Can India do a Falklands war type campaign if PLAN takes over Andamans

[Dovah]

well man ,i really found that unusual so i said it ,i think u took it personal ,well i apoligise for that
REGARDS

No need to apologize mate. I know you meant well.

 

[Zebra]

Soviet aircraft carrier Minsk :

In 1995 she was sold to a South Korean businessman, and later resold to Shenzhen Minsk Aircraft Carrier Industry Company Limited. a Chinese company. Until 2006, when the company went bankrupt, Minsk was part of a military theme park in Yantian district, Shatoujiao (沙头角) sub-district, Shenzhen called Minsk World. The aircraft carrier was put up for auction on 22 March 2006. No bids at the starting price of 128 million RMB were received, so the carrier was withdrawn from sale. On 31 May 2006, the Soviet aircraft carrier was finally auctioned off in Shenzhen for 128 million RMB to CITIC Shenzhen .


Kiev and Varyag :

Reports state that two 50,000-60,000 ton Type 089 aircraft carriers based on the Varyag, are due to be finished by 2015.


Source wiki .
So out of 4 second aircraft carriers China will get only two ready by 2015 .

Plus whet ever they build by them selves ( all new ) that will be extras . If they have some ?

 

[Galaxy]

@aayush

Even, If it is true by 2015. Then also,

We will also have 3 CBG by 2014.

Also,

Aircraft based here will be involved in air defence over the strategic Andaman and Nocobar Islands and the Bay of Bengal. The tri-services command at the A&N Islands will be in charge of the squadrons of Su-30 MKIs and other advanced aircraft based at Kalaikunda for this specific purpose

Kalaikunda fighters in charge of Andaman and Nicobar Islands defences - The Economic Times

Within 2-3 years, We will be operating some 30+ combat warships including 5 Destroyers, 1 ACC, 5-6 Frigates, Submarines on east side and A&N Islands. Currently, We have around 8,000 army personnel permanently along with many helicopters and missiles. 3 airbase is capable for MKI or any other jets.

 

[ejazr]

Well the A&N islands situation also has a diplomatic cost to it. The islands are recognized to be part of India internationally and no country has staked a claim on it. So in accordance with International law, China will be in a very tight spot and will have to backdown quickly. But even then it will make all ASEAN countries very nervous and might end up creating a counter bloc of India-ASEAN that would lock it out of the Malacca straits.

 

[ace009]

Dudes - you are indeed forgetting the entire point of this post ...

The point is NOT TO SAY that PLAN can invade and hold the A&N islands - the point is to analyze the scenario - if something like that can happen, how India can stop it from happening and if it does happen, what can India do about it.

Now, for all the hu-ha's like MrSomnath, before you start mouthing your ass off - and I meant it that way no apologies, think about this.
Failure of defence side -
1. French built a massive Maginot line to stop the Germans - Hitler found a way to get around it and invade France.
2. The Soviets preparation for German invasion imploded as the Nazis marhced over all Soviet field emplacements and old tanks.

Successful defences -
1. Falklands by the Brits against Argentine forces - bringing support from thousands of miles away
2. Arab vs Israel in 1948 where 20000+ Israelites (mostly civilian militia) trounced a 100000+ strong professional Arab army (actually 4)

The reason for the two successes and the reason for the two failures cited above - planning for the future and NOT underestimating the enemy.

MrSomnath seems to have learnt nothing from our "friends" across the border - Pakistan. Their persistence in underestimating Indian military has led to 3 and a half defeats in wars with India. Not to mention the loss of half of their country.

So, MrSomnath, you should always prepare for the worst.

Why A&N islands? We have gone through that too - it sits on THE gateway to South China Sea from IOR. Most of China's oil flows near there. In case of a future Indo-Chinese war, IN should try to choke of Chinese oil supply by a naval blockade of the Malacca straits. In resposne PLAN would like to open the blockade and remove the nearby Indian strongpoints - especially great Nicobar island - and setup their own naval facility there. It is the logical choice in case of an all out war.

India-China will then have three fronts - largest in northeast - but limited due to terrain, a brutal yet futile one over Kasmir/ Ladakh - since none of them can bring string armor, but can beat the shit out of each other by rockets, arty and missiles and a free-for-all in the IOR between the two navies.

If India wants to prepare for A REAL war (and not the umpteenth ass-scratching from Pakistan, whom India should be able to deal with by 2020, with one hand tied behind our backs), ti should be a three front war against the Chinese.

If you are still not convinced why we should discuss this scenario and want to take your wisecracks and nosepickings to somewhere else, please be our guest and leave us to our discussions - however "ill-advised".
Thanks a lot ...

 

[Drsomnath999]

Dudes - you are indeed forgetting the entire point of this post ...

The point is NOT TO SAY that PLAN can invade and hold the A&N islands - the point is to analyze the scenario - if something like that can happen, how India can stop it from happening and if it does happen, what can India do about it.

Now, for all the hu-ha's like MrSomnath, before you start mouthing your ass off - and I meant it that way no apologies, think about this.
Failure of defence side -
1. French built a massive Maginot line to stop the Germans - Hitler found a way to get around it and invade France.
2. The Soviets preparation for German invasion imploded as the Nazis marhced over all Soviet field emplacements and old tanks.

