Imported Single Engine Fighter Jet Contest

[sthf]

IAF is even forced to buy the parts of J7s from black market to maintain the Mig 21 fleet.

Would you like to share the source or is it another one of the things that only you know?

 

[Kunal Biswas]

IAF and IA both buy spares from east block countries via some Indian companies ..

 

[Screambowl]

IAF must order 300 tejas mk 1a.

we don't have hangers for them
.....................................................

 

[Kshithij]

If we share Marut design with all three private aerospace companies, getting our magic number of squadron strength will look easy.

Why get Marut when we have HAWK? By the way, it is perfectly possible to make large numbers of Tejas aircraft. Just look at the number of F16 - 4000, F18 - 1500, F15 - 1200 built in addition to thousands of transport planes, choppers etc by USA for example

Well, because every single part of J7s is produced by Chinese manufacturers, they will be produced continuously until these J7s are retired completely. On the other hand, Russians are shutting down the production lines for the parts of Mig 21s. IAF is even forced to buy the parts of J7s from black market to maintain the Mig 21 fleet.

I thought India manufactured most of the MiG21 parts, except for the engine. Did India stop making these parts nowadays?

 

[Doc Mozart]

A bit off topic question, but is there any plan within the iaf to turn the advanced hawk into a dedicated CAS platform like the A-10?

 

[Kshithij]

A bit off topic question, but is there any plan within the iaf to turn the advanced hawk into a dedicated CAS platform like the A-10?

Yes and HTFE is being developed for the same reason

 

[TPFscopes]

A bit off topic question, but is there any plan within the iaf to turn the advanced hawk into a dedicated CAS platform like the A-10?

Not really compared with A-10..
But it can can carry Armaments of upto 300kgs.. whereas A-10 can carry 7000+ kgs

The aircraft is also being showcased as a force multiplier for any air force due to its ability to carry a range of weapons and a laser designation pod. "The Advanced Hawk can carry a payload of 3,000 kg mounted across seven stations. It is ready to play the role as a force multiplier in combat operations," said Dave Corfield who heads Hawk India.

https://m.economictimes.com/news/de...oks-to-take-on-china/articleshow/56990382.cms

Yes and HTFE is being developed for the same reason

HTFE is another side story to increase the indigenous stuff on indian jets...
HTFE-25 (will be ready by 2018) for HJT-36 and Hawk-i
HTFE-40 (need further 2 years) for Jaguar

 

[no smoking]

IAF should have enough Mig-21 s to cannibalize. Do you have a source on this?

Cannibalizing among your Mig-21 only slows down the trend that the number of your battle ready Mig-21 is becoming less and less.
The story was coming from a TV interview of a Chengdu aviation engineer that he was surprised to receive a call from India requiring a post-sale service for a part for the J-7 II they sold to another country.

 

[no smoking]

And here is an article suggesting that India was buying Mig-21 parts outside Russia:

Quote:"Defense authorities in Moscow have previously warned India not to cut corners in purchasing authentic parts. The Russian ambassador in New Delhi, Alexander Kadakin, has said that India should not be surprised if aircrafts meet with accidents if it continues to use spares from outside Russia."

https://india.blogs.nytimes.com/2013/08/08/the-trouble-with-indian-air-forces-mig-21-fighter-jets/

It is very interesting that who else can supply the M-21 spares when India has the largest M-21 fleet to cannibalize.

 

[Kshithij]

Not really compared with A-10..
But it can can carry Armaments of upto 300kgs.. whereas A-10 can carry 7000+ kgs
https://m.economictimes.com/news/de...oks-to-take-on-china/articleshow/56990382.cms


HTFE is another side story to increase the indigenous stuff on indian jets...
HTFE-25 (will be ready by 2018) for HJT-36 and Hawk-i
HTFE-40 (need further 2 years) for Jaguar

3ton is the payload of hawk, not 300kg. 300kg is the payload of drones

 

[TPFscopes]

3ton is the payload of hawk, not 300kg. 300kg is the payload of drones

Its typo,
And its already mentioned in the text I quoted there.. isn't it?

The aircraft is also being showcased as a force multiplier for any air force due to its ability to carry a range of weapons and a laser designation pod. "The Advanced Hawk can carry a payload of 3,000 kgs mounted across seven stations. It is ready to play the role as a force multiplier in combat operations," said Dave Corfield who heads Hawk India.

Check it out again

 

[sthf]

The story was coming from a TV interview of a Chengdu aviation engineer that he was surprised to receive a call from India requiring a post-sale service for a part for the J-7 II they sold to another country.

