Indian nuclear submarines

[p2prada]

Understand mate that it's paint job, but then it's also the only way to have three missiles in one tube.

Oh, there are many methods. We can place them one over the other too, though the diameter of the sub will not be enough. We can even place 6 if the sub was big enough.

 

[p2prada]

A SLBM should be qualify for at least two requirement, one It should be water tight seal at the weapon bay lid so that water cannot entered into the compartment, second after the weapon bay lid is open their should be enough water tightness between the missile and the tube to form a gas escape for the missile from to submarine until it reaches the free air where its rocket boosters can be ignited. But if you make an arrangement for 3 missiles in one single lid, water can enter into the compartment and the missile may loose its water tight properties between the missile and the tube in the long run, if this problem can be solved then their shouldn't be a problem in its integration.

Before launch, one method is to fill the tube with certain amount of water so that the missile acts like a Piston during launch. The missiles are separated by gas bags filled with Nitrogen. So, water does not affect the other missiles. Even the spaces in the missile components are filled with pressured gas to keep water from entering.

 

[p2prada]

Lastly, none of our ATVs will be used for testing purposes. Nerpa and a couple of Akula 1s are more than enough for testing. Once the ATV is operational, it will be sent out to sea for a long time. All the testing will be carried out with hot nukes.

Most probably testing missiles will be conducted during the sea trials. Not to mention, the experience gained during the underwater Pontoon tests.

We don't have the luxury of waiting for ever to make our first sub operational. Every ATV will be sent out to sea as soon as they are ready.

 

[Yusuf]

Exactly my thoughts. I dont know why a lot of people thing its going to be a testing platform. No boomer can be a test platform. A billion dollar equipment cannot be just a test bed.

 

[venom]

Just my thought-

wouldn't it be better to operate 6000tons ATV Instead of Say some 9000 ton or 12000 ton one.?

clarification
Typhoon class SSBM of RUSSIA-
26000tons,Carries 20 Long range SLBM's[range 8000 - 12000 kms]

Indian ATV SSBM-
6000tons, Carries 12 K-15 SLBM[range 750 kms] or 4 Agni-3 SL [Range 3500kms].

In case of war it would b an advantage if the navy operates 4 ATV's instead of 1 Typhoon or US Ohio Class.The reason for this is-
1.In order to eliminate the chance of 2nd strike sub's, the enemy will have to destroy 4 ATV's Instead Of One Typhoon which is a difficult task.
2.V can surround The enemy from a no of sides instead of 1.
3.If the missiles are launched from 4 diff directions, the enemy will find it very difficult to track & intercept them.
4.It is easy to detect a large sub.
5.The enemy will have to divide its fleet various parts so as to search for 4 subs which makes them more venerable to attack.

So i think tat India should induct ATV's which are smaller rather than large ones.Building large subs is nothing more than show of strength.India should concentrate on building Subs which are more effective & deadly rather than large ones.

 

[Dark Sorrow]

One question to experts,
If we initiate the missile lauch sequence and open the lid for the missile but the decide not to lauch then lid of missile be closed. Now my question is can we again initiate the lauch sequence for that missile.

 

[venom]

As per my knowledge the lids are opened only when the final decision has been made....

 

[p2prada]

Just my thought-

wouldn't it be better to operate 6000tons ATV Instead of Say some 9000 ton or 12000 ton one.?

clarification
Typhoon class SSBM of RUSSIA-
26000tons,Carries 20 Long range SLBM's[range 8000 - 12000 kms]

Indian ATV SSBM-
6000tons, Carries 12 K-15 SLBM[range 750 kms] or 4 Agni-3 SL [Range 3500kms].

In case of war it would b an advantage if the navy operates 4 ATV's instead of 1 Typhoon or US Ohio Class.The reason for this is-
1.In order to eliminate the chance of 2nd strike sub's, the enemy will have to destroy 4 ATV's Instead Of One Typhoon which is a difficult task.
2.V can surround The enemy from a no of sides instead of 1.
3.If the missiles are launched from 4 diff directions, the enemy will find it very difficult to track & intercept them.
4.It is easy to detect a large sub.
5.The enemy will have to divide its fleet various parts so as to search for 4 subs which makes them more venerable to attack.

So i think tat India should induct ATV's which are smaller rather than large ones.Building large subs is nothing more than show of strength.India should concentrate on building Subs which are more effective & deadly rather than large ones.

That's right. But, the cost of operating many subs is definitely more than the cost of one big sub. Our doctrine must also take our economy into consideration. We are not US or erstwhile SU to be able to have many operational subs as of now. In the future, me may have a lot of subs with a larger displacement.

Also, a larger sub can dive deeper and obviously carry a lot of load. This has more advantages than a smaller one, especially when we start fielding ICBMs in the subs..

 

[venom]

But it would be a more effective & deadly deterrent........

