insurgency has also taken root.

There was a time when it was an open secret that the Pakistani authorities were directly supporting militancy in Kashmir.

But now Pakistan claims those days are over.

"I assure you, as a state, as a government, there is no such policy of training Kashmiri militants to be sent across [to Indian-administered Kashmir]," Pakistan's Interior Minister, Rehman Malik, tells me.

He says that because of the monitoring of his government, militant groups have been brought under control, that they are no longer a threat to India, and that fighters cannot cross into the Indian-run side of Kashmir.

When I tell him about the militant we had met, and the organised training camp he had talked of, Mr Malik admitted there might be "some non-state groups" still operating.

'Supporting militancy'

But most people living in Pakistani-administered Kashmir will say the government is not telling the full story.

"The intelligence agencies in Pakistan are still fully supporting and financing militant groups here and the government is completely aware," says Zahid Habib Sheikh, from the Jammu Kashmir Liberation Front (JKLF).

"They will tell you there are no training camps but, of course, there are. This has always been Pakistan's Kashmir strategy, but it is a selfish policy that has only damaged our cause," he adds.


Despite its problems, Kashmir is known for its natural beauty Mr Sheikh says he feels Pakistan is supporting militancy here not for the sake of Kashmiris, but to keep India engaged in conflict, and to use the militants as a bargaining chip in negotiations.

"Pakistan has also turned what should be a nationalist cause, about human rights abuses by India, into a religious cause," he says.

The organisation he belongs to re-launched its "Quit Kashmir" campaign earlier this year. It calls for both India and Pakistan to end their involvement in the region.

In what is traditionally protest season in Pakistani-administered Kashmir, where all political groups hold rallies, the march by JKLF was one of the biggest in Muzaffarabad, blocking the centre of the city.

People across Pakistani-administered Kashmir are united in their anger over the recent deaths of over a hundred Kashmiris in the Indian-administered side, killed while protesting against Indian control.

Just as we are leaving Muzaffarabad, after the "Quit Kashmir" rally, we hear crowd noise coming from a marketplace.

There, in the middle of the day, stands a bearded man on a platform, surrounded by armed men in military-type fatigues.

Scores of people have gathered to listen to what he has to say, and respond to his slogans by chanting them back.

He is a senior militant leader, openly urging new recruits to step forward. Undoubtedly more of them will.
 

ejazr

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Anti-strike activists protest
Hoist white flag in Lal Chowk before being attacked by some youths


Srinagar, Nov 07: Around 100 activists staged a protest rally in Lal Chowk area of Srinagar on Sunday against the continuous strikes called by Hurriyat-G over the past few months, but had to beat a hasty retreat after being attacked by some youths.
Nearly 25 vehicles carrying the protestors, who had come from various parts of the Valley, assembled at Tourist Reception Centre (TRC) grounds here, official sources said.
Holding placards denouncing the frequent strikes, they later proceeded in a car rally towards the city centre Lal Chowk, where one of the protestors hoisted a white flag, symbolizing peace, atop the Clock Tower ('Ghanta Ghar').
However, while the organiser of the rally Bashir Ahmad – formerly associated with a mainstream political party - was talking to reporters, a group of youths beat him up and forced the anti-strike protestors to flee.
Ahmad was bleeding from the mouth before being rescued by police personnel providing security cover to the rally.
An agitated youth also removed the white flag and set it ablaze. Police later detained the youth who brought down the flag while chasing away his other accomplices.
Several groups of people appeared from nearby Kokerbazar, Maisuma and Court Road localities and raised pro-freedom slogans and started throwing stones at the police personnel.
Police burst teargas shells and used batons to bring the situation under control. Normalcy later returned to the area after an hour.
The Valley has been facing frequent strikes and curfew restrictions since June this year.
This is second protest against the strikes called by Hurriyat-G led by Syed Ali Shah Geelani since the ongoing unrest began in the Valley in June.
On September 01, another mainstream political activist brought some school children for a students' protest rally at Residency Road but he too had to beat a hasty retreat following opposition from some youths in the area.
 

ejazr

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@mehwish

If you look at Pakistani propaganda sites, they would report the incident as "IA flees after trying to slaughter sikhs". That does not make any sense and is obviously a feeble attempt to fan unrest as the Summer protests have died down almost.

The incident if you read the Hindu and outlook reports seem more like a night patrol that needed some help from the locals. And that incident has been blown out of proportion into some sort of sinister attempt.

