Indian Army's 'Future Soldier Program' will make our soldiers the most feared on the planet

Blood+

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along with rifles indian army also requires handheld machine guns,
Go read about PKM and FN MAG 58s,the two standard issue GPMGs in use by the Indian Army!!And guess what,even the US forces use the MAGs.

indian army using ww2 and cold war era handheld machine guns,,
So does all the other armies,including that of the USA!!The M240 is nothing but the same FN MAG 58 that is standard issue in Indian Army!!
while usa army got m60,m240,m265 handheld machine guns and their new versions,
M60 is a flat out junk and since has been substituted by the FN MAG,the same one ehich has been in use in ia FOR AGES!!

drdo is bs
Yeah yeah,like we haven't heard this one before,go find something new kiddo.
r
equires pvt. players like kalyani who can took up this task like they did about howitzers.
Kalyani didn't do shit kiddo!!You heard me right,they didn't do shit by themselves!!All they did was to buy up the design blueprints of the GC-45 howitzer,developed way back in the early 70s,by the company named Space Research Corporation (SRC),owned by a Canadian engineer by the name Gerald Bull,who was assassinated in 1990,in Brussels,Belgium!!
So in all practical intents and purpose,the total time and resources sunk in by the Kalyani is akin to a,you guessed it right......................a big fat FUCKING ZERO!!ZILCH!!NADA!!
 
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Blood+

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..world fear Soldier????

first I love my country nd Indian army...

but.. reality is reality.


Ok we have.. world 's 3 Rd army.. in number (only)

it means not that... ki we r super army...

lookk... yaar. this is 21st century... nd here number doesn't matter...

all. supre power army... Us, UK , France, germany, China Russia, s Korea, Japan, also European countries, are morden than us.. it's a bitter truth...

we have just number 13,00,000 army personal

than
we have not primary world class rifle. ( we use 1999 se insas use after that not change

we have not our primary tank..arjun is since 1980 se developing me hae..abhi tak koi.. final model not for use in war... that's while we had to purchase t90 from Russia.

we hav not primary IFV abhay.programme not move since2004. we use bmp2 1975 se use kar rahe hai..

we have not.. Body armor for all persons since 2008 attck, also using 303 rifle..we had not smg,lmg, for police.

we have not any.. Anti meterial rifles.. pak have m82(barret).. Chinese also use like that wepone locally produced...

our mig 21 pass it's all work..period..
fir bhi koi.. naye jets... nai kharide ja sake jo 2010 me aa jane chahiy ethe.

our army have not Attck helicopter which is 21 and century demands... icv not.. in good to use.. our icv. have not ant.. big caliber weapon..(20,25,30mm gun)
we have old problem.
that..is..our.. defense..company.. made a program..made a plastic model.. and fram it..
after that they...spent in that.. prograam lots of money also

time... nd after long period lots of testing nd research theu..not find that.what.they.said....


haadd hai..yaar....
nd then.... army need that technology..must... so government buy it.from international suppliers to paid big.. cost...Arjun, ifv, akash sam, astra ATA missle, insas rifle, lca's engine, Druv heli's 70% parts, even bullet also.we have to import...


vaddi.vaddi..bate bandh..karo... jawan sahid.ho..rahe hai...
Do try write your shit in a manner that is understandable to people other than your self from here on,all right??
 

Blood+

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...........................................................................................................
 
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Blood+

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1) Good light BPJ and Helmets
You can either have a 'good' body armor,or a 'light' body armor!,but can not have both at the same time,at least not for the time being,not with present level of advancements into material sciences..............and unless and until some radically new discovery is made wrt new types of super hardened and ultra light weight materials,what you just mentioned will remain a pipe dream only!!
Just go through these following video links to try and figure out what I'm trying to convey here,find out the vast differences between steel and ceramic plates and their respective protective values and durability and I'm sure these will go a long way in putting to rest a lot of common misconceptions prevalent about the terminal ballistics of different rifle ammunitions :
1.Armor Plate Tests : Part
2.Armor Plate Tests : Part II
3.Ballistic Plate Comparison - AR500 - SafeGuard Polyethylene - Ceramic SAPI
4.Shooting A Ceramic Level 4 Plate With An AR-15
5. 5.56 green tip SS109 VS. AR500 Ballistic steel armor
6.90 Green Tip Penetrators vs Body Armor
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=d2TBoP9Aoow
7.Shoot out...Ceramic against AR500
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=b39MQxIi0mc

