Arjun Main Battle Tank (MBT) Mark II

[V_Force]

Thank GOD, now finally we have the Govt. who listen or give attention to the sentiments of the common people and take decisions in the national interest.


This was my tweet in November 2017.

I exactly don't know what's the status of Arjun Mk-II or how much Arjun Mk-II has been ordered. I pray to GOD to give some sense to our army to Firmly back the Arjun MK-II. Govt. Should have to look into this matter also like LCA TEJAS.

 

[WolfPack86]

I hope Govt will force Indian Army to accept more Arjun mk 2 tanks very similar they did with Indian Air Force.

 

[Aghore_King]

I hope Govt will force Indian Army to accept more Arjun mk 2 tanks very similar they did with Indian Air Force.

Right now arjun mk 2 is too heavy, they should get the weight in range of 62-63 tons first...

 

[darshan978]

do every t90 have mine plough?? why we are measuring weight of arjun mk 2 with mine plough??? very injustice to our own weapons.....

 

[cyclops]

In the last 2 years there has been an effort to set a precedent by giving the thumbs up to projects like the Tejas Mk2 by the Modi government.

And IMO the army will be forced, sated and consoled into accepting the Arjun Mk2.
No more diversionary, halting and unfair testing tactics to curb local product and buy underperforming russi maal.

I think we are finally seeing the state defence manufacturing spanked and set straight and the military being made to accommodate the desi stuff unequivocally.

 

[ezsasa]

Thank GOD, now finally we have the Govt. who listen or give attention to the sentiments of the common people and take decisions in the national interest.


This was my tweet in November 2017.

View attachment 23619

I exactly don't know what's the status of Arjun Mk-II or how much Arjun Mk-II has been ordered. I pray to GOD to give some sense to our army to Firmly back the Arjun MK-II. Govt. Should have to look into this matter also like LCA TEJAS.

God has nothing to with this...
It is between man and machine..

 

[sayareakd]

do every t90 have mine plough?? why we are measuring weight of arjun mk 2 with mine plough??? very injustice to our own weapons.....

Its DGMF that think that T90S does not need it and for Arjun its mandatory.

 

[binayak95]

I think at one level, the IA has made the Arjun (and the MKII) into an equivalent of what the British termed breakthrough tanks. They would be the ones clearing through enemy fortifications and minefields (thus the mine plough), taking the brunt of enemy anti tank defences and tanks, while the T-90s flank around, make hit and run attacks... etc etc. And I believe that this came about after the comparative trials between the two tanks.

I could be completely wrong and the IA might just be dragging its feet, but seems unlikely...

 

[hammer head]

I think at one level, the IA has made the Arjun (and the MKII) into an equivalent of what the British termed breakthrough tanks. They would be the ones clearing through enemy fortifications and minefields (thus the mine plough), taking the brunt of enemy anti tank defences and tanks, while the T-90s flank around, make hit and run attacks... etc etc. And I believe that this came about after the comparative trials between the two tanks.

I could be completely wrong and the IA might just be dragging its feet, but seems unlikely...

Well your completely here mate, Arjun is not a break through tank. Employment of Tanks T90 or Arjun in our context is primarily
1. Lean on Operations on Enemy Ditch cum bunds
2. Break out and contacting enemy on its second Ditch cum bund using their own bridges, now lets see why the Army is not Pro for Arjun.

1. If you induct a 70 Ton Tank you will have to change the complete equipment profile of Assault Engineer Regiments, Their Armour ed recovery vehicles, Bridge laying tanks and other maint equipment.
2. The entire change in the inventory will require ,Huge amount of money and time. Do we have the time and money at this stage ?? well i leave it for you to decide.

Arjun is my favourite Tank i have been lucky enough to have seen this beast from close and go through all the incorporated changes which really makes it world class. What DRDO really need to DO at this stage would be to make a FMBT with weight under the domain and Tech incorporating all what Arjun Mk 2 has.

And for Gods sake pls stop abusing the Army, yes they have made mistakes but they are no fools to invest in a machine which will not fetch them victory in WAR.

 

[porky_kicker]

Well your completely here mate, Arjun is not a break through tank. Employment of Tanks T90 or Arjun in our context is primarily
1. Lean on Operations on Enemy Ditch cum bunds
2. Break out and contacting enemy on its second Ditch cum bund using their own bridges, now lets see why the Army is not Pro for Arjun.

1. If you induct a 70 Ton Tank you will have to change the complete equipment profile of Assault Engineer Regiments, Their Armour ed recovery vehicles, Bridge laying tanks and other maint equipment.
2. The entire change in the inventory will require ,Huge amount of money and time. Do we have the time and money at this stage ?? well i leave it for you to decide.

