Army scraps the world's largest assault rifle tender

[Blood+]

I fail to see the logic behind letting this one particular poster to keep spreading his trash-talk propaganda gibberish,even after being provided with facts which prove the situation to be completely opposite to the ones in his wet dreams!!Why shouldn't he get a thread ban at the very least??

 

[Hari Sud]

There are a number of posts and poster(s) who hijack the thread for their own end. They are easy to identify. They are paid (who) to be difficult, misleading and ambiguous. They are argue on points which are not true. In my opinion they are paid by interested arms merchant who hire people to spread as many false rumours as possible.

The DFI has not have the guts to take them out of circulation as the DFI itself is sponsored by interested parties. Even if you take them out, they reappear in different form and follow the same agenda. The trick is to ban them as many times as they make appearance and their names posted in the banned list. Sooner than later they will get tired of being banned so many times.

 

[pmaitra]

DFI gives an opportunity to everyone to express his or her opinion, however, one must remain within the forum rules. Most members post voluntarily and DFI neither gets paid by members nor pays the members. There were a few exceptional instances where members have voluntarily donated at times of duress.

 

[ALBY]

Quality control...what is wrong with your INSAS? Our RK62 is 53 years old and will be in service until 2035...quality control....

Seems that the word quality is viewed on a lighter note in these parts of world.

 

[ALBY]

@ALBY, concerning your statement which i have quoted above, I have seen in an interview conducted around 4-5 years ago that the CRPF guys say the for a smaller caliber rifle they prefer to carry the X-95 over INSAS.
However, now you are stating that they prefer not to carry due to extreme care required and attention received.
Can you please elaborate on the topic as this is an unheard development for me plus the CRPF COBRA units are equipped with the Tavor as one of their primary weapons so what instead they prefer to carry inplace of the Tavor since they are also keen on replacing the INSAS they have, is it AKs ??

My post too was based chat with some regular CRPF guys they said the fear of breaking of optics prevent them from rough use,plus they fears seeing such high profile weaponry wiith common men assignedd for patrolling or guard duties will attract unwanted attention so it is not encouraged.(You know CRPF is professionallly very dfferent from army).No problems reported about the qualiity ,though and it is one of the best.
But at that heavy price tag it is an absolute unwanted item for CRPF as an SOPMOD AK could only cost 1/3rd of it with all those gadgets and an SIG-551 with sights could havebeen bought at half the price,whch gives the same effect.

 

[pmaitra]

Sir, I don't want to put myself in your mudsling competition but its dark fact that there corruption to core in Armed forces , same level as in Judiciary, Bureaucracy & Politics.
Most of Generals offspring are become defence contracters agent & work as middle men.
There no open secret that if DRDO , OFB or HAL start giving kickbacks then their shoddy products would be never rejected but they can't due to they themself are corrupt & inefficient to the core.
Same Army does not have any problem when Foreign Gun would be produced by OFB with so called TOT (And everybody know OFB production quality).
Here is a sample of OFB made quality of Gun & same OFB would start producing State of the Art Gun

After selection of foreign gun everyone happy, Generals with their kickback & commissions, OFB with their production contract, Foreign defence contractors with their huge royalties.
Only loser would be Soldiers who hold these OFB produce high quality foreign gun & Indian Taxpayers.

The picture above (in the quote) is real, and of one of the very early versions of the INSAS, taken from a source that was evaluating the rifle.

A closeup of any system will show the flaws.

Modern INSAS, posted by @Kunal Biswas.

L-85 closeup.

Finnish Kalashnikov clone, posted by @jouni.

I don't see any significant difference in quality, fit, or finish.

Also, check this post by @Kunal Biswas, and see how different the fit and finish of the INSAS is, and decide whether there has been an improvement over the one at the top (in the quote) with orange furniture.

Also, please keep in mind, that parkarized finish supresses the imperfections while glossy finish highlights the imperfections. Please see this post.

 

[jouni]

Quality matters, even Russians say it....

 

[Bhadra]

Quality matters, even Russians say it....

So many misses at such a close range ??

 

[jouni]

So many misses at such a close range ??

Yeah, the shooter was a Russian guy

Even a blind man can shoot it and praise its quality...