These above footages puts it beyond any doubt that,as of now,as things stands,the steel armor plates,although quite a bit heavier than their polythene and Ceramic counterparts,also provides far greater level of protection against a lot more number of hits from different cartridges and that too at a fraction of cost of the Ceramics!!So my advice to our soldiers would be to stop being pussies and stop your gruntings and moanings about weight,just hit the gyms and bulk up!!
2)Helmet mounted sights
Can not argue there.
3) Reliable advanced Rifles with UBGL and modern all weather sights.
Again,can't be argued,although the UBGLs and sights are now being made available,albeit at a rate slower than desirable,I

admit.
This cannot and should not be turned into a two decade long DRDO

jamboree
You want the Ferrari,then be ready to pay for the Ferrari.But if you pay for peanuts,you will only get peanuts in

return,it never gets simpler than that!!Don't blame the DRDO for the Government paying them with peanuts and then expect

them to deliver something like the ARX in return and the former failing to deliver for the obvious reasons!!If you want

them to deliver quality products,then be ready to make quantum increase to that joke of an R&D budget you allocate to them

every year!!Otherwise,the situation will continue to remain the same I'm afraid.
Indian Companies like http://www.mku.com/ ,

http://tonboimaging.com/wp/products-2/soldier-systems/ need to be brought in as amanufacturing and consulting partners

while the OFB needs to be taken into account to finalize and bring the MSMC and MCIWS programs to fruition.
Sensors et all can be kept in development simultaneously and incremental upgrades can be brought in accordingly.
Nice suggestion really,now do pass this on to the higher ups in the Indian Army!
 

Bornubus

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Paki and Chinese are getting ahead head in terms of modernization, we shouldn't lag behind,especially when an average NCO earn equal to paki commissioned officer.

On LoC we still use Patka while paki started using Ballistic helmet,they have long range sniper we have 60s Dragunov.

IMG-20150417-WA0005.jpg
 

FRYCRY

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Paki and Chinese are getting ahead head in terms of modernization, we shouldn't lag behind,especially when an average NCO earn equal to paki commissioned officer.

On LoC we still use Patka while paki started using Ballistic helmet,they have long range sniper we have 60s Dragunov.

View attachment 7293
8487_10153629847609130_3229490038846877022_n.jpg


paki soldiers seems well equipped these days
 

Blood+

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On LoC we still use Patka while paki started using Ballistic helmet,
The Patka provides NIJ level III protection against M43 rounds fired from a distance of 10 meters and against M80 rounds from 50 meters!!No ballistic helmet can provide you with that level of protection,all they are any good against are just splinters and shrapnel!!
they have long range sniper we have 60s Dragunov.

View attachment 7293
Again you made an alimentary mistake son!!The Dragunov is not used as a sniper rifle in Indian Army but it's used as a DMR!!Go read up the difference between the two.The standard issue sniper rifles in use by Indian Army snipers are Mauser Sp 66s and HK PSG-1s.
 

Bornubus

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The Patka provides NIJ level III protection against M43 rounds fired from a distance of 10 meters and against M80 rounds from 50 meters!!No ballistic helmet can provide you with that level of protection,all they are any good against are just splinters and shrapnel!!

Again you made an alimentary mistake son!!The Dragunov is not used as a sniper rifle in Indian Army but it's used as a DMR!!Go read up the difference between the two.The standard issue sniper rifles in use by Indian Army snipers are Mauser Sp 66s and HK PSG-1s.
My young son,i am well aware of the difference between Marksman and Sniper rifle.what i was pointed that there is no sniper in service which outclass what pakis have on LOC including M 82 and SSG 69.

No matter what is the standard sniper of army,they still use Dragunov in large number and some vidhwansak as well.
 
