Indian Counter Terror Operations Pictures & Discussions

[Sam@Indian]

PKM is 7.62x54R, interchangeable with Dragunov.

..PKM has it's 7.62x51 variants too....the same ammo that is being used in Bren-LMG's

 

[Sam@Indian]

The reason IA preferred magazine feed LMGs is because they are highly efficient in charge / assault, Bren is a older design but use magazine feed ammunition and is very accurate and light, Belt feed LMG are known as GPMG are different category and PKM falls into that, They are not efficient while charging or assault ..

...It's weird the whole world uses it But we're struck in the 1960's weapons....Bren's are heavier than PKM's....And,I though the main purpose of a GPMG was to provide covering fire rather than taking part in any Charge or Assault??.....My question is the whole World including Pakistan and China use Belt-fed GPMG's then Why Indian Army is struck to the Bren's??

 

[kr9]

...It's weird the whole world uses it But we're struck in the 1960's weapons....Bren's are heavier than PKM's....And,I though the main purpose of a GPMG was to provide covering fire rather than taking part in any Charge or Assault??.....My question is the whole World including Pakistan and China use Belt-fed GPMG's then Why Indian Army is struck to the Bren's??

Pakistan still uses the MG 42s. And IA uses a lot of INSAS LMGs as well. It is not all Bren. And as far as versatility is concerned, a drum mag would allow rapid reload as well a sustained fire for a longer duration. So we should be looking at integrating that into the INSAS LMGs.

 

[pmaitra]

..PKM has it's 7.62x51 variants too....the same ammo that is being used in Bren-LMG's

Ok, I see it is a Polish GPMG based on the PKM.

UKM-2000P machine gun

 

[Kunal Biswas]

Not only the Belt feed machine gun is inefficient in any charge or assault but as well In combat its the entire squad or platoon carry the ammunition for the LMG, Carrying such large amount of weight has issues on long runs, For these very reason LMG comes with magazines as well, If you ask any Infantry man of any nation abt his opinion regarding Belt feed and Magazine feed LMG in long range patrols and assault, His preference will be magazine..

RPK and Negav and Ultimax 100 use drum as well as magazine ..

My question is the whole World including Pakistan and China use Belt-fed GPMG's then Why Indian Army is struck to the Bren's??

 

[Zulfiqar Khan]

Indian Army does not target civilians. Targeting civilians is not an option, no matter what PA does. Unless there is solid proof, such suggestions should never be made. It only makes India look like the bad guy in international fora.

Compare Civilian to Military deaths

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/India–Pakistan_border_skirmishes_(2014–present)
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2013_India–Pakistan_border_skirmishes
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2011_India–Pakistan_border_skirmish

I lived at Sialkot; which is right on the border. At night you could hear series of constant bombardment; I have family members at a village that is very close to the border fence. Usually skirmishes begin with very small and isolated firefights at night which signals that mortar attacks and shelling will begin the next night - it is when all villages bordering the fence are evacuated. But on eid indiscriminate shelling fell upon the village with no warning - the next we were called over to see the sight of dead livestock (mostly cows), blood and just complete destruction.

Despite ranger outposts being quite open and far away from the villages; it is only the villages that are targeted - the only military casualties on our side happens during isolated firefights or emergency evac/medic teams sent into shelled villages.

If you look at the minarets at each mosque at the border; it will not be uncommon to find bullets marks.

I'll try to get my cousin to make a video and send it; so I may share it on this forum.

I do not know what happens much on the Indian side, but I notice most fire is focused on military targets or fields rather than villages.

I once asked a ranger and he replied it was because many villagers on the other side were Muslims as well, I was pretty pissed at the answer that he was willing kill people on the basis of their religion alone; but meh - the answer was better than nothing.

 

[AbRaj]

Compare Civilian to Military deaths

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/India–Pakistan_border_skirmishes_(2014–present)
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2013_India–Pakistan_border_skirmishes
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2011_India–Pakistan_border_skirmish

I lived at Sialkot; which is right on the border. At night you could hear series of constant bombardment; I have family members at a village that is very close to the border fence. Usually skirmishes begin with very small and isolated firefights at night which signals that mortar attacks and shelling will begin the next night - it is when all villages bordering the fence are evacuated. But on eid indiscriminate shelling fell upon the village with no warning - the next we were called over to see the sight of dead livestock (mostly cows), blood and just complete destruction.