In conflict environment, its very easy for rumours and misconceptions to become larger than life and most likely this is what happened here.
 

ejazr

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Thought provoking editorial in an Urdu daily in J&K

Of victorious smiles and trumpet of defeat

Manzoor Anjum

It is true that the current agitation has ensured victorious smile on Geelani's face as people seek permission from him even for celebrating religious festivals but sad part of the story is that ordinary people have started smelling their defeat despite huge sacrifices.

The other day, a delegation of non-Muslims approached Hurriyat (G) chairman, Syed Ali Geelani and appealed him to amend his calendar and exempt the day of Diwali from strike. And the senior separatist leader amended the calendar – the calendar through which he has been directing people from past few months when to stay at home and when to roam around. By allowing non-Muslims to celebrate Diwali, Geelani conveyed that he respects the religious sentiments of non-Muslims too and at the same moment proved that he is the one who rules this place (Kashmir Valley). The episode also indicates the quantum of authority that Geelani enjoys – people have to seek permission from him even for celebrating religious festivals! But at the same, the episode also throws up two vital questions – One, who is Geelani and who has given him the mandate to rule. Two, where is the freedom movement in which Geelani finds legitimacy to rule? And one more thing, what have the sacrifices that Geelani demanded from ordinary people, achieved?
Fact of the matter is that the agitation of past few months has completely changed the very nature of Kashmir issue. While beyond Khadanyar and Qazigund, Hurriyat (G) calendar has failed to make any impact, in Kashmir Valley the state government has ceased to enjoy any authority or writ. So, Maharaja Hari Singh's Jammu and Kashmir which was divided in the wake of a war between two countries, stands further fragmented with divisions within the divisions. The current agitation, in which one hundred and eleven precious lives were lost, has achieved nothing but contrary it has damaged the Kashmir cause. As the agitation was confined to Kashmir Valley alone, the outer world now seems convinced that it is just an issue of a particular community within the Valley. Non Muslims living in Indian controlled Kashmir are satisfied with the arrangements and so are Muslims living in Pakistan controlled Kashmir. Problem lies with the Muslim population of Valley under Indian control. Therefore, the current agitation has reduced Kashmir issue from being an international issue to a communal one.
Kashmir is face to face with worst tragedy of its history. Four months back, Kashmiris were asked to come out and make sacrifices as the 'movement for freedom was in a decisive phase and Azadi was round the corner'. Though the sacrifice seekers never spelled out what Azadi means and where they are leading people to, but in the name of religion and sentiment people were mesmerized to the extent that they put everything on stake (including their lives) for a goal that was never defined. Four long months Kashmiris rendered unparalleled sacrifices. 111 people died, hundreds have become handicapped after sustaining injuries. Economy is in complete shambles. Education of children got worst beating but people achieved nothing.
The set back has shocked the entire populace. They have started realizing that they were cheated on mere slogans and there was no strategy with the sacrifice seekers nor had any thought gone into the whole exercise. They were banking on dead bodies – one killed and the killing gets people on roads; more violence and another death and the cycle went on. Once the dance of death stopped, the agitation lost its sting. Again sacrifice seekers are waiting for a dead body unmindful of the fact that now it will be of no use as people have realized the futility of the agitation that has given them nothing but sufferings, death and destruction.
The sacrifices of 111 people during past four months have not changed anything nor have the sacrifices of one hundred thousand people during past twenty years. Kashmir is where it was. The militant movement faced defeat and today Kashmiris have started tasting another bitter defeat. Responsibility lies exclusively on the leadership which failed to strategize its moves but went to the extreme riding on the blind emotions and rhetorical slogans. And now the same very leadership is in a fix, not knowing what to do. The shopkeeper, who closed down his shop willingly all these months wants to open it; the transporters want to ply their vehicles on roads again. Neither they are waiting for Obama nor expecting any "Good News". All are eager to resume their normal lives but stone pelters are being used to disallow normality. Young boys are delivering threatening letters to shopkeepers, hoteliers, filling stations warning them not to resume normal functioning. Isn't it an irony that the very people, who took to streets sacrificing everything for movement are now being forced to do the same again. The problem with the people is that they failed to understand the leaders who distanced from armed struggle, which had claimed nearly one lakh lives, and then raised the slogan of "peaceful movement" and started counting dead bodies afresh. When the counting couldn't go beyond 111, to save itself from the negative impact of anti-climax, the leadership started using force against the same people who actually made the sacrifices.
Now, let us have a look at Geelani's leadership and polity. Young blood never likes moderation and patience and never accepts moderate voices. It is extremist in itself and always looks towards those who denounce moderate voices. Kashmiri youth were angry and their anger coincided with Geelani's extremist polity. Intellectuals and writers too played dirty and instead of raising their voice against extremism, they jumped into the bandwagon and dragged entire populace into this mad race. And the Hurriyat (G) crossed even the limits of extremism by issuing calendar which in itself is a humiliation to the entire nation. Logic and wisdom stand witness that no people have ever made their day-to-day life, education of their children or their opportunities of earning hostage to any movement. Yes, nations have made huge sacrifices for their respective movements but none has made itself hostage and slave of the movement.
When the people came out of their homes four months back, they were ready to make sacrifices and that is what a successful movement needs. But this agitation lacked a proper and well thought out strategy. The youth were angry, full of vigour and ready to do anything and everything and Geelani took over the leadership of these angry youth in the same manner as he did with armed struggle. That time he had some competition from late Abdul Gani Lone, Mirwaiz Umar, Mohammad Yasin Malik, Prof Abdul Gani Bhat and Maulana Abbass Ansari and, for most of the time, he just busied himself in elbowing them out. He broke all coalitions and coordinations and legitimized even the wrongs of the militant movement. His justification of wrongs disillusioned the people, who had sacrificed a lot for the said movement.
After that the youth launched several movements on their own and every time Geelani volunteered to lead those movements. Though the Shrine Board land agitation was not in sync with Geelani's political stance (as he believes entire J&K disputed and therefore had no justification to fight for a small piece of land) but still he jumped in and tried to lead the agitation. The matter was resolved and later huge number of people participated in elections. Then youth surfaced on streets pelting stones. Though stone pelting too doesn't gel with Geelani's ideology but he again jumped in; justified stone pelting and described it as the only weapon of oppressed people. Then began the cycle of killings and with every death, Geelani's hold over the situation strengthened and once situation was completely in his grip, his attention shifted from freedom struggle to his own authority and rule. Now that non Muslims are approaching him with requests that they be allowed to celebrate their religious festival, his authority got established and the smile on his lips was conveying everything. Sad, he couldn't realize that how much people of Kashmir have suffered to ensure this victorious smile on his face.
Once Obama concludes his India visit, people in Kashmir will start to resume normal life. Again force will be used to scuttle normality. How long? People can offer sacrifices for freedom movement for thousands of years but they can't observe strikes for such long periods. Success or failure of strikes is no instrument to gauge the popularity of any movement or leader.