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Blood+

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My young son,i am well aware of the difference between Marksman and Sniper rifle.
Oh I highly doubt that my dear little sweet innocent grand daughter,otherwise you wouldn't have compared apples with oranges!!
what i was pointed that there is no sniper in service which outclass what pakis have on LOC including M 82 and SSG 69.No matter what is the standard sniper of army,they still use Dragunov in large number and some vidhwansak as well.
Again wrong!!Both the PSG1s and SP 66 are more or less at the same level with Steyer SSG 69 you mentioned of.And as for matching the M 82s are concerned,sure those things are lighter than what IA has,lighter by quite a bit,but if we consider the destructive power of the M82 and then that of the Denel NTW 20s/Vidhyanshak ,the former doesn't even come in comparison with the later!!
 

HariPrasad-1

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No wonder the world make fun of us.
When we fire a tiny size rocket, world made fun of us. When we said that we are going to make rss aircraft, they made fun of us. When we said that we will launch a mars mission, they said that money be better spent on poors. Let them make fun of us once again.
 

Bornubus

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Oh I highly doubt that my dear little sweet innocent grand daughter,otherwise you wouldn't have compared apples with oranges!!

Again wrong!!Both the PSG1s and SP 66 are more or less at the same level with Steyer SSG 69 you mentioned of.And as for matching the M 82s are concerned,sure those things are lighter than what IA has,lighter by quite a bit,but if we consider the destructive power of the M82 and then that of the Denel NTW 20s/Vidhyanshak ,the former doesn't even come in comparison with the later!!
My infant child,i never made a comparison between a sniper and a DMR,open your tiny eyes and re read that post again,before your elders takes you to sleep.

Pakis had SSG 69 even in Kargil,while IA still operate SVDs,the past few of our casualties are due to sniper fire.
 
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kr9

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True,except they have got those cumbersome G3A3s,those things are dinosaurs really.
Which unfortunately kills better and kills at longer ranges than the INSAS and AKMs.

Scraped or not; with or without a fancy acronym, we need to drastically modernize our military.

We should improve our soldiers' look and physique.
Handlebar moustaches and the Rajputana styles are good but we should ban moustaches that look like shoe brushes, especially when combined with double chins and pot bellies.

Looking at the bigger picture, we should streamline and organize our command structure and army composition. We should be training & equipping our average soldiers in long range combat (up to 600 meters), martial arts and manoeuvre warfare, coordinated battle training with IAF & IN, and developing additional multi-role and specialised regiments or battalions; for eg:- maybe a dedicated recon & sniper division (I agree with our honourable members), more mechanized infantry divisions etc.

Coming to the gear:- standardized uniforms and camo would be nice - with dark monochromatic insignias, flag and name patches (our current gaudy tricolour & gold would be visible even in a dense jungle).

Side-arms, combat knifes, toolkits; Body armour, tactical vests, back packs; rifles with optics & iron sights (I hope our TAR-21s have back up iron sights) - will top everything off nicely.
 

Senyor Sandeep

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Everyone seems to be a PhD holding expert in every area in this forum and in India in general. Country could be much better if only these people could move their butts out of this forum and do some real field work with their expertise. Many seem like empty vessels making useless noise.
 

punjab47

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@kr9 lol that's our heritage, just allow open beard & our army will look fiercest.

Who cares about 'look' war is not fashion contest.
 

Chinmoy

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Which unfortunately kills better and kills at longer ranges than the INSAS and AKMs.

Scraped or not; with or without a fancy acronym, we need to drastically modernize our military.

We should improve our soldiers' look and physique.
Handlebar moustaches and the Rajputana styles are good but we should ban moustaches that look like shoe brushes, especially when combined with double chins and pot bellies.

Looking at the bigger picture, we should streamline and organize our command structure and army composition. We should be training & equipping our average soldiers in long range combat (up to 600 meters), martial arts and manoeuvre warfare, coordinated battle training with IAF & IN, and developing additional multi-role and specialised regiments or battalions; for eg:- maybe a dedicated recon & sniper division (I agree with our honourable members), more mechanized infantry divisions etc.

Coming to the gear:- standardized uniforms and camo would be nice - with dark monochromatic insignias, flag and name patches (our current gaudy tricolour & gold would be visible even in a dense jungle).