Despite ranger outposts being quite open and far away from the villages; it is only the villages that are targeted - the only military casualties on our side happens during isolated firefights or emergency evac/medic teams sent into shelled villages.

If you look at the minarets at each mosque at the border; it will not be uncommon to find bullets marks.

I'll try to get my cousin to make a video and send it; so I may share it on this forum.

I do not know what happens much on the Indian side, but I notice most fire is focused on military targets or fields rather than villages.

I once asked a ranger and he replied it was because many villagers on the other side were Muslims as well, I was pretty pissed at the answer that he was willing kill people on the basis of their religion alone; but meh - the answer was better than nothing.

, yes we all know Paki army are marde momins /mujahids who doesn't kill civilians specially Muslims. Nevvvvver....
Instead they first declare them traitors /infidels /"not very pure "Muslims and then only peacefully kill/bomb them. Also They train their "non-conventional wing"aka "terrorists" by some infidels and then do suicide bombing at civilian places like markets, streets, hotels, railway stations. But ofcourse the victims are infidels so it's very much justified by pious Paki Muslims and their Allah send army:grin:.
Btw thanks you for letting us know the fucked up thinking of mujji army.

 

[Sam@Indian]

Not only the Belt feed machine gun is inefficient in any charge or assault but as well In combat its the entire squad or platoon carry the ammunition for the LMG, Carrying such large amount of weight has issues on long runs, For these very reason LMG comes with magazines as well, If you ask any Infantry man of any nation abt his opinion regarding Belt feed and Magazine feed LMG in long range patrols and assault, His preference will be magazine..

RPK and Negav and Ultimax 100 use drum as well as magazine ..

..But,Every Military in the world almost uses Belt-Fed General Purpose Machine Guns like PKM or M60's etc.....I completely agree with you that LMG's with Magazines like INSAS,RPK,M27 are better when compared to only belt fed LMG's like RPD...But,I just only wanted to know that Why Bren LMG or We can Bren GPMG is not getting replaced by PKM variants???....
http://ofbindia.gov.in/products/data/weapons/wsc/16.htm
This Bren Derivative is heavier than PKM's and Does not provide the same amount of Fire Power as Belt Fed Machine guns.
As, I've already mentioned that I agree with you that Magazine fed LMG's are better than Belt Fed LMG's....But, I've haven't seen a 100-Round Drum magazine for INSAS LMG's as there is for RPK-74M's or a 150-Round Beta-C-Mag for M27 IAR.....But, I think IWI Negev's 5.56 LMG's is the best in the World when it comes to fire power,mobility,reliability and enhancements.

 

[sydsnyper]

@Sam@Indian - here is another perspective on your question...


This adds credence to what Kunal has been trying to explain with belt fed machine guns.

 

[Bornubus]

No Jihadi gives a 2 fuk about 5.56 Negev, that's why RR still prefer LMG and Pika by Para.

The sound of it's fire send a chill to their Spine while Kashmiri Mullah run around "woh LMG waley aa Gaye"a


Now mgl has been used extensively to complement LMG's firepower.

 

[Bornubus]

Yesterday, i took some pics from Mana near Indo - China Border.

The units posted here are "A coy" Garhwal Scouts and Grenadiers

And they are using Mahendra XTVs in rugged terrain

Not sure about this UAV but seems like Heron ?

And Army is generating its own electricity by Wind

 

[Kunal Biswas]

Bren comes into LMG category for above we have MMG that is for fixed position and vehicle mounted ..

Army has issued RFI both domestic and foreign for such GPMG, It is realized that such firearm are needed, It is not clear though this is for only Special forces or Regular Infantry.