Successful defences -
1. Falklands by the Brits against Argentine forces - bringing support from thousands of miles away
2. Arab vs Israel in 1948 where 20000+ Israelites (mostly civilian militia) trounced a 100000+ strong professional Arab army (actually 4)

The reason for the two successes and the reason for the two failures cited above - planning for the future and NOT underestimating the enemy.

MrSomnath seems to have learnt nothing from our "friends" across the border - Pakistan. Their persistence in underestimating Indian military has led to 3 and a half defeats in wars with India. Not to mention the loss of half of their country.

So, MrSomnath, you should always prepare for the worst.

Why A&N islands? We have gone through that too - it sits on THE gateway to South China Sea from IOR. Most of China's oil flows near there. In case of a future Indo-Chinese war, IN should try to choke of Chinese oil supply by a naval blockade of the Malacca straits. In resposne PLAN would like to open the blockade and remove the nearby Indian strongpoints - especially great Nicobar island - and setup their own naval facility there. It is the logical choice in case of an all out war.

India-China will then have three fronts - largest in northeast - but limited due to terrain, a brutal yet futile one over Kasmir/ Ladakh - since none of them can bring string armor, but can beat the shit out of each other by rockets, arty and missiles and a free-for-all in the IOR between the two navies.

If India wants to prepare for A REAL war (and not the umpteenth ass-scratching from Pakistan, whom India should be able to deal with by 2020, with one hand tied behind our backs), ti should be a three front war against the Chinese.

If you are still not convinced why we should discuss this scenario and want to take your wisecracks and nosepickings to somewhere else, please be our guest and leave us to our discussions - however "ill-advised".
Thanks a lot ...

i beg ur pardon to satisfy ur bruished EGO .But mate ,the problem is u have nt read all my posts apart from Hu..HAA ,then reply ur kind views regarding me .
Well regarding the question of prepardness & hypothetical scenario , i agree u can post anything nothing wrong it.But u should understand the line between fantasy & reality .But if u still think i am wrong then i m sorry i cant do anything about it.Well u have the right to express ur views
REGARDS

 

[Armand2REP]

Excuse me i am talking of indian navy not of srilankan or myammar navy ..1st read about Indian navy & then post such craps .

Excuse me, I am talking about Andaman Command which only has 4 permanent warships.

 

[Armand2REP]

Who told you we have only 16 missiles to take PLAN ?

We have 100's of Missile. Missile can be launched from Island also.

Only the Talwars have been fitted to date so there are only 24 deployable VLS tubes. Only 16 of those can be deployed at once. If China launches an invasion tomorrow, there is no Brahmos on any of the islands.

1 of them is Brahmos @ Mach speed 2.8, 300 Km range. That will be deadly to take Chinese warships. In addition, we have/will have many more things on Island. 1 Squadron of MKI from WB near Kolkatta by 2014 will be dedicated specially to cover A&N Island.

I am not talking about next year or next decade... I am talking now.

 

[Param]

Only the Talwars have been fitted to date so there are only 24 deployable VLS tubes. Only 16 of those can be deployed at once. If China launches an invasion tomorrow, there is no Brahmos on any of the islands.



I am not talking about next year or next decade... I am talking now.

If China wants to launch an invasion tomorrow they have easier options than invading the Andamans. They can simply launch an offensive into Ladhak.

This thread itself is hypothetical. Why would the Chinese choose a difficult option when they have a massive advantage along the Himalayas?

 

[Armand2REP]

If China wants to launch an invasion tomorrow they have easier options than invading the Andamans. They can simply launch an offensive into Ladhak.

They can do both. The question is can India defend both.

This thread itself is hypothetical. Why would the Chinese choose a difficult option when they have a massive advantage along the Himalayas?

It is called killing two birds with one stone. If China ever wants a couple islands in AN, they would do it in a coordinated land grab.

 

[ace009]

@ MrSomnath
Regards - please take your nosepicking elsewhere. As for fantasy versus fiction - even Pakistan being able to explode nukes a week after India in 1998 was considered a fantasy.

@Param
Have you seen the ladakh? Been there? You think it is easier to invade India through Ladakh? Just a question - why then India has never been invaded through Ladakh in the last 4000 years?
Why did the chinese not try it since 1962? Even the Chinese incursion of 1962 ended in a voluntary retreat. Why?
Maybe you should ask yourself this question - what is the value of Arunachal or Ladakh to Chinese versus the shipping lanes of IOR?

As for this thread being hypothetical - absolutely it is. Any thread here that speaks of potential cases in the future - is hypothetical. Maybe you only deal with solid info and technical discussions - although I have not noticed it.

 

[Param]

They can do both. The question is can India defend both.



It is called killing two birds with one stone. If China ever wants a couple islands in AN, they would do it in a coordinated land grab.

Look my logic is simple, the human cost for their Andaman campaign would be just too high and even if they capture A&N they will not be able to hold it for long. And you must be underestimating GOI if you think we would let go of A&N.