 

[jouni]

Why not follow the Canadiens in how they will replace their service Lee Enfields?

http://www.thefirearmblog.com/blog/...cted-for-canadian-rangers-lee-enfield-rifles/

 

[ALBY]

The quality of the weapon depends on the metal availabe in the country.And in our nation as every one knews we desi's had to satisfy ourselves always wth substandard quality thanks to not so developed industies and also as O.F.B is a govt.establishment the quality control will be a matter of concern .So there is no point in arguing about the qualty of INdian INSAS vs RK62.

 

[jouni]

Maybe you should name your next rifle INSANE: INdian Small arms Advanced New Edition.

 

[Bhadra]

Why not follow the Canadiens in how they will replace their service Lee Enfields?

http://www.thefirearmblog.com/blog/...cted-for-canadian-rangers-lee-enfield-rifles/

yes, and make that INSANE like the rifle which can not shoot strait at 10m ... as demonstrated by you in two videos ... only capable of being fired by blinds..

Shabd Vedi ( sound piercing) bullets ... Ha Ha Ha ... Ha Ha Ha.. Ha Ha Ha ...

 

[Abhijeet Dey]

Maybe Indian Army is looking for this.

 

[Killswitch]

Good to hear. I am no fan of the INSAS or OFB. Hopefully a private company can make the MCIWS. OFB is a disgrace and I dont trust the troops lives with them.

 

[akshay m]

Army zeroes in on Made in India rifles to replace INSAS
The performance of the DRDO-designed 'Excalibur' assault rifle in trials last month at the Armament Research and Development Establishment in Pune has further enthused the Army.

The Indian Army has decided to go for an indigenous assault rifle to replace the problematic INSAS rifles. The decision that could save thousands of crores in foreign exchange and boost local manufacture was taken recently by Army Chief General Dalbir Singh. The Army then cancelled a problematic Rs 4,848 crore order for importing Multi Caliber Assault Rifles on June 15-first reported by Mail Today on July 1.

"We are going in for a designed and Made in India rifle in keeping with the government's indigenisation thrusts," senior Army sources told Mail Today.

The performance of the DRDO-designed 'Excalibur' assault rifle in trials last month at the Armament Research and Development Establishment (ARDE) in Pune has further enthused the Army. The Excalibur had only two stoppages (where the bullet gets stuck in the breech) after 24,000 rounds were fired, close to the Army's specifications of only one stoppage.




New features

The Excalibur is an improved version of the INSAS rifle and fires 5.56x45 mm ammunition. It has full-automatic capability over the INSAS which can only fire a three-round burst. The Excalibur barrel is shorter by 4 mm, has a side folding butt stock and features a Picatinny rail, a universal mount that allows a range of weapon sights and sensors to be fitted on the rifle.

DRDO officials say it will take the OFB's Rifle Factory Ishapore at least eight months to incorporate design changes suggested by the ARDE and field the first prototypes of what they are calling the 'Modified INSAS Rifle' (MIR). Changes suggested after trials include a smaller handguard and improved polycarbonate magazine.

If the Excalibur/MIR clears trials, it could be in the hands of infantry soldiers within two years, DRDO officials say. The DRDO is designing a second version of the Excalibur, the AR-2 that fires 7.62x39 mm rounds used by AK-47. The AR-2 will be offered as an alternative to the Russianorigin assault rifle.

The Army's 2011 tender was for a Multi Caliber Assault Rifle or for a weapon that could fire INSAS and AK-47 ammunition with a barrel change.

Five international firms - Beretta of Italy, Israeli Weapons Industries (IWI), Colt Defense of the US, Ceska Zbplojovka of Czech Republic and SiG Sauer of Switzerland-were shortlisted for the trials.

However, Army officials now admit the specifications were poorly drafted and unrealistic.

 

[jouni]

Is INSAS really so bad that you have to replace them all? Why not keep them and only buy new rifles to those who need the? We bought 500 Scars for our special forces, then we have 20000 RK 95s for other top units, 350000 RK62s for standard rifle and 200000 Chinese and east german surplus AKs for reserve and secondary troups. Why you need to buy over 1 million new?

http://www.janes.com/article/49545/finland-selects-fn-scar-l-for-its-special-forces

 

[Bhadra]

Army zeroes in on Made in India rifles to replace INSAS
Published July 5, 2015 | By admin SOURCE: INDIA TODAY
http://idrw.org/army-zeroes-in-on-made-in-india-rifles-to-replace-insas/#more-67820


The Indian Army has decided to go for an indigenous assault rifle to replace the problematic INSAS rifles. The decision that could save thousands of crores in foreign exchange and boost local manufacture was taken recently by Army Chief General Dalbir Singh. The Army then cancelled a problematic Rs 4,848 crore order for importing Multi Caliber Assault Rifles on June 15-first reported by Mail Today on July 1.