In reaction to Indira-Abdullah Accord, then Pakistan Prime Minister, Zulfikar Ali Bhutto called for Kashmir bandh to protest Sheikh Abdullah's arrival. A day ahead of Bandh Call, some petrol bombs rocked Srinagar city and the strike was very successful. People concluded that every Kashmiri was opposed to the Accord. When Sheikh Abdullah reached Srinagar, lakhs of people were on streets welcoming him and again conclusions were made that Bhutto's strike call was successful only because of the bomb blasts. To conclude, if some leader thinks that success of his strike calls is vindication of his popularity, it is nothing but delusion.
The Writer is the Chief Editor of 'Daily Uqab', an Urdu newspaper published from Kashmir Valley. The Write-up has been translated from Urdu.
 

anoop_mig25

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Ok i may be wrong here but i want humble opinion some people/ thinkers supports india did not consider or forward to an idea of recapturing pok area because
a> we do not know whether people of pok would support us (plz do not include parties there supporting their freedom )
b> militarily/financially not possible
c> powerful countries in this world wont allow it to happen rather they would support status quo
d> mountain/peaks at loc provides us with perfect natural borders then those plain in pok

but I read somewhere that there is another angle to it which is

indian would be forced to held plebiscite if india where to re-capture pok area as separatist would force us as well as international powers would pressurizes us to keep our promise
and as we know we mat loose in plebiscite

so better policy is of status quo
 

ajtr

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Ok i may be wrong here but i want humble opinion some people/ thinkers supports india did not consider or forward to an idea of recapturing pok area because
a> we do not know whether people of pok would support us (plz do not include parties there supporting their freedom )
b> militarily/financially not possible
c> powerful countries in this world wont allow it to happen rather they would support status quo
d> mountain/peaks at loc provides us with perfect natural borders then those plain in pok

but I read somewhere that there is another angle to it which is

indian would be forced to held plebiscite if india where to re-capture pok area as separatist would force us as well as international powers would pressurizes us to keep our promise
and as we know we mat loose in plebiscite

so better policy is of status quo
once india captures Azad kashmir then the problem will be buried once for all.coz there wont be any party left to dispute it.
 