 

[p2prada]

But it would be a more effective & deadly deterrent........

I did agree to it. Money is the problem.

 

[venom]

It might cost a bit more but there wont be more difference ........ If u want 2 have something u have to spend......in war numbers do matter....

 

[venom]

i cant just wait 2 c ATV in sea..........

 

[K Factor]

i cant just wait 2 c ATV in sea..........

SMS type language is discouraged here mate. Normal English looks better.

P2P, about the hot-nuke during trails, do you have a source, or is that speculation/educated guess?

 

[venom]

More than two decades after it was conceived, India’s first indigenously built nuclear submarine, for long called the Advanced Technology Vehicle project, is set for a quiet launch towards the end of this month. Christened INS Chakra after the Charlie class nuclear submarine taken on lease from the Soviet Union in 1988 for three years, it will be put out in the waters of the Bay of Bengal in Visakhapatnam harbour for sea trials.

Top government sources told The Indian Express that the Navy has been cleared for two more 7,000 tonne-Chakra class submarines with an in-principle clearance for another two of the same class. Completing the nuclear triad as envisaged in the Indian nuclear doctrine, INS Chakra will carry intermediate range submarine-launched missiles that have already been tested twice on the eastern coast.

The submarine was scheduled to be launched on July 26 but the date has now been changed because it also happens to be Kargil Victory Day and the government has no intention of sending any message to the neighbourhood. As of now, the plan is to quietly launch the submarine without fanfare or overt publicity. Even Defence Minister A K Antony is not expected to be present for the launch.

It will be nearly a year before the Chakra class submarine can take to the sea as the nuclear engine and its super structure will undergo rigorous tests in a special enclosure in the Vizag shipyard. For now, it will be put out in the waters, checked, fitted with parts and then put through tests in the waters. The tests and fitments over, it will be formally commissioned towards the end of next year.

Launched in the mid-1980s, the ATV project is now headed by Vice Admiral B Kanan whose wife Nirmala, incidentally, is the younger sister of Indian Ambassador to China and Foreign Secretary-designate Nirupama Rao. The submarine is going to be tested on India’s eastern seaboard and earlier plans of moving it to Karwar in Goa have been shelved for the time being. Instead, the first of the two Russian Akula class nuclear submarines that India is taking on lease will be deployed on the western seaboard.

The Chakra class submarine bridges a key gap in India’s minimum nuclear deterrence as the armed forces already have platforms for nuclear weapon delivery from sky and land through proven intermediate range nuclear missiles and aircraft-borne bombs.

The need for a nuclear submarine was felt by New Delhi as Beijing is moving towards a sea-based doctrine and already has one Xia class and two Jin class nuclear submarines with JL-1 and 2 series submarine-launched nuclear missiles. Each of these submarines carries up to 12 JL-1 or 2 strategic missiles. Even Pakistan has eight tactical submarines that have deep sea diving capability with advanced air propulsion and Harpoon missiles.

 

[p2prada]

P2P, about the hot-nuke during trails, do you have a source, or is that speculation/educated guess?

Its an educated guess. Do you remember the Atlantique that was shot down in Gujarat?

It was a training sortie. So, they were sucking up all the trons as the crew were being trained. You will see something similar with the ATV too. The crew will learn to operate the sub and at the same time the nukes will be ready to go.

 

[Sridhar]

More than two decades after it was conceived, India’s first indigenously built nuclear submarine, for long called the Advanced Technology Vehicle project, is set for a quiet launch towards the end of this month. Christened INS Chakra after the Charlie class nuclear submarine taken on lease from the Soviet Union in 1988 for three years, it will be put out in the waters of the Bay of Bengal in Visakhapatnam harbour for sea trials.

Top government sources told The Indian Express that the Navy has been cleared for two more 7,000 tonne-Chakra class submarines with an in-principle clearance for another two of the same class. Completing the nuclear triad as envisaged in the Indian nuclear doctrine, INS Chakra will carry intermediate range submarine-launched missiles that have already been tested twice on the eastern coast.

The submarine was scheduled to be launched on July 26 but the date has now been changed because it also happens to be Kargil Victory Day and the government has no intention of sending any message to the neighbourhood. As of now, the plan is to quietly launch the submarine without fanfare or overt publicity. Even Defence Minister A K Antony is not expected to be present for the launch.

It will be nearly a year before the Chakra class submarine can take to the sea as the nuclear engine and its super structure will undergo rigorous tests in a special enclosure in the Vizag shipyard. For now, it will be put out in the waters, checked, fitted with parts and then put through tests in the waters. The tests and fitments over, it will be formally commissioned towards the end of next year.