..But,Every Military in the world almost uses Belt-Fed General Purpose Machine Guns like PKM or M60's etc.....I completely agree with you that LMG's with Magazines like INSAS,RPK,M27 are better when compared to only belt fed LMG's like RPD...But,I just only wanted to know that Why Bren LMG or We can Bren GPMG is not getting replaced by PKM variants???....
http://ofbindia.gov.in/products/data/weapons/wsc/16.htm

====================

Enjoy the cold fresh mountain air, I miss it ..

Do you have leopards there ?

Yesterday, i took some pics from Mana near Indo - China Border.

 

[Shaitan]

..But,Every Military in the world almost uses Belt-Fed General Purpose Machine Guns like PKM or M60's etc.....I completely agree with you that LMG's with Magazines like INSAS,RPK,M27 are better when compared to only belt fed LMG's like RPD...But,I just only wanted to know that Why Bren LMG or We can Bren GPMG is not getting replaced by PKM variants???....
http://ofbindia.gov.in/products/data/weapons/wsc/16.htm
This Bren Derivative is heavier than PKM's and Does not provide the same amount of Fire Power as Belt Fed Machine guns.
As, I've already mentioned that I agree with you that Magazine fed LMG's are better than Belt Fed LMG's....But, I've haven't seen a 100-Round Drum magazine for INSAS LMG's as there is for RPK-74M's or a 150-Round Beta-C-Mag for M27 IAR.....But, I think IWI Negev's 5.56 LMG's is the best in the World when it comes to fire power,mobility,reliability and enhancements.

The army requires a belt fed LMG now. DRDO is making one.

 

[pmaitra]

Compare Civilian to Military deaths

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/India–Pakistan_border_skirmishes_(2014–present)
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2013_India–Pakistan_border_skirmishes
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2011_India–Pakistan_border_skirmish

I lived at Sialkot; which is right on the border. At night you could hear series of constant bombardment; I have family members at a village that is very close to the border fence. Usually skirmishes begin with very small and isolated firefights at night which signals that mortar attacks and shelling will begin the next night - it is when all villages bordering the fence are evacuated. But on eid indiscriminate shelling fell upon the village with no warning - the next we were called over to see the sight of dead livestock (mostly cows), blood and just complete destruction.

Despite ranger outposts being quite open and far away from the villages; it is only the villages that are targeted - the only military casualties on our side happens during isolated firefights or emergency evac/medic teams sent into shelled villages.

If you look at the minarets at each mosque at the border; it will not be uncommon to find bullets marks.

I'll try to get my cousin to make a video and send it; so I may share it on this forum.

I do not know what happens much on the Indian side, but I notice most fire is focused on military targets or fields rather than villages.

I once asked a ranger and he replied it was because many villagers on the other side were Muslims as well, I was pretty pissed at the answer that he was willing kill people on the basis of their religion alone; but meh - the answer was better than nothing.

Interesting you mention firing on Eid. Are you aware of attacks on Amarnath Pilgrims?

It was Pakistan that started mixing religion with politics, not India.

Just so that you understand, since 1989 till 1994, it was mainly the BSF and J&K police who did COIN operations. Majority of J&K police involved were/are Muslims. It was the jihadis who burnt down Hazratbal, which was restored by the Indian Government.

I hope you are not trying to divide the people of India.

 

[sydsnyper]

If your humanity does so trouble you over innocent deaths, raise your voice against this nonsense:

https://www.amnesty.org/en/countries/asia-and-the-pacific/pakistan/report-pakistan/

You'll be hated by the mullas, chased down by your ISI and army, but it depends whether in all your magnanimity you have the guts to stand by your words.

And also read this before you drool over your ISPR propaganda:

https://www.hrw.org/news/2014/07/23/dispatches-media-muzzled-pakistans-waziristan-offensive

Compare Civilian to Military deaths

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/India–Pakistan_border_skirmishes_(2014–present)
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2013_India–Pakistan_border_skirmishes
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2011_India–Pakistan_border_skirmish

I lived at Sialkot; which is right on the border. At night you could hear series of constant bombardment; I have family members at a village that is very close to the border fence. Usually skirmishes begin with very small and isolated firefights at night which signals that mortar attacks and shelling will begin the next night - it is when all villages bordering the fence are evacuated. But on eid indiscriminate shelling fell upon the village with no warning - the next we were called over to see the sight of dead livestock (mostly cows), blood and just complete destruction.