S.A.T.A

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India has not and cannot make any legal commitments which violates the fundamental tenets of our national integration and sovereignty.Whatever temporary exigencies that prevent from us pursuing the goal of complete integration,it must be understood they are only 'temporary' and we must bide our time for a more favorable environment where the such a integration is possible.Until then lets us not bind ourselves into some phony commitments which is against our interest.
 

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Kashmir's Fruits of Discord

http://www.nytimes.com/2010/11/09/opinion/09roy.html?pagewanted=1&_r=1

By ARUNDHATI ROY
Published: November 8, 2010 New Delhi

A WEEK before he was elected in 2008, President Obama said that solving the dispute over Kashmir's struggle for self-determination — which has led to three wars between India and Pakistan since 1947 — would be among his "critical tasks." His remarks were greeted with consternation in India, and he has said almost nothing about Kashmir since then.

But on Monday, during his visit here, he pleased his hosts immensely by saying the United States would not intervene in Kashmir and announcing his support for India's seat on the United Nations Security Council. While he spoke eloquently about threats of terrorism, he kept quiet about human rights abuses in Kashmir.

Whether Mr. Obama decides to change his position on Kashmir again depends on several factors: how the war in Afghanistan is going, how much help the United States needs from Pakistan and whether the government of India goes aircraft shopping this winter. (An order for 10 Boeing C-17 Globemaster III aircraft, worth $5.8 billion, among other huge business deals in the pipeline, may ensure the president's silence.) But neither Mr. Obama's silence nor his intervention is likely to make the people in Kashmir drop the stones in their hands.

I was in Kashmir 10 days ago, in that beautiful valley on the Pakistani border, home to three great civilizations — Islamic, Hindu and Buddhist. It's a valley of myth and history. Some believe that Jesus died there; others that Moses went there to find the lost tribe. Millions worship at the Hazratbal shrine, where a few days a year a hair of the Prophet Muhammad is displayed to believers.

Now Kashmir, caught between the influence of militant Islam from Pakistan and Afghanistan, America's interests in the region and Indian nationalism (which is becoming increasingly aggressive and "Hinduized"), is considered a nuclear flash point. It is patrolled by more than half a million soldiers and has become the most highly militarized zone in the world.

The atmosphere on the highway between Kashmir's capital, Srinagar, and my destination, the little apple town of Shopian in the south, was tense. Groups of soldiers were deployed along the highway, in the orchards, in the fields, on the rooftops and outside shops in the little market squares. Despite months of curfew, the "stone pelters" calling for "azadi" (freedom), inspired by the Palestinian intifada, were out again. Some stretches of the highway were covered with so many of these stones that you needed an S.U.V. to drive over them.

Fortunately the friends I was with knew alternative routes down the back lanes and village roads. The "longcut" gave me the time to listen to their stories of this year's uprising. The youngest, still a boy, told us that when three of his friends were arrested for throwing stones, the police pulled out their fingernails — every nail, on both hands.

For three years in a row now, Kashmiris have been in the streets, protesting what they see as India's violent occupation. But the militant uprising against the Indian government that began with the support of Pakistan 20 years ago is in retreat. The Indian Army estimates that there are fewer than 500 militants operating in the Kashmir Valley today. The war has left 70,000 dead and tens of thousands debilitated by torture. Many, many thousands have "disappeared." More than 200,000 Kashmiri Hindus have fled the valley. Though the number of militants has come down, the number of Indian soldiers deployed remains undiminished.

But India's military domination ought not to be confused with a political victory. Ordinary people armed with nothing but their fury have risen up against the Indian security forces. A whole generation of young people who have grown up in a grid of checkpoints, bunkers, army camps and interrogation centers, whose childhood was spent witnessing "catch and kill" operations, whose imaginations are imbued with spies, informers, "unidentified gunmen," intelligence operatives and rigged elections, has lost its patience as well as its fear. With an almost mad courage, Kashmir's young have faced down armed soldiers and taken back their streets.


Since April, when the army killed three civilians and then passed them off as "terrorists," masked stone throwers, most of them students, have brought life in Kashmir to a grinding halt. The Indian government has retaliated with bullets, curfew and censorship. Just in the last few months, 111 people have been killed, most of them teenagers; more than 3,000 have been wounded and 1,000 arrested.
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Times Topic: Kashmir
But still they come out, the young, and throw stones. They don't seem to have leaders or belong to a political party. They represent themselves. And suddenly the second-largest standing army in the world doesn't quite know what to do. The Indian government doesn't know whom to negotiate with. And many Indians are slowly realizing they have been lied to for decades. The once solid consensus on Kashmir suddenly seems a little fragile.