Lovely. So you are your own source. Every and now and then, you pull out stuff from your rear and get caught with your pants down and willy hanging.

India sourced third party Mig-21 parts is no secret, never was. It became a huge political issue during the late 90s and early 2000s. But it is utterly moronic to say that India seeked Chinese parts when you don't have a source to back it up.

Another sad attempt at hit and run, eh?

 

[Kunal Biswas]

@no smoking, Do provide a link or even screen shot with sub-titiles ..

 

[no smoking]

@no smoking, Do provide a link or even screen shot with sub-titiles ..

Sorry, I can't. It was a TV show I watched a couple of years ago.

Anyway, my point is that India can't produce every necessary part for her Mig-21. That is why she has to retire her Mig-21 while Chinese can still fly J-7 even though the replacing plan is carried out.

 

[TPFscopes]

Sorry, I can't. It was a TV show I watched a couple of years ago.

Anyway, my point is that India can't produce every necessary part for her Mig-21. That is why she has to retire her Mig-21 while Chinese can still fly J-7 even though the replacing plan is carried out.

I don't know, what you are talking about..
If you are concerned with chinese J-7s, than you should know that china already retired most of the older airframes and the jets which are still in service were duly delivered between 1990-2003. I don't think that any of the professional air force retire their jets in 15-25years.. and the most duly airframe rolled out from Chengdu was from 2013 with the end of license production contract.

If you are concerned with spares of IAF Mig-21 , we are still producing almost all of the consumable parts in india , like we are doing same for Jaguar. But there are very minor purchases of damaged parts which can be cannibalized from retired migs and sourced through rosoboronexport.

 

[no smoking]

I don't know, what you are talking about..
If you are concerned with chinese J-7s, than you should know that china already retired most of the older airframes and the jets which are still in service were duly delivered between 1990-2003. I don't think that any of the professional air force retire their jets in 15-25years.. and the most duly airframe rolled out from Chengdu was from 2013 with the end of license production contract.

Well, looks like you got some wrong information here. The last J-7 acquired by PLAF was in 2006. Until today, there are still around 900 J-7 in service this years. So, no, Chinese hasn't started to retire 1990-2003 delivered J-7 yet.

If you are concerned with spares of IAF Mig-21 , we are still producing almost all of the consumable parts in india , like we are doing same for Jaguar. But there are very minor purchases of damaged parts which can be cannibalized from retired migs and sourced through rosoboronexport.

Of course, these minor purchases don't affect the quality of your Mig-21.

 

[Kunal Biswas]

If by any chance its proven that IAF is some how buying Chinese parts for its MIG-21 fleet, Things will get pretty ugly for IAF ..

IAF operate more than 3 types of MIG-21 alone, Type 96,Type 66 / 68 / 69, BIS, Bison ..

 

[no smoking]

If by any chance its proven that IAF is some how buying Chinese parts for its MIG-21 fleet, Things will get pretty ugly for IAF ..

IAF operate more than 3 types of MIG-21 alone, Type 96,Type 66 / 68 / 69, BIS, Bison ..

Well, I would call it economical and pragmatic. Otherwise, you have to investment a chunk of money to produce some parts which will soon be useless anymore, or you have to buy these parts from Russia that are more and more expensive since they have to keep an production line open for your declining demand.

 

[AnantS]

ore expensive since they have to keep an production line open for your declining demand.[/QUOTE]
Chinese Mig 21 copy is based on Mig 21 F-13, a type which India did not operate in numbers. I guess very few first aircraft inducted were f-13 type in late 60's but for India, Mig 21 saga really started from type 77(FL), Type 88(M), Bis to Bison. Which varied a lot from old F-13 type. Not to mention would have varied a lot from Chinese copy of of F-13. India primarily sought spares from ex Warsaw pact countries or ex Soviet republics after disintegration of Soviet Union. If my memory serves right Czechoslovakia later Czech/Poland was the main source of second hand spares from Cannibalized Migs. It did till, India started producing those parts inhouse.

 

[Kunal Biswas]

You may find this interesting ..

http://defenceforumindia.com/forum/threads/kaveri-for-infamous-mig-21-fleet.64835/page-6

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Well, I would call it economical and pragmatic. Otherwise, you have to investment a chunk of money to produce some parts which will soon be useless anymore, or you have to buy these parts from Russia that are more and more expensive since they have to keep an production line open for your declining demand.