DRDO Multical Rifle Unveiled

[abingdonboy]

Hope it does not create logistic problem if i am soldier and i am using 5.56 i dont want to be supplied with 7.62 or 6.8.


Israelis have MRPS sight

Why would this even happen??? Do RR units in JK get 5.56.mm INSAS rounds for their AKs now?

Then question of having to have other magazine and parts available to them. Not to forget extra weight or extra things to be carried in base or launching area.

This is a non-issue, the spares will be housed with the base/unit's armorer as THEY ARE NOW.


Sir I have great respect for you but it seems like you are inventing problems out of thin air.

 

[abingdonboy]

Also its imo silly to have only a 100 rounds per soldier, Dump the 20 round INSAS mag, stick to a 30 round MAG with 29 in mag and 1 in the chamber just like SAS does with their Canadian M-4s, this should keep the spring action soft & reliable. Also more MAGs issued with atleast 6 to 10 i.e 180-300 rounds.

Where did you all get this figure of 100? My uncle is ex 7 PARA and he said he used to go out with 700+ rounds of 5.56mm for his Tavor, he even said they used to sometimes have a mix of rounds (they had carried 5.56mm Frangible and 5.56mm Armor-Piercing Hard Core along with their standard 5.56mm ammo). I highly doubt the 100 round figure is correct for troops deployed on missions.

 

[DivineHeretic]

Why would this even happen??? Do RR units in JK get 5.56.mm INSAS rounds for their AKs now?



This is a non-issue, the spares will be housed with the base/unit's armorer as THEY ARE NOW.


Sir I have great respect for you but it seems like you are inventing problems out of thin air.

The first point is an issue, with all due respect. We have had far worse wrong deliveries than just misplaced ammo in the past.

as far as I see it, the piece of paper requesting ammo and other spares will now have the same name of the weapon for different types of ammo. It is very plausible that the wrong shipment be sent to the wrong units.

But then again, these are relatively small problems compared to what could happen at the armorer.

 

[arnabmit]

Not a real issue, am just nitpicking. This is too boxy. All functionality and no aesthetics. Maybe they can get a fiber reinforced polymer or a milled aluminium body instead of a tin box.

Also, where are the dual ports for the laser range finder? Or is it just a thermal sight? The text in the poster says otherwise.

A similar solution (Barrett BORS):

 

[ladder]

Where did you all get this figure of 100? My uncle is ex 7 PARA and he said he used to go out with 700+ rounds of 5.56mm for his Tavor, he even said they used to sometimes have a mix of rounds (they had carried 5.56mm Frangible and 5.56mm Armor-Piercing Hard Core along with their standard 5.56mm ammo). I highly doubt the 100 round figure is correct for troops deployed on missions.

80-100 is standard issue for a infantry soldier. Be it LRP or or other purposes. For special missions and for Ghataks and SF's and RR might have their own SOP and different for different mission profiles.
@Kunal Biswas Sir, can provide details.

 

[abingdonboy]

The first point is an issue, with all due respect. We have had far worse wrong deliveries than just misplaced ammo in the past.

as far as I see it, the piece of paper requesting ammo and other spares will now have the same name of the weapon for different types of ammo. It is very plausible that the wrong shipment be sent to the wrong units.

But then again, these are relatively small problems compared to what could happen at the armorer.

You don't seem to fathom the IA ALREADY has 2 different types of ammo (7.62 and 5.56) as they use the AK for COIN ops so I can't see the MCWIS ADDING to logistical issues but only reducing them.

 

[abingdonboy]

80-100 is standard issue for a infantry soldier. Be it LRP or or other purposes. For special missions and for Ghataks and SF's and RR might have their own SOP and different for different mission profiles.
@Kunal Biswas Sir, can provide details.

He was a a SF and served in a regular infantry btn(not going to say which one) before joining the PARAs and he said that throughout his career the troops would go out with "considerably more" ammo than 100 rounds when I asked him a few months back and that in the PARAs (again non SF) they would obviously carry even more than the regular grunts, I don't even know what the SFs will be carrying!!

 

[abingdonboy]

as far as I see it, the piece of paper requesting ammo and other spares will now have the same name of the weapon for different types of ammo. It is very plausible that the wrong shipment be sent to the wrong units.

Another thing to note is the IA is actively improving its logistics arm and is digitising its stores so this "piece of paper" request is a moot point.