I WAS in a bit of trouble the morning we drove to Shopian. A few days earlier, at a public meeting in Delhi, I said that Kashmir was disputed territory and, contrary to the Indian government's claims, it couldn't be called an "integral" part of India. Outraged politicians and news anchors demanded that I be arrested for sedition. The government, terrified of being seen as "soft," issued threatening statements, and the situation escalated. Day after day, on prime-time news, I was being called a traitor, a white-collar terrorist and several other names reserved for insubordinate women. But sitting in that car on the road to Shopian, listening to my friends, I could not bring myself to regret what I had said in Delhi.

We were on our way to visit a man called Shakeel Ahmed Ahangar. The previous day he had come all the way to Srinagar, where I had been staying, to press me, with an urgency that was hard to ignore, to visit Shopian.

I first met Shakeel in June 2009, only a few weeks after the bodies of Nilofar, his 22-year-old wife, and Asiya, his 17-year-old sister, were found lying a thousand yards apart in a shallow stream in a high-security zone — a floodlit area between army and state police camps. The first postmortem report confirmed rape and murder. But then the system kicked in. New autopsy reports overturned the initial findings and, after the ugly business of exhuming the bodies, rape was ruled out. It was declared that in both cases the cause of death was drowning. Protests shut Shopian down for 47 days, and the valley was convulsed with anger for months. Eventually it looked as though the Indian government had managed to defuse the crisis. But the anger over the killings has magnified the intensity of this year's uprising.

Shakeel wanted us to visit him in Shopian because he was being threatened by the police for speaking out, and hoped our visit would demonstrate that people even outside of Kashmir were looking out for him, that he was not alone.

It was apple season in Kashmir and as we approached Shopian we could see families in their orchards, busily packing apples into wooden crates in the slanting afternoon light. I worried that a couple of the little red-cheeked children who looked so much like apples themselves might be crated by mistake. The news of our visit had preceded us, and a small knot of people were waiting on the road.

Shakeel's house is on the edge of the graveyard where his wife and sister are buried. It was dark by the time we arrived, and there was a power failure. We sat in a semicircle around a lantern and listened to him tell the story we all knew so well. Other people entered the room. Other terrible stories poured out, ones that are not in human rights reports, stories about what happens to women who live in remote villages where there are more soldiers than civilians. Shakeel's young son tumbled around in the darkness, moving from lap to lap. "Soon he'll be old enough to understand what happened to his mother," Shakeel said more than once.

Just when we rose to leave, a messenger arrived to say that Shakeel's father-in-law — Nilofar's father — was expecting us at his home. We sent our regrets; it was late and if we stayed longer it would be unsafe for us to drive back.

Minutes after we said goodbye and crammed ourselves into the car, a friend's phone rang. It was a journalist colleague of his with news for me: "The police are typing up the warrant. She's going to be arrested tonight." We drove in silence for a while, past truck after truck being loaded with apples. "It's unlikely," my friend said finally. "It's just psy-ops."

But then, as we picked up speed on the highway, we were overtaken by a car full of men waving us down. Two men on a motorcycle asked our driver to pull over. I steeled myself for what was coming. A man appeared at the car window. He had slanting emerald eyes and a salt-and-pepper beard that went halfway down his chest. He introduced himself as Abdul Hai, father of the murdered Nilofar.

"How could I let you go without your apples?" he said. The bikers started loading two crates of apples into the back of our car. Then Abdul Hai reached into the pockets of his worn brown cloak, and brought out an egg. He placed it in my palm and folded my fingers over it. And then he placed another in my other hand. The eggs were still warm. "God bless and keep you," he said, and walked away into the dark. What greater reward could a writer want?

I wasn't arrested that night. Instead, in what is becoming a common political strategy, officials outsourced their displeasure to the mob. A few days after I returned home, the women's wing of the Bharatiya Janata Party (the right-wing Hindu nationalist opposition) staged a demonstration outside my house, calling for my arrest. Television vans arrived in advance to broadcast the event live. The murderous Bajrang Dal, a militant Hindu group that, in 2002, spearheaded attacks against Muslims in Gujarat in which more than a thousand people were killed, have announced that they are going to "fix" me with all the means at their disposal, including by filing criminal charges against me in different courts across the country.

