Indian Army Artillery

Blood+

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It's really weird to call somebody a "senile old man"
He's old as fuck. No really, he IS.
but simultaneously internet quarterback on your obsession with tanks and how that qualifies you to say Arjun is a bad tank. Your obsession currently nets you $0.
Facts are often too bitter to swallo, I know. But I'd still advise you to stop crying over it.
 

cyclops

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Could it be that DRDO knew that IA was gonna tank the ATAGS which is why they released that tender last month for the laser ignition system for ATAGS, which should reduce the weight by overall removing the need for a primer based ignition system?:hmm:

The acquisition dates seem aggressive enough....

 

Blood+

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read on twitter that the time for setting up m777 towed on site and packing it up is just ~2 mins . thought it would in 10 - 20 min range.
Yeah, same. There's a lot of misconception and misinformation.
chinese seem to have gone for wheeled ones . wonder which is really good of LAC .
Really would depend on the terrain and the situation. The biggest plus of towed systems is their strategic mobility - you can air-drop those things pretty much anywhere there is a patch of flat ground, the same can not be done with self-propelled ones.
 

kharabela

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read on twitter that the time for setting up m777 towed on site and packing it up is just ~2 mins . thought it would in 10 - 20 min range.

chinese seem to have gone for wheeled ones . wonder which is really good of LAC .
Mounted gun system provides shoot and scoot capability . Thus more immune to counter battery fire . Minimize ability to locate and fire the position . Also the idea is it is less time taking to prepare a mounted system . It has its own benefits . Mix of towed and mounted is the right way for a army .
 

another_armchair

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Mounted gun system is gone too, if no new indigenous guns come during this government
Rest assured we will.be fighting the chink with obsolete 130 mm towed guns
Amd some documentary will say ij 2050 ( ye topen bohot modern hai. Ye itni bhaari hai ki inko base camp me parts me laya jata hai aur fir reassemble kiya jata hai. ) deal with it and cope
Bharat forge literally has more guns to offer than army has in service.
Lo private came , and they did a splendid effort. See how it ended finally.
All these rfi will extend beyond 2024 and if the present government will not come back the import shimport ban list will be used as a toilet paper and the guns will not come. They will never come .
Never ever. Mind it .
What you thought, army ko option Doge to army khus hogi , aree nai army tumhare options ko sabotage karegi .
After all this army is very similar to pakis , its good Nehru and his successors showed them their place initially or the nation would have been ruined by them just like pakis did .
Or its the fact that, the officers of manekshaws type are not just made anymore now .
Inko kisi cheez ka free hand mat do Yaar, especially equipment ka to hargiz nai , ask them the generals grill them as to why should the nation import stuff when it has so many options at home. And if they say its necessary then ask to do with what they have , even considering import should be restricted
If nothing think about forex .
India Super Power 2020, then 2030 is a meme friends, the army shows it.
The Chinese induct their own stuff, the Indian private companies and drdo developed a comparable and better gun, but no inki wafadari Israel ko leke zyada hai na .
Airforce ka to alg hi chakkar hai, unko 114 mrca chahye meanwhile pilots die in mig 21s .
then a general flies that coffin and says see all good, the pilot was duffer to die amd crash it .
Its a very hard plane, aree to naya lo na phir, hard plane kab tak rakhoge tumlog, to lo phir naya .
Imagine if he were coas today, he would have inducted 2000 atags right away.
But no import kaayam rahega aur uske Saath andhkaar bhi .
@Blademaster
Chotay tu dukhi mat ho. Sab maaya hai....


Hope you can figure out who is playing MoD and who is playing Forces.
 

Love Charger

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Chotay tu dukhi mat ho. Sab maaya hai....


Hope you can figure out who is playing MoD and who is playing Forces.
Constitution me directive principle, article 36 se 51 me self reliance ko badhawa dena hai.
Lekin ye chiz court enforce nai karskati hehe, its all moh and maya
 

abingdonboy

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Only solace will be if army is shoved down its throat either bharat 52 or dhanush 52 .
Also can we say mounted gun system us also gone now ? Since atags gone?
@abingdonboy
The last I heard the MGS tender had been withdrawn.