 

[Twinblade]

Not a real issue, am just nitpicking. This is too boxy. All functionality and no aesthetics. Maybe they can get a fiber reinforced polymer or a milled aluminium body instead of a tin box.

Also, where are the dual ports for the laser range finder? Or is it just a thermal sight? The text in the poster says otherwise.

It says in the poster exactly what it is, it's an uncooled long wave infra red sight.

 

[arnabmit]

Can you point out the laser transmit and receive reticles? It says it has FCC and FCC requires range finding.

Or is there some IR based range finding mechanism?

It says in the poster exactly what it is, it's an uncooled long wave infra red sight.

 

[Kunal Biswas]

6.8mm may sound nice and better but not battle proven, 5,56mm on other hand did in many ways, 64gr 5.56mm is lethal and i hope more lethal 5.56mm get inducted ..

Infantry should dump the 5.56, I think overall infantry should use 6.8mm, 5.56 should be used for strictly law enforcement i.e police forces. A modern enemy will always deploy bulletproof jackets (they will only get better) and 5.56 or even 7.62 just won't cut it, 6.8mm is the way forward since its ballistics and energy are far better. 7.62 can used for COIN and SF. SF units like to have a delicate foot print espcially for covert ops, any enemy who does a post raid analysis would easily suspect something fishy if 5.56 or 6.8mm rounds are used, since mostly (speaking in genralities) professional forces use 5.56 and 6.8 is very rare in use across the world. Use the AK round and an enemy like Pak would be confused as to who performed the raid (might as well be one of the local militant groups) In such covert ops best to leave a very light foot print.

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@sayareakd Sir, Only showed what IA top brass think, But in real the ammo are spend like water, Lots of spray and pray ..

With due respect sir,yours is a truely ----ed up logic.You want to send a soldier with just a hundred 5.56 ammo!!I almost fell from my chair!!I

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A Grunt get 5 mag of 20round mag, One in the rifle and rest in the chest rig, In CT its a different story..

Where did you all get this figure of 100? My uncle is ex 7 PARA and he said he used to go out with 700+ rounds of 5.56mm for his Tavor, he even said they used to sometimes have a mix of rounds (they had carried 5.56mm Frangible and 5.56mm Armor-Piercing Hard Core along with their standard 5.56mm ammo). I highly doubt the 100 round figure is correct for troops deployed on missions.

 

[sayareakd]

With due respect sir,yours is a truely ----ed up logic.You want to send a soldier with just a hundred 5.56 ammo!!I almost fell from my chair!!It's just insane to think a soldier should be supplied with just a hundred rounds else he would waste ammo!!We're talking about Indian Army here,and not some sorry arse ragtag irregulars!!There is a reason the soldiers are trained for 18-24 months are taught to follow strict firing disciplines.
And for once stop the 'eik goli eik dusman' bull shit please.How can you guarantee every soldier can fire with 100% accuracy.
Do you even know that US and NATO soldiers usually carry anywhere from 600 upto a 1000+ SS 109 rounds during a LRP mission??Issuing just a hundred 5.56 rounds per soldiers beats the very reason for its development at the first place,no sane commander would pull such a stupid stunt.Heck,each individual IA soldiers carried 25 kg of rifle ammo which would convert to probably 2000+ 5.56 ammo during Kargil conflict if you remember,if that did not create any logistical problem in 1999,then it won't create one in 2014 either.

Sir, in Kargil war, 100 bullets per soldier was given and this has been the case since long time. We went to war with this logic and it worked perfectly.

 

[sayareakd]

Where did you all get this figure of 100? My uncle is ex 7 PARA and he said he used to go out with 700+ rounds of 5.56mm for his Tavor, he even said they used to sometimes have a mix of rounds (they had carried 5.56mm Frangible and 5.56mm Armor-Piercing Hard Core along with their standard 5.56mm ammo). I highly doubt the 100 round figure is correct for troops deployed on missions.

But crawling up, inch by inch, along the steep, smooth incline in the face of blanket firing by the intruders made the troops' task highly risky. "It was almost a suicidal mission," recalls a major. Barely acclimatised, a five-metre trudge would leave soldiers, weighed down by guns, equipment packs and ammunition weighing 25 kg or more, panting for breath. "Every gram of the weight you carry is extra load," says Captain Ajit Singh of the 16 Grenadiers who was part of the initial assault. "And you have to choose between your ration and ammunition." A 2-kg food pack or 100 bullets. Ajit, like many of his colleagues, chose bullets. For three days, he says, he survived on cigarettes.