Indian nationalists and the government seem to believe that they can fortify their idea of a resurgent India with a combination of bullying and Boeing airplanes. But they don't understand the subversive strength of warm, boiled eggs.
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Now i came to know where such people gets money to stay live. arre yaar this kind of people bad mouth american in india and probably earn their living their live hood form same american press are yaar kuch to sharm karo

plz some provide me her email-id i would provide her with full account of what happen in sophian case. she is still stuck there only
 
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The Messiah

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She is not traitor because she was never Indian in the first place.

"Attention seeking whore" is the term i use to describe her....she lives in 100 crore house and has audacity to claim that nothing is being done for poor...while making money for spouting nonsense about the country in foreign media.

She has aligned herself with gelani who wants sharia law implemented and yet she hails freedom of speech and democracy which would be denied under the likes of gelani and then abuses India where she has these rights. Infact i think she thinks gelani is an extremist but also knows that controversy creates $$$ for her so she is also a fake activist and fake writer.

Hypocritical bitch.
 
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pankaj nema

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If Indian government eliminates her or even imprisons her then she immediately becomes a martyr and a heroine. And India gets more bad press abroad

She should be just ignored. But unofficially govt. should organise a small attack on her By WOMEN preferably like it is done on Taslima Nasreen By throwing shoes on her or giving a few hard slaps or throwing black ink on her

Such people have a shelf life like Medha PAtkar of Narmada agitation has now become irrelevant ,nobody even bothers whether she is dead or alive
 

Ray

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Don't pity us, Arundhati – not yet

Anshul Chaturvedi

27 October 2010, 06:37 AM IST

Insofar as putting thoughts into words go, I guess I'm not really qualified to take up an issue with Arundhati Roy; she's a globally acknowledged, indeed, acclaimed writer, while I am no more than an inconsequential rarely-read salaried cog in the gigantic wheels of the print media. Having said that, I am very clear that I don't want my share of the accumulated pity that she thinks the nation collectively merits. So, here's my inadequate submission:

Arundhati has said that she "spoke about justice for the people of Kashmir who live under one of the most brutal military occupations in the world; for Kashmiri Pandits who live out the tragedy of having been driven out of their homeland; for Dalit soldiers killed in Kashmir whose graves I visited on garbage heaps in their villages in Cuddalore; for the Indian poor who pay the price of this occupation in material ways and who are now learning to live in the terror of what is becoming a police state."

I disagree with the effortless branding of Kashmir as "one of the most brutal military occupations in the world" – it is not pleasant, today, I am sure, but from 1948 to say, at least 1988, a period of well over four decades, Kashmir was a part of what we consider India – merged, integrated, acceded, depends on whom you ask – and for those four decades it was not part of India on the strength of a "brutal military occupation". Unlike German soldiers marching into Poland or Chinese troops invading Tibet, India did not have to "invade" Kashmir and then hold it from Day One by administering martial law or its equivalent. I don't mean to sound cheesy, but for years and years Bollywood didn't churn out those scenes of a beautiful, peaceful, idyllic Kashmir on the strength of shooting crews backed by hundreds of 'brutal soldiers' trying to create a pretence of normal, peaceful life. That's just how it was. Someone worked to change it. The question is – who?

Punjab, too, faced a decade of insurgency, something which we forget all too easily today. But it wasn't 'occupied' prior to that; it isn't 'occupied' today. Kashmir has faced more than a decade of insurgency, agreed, but to portray it as if everyone in Kashmir for all time has been subject to "one of the most brutal military occupations" does no justice to the intellect which Arundhati obviously possesses – more so in the context of the fact that the other friendly democratic states that border Kashmir, namely Pakistan and China, have no noticeable tradition of tender loving care extended by their respective militaries to people who question whether they belong to those states.

Having lived and worked in J&K for many years, as an editor, I have carried stories about remote hilly villages where terrorists surrounded hamlets of Gujjars and slit the throats of two dozen villagers to indicate the price of 'cooperation' extended to security forces patrolling the hills. When Bill Clinton came to India, we saw the carnage of 36 Sikhs in Chatttisinghpora – something which Arundhati's comrade in arms, Syed Ali Shah Geeelani, incredibly enough, still reiterates was 'done by India to defame Kashmiris'. There is no dearth of such instances – I quote only a couple to remind us all that Kashmir's brutal occupation is not quite as much of an innocent-lambs-being-led-to-slaughter scenario as Ms Roy perhaps sees it as.