Side-arms, combat knifes, toolkits; Body armour, tactical vests, back packs; rifles with optics & iron sights (I hope our TAR-21s have back up iron sights) - will top everything off nicely.
I think you are talking about the men when they are in Garrison. I've seen these people carrying out combing ops and COIN ops. The camo they use in those situations are totally different from what we see in day to day life. Even up there in mountain, they do sport different camo during there time in post and patroling. For a place like India, you simply can't fix a standard of gear.
 

kr9

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Everyone seems to be a PhD holding expert in every area in this forum and in India in general. Country could be much better if only these people could move their butts out of this forum and do some real field work with their expertise. Many seem like empty vessels making useless noise.
Corruption, more value on 'who you know' & educational tags (B.Tech, MBA etc) than ideas / talent, general apathy in the society regarding armed forces - lots of reasons.

And yes, I was also an idiot and did not opt for an engineering / science course in college (DRDO, ARDE is out).
I was an even bigger idiot and stupid when I could have joined IMA.
I take full responsibility for these.

But I hope that this forum can generate more interest in the population and that the bigwigs may actually notice the sensible info in here and act on them.

I am truly sorry and understand that this sounds defeatist, but I am open to ideas on how to put our case in front of the military and those in defence research (other than writing letters to the authorities, which I have done and is probably in the trash by now).

But I appreciate your zeal.
 

Blood+

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We should be training & equipping our average soldiers in long range combat (upto 600 meters),
The present range is good enough in my humble opinion.The present standard range for what the soldiers are trained in the firing ranges is 400 meters without scopes,same as our NCC,which in my opinion is adequate.You have to understand that,standard engagements rarely take place beyond 250-300 yards,and even that might be an overstatement as it is.Cause even with scopes,it's quite challenging to score hits on human sized targets beyond that ranges
martial arts
Irrelevant mostly,cause those flashy moves that looks so good on Chinese movies can never be performed when the average grunt is carrying a load out of 35 kgs!!And besides,in today's battlefield,if you run out of ammo,then you are pretty much screwed!!You can be a black belt in one hundred different styles and disciplines and all but as long as your opponent has got live ammunition left,he won't give you spare you any opportunity to go Bruce Lee on him,instead he will simply put a bullet right between your eyes and that would be the end of line for you bud.
There is a saying in the US military and it goes something like this,"during a CQB,the one with the last bullet left would come out victorious 9 out of 10 times!!
I would say,IA instead of some flashy and fancy martial arts training,IA should introduce something in the line of SOCP and Krav Maga ,the later being already made it to the training regime of SFs and Ghataks.
and manoeuvre warfare,
The IA has been practising and perfecting the manoeuvre warfare ever since General K Sunderjee became the COAS!!
coordinated battle training with IAF & IN,
That's being done as we speak,through yearly exercises.
and developing additional multi-role and specialised regiments or battalions;for eg:- maybe a dedicated recon & sniper division (I agree with our honourable members), more mechanized infantry divisions etc.
That's quite imperative and can not argue there really.
Coming to the gear:- standardized uniforms and camo would be nice - with dark monochromatic insignias, flag and name patches (our current gaudy tricolour & gold would be visible even in a dense jungle).
True that,I think they should standardise on MARPAT pattern,of course,customised for Indian conditions,catering for different terrains and all.
Side-arms,
Side arms is not needed for regular infantry.Instead,make provision to carry more numbers of rifle ammunition would be desirable.
combat knifes,
Khukries are good enough,those are extremely versatile and also come in very handy as a throwing weapon.
toolkits; Body armour, tactical vests, back packs; rifles with optics & iron sights (I hope our TAR-21s have back up iron sights) - will top everything off nicely.
Barring the tool kits,all of these items have been made available a long ago.
 

kr9

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The present standard range for what the soldiers are trained in the firing ranges is 400 meters without scopes,same as our NCC,which in my opinion is adequate.You have to understand that,standard engagements rarely take place beyond 250-300 yards,and even that might be an overstatement as it is.
I agree that usually that would be the case. But I was thinking of the terrain that makes up our borders - in particular the deserts of western India and the Himalayan ranges where combat is not limited to 300 meters.
If the enemy is high on a peak, won't our 300 meters feel like 500 meters shooting up?

And I apologize, 'martial arts' was a poor choice of word. But some hand to hand combat technique is necessary that will help in closed environments like inside a house, maybe.
 

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