INS Vikrant Aircraft Carrier (IAC)

Tshering22

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blackleaf

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It would be optimistic to assume that the deal would be concluded before the General Elections in 2024. This was indicated by several former defence personnel. The only major deals that I see going through before PM Modi's return in May-June 2024 are the Tejas MK2 and anything related to TEDBF and AMCA.

Macron will be here for republic day. But that will probably be too soon for any deals.
 

Tshering22

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Macron will be here for the Republic Day. But that will probably be too soon for any deals.
Macron has bigger deals to sign other than these. France has been gearing up to diversify its economy outside of the conventional EU markets. Xi sees French interest as a cash cow and welcomes him and the Germans. But Macron knows that investing completely in China is a risk - thus, he is pushing for expanding French business interests in India as well. We offer him a more amenable market, whereas in China he will have a much weaker hand.

Naval Group, MBDA, Thales, and Safran, are just the defence companies. There is also a lot of interest in the French finance and fintech ecosystem regarding the Indian market. Those of you who monitor the financial markets and major M&As will see a lot more French involvement in the coming years.
 

FactsPlease

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Russia should just sell their 25 mig29k at 60m a pop to us . It's not like they have any use of those.
Unless Russia totally gives up any hope of carrier based wings for next 15~30 years. Selling those Mig29k will "cut" such a deep gap in naval wings capacity, and capability potential. With NATO esp USA still hanging over its head like sword of Damocles, hard to imagine Russia would give up such a strategic edge. Another "unless" is its LACM tech can make up this edge.
-- Off topic but, once Russia wins Ukraine "conflict", it should make best of this rare opportunity to supplement all long-waiting military needs, by diverting the resources being used for e.g. tanks & loitering missiles. Why? This opportunity is earned by the suffering from west sanctions. Russia had adjusted its economy and industry at such a huge cost. Exactly at this moment, it should reconsider all resource allocation, including technology and logistics sourcing, for next few decades. It won't have this luxury once war and sanction ends.
 

abingdonboy

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Russia should just sell their 25 mig29k at 60m a pop to us . It's not like they have any use of those.
You realise the issue is not availability of the 29K sales but the IN rejecting the type once they found out what a complete liability it is operationally? The Russians could be giving them away and they’d still probably be a bad deal

a lot has been published about why these things are a god awful military platform and I’ve heard even more disturbing things about them behind the scenes

if it was as simple as trying to get a discount the IN would have 90 MiG-29K/KUB orders to date (much less than that in service of course). MRCBF only exists because the 29K is effectively useless to the IN aside from surge Ops
 

binayak95

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You realise the issue is not availability of the 29K sales but the IN rejecting the type once they found out what a complete liability it is operationally? The Russians could be giving them away and they’d still probably be a bad deal

a lot has been published about why these things are a god awful military platform and I’ve heard even more disturbing things about them behind the scenes

if it was as simple as trying to get a discount the IN would have 90 MiG-29K/KUB orders to date (much less than that in service of course). MRCBF only exists because the 29K is effectively useless to the IN aside from surge Ops
Exactly! IN should offload the MiG29Ks to the IAF - but that mean that the VKD is reduced to a helo carrier so perhaps no.
 

abingdonboy

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Exactly! IN should offload the MiG29Ks to the IAF - but that mean that the VKD is reduced to a helo carrier so perhaps no.
At this rate it’s not that likely the 29Ks will outlive the Vikky by much and as it is neither the ship or planes are operating enough to be considered operational. They’ll both limp on for another ~10-15 years

it’s not even like the IN has enough helos to make use of a helo carrier. A training vessel is all she is at this point
 

binayak95

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At this rate it’s not that likely the 29Ks will outlive the Vikky by much and as it is neither the ship or planes are operating enough to be considered operational. They’ll both limp on for another ~10-15 years

it’s not even like the IN has enough helos to make use of a helo carrier. A training vessel is all she is at this point
Once the MH60Rs and the new tranches of Dhruvs come in, perhaps.
 

Tshering22

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At this rate it’s not that likely the 29Ks will outlive the Vikky by much and as it is neither the ship or planes are operating enough to be considered operational. They’ll both limp on for another ~10-15 years

it’s not even like the IN has enough helos to make use of a helo carrier. A training vessel is all she is at this point
So till the time the French send us the Rafales, Vikrant will likely remain a very big helicopter carrier from an availability point of view eh? MiG-29Ks often take off and land on carriers, but with availability below 60%, there is no guarantee as to how readily available is the fleet to fight.
 

Aniruddha Mulay

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So till the time the French send us the Rafales, Vikrant will likely remain a very big helicopter carrier from an availability point of view eh? MiG-29Ks often take off and land on carriers, but with availability below 60%, there is no guarantee as to how readily available is the fleet to fight.
Last time I checked, the Mig 29K had an availability of 70%.
It's high time people stop quoting the 2016 CAG report, that thing is almost 8 years old now.
 

Tshering22

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Last time I checked, the Mig 29K was available at 70%.
It's high time people stop quoting the 2016 CAG report, that thing is almost 8 years old now.
Hey don't get upset at me; the Navy isn't happy with it and the bottomline remains that they better be available when we need it the most. 70% is an acceptable available rate in many modern Western air forces. If that were the real availability, the Navy wouldn't be complaining.

The Rafale M was available even back then in 2004 when Vicky was being ordered. But Scamgress forced it down the Navy's throats.

We need new jets and the MiG-29Ks are nowhere as efficient as their Air Force counterparts are.
 

abingdonboy

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So till the time the French send us the Rafales, Vikrant will likely remain a very big helicopter carrier from an availability point of view eh? MiG-29Ks often take off and land on carriers, but with availability below 60%, there is no guarantee as to how readily available is the fleet to fight.
You’re as good as your weakest link, the 29Ks are abysmal

take from that what you will, no point in quoting %, those can be manipulated to show whatever you’d like. It’s obvious the carrier fleet is hobbled by their air arm
 

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