Launched in the mid-1980s, the ATV project is now headed by Vice Admiral B Kanan whose wife Nirmala, incidentally, is the younger sister of Indian Ambassador to China and Foreign Secretary-designate Nirupama Rao. The submarine is going to be tested on India’s eastern seaboard and earlier plans of moving it to Karwar in Goa have been shelved for the time being. Instead, the first of the two Russian Akula class nuclear submarines that India is taking on lease will be deployed on the western seaboard.

The Chakra class submarine bridges a key gap in India’s minimum nuclear deterrence as the armed forces already have platforms for nuclear weapon delivery from sky and land through proven intermediate range nuclear missiles and aircraft-borne bombs.

The need for a nuclear submarine was felt by New Delhi as Beijing is moving towards a sea-based doctrine and already has one Xia class and two Jin class nuclear submarines with JL-1 and 2 series submarine-launched nuclear missiles. Each of these submarines carries up to 12 JL-1 or 2 strategic missiles. Even Pakistan has eight tactical submarines that have deep sea diving capability with advanced air propulsion and Harpoon missiles.

Post the link , this is the second time i am informing you.

 

[shiv]

Atv online by month end

All set for a quiet launch of India's first indigenous N-submarine

More than two decades after it was conceived, India’s first indigenously built nuclear submarine, for long called the Advanced Technology Vehicle project, is set for a quiet launch towards the end of this month. Christened INS Chakra after the Charlie class nuclear submarine taken on lease from the Soviet Union in 1988 for three years, it will be put out in the waters of the Bay of Bengal in Visakhapatnam harbour for sea trials.

Top government sources told The Indian Express that the Navy has been cleared for two more 7,000 tonne-Chakra class submarines with an in-principle clearance for another two of the same class. Completing the nuclear triad as envisaged in the Indian nuclear doctrine, INS Chakra will carry intermediate range submarine-launched missiles that have already been tested twice on the eastern coast.

The submarine was scheduled to be launched on July 26 but the date has now been changed because it also happens to be Kargil Victory Day and the government has no intention of sending any message to the neighbourhood. As of now, the plan is to quietly launch the submarine without fanfare or overt publicity. Even Defence Minister A K Antony is not expected to be present for the launch.
It will be nearly a year before the Chakra class submarine can take to the sea as the nuclear engine and its super structure will undergo rigorous tests in a special enclosure in the Vizag shipyard. For now, it will be put out in the waters, checked, fitted with parts and then put through tests in the waters. The tests and fitments over, it will be formally commissioned towards the end of next year.


Launched in the mid-1980s, the ATV project is now headed by Vice Admiral B Kanan whose wife Nirmala, incidentally, is the younger sister of Indian Ambassador to China and Foreign Secretary-designate Nirupama Rao. The submarine is going to be tested on India’s eastern seaboard and earlier plans of moving it to Karwar in Goa have been shelved for the time being. Instead, the first of the two Russian Akula class nuclear submarines that India is taking on lease will be deployed on the western seaboard.

The Chakra class submarine bridges a key gap in India’s minimum nuclear deterrence as the armed forces already have platforms for nuclear weapon delivery from sky and land through proven intermediate range nuclear missiles and aircraft-borne bombs.

The need for a nuclear submarine was felt by New Delhi as Beijing is moving towards a sea-based doctrine and already has one Xia class and two Jin class nuclear submarines with JL-1 and 2 series submarine-launched nuclear missiles. Each of these submarines carries up to 12 JL-1 or 2 strategic missiles. Even Pakistan has eight tactical submarines that have deep sea diving capability with advanced air propulsion and Harpoon missiles.


All set for a quiet launch of India's first indigenous N-submarine

 

[shiv]

With the launching of atv by the months end,One question comes to mind,is a missile ranging only 800kms worth the effort and money???

cant we convert agni 3 or agni 5 and put it on the atv??

does sagarika have MIRV capablity?i think not.....

 

[Singh]

With the launching of atv by the months end,One question comes to mind,is a missile ranging only 800kms worth the effort and money???

A missile like Shourya/Sagarika ? Of course.

cant we convert agni 3 or agni 5 and put it on the atv??

Agni 3 is in the process of being converted into an SLBM.
Agni 5 is still in development stage, and theoretically it can be.

does sagarika have MIRV capablity?i think not.....

Nope and not will have in the future. Agni-3 will in all likelihood have MIRV capabilities.

 

[John]

Sagarika qualifies more as a Tactical missile and not is intended for MIRV "i'll wipe you out" purposes. Agni-3 SL is the true "i'll screw you while you sleep" weapon with ability to carry as many as 12 MIRVS, range between 5000km to 11600km on a lighter load, its the ideal SLBM. Sagarika in wars will most likely be used to take out critical and time limited targets or with a single warhead take out a massive formation or a nuke assembly complex or stuff like that, AGNI-3 SL will carry mk-2 MIRVS, this MIRV is more advanced than any other on the planet due to its unique design and flightpath.