When Arundhati says that she speaks for justice "for Kashmiri Pandits who live out the tragedy of having been driven out of their homeland", it is too ridiculous to even merit comment, given that she wants that justice to come while she shares a dias with Geelani. They were 'driven out of their homeland', Arundhati, by the brutal military occupiers of Kashmir, or by someone else? Driven out by whom? Why leave it to delightful ambiguities here? I do not know if Kashmiri Pandits give any weightage to her speaking ostensibly on their behalf. And the statistical chances of Pandits returning to Kashmir if the brutal military occupation ends tomorrow are slimmer than of Arundhati joining the BJP.

Arundhati seeks justice, too, "for Dalit soldiers killed in Kashmir whose graves I visited on garbage heaps in their villages in Cuddalore." This is slick if you are writing a column for a foreign audience, the way Aussie 'experts' wrote on the caste composition of the Indian cricket team during the Bhajji-Symonds spat, but, hello, "Dalit soldiers" killed in Kashmir die in situations different from upper caste soldiers or Sikh soldiers or Muslim soldiers – or local, Kashmiri Muslim policemen? Don't insult our intelligence, and the Army's basic DNA, with this line of argument. You wish to be the defender of the rights of those oppressed in Kashmir, of the Pandits, and of the "Dalit soldiers" from among the troops who die there day in and day out? Sorry, this is just not real; it's just not genuine, even if it is possibly good homework for global awards coming your way as defender of the rights of all oppressed sections in this part of the world.

Arundhati's also looking for justice "for the Indian poor who pay the price of this occupation in material ways and who are now learning to live in the terror of what is becoming a police state", but I have little comment to offer on this because, frankly, it is a little too esoteric for me to understand the point. I understand that India is in selective ways and selective zones a police state of sorts, but how insensitive policing in interior Bihar is attributable to Kashmir's status – and how Azadi will address that – must have a subtle connect which my everyday, non literary mind has singularly failed to grasp. But then, we are all not blessed with equal talents.
Anyway, this is not one of Ms Roy's essays, so I daren't type away endlessly. I'll conclude.

You say, Arundhati, "Pity the nation that has to silence its writers for speaking their minds. Pity the nation that needs to jail those who ask for justice, while communal killers, mass murderers, corporate scamsters, looters, rapists, and those who prey on the poorest of the poor, roam free." I say, you are jumping the gun. Neither have you been silenced at any point for speaking your mind – distasteful as it may be to many when it veers towards applauding anyone willing to kill an Indian soldier, be it a Naxal in Chattisgarh or a terrorist in Kashmir – nor does the nation need to be pitied. Yet, writers and dissidents are silenced, in friendlier and I suppose less 'brutal' societies such as Pakistan, China, Myanmar, but the very fact that you can issue statements and notes challenging the same to be done here is, perhaps, the strongest negation of those statements. Yes, many murderers, scamsters and rapists still roam free, and no, we aren't proud of that in the least, but no, you haven't been jailed for asking for justice. And I don't see that happening. Truth be told, I think you don't see it happening either.

So while one gives all credit to your intellectual prowess, I don't think this overdose of pity for the nation is quite deserved. It's a lot of hyperbole. As part of 'the nation', even if just one-billionth, I respectfully wish to return my proportion of pity offered by you, Ms Roy. Please accept it. And while you're at it, pass it on to Mr Geelani; I daresay he needs it more.

__._,_.___
Best Regards,
 
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SHASH2K2

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If Indian government eliminates her or even imprisons her then she immediately becomes a martyr and a heroine. And India gets more bad press abroad

She should be just ignored. But unofficially govt. should organise a small attack on her By WOMEN preferably like it is done on Taslima Nasreen By throwing shoes on her or giving a few hard slaps or throwing black ink on her

Such people have a shelf life like Medha PAtkar of Narmada agitation has now become irrelevant ,nobody even bothers whether she is dead or alive
Who is asking government to kill or imprison her. but there is a lot that we can do. I am planning to get a bitch and will name her Arundhati. on government end they should stop using animals and diffrent creative dustbins at govenments offices , stations etc. Instead they should all start to use statue of Arundhati Roy or anti-nationals as dustbins. Kind of love we all have for them it will help government to reduce garbage problem as well. We will kill two bird using one stone.
 

S.A.T.A

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May be the process of denying counter nationalists like Roy space to pedal their frivolity should start right here on this forum.If we stop posting any more of her senile writings,it would be a start.
 

captonjohn

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Kashmir issue has been an painful ulcer for India just because of some worse mistakes of our politicians. If Nehru didn't take this issue to UN then this problem could be not bigger as this it today. By the way after fighting four wars with Pakistan and continuously facing terrorism and terrorist attacks like 26/11, one thing is sure that this issue can't be solved on table. Pakistan has no intention to solve this issue and he just want to swallow whole kashmir for himself in the name of freedom of kashmiri people. This problem become more worse since when China has joined pakistan and supported pakistan by telling J&K is disputed area and blocking visa in separate paper. We all must hear the sound of incoming problem.