“We are going in for a designed and Made in India rifle in keeping with the government’s indigenisation thrusts,” senior Army sources told Mail Today.

The performance of the DRDO-designed ‘Excalibur’ assault rifle in trials last month at the Armament Research and Development Establishment (ARDE) in Pune has further enthused the Army. The Excalibur had only two stoppages (where the bullet gets stuck in the breech) after 24,000 rounds were fired, close to the Army’s specifications of only one stoppage.

New features

The Excalibur is an improved version of the INSAS rifle and fires 5.56×45 mm ammunition. It has full-automatic capability over the INSAS which can only fire a three-round burst. The Excalibur barrel is shorter by 4 mm, has a side folding butt stock and features a Picatinny rail, a universal mount that allows a range of weapon sights and sensors to be fitted on the rifle.

DRDO officials say it will take the OFB’s Rifle Factory Ishapore at least eight months to incorporate design changes suggested by the ARDE and field the first prototypes of what they are calling the ‘Modified INSAS Rifle’ (MIR). Changes suggested after trials include a smaller handguard and improved polycarbonate magazine.

If the Excalibur/MIR clears trials, it could be in the hands of infantry soldiers within two years, DRDO officials say. The DRDO is designing a second version of the Excalibur, the AR-2 that fires 7.62×39 mm rounds used by AK-47. The AR-2 will be offered as an alternative to the Russianorigin assault rifle.

The Army’s 2011 tender was for a Multi Caliber Assault Rifle or for a weapon that could fire INSAS and AK-47 ammunition with a barrel change.

Five international firms – Beretta of Italy, Israeli Weapons Industries (IWI), Colt Defense of the US, Ceska Zbplojovka of Czech Republic and SiG Sauer of Switzerland-were shortlisted for the trials.

 

[pmaitra]

Is INSAS really so bad that you have to replace them all? Why not keep them and only buy new rifles to those who need the? We bought 500 Scars for our special forces, then we have 20000 RK 95s for other top units, 350000 RK62s for standard rifle and 200000 Chinese and east german surplus AKs for reserve and secondary troups. Why you need to buy over 1 million new?

http://www.janes.com/article/49545/finland-selects-fn-scar-l-for-its-special-forces

Please read before you write.

The INSAS is being replaced by an improved INSAS. It is called MIR - Modified INSAS Rifle, also called Excalibur.

 

[Bhadra]

Derived from the (in) famous INSAS weapon systems of India which have been tested in large scale infantry combat, anti-terrorist and mob control situations, this weapon is called the INSAS EXCALIBUR MARK-I incorporates, in addition to the features of earlier INSAS Weapons, certain characteristics which makes it truly the ultimate sword- �THE EXCALIBUR�. The reasons for calling it Excalibur are that it incorporates the features of a weapon which is rugged for battlefield engagements and at the same time capable of being light and easy to handle during low intensity conflict and CQB situations. It has ergonomically designed with folding butt and can fire 20-30 rounds magazines. It is also fitted with picaatinny rails for mounting of opto electronic devices.

SPECIFICATIONS:

Calibre - 5.56mm

Length-Butt Folded/Butt Extended -665mm/895mm

Weight without Magazine -3.81 kg.

Weight with Full Magazine -4.03 kg

Weight of Empty Magazine -0.09 kg.

Magazine Capacity -20/30 rounds

Length of Barrel -400 mm

Barrel Chamber and Bore -Chrome Plated

Rifling (No. of Grooves/Twist/Direction) -6/1 turn in 200 /RH

Sight ( Front /Rear/ Range Graduation/Radius) -Post type/aperture/200 mm & 400mm/475mm

System of Operation -Gas operated

Mode of Fire

i). Single Shot
ii) Automatic

Rate of Fire ( rounds/min) -650 to 700

Effective range -400 m