Read more at: Tololing peak: The battle that probably changed the course of Kargil war : Cover Story - India Today

 

[pmaitra]

Tavor? Why would the Tavor begin to be licence produced in India? This would only make sense if there was an order of 10s if not 100s of thousands coming IWI's way! :confused

Tavor, or variant thereof. Why? I don't know. All I know if that after INSAS production is wrapped up, they will switch to either of the two.

 

[Twinblade]

Can you point out the laser transmit and receive reticles? It says it has FCC and FCC requires range finding.

Or is there some IR based range finding mechanism?

FCC should be a separate attachment, with the ability to connect with this sight.

Where did you all get this figure of 100? My uncle is ex 7 PARA and he said he used to go out with 700+ rounds of 5.56mm for his Tavor, he even said they used to sometimes have a mix of rounds (they had carried 5.56mm Frangible and 5.56mm Armor-Piercing Hard Core along with their standard 5.56mm ammo). I highly doubt the 100 round figure is correct for troops deployed on missions.

With due respect, 700+ rounds is in excess of 9 kilos of ammunition. That is a tall tale.

 

[sayareakd]

FCC should be a separate attachment, with the ability to connect with this sight.




With due respect, 700+ rounds is in excess of 9 kilos of ammunition. That is a tall tale.

Para carry 40 kg weight and run for 40km almost 3-4 times in week. It is called 40-40 run.

 

[sayareakd]

Tavor, or variant thereof. Why? I don't know. All I know if that after INSAS production is wrapped up, they will switch to either of the two.

Tavor is never made in India.

 

[pmaitra]

Tavor is never made in India.

The only AR currently being made in RFI is INSAS. I am talking about what might be made in the future.

 

[ALBY]

Where did you all get this figure of 100? My uncle is ex 7 PARA and he said he used to go out with 700+ rounds of 5.56mm for his Tavor, he even said they used to sometimes have a mix of rounds (they had carried 5.56mm Frangible and 5.56mm Armor-Piercing Hard Core along with their standard 5.56mm ammo). I highly doubt the 100 round figure is correct for troops deployed on missions.

man actually the sanctioned ammo quantity is 700 per person.But they carry only less than 150 or 200 max ammo.Resst of the ammo will be in the cam oor unitss armoury.The men patroling will not be going with 700 ammo.I am prett sure about this cooz whenn chatting with an ITBP soldier he said that every personn is allotted about 700 bullets but they carry only 3/4 mags with them.And how the are going to carry 700 bulets with them ?It need 23 mags if iit is of AK or 35 mags if it is of 5.56 INSAS.And the flak jacket could hold only 4 mags in pouches

 

[ghost]

man actually the sanctioned ammo quantity is 700 per person.But they carry only less than 150 or 200 max ammo.Resst of the ammo will be in the cam oor unitss armoury.The men patroling will not be going with 700 ammo.I am prett sure about this cooz whenn chatting with an ITBP soldier he said that every personn is allotted about 700 bullets but they carry only 3/4 mags with them.And how the are going to carry 700 bulets with them ?It need 23 mags if iit is of AK or 35 mags if it is of 5.56 INSAS.And the flak jacket could hold only 4 mags in pouches

Bro i agree with ur points even i was about to state that in normal patrol it is highly unlikely for a trooper to carry 700+ ammo.Even the us navy seal carry 8 magazine of 30 rounds which is 240 rounds as standard for mission.A quote from navy seal eyewitness account book "the last moment, still worried about this entire venture, I grabbed three extra magazines, which gave me a total of eleven, each holding thirty rounds. Eight was
standard, but there was something about Operation Redwing. It turned out everyone felt the same. We all took three extra magazines. "
This shows in normal condition it is unlikely for forces to carry 700+ round but my guess is that his uncle would have mentioned about their lrp which would usually be of more than 2 days and in such case he might be carrying extra ammo in his backpack or bag so that he would be self sustain for longer hours even in deep jungles or hills far away from their camp. You are right It is no where possible to carry such ammo in one flak jacket on normal patrol but my guess is he meant the LRP or own personal choice.