 

[Armand2REP]

It isn't so simple when China throws away half a million men just to prop up a dictator or 30,000 for nothing in Vietnam. You must be underestimating CCP if you think they care about the lives of soldiers.

 

[Param]

It isn't so simple when China throws away half a million men just to prop up a dictator or 30,000 for nothing in Vietnam. You must be underestimating CCP if you think they care about the lives of soldiers.

Does'nt matter if CCP throws a hundred million sodiers India will not let go of A&N even if it takes a Hundred years.

 

[Drsomnath999]

Excuse me, I am talking about Andaman Command which only has 4 permanent warships.

ok i am wondering where would be our rest 164 warships at that time , i think they would doing naval exercise with french navy like Varuna 2011.

 

[Drsomnath999]

@ MrSomnath
Regards - please take your nosepicking elsewhere. .

well mate i had no interest to nosepick if u hadnt replied my comments in such a friendly manner

As for fantasy versus fiction - even Pakistan being able to explode nukes a week after India in 1998 was considered a fantasy.

.

mate let me give u some light about Pak nuclear program before u say that thing that i marked as red in ur quote
.PAKISTAN'S NUCLEAR WEAPONS

After the 1971 debacle & conduction of india's nuke test in 1974 pakistan realished that it has to attain nuke weapons to save herself from india's wrath in future & to achieve parity with india .So pakistan under the Bhutto's administration started project -706 under the leadership of Dr A.Qkhan & Dr Munir ahmed khan i.e to build nuclear weapons as it was essential for nation's survival.It was in the year 1983 11th march ,when pakistan carried out 1st succesful cold test of a nuclear device,since then between 1983 -1990 pakistan carried out 24 more cold test of various nuclear design.China also whole heartedly supported pakistan's quest of acheiving nuke weapons by supplying nuke reactors & fuel.China beleives in policy of enemy's enemy is a friend ,so secretly gave nuke weapons & M 11 missile designs to pakistan.Pakistan conducted his 1st official nuke test on may28 1998 in chagai hills by exploding 5 nuclear test & one more on 30 th may .

well mate india knew much before 1998 pak nuke test that pak was nuclear capable ,so P.v rao our prime minster at the yr 1992 had planned out
nuclear test in pokhran but US satellites spotted it & under US pressure india had to cancelled nuke test .But in 1998 india secretly managed to do it becoz india had to test it as pak was already secretly tested it's nuke through cold test .Also there was rumour that china had tested pak nuclaer weapon for it 1990's so enabling Islamabad to respond within weeks to the Indian atomic tests

'China tested Pakistan's first nuclear bomb in the 90s'
.So comparing it to fantasy is again a bull s%%%,sorry again to say that word ,but i cant resist that .Hope u dont mind

 

[ace009]

BS - spewed by Indian Media AFTER the fact.

 

[LurkerBaba]

BS - spewed by Indian Media AFTER the fact.

Not BS, read the quote

"The Chinese did a massive training of Pakistani scientists, brought them to China for lectures, even gave them the design of the CHIC-4 device, which was a weapon that was easy to build a model for export," former US Air Force Secretary Thomas Reed told American news magazine 'US News and World Report'.

Another link for the same
Why China Helped Countries Like Pakistan, North Korea Build Nuclear Bombs - US News and World Report

IMO we knew that the Pakistanis had nukes, and the 1998 tests were done to make them "come out of the closet"

 

[ace009]

Not BS, read the quote



Another link for the same
Why China Helped Countries Like Pakistan, North Korea Build Nuclear Bombs - US News and World Report

IMO we knew that the Pakistanis had nukes, and the 1998 tests were done to make them "come out of the closet"

I am not questioning the part about whether China helped Pakistan develop it's nukes - I am sure they did - that part is not what I called BS. What I called BS is the part that India knew about how ready Pakistani Nukes were and the 1998 tests were done by India to "draw Pakistan out of the closets" - that is BS. India did the tests to drum up our claim to be acknowledged as a nuclear power, to get a better claim to the UN security Council seat and to pre-empt the signing of CTBT or NPT - if India was forced by circumstances to sign it (because of economic and political situations), having declared their nuclear powers will make sure that India will not be asked to disarm.

 

[Drsomnath999]

I am not questioning the part about whether China helped Pakistan develop it's nukes - I am sure they did - that part is not what I called BS. What I called BS is the part that India knew about how ready Pakistani Nukes were and the 1998 tests were done by India to "draw Pakistan out of the closets" - that is BS. India did the tests to drum up our claim to be acknowledged as a nuclear power, to get a better claim to the UN security Council seat and to pre-empt the signing of CTBT or NPT - if India was forced by circumstances to sign it (because of economic and political situations), having declared their nuclear powers will make sure that India will not be asked to disarm.

SO u are saying that pakistan is so advanced that it made a nuclear device just 7 days after india exploded nuclear test,well soviet union conducted his 1st nuclear test 4 ys after US conducted his 1st atomic test ,so pakistan is more advanced & talented than russia .

Only a pakistani or a false flaghoister would bluff like that.