This issue can't be solved by politically, diplomatically hence military option is the last option and it will be solved by only this option as all options has failed to solve this problem. So the only solution to this problem is that India should prepare himself for a two front war and strengthen it's armed forces at that level that no Pak-China can win from India. I've researched a lot about this issue and learned that china has sent it's military personnel to POK along with military buildup which clearly indicates that something is smelling in these neighbor countries mind. I've also read some news from genuine sources that china has some sort of military plans for India in future and as a strategist I've no doubt in it. In short this option can only be solved by war because sometimes war is necessary to save peace. When India will have control over whole J&K including POK, COK and J&K then only this problem would solve. What do you think?
 

mehwish92

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say whatever you want about her. she may be a hypocrite. she may be a traitor. she may be an attention-seeking *****. and for the most part i'll agree.

but she said absolutely nothing wrong in this article.

well, other than her statement that indian nationalism is getting more aggressive and "Hinduized". I beg to differ with her on that.

Apart from that, what did she say wrong in this article?

Think abut Shakeel's son. When he grows older and learns about what happened to his mother, he will definitely be anti-India. Now imagine thousands of kids like him.

The more we ignore Kashmir, the more it will slip from our hands.
 

SHASH2K2

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say whatever you want about her. she may be a hypocrite. she may be a traitor. she may be an attention-seeking *****. and for the most part i'll agree.

but she said absolutely nothing wrong in this article.

well, other than her statement that indian nationalism is getting more aggressive and "Hinduized". I beg to differ with her on that.

Apart from that, what did she say wrong in this article?

Think abut Shakeel's son. When he grows older and learns about what happened to his mother, he will definitely be anti-India. Now imagine thousands of kids like him.

The more we ignore Kashmir, the more it will slip from our hands.
Think about all people who has been killed by Kashmiri terrorists and Maoists . What about pain of Kashmiri Pandits and people killed by Maoists? are they animals? People that B**** is supporting whom she is supporting are ones who started Violence and killing. I accept that there may be a few unpleasent incidences while dealing with those Anti-national elements but you cannot say that its supported by administration or its part of larger conspiracy against them.
 

S.A.T.A

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Some of my posts have gone missing,accident or deliberate ?.......some clarification would be helpful
 

Agnostic_Indian

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We should not have accepted tibet and taiwan as part of china unless they accept kashmir is integral part of india..We may re think our policy.
 
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Rage

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say whatever you want about her. she may be a hypocrite. she may be a traitor. she may be an attention-seeking *****. and for the most part i'll agree.

but she said absolutely nothing wrong in this article.

well, other than her statement that indian nationalism is getting more aggressive and "Hinduized". I beg to differ with her on that.

Apart from that, what did she say wrong in this article?

Think abut Shakeel's son. When he grows older and learns about what happened to his mother, he will definitely be anti-India. Now imagine thousands of kids like him.

The more we ignore Kashmir, the more it will slip from our hands.

mehwish, you may be right on the legitimacy of her views. But my point is, you can't look at the view or the opinion, devoid of the person. Arundhati Roy is a person, who lives in a million dollar home and talks about the plight of the Dalits. She decries state use of violence against the Maoists, on the one hand and justifies their use of violence, often against innocent, poor, unarmed and unwanting civilians, on the other. Charity begins at home, it is rightly said; And I'd like to see Arundhati step out of her house for once, and actually do something about the beggars down the street. I'd like to see her live by more modest means, before she criticizes, like a hypocrite, the wealth and ostentation of others. I'd like to see her suffer at the hands of violent miscreants, before she condones the use of violence by Maoists. Heck, she cried over the breaking of her flower pot! when BJP goons vandalized the plot outside her house. I'd like to see what she'd say, when it came down to breaking her nose!

Besides, no one, no matter how inane, espouses the breaking of their country, unless they've no love for the country in the first place. Do you think Kashmir would really be better off with Pakistan? Or for that matter, free? How entrepreneurial are they? What effort have they made, on their own, to establish social services? or educational institutions? or a working ambulance? Where are their leaders, when it comes down to the basic things of life?

They look to the state for everything. And against the state, violence they beget?
 
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