I haven’t heard anyone from IA mention MGS in the last 5 years

When/if ATHOS wins the towed gun deal, their mounted version will surely be the favourite for any future MGS requirements the IA floats, commonality, track record etc
 

abingdonboy

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No fucking accountability, are you buying diwali rocket that if one pack is dud , you buy another.
If army never said anything about weight till now. Then ab konsa saanp soonghgaya? Why reduce the weight now?
Kalyani has a 155 52 mm ulh howitzer in both titanium and steel barrel.
Will they buy it? No they want Athos they will get Athos and earrn a lot subsequently in purchase of spare parts.
Rotten system, it is like every other govt department
Its a retarded exercise, the atags farce has cost a lot of money .
The hilarious/pathetic part is the DRDO were given the brief to design a towed 155/52 with world class specs- they did this and included the 25L chamber so the ATAGS has beaten all existing 155/52 range records. It’s the only gun in india that could hit zones 1-7 with conventional ammo

the IA were consulted from the very start and had no issues with ATAGS, in the last stages of validation they pull this $hit, how much more blatant/corrupt can they be?

the biggest joke is the MoD/civilians being clueless enough to let these games be played out

every damn time these clowns let the IDDM product get into testing then release SQRs that explicitly exclude that system
 

abingdonboy

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Truck mounted is better than towed
Its one chassy, the army is not planning to induct elephants and oxen to tow the gun , or are they?
They all have their uses. Truck mounted/MGS is good for combined arms offensive tactics (shoot and scoot). The towed guns are useful for entrenched firing locations and for infantry support

MGS will be inherently more costly and complex to maintain, for India’s needs it’s good to have large numbers of all types (included tracked SPG)
 

abingdonboy

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Bad Decision to Import Towed Artillery Gun

The Indian Army has done it again; it has placed the locally made artillery gun (ATAGS) on back burner and has issued a RFI to purchase a towed gun under 15 tons in weight.


The Indian Army hates local stuff, no matter how good it is! One quick reason given is weight of the ATAGS is a ton and half greater than arbitrarily set weight limitations of 15 tons. Although the Army knows that ATAGS has a greater range than any other gun which will participate in this tender……. Shame on the Army as well the civil MOD who is a full participant in this stupidity. Now we know why ATAGS was undergoing such a long trial and evaluation process. It was trying to look for possible defects in order to reject it. Kalyani, TATA and L&T and DRDO must be stunned at this development. Now this RFI process will take at least five years and then it will be re-tendered at least three times and emerging winner will be no better than ATAGS…… Shame on them again.

Don‘t you see the artificial rejection ten years back of highly upgraded Arjun tank in favour of T-90. The rejection of Arjun was based on 4 tons extra weight due to, too many improvements requested by the Army which added weight. It was flimsily argued that Indian rail and road bridges cannot take that extra weight. Now the argument for Indian made artillery is same that it is ton and half heavier and harder to make turn in the mountains; another flimsy argument to favor imports.

Our Atamnirbharta has become a laughing stock.
Not going to get into the Arjun stuff here (their games there are for all to see)

but the ATAGS one debacle could not be more obvious to see.

Like you said, 15t is completely arbitrary, just like the IN and the NUH AUW NSQR, where the eff did 15t come from? They are operating the 40+ ton K9 and T90 in foreword areas along the LAC for god’s sake, suddenly 18t is an issue, but 15t is not? Weight is a complete red herring like it was for Arjun (which had lower ground pressure than the T90), MOBILITY is the key issue aka getting the guns from A to B and here ATAGS has been tested and proven to perform in the hills/mountains


Before going down the weight/mobility rabbit hole I recommend everyone watch this again:


-ATAGS has already been tested in hills/mountains with IN SERVICE GTVs (new gen super stallions)
-to overcome mobility issues they have employed a TECHNOLOGICAL solution (steered caster wheels with programmable terrain sensitive modes)

Now we see some ret@rds on defence channels claiming the 15t demand came because the IA’s 40+ year old Scania GTVs can’t haul 18t. Even for the M777s the IA bought new trucks, they’ve got an open tender for new GTV that are to be able to haul 20t plus.

the more I see the more I want public executions over this cr@p,these games are insidious and no different to treason during wartime (which india unofficially is in)
 

abingdonboy

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Could it be that DRDO knew that IA was gonna tank the ATAGS which is why they released that tender last month for the laser ignition system for ATAGS, which should reduce the weight by overall removing the need for a primer based ignition system?:hmm:

The acquisition dates seem aggressive enough....

Apparently L&T made an unsolicited offer for the Nexter 155/52 towed gun very recently to the IA. Insiders seemed to know what was going on, what dirty dirty games that go on inside Delhi HQs
 

Flying Dagger

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read on twitter that the time for setting up m777 towed on site and packing it up is just ~2 mins . thought it would in 10 - 20 min range.

chinese seem to have gone for wheeled ones . wonder which is really good of LAC .
2 minutes mein maggi bhi nahi banti. Don't go by these brochure release.
 

Flying Dagger

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Table Taken from Twitter

so the 15t limit they pulled out of their backsides is designed to keep which gun out only?

View attachment 186785

That 3-4 ton needed to be check though by ATAGS it's been years knowing that. If still some one is saying they pulled it out from nowhere.. well no they raised this issue years back .

Other than that... Ram Jaane !

Only solace will be if army is shoved down its throat either bharat 52 or dhanush 52 .
Also can we say mounted gun system us also gone now ? Since atags gone?
@abingdonboy
Bharat 52 already got a small export order from Saudis within 2 years of trials.
 
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