Arjun is my favourite Tank i have been lucky enough to have seen this beast from close and go through all the incorporated changes which really makes it world class. What DRDO really need to DO at this stage would be to make a FMBT with weight under the domain and Tech incorporating all what Arjun Mk 2 has.

And for Gods sake pls stop abusing the Army, yes they have made mistakes but they are no fools to invest in a machine which will not fetch them victory in WAR.

understandable

but someday you will make to make these changes as future warfare trend indicate that as anti tank weapons etc get more powerful the weight of tanks will increase to cater for more protection.

light weight and medium weight tanks have no chance to dominate the future battlefield even under heavy air support . (unless for specific tasks)

let me ask you do you really think the T90 tanks will be able to survive the inevitable entrenched anti tank troops equipped with ATGMs . if the tanks loose their mobility even for a moment they will become toast.

only arjun has the capability to take multiple hits and survive

but i am no expert , i just replied for the sake of it, maybe you can address the concerns.

all i know those who dont evolve with time and threats they perish

 

[mostuselesshit]

We need lighter faster tanks which can be produced in insane numbers...or we would be overrun by chinese mass produced shit tanks...just like wht russia did to germany....

well its not a perfect equivalence...since russian tanks were pretty good too...n chinese tanks are...ahhhm....hmm...made in china ....

But still...DRDO and CVRDE need to build something like a T90 or T72 that India can produce in huge numbers with locally available/produceable materials...

overall outer surface concerns me more than overall weight....smaller area...smaller target...

Do love Arjun mk2...but I think army needs to induct it and keep asking for more changes simultaneously...like they do to leapord 2...u cant get everything perfect in first go...

 

[hammer head]

understandable

but someday you will make to make these changes as future warfare trend indicate that as anti tank weapons etc get more powerful the weight of tanks will increase to cater for more protection.

light weight and medium weight tanks have no chance to dominate the future battlefield even under heavy air support . (unless for specific tasks)

let me ask you do you really think the T90 tanks will be able to survive the inevitable entrenched anti tank troops equipped with ATGMs . if the tanks loose their mobility even for a moment they will become toast.

only arjun has the capability to take multiple hits and survive

but i am no expert , i just replied for the sake of it, maybe you can address the concerns.

all i know those who dont evolve with time and threats they perish

I am happy you have asked this question, so let me answer yoy question one by one. I dont wish to enagage in rhetorics and would request others also to add on to the discussion
Qn- .but someday you will make to make these changes as future warfare trend indicate that as anti tank weapons etc get more powerful the weight of tanks will increase to cater for more protection.
Ans: No tank today is immune from the latest gen Anti tank ammunition!! Be it M1 A1 Abrahams or Merkeva 4, You can make a tank heavy but it can still be easily made Immobile by blowing of the Tank. Tracks have no connection to the Armour you have on the Tank. YES WE WANT TO ADAPT TO THE LATEST CHANGES FOR THAT MATTER WE WANT TO BE AHEAD OF THE CHANGES!! But bhai we dont have the money for it, As simple as that. Modernization is a slow and painful process and if you talk about apna Desh toh phir i dont even want to comment.

Qn- only arjun has the capability to take multiple hits and survive.
Ans- True, But whats the point if your tank is unable to cross over a bridge close to Lahore or in chambh jauria sector??? So you need a Tank which is mid weight with all the jing bang of the FMBT.

 

[porky_kicker]

I am happy you have asked this question, so let me answer yoy question one by one. I dont wish to enagage in rhetorics and would request others also to add on to the discussion
Qn- .but someday you will make to make these changes as future warfare trend indicate that as anti tank weapons etc get more powerful the weight of tanks will increase to cater for more protection.
Ans: No tank today is immune from the latest gen Anti tank ammunition!! Be it M1 A1 Abrahams or Merkeva 4, You can make a tank heavy but it can still be easily made Immobile by blowing of the Tank. Tracks have no connection to the Armour you have on the Tank. YES WE WANT TO ADAPT TO THE LATEST CHANGES FOR THAT MATTER WE WANT TO BE AHEAD OF THE CHANGES!! But bhai we dont have the money for it, As simple as that. Modernization is a slow and painful process and if you talk about apna Desh toh phir i dont even want to comment.