Despite ranger outposts being quite open and far away from the villages; it is only the villages that are targeted - the only military casualties on our side happens during isolated firefights or emergency evac/medic teams sent into shelled villages.

If you look at the minarets at each mosque at the border; it will not be uncommon to find bullets marks.

I'll try to get my cousin to make a video and send it; so I may share it on this forum.

I do not know what happens much on the Indian side, but I notice most fire is focused on military targets or fields rather than villages.

I once asked a ranger and he replied it was because many villagers on the other side were Muslims as well, I was pretty pissed at the answer that he was willing kill people on the basis of their religion alone; but meh - the answer was better than nothing.

 

[Sam@Indian]

Pakistan still uses the MG 42s. And IA uses a lot of INSAS LMGs as well. It is not all Bren. And as far as versatility is concerned, a drum mag would allow rapid reload as well a sustained fire for a longer duration. So we should be looking at integrating that into the INSAS LMGs.

...Actually,Pakistan Armed Forces use Rheinmetall MG3,which is different from MG-42's
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rheinmetall_MG_3
Bren Machine gun is being used a GPMG is my biggest concern.....A GPMG is meant to posses the capability of firing at a target for a longer duration when compared to a LMG.....Bren LMG is heavier than PKM variants and it's fire power is also very less...Hence, it gives a disadvantage to Infantry troops....Also,Bren LMG's used by Indian Army uses Steel Magazines leading to more weight issues.
I agree with you that INSAS LMG's require a high capacity magazines like 45-Round magazines and a 100-Round drum magazines for providing covering fire to troops for a longer duration....But,there should be some other external change to i.e. the Barrel length of INSAS LMG should be increased and it's fixed butt stock should be replaced with either a polymer folding butt stock or a modern butt stock with both the capabilities of getting collapsed as well as folded when required.

 

[Sam@Indian]

@Sam@Indian - here is another perspective on your question...


This adds credence to what Kunal has been trying to explain with belt fed machine guns.

The same British Army now uses FN MAG as it's General Purpose machine gun...The era that video is referring to didn't have the concept of Assault rifles or Carbines....In World War 2 only Germans developed a Assault rifle but Americans,British and others were clueless about it....The LMG's of those era are Now referred to as GPMG's (General Purpose Machine guns).......In modern scenario a LMG or SAW is the weapon that uses the same ammunition as being used by the standard assault rifle of that Army...That SAW or LMG could be belt fed or magazine fed or even available with both options.
On the other hand a GPMG is the weapon that can provide the fire power of a MMG in such a way that it could be used by Infantry troop for both the purpose of Defence and attack.
There have been many improvements in the design of GPMG's be it M60,MG3 or PKM machine guns....Nowadays,there are many reports that many Nations are trying to make GPMG's with a Semi-Auto mode along with the Full-Auto mode to allow the gunner to fight on it's own and without being dependent on other soldiers.
I've No Doubt that Regular infantry troops require a larger number of LMG's but a considerable presence of GPMG's is also very important.

 

[Bornubus]

Bren comes into LMG category for above we have MMG that is for fixed position and vehicle mounted ..

Army has issued RFI both domestic and foreign for such GPMG, It is realized that such firearm are needed, It is not clear though this is for only Special forces or Regular Infantry.



====================

Enjoy the cold fresh mountain air, I miss it ..

Do you have leopards there ?

Yes, including the rare Snow Leopard spotted last year at Niti but i've never seen it.

My cousin engineer unit has made and repair Army Posts here.

 

[Hardi]

View attachment 8543
View attachment 8544

View attachment 8546

Ak with foregrip


View attachment 8545


@Kunal Biswas which offers better protection Patka or this regular helmet ?

View attachment 8542

I think PATKA is look horable and It's an Indian army id.... great

 

[Bornubus]

I think PATKA is look horable

Bhai Army apna Sir Bachaye gi ya Looks dekhegi ?