Qn- only arjun has the capability to take multiple hits and survive.
Ans- True, But whats the point if your tank is unable to cross over a bridge close to Lahore or in chambh jauria sector??? So you need a Tank which is mid weight with all the jing bang of the FMBT.

regarding the first point mobility kill is no problem , provided my crew survives , in T90 all will be KIA but not so in arjun which gives them a more than fighting chance to survive . u know the problem with T series tank regarding ammo cook off , the crew wont survive , not a problem in arjun, my crew can escape to fight another day.

my overall point is even with ATGMs arjun offers much better survival chances than T90 for the crew.

your second point is valid regarding bridges in porkistan etc (cant we ask them to make their bridges stronger :biggrin2: )
my point why not use arjun for taking the enemy head on with the T90 at the flanks , after that as conditions permit T90 can use the bridges which can support them inside porkistan to move ahead with their objectives while arjun follows them after our engineers lay their bridges.

i am asking/suggesting the use of arjun and T 90 based on their strengths and have them complement each other depending on their capabilities. and this is very much doable

 

[pankaj nema]

I am happy you have asked this question, so let me answer yoy question one by one. I dont wish to enagage in rhetorics and would request others also to add on to the discussion
Qn- .but someday you will make to make these changes as future warfare trend indicate that as anti tank weapons etc get more powerful the weight of tanks will increase to cater for more protection.
Ans: No tank today is immune from the latest gen Anti tank ammunition!! Be it M1 A1 Abrahams or Merkeva 4, You can make a tank heavy but it can still be easily made Immobile by blowing of the Tank. Tracks have no connection to the Armour you have on the Tank. YES WE WANT TO ADAPT TO THE LATEST CHANGES FOR THAT MATTER WE WANT TO BE AHEAD OF THE CHANGES!! But bhai we dont have the money for it, As simple as that. Modernization is a slow and painful process and if you talk about apna Desh toh phir i dont even want to comment.

Qn- only arjun has the capability to take multiple hits and survive.
Ans- True, But whats the point if your tank is unable to cross over a bridge close to Lahore or in chambh jauria sector??? So you need a Tank which is mid weight with all the jing bang of the FMBT.

Sir you must have read and Heard about the Pakistan's Anti tank Battalions

They have created and raised a large number of Anti tank batallions to stop Indian Mechanised forces

So what is the Best way and Best weapon to defeat these battalions

 

[porky_kicker]

Sir you must have read and Heard about the Pakistan's Anti tank Battalions

They have created and raised a large number of Anti tank batallions to stop Indian Mechanised forces

So what is the Best way and Best weapon to defeat these battalions

using non line of sight weapons like self propelled artillery or self propelled mortars

 

[hammer head]

Well LAT( light anti tank) and HAT (heavy anti tank )battalions have been raised but they are authorised at Paki Div level. They are a formidable force and now these assets have been very recently been incorporated even at Brigade level.

To understand how theyare a threat to our tanks you first need know where all can they be employed in the battle DCB, CANAL, Delay lines, BOPS etc. They can be taken out simply by arty fire or Tank fire.

 

[binayak95]

Well LAT( light anti tank) and HAT (heavy anti tank )battalions have been raised but they are authorised at Paki Div level. They are a formidable force and now these assets have been very recently been incorporated even at Brigade level.

To understand how theyare a threat to our tanks you first need know where all can they be employed in the battle DCB, CANAL, Delay lines, BOPS etc. They can be taken out simply by arty fire or Tank fire.

As the army receives Rudras, LCHs and Apaches it'll learn how to use them and armour together. Bye bye anti tank forces.

 

[Pandora]

If point is just weight factor then whole world is idiot to develop 60+ tank.

 

[hammer head]

If point is just weight factor then whole world is idiot to develop 60+ tank.

The whole world is not having a DCB and Canal based obstacle system.
The world is not having Terminal objevtives like Lahoe during hostilites.'
The whole world would not get involved in Lean on Break in Break out ops.

 

[Abhi9]

Well your completely here mate, Arjun is not a break through tank. Employment of Tanks T90 or Arjun in our context is primarily
1. Lean on Operations on Enemy Ditch cum bunds
2. Break out and contacting enemy on its second Ditch cum bund using their own bridges, now lets see why the Army is not Pro for Arjun.

1. If you induct a 70 Ton Tank you will have to change the complete equipment profile of Assault Engineer Regiments, Their Armour ed recovery vehicles, Bridge laying tanks and other maint equipment.
2. The entire change in the inventory will require ,Huge amount of money and time. Do we have the time and money at this stage ?? well i leave it for you to decide.

Arjun is my favourite Tank i have been lucky enough to have seen this beast from close and go through all the incorporated changes which really makes it world class. What DRDO really need to DO at this stage would be to make a FMBT with weight under the domain and Tech incorporating all what Arjun Mk 2 has.

And for Gods sake pls stop abusing the Army, yes they have made mistakes but they are no fools to invest in a machine which will not fetch them victory in WAR.

Good try on being the devils advocate. Again try to defend the rampant corruption to earn comissions on arms trade, constantly changing requirements, never being part of embracing the development of military eco system, stop putting these absurdities into an absolute fact that indian army is on constant endeavour do scuttle desi programs , be it tanks or machine guns. Armies involve products into their battle field schemes and not make battle field schemes around a tank. Just hoardes of nonsense