F-35 Joint Strike Fighter

[IndianHawk]

S400 deliveries commence to Turkey and reactions are starting to come in from US political class:



Calls for sanctions already coming in. F35 will now be de-liked from Turkey (remember Turkey was to be a manufacturing hub for the F35). If they are doing this to a a NATO ally and F35 partner, what will they do to India?

Wake up people. It was always S400 or F35, the two could never be bought together. India has made a calculation and concluded f35 is not what it wants.


Chapter is closed (before it was ever really opened)


What do you think that changes? Nothing.

The US’s objection to the S400 is that it will allow Russia to build a profile of the F35’s signature. No F35 operator will be allowed to order the S400. End. Of. Story.

Get F35 out of your mind. S400 payment will be made in next few weeks and after that F35 will not be an option for any Indian branch.




Perhaps but with time and budgetary support India will create a similar system. It might not be 100% of S400’s capabilities but it will be sufficient for Indias needs and will be 1) cheaper and 2) independent

It's good we need to put our money on AMCA.
US is also threatening our s400 purchase with sanctions. Time to develop Kaveri-m88 on war footing we need to secure an alternative to us engine.

Our own xr Sam is 5-7 years away from development and then we will have to integrate akash , MRSAM , XR SAM all together and we will have an indegenios s300. It will still be behind s400.

Hence buying s400 now is a wise decision as it also helps falling squadron numbers by doing the job of point defense fighters too.

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[asianobserve]

Two more F-35 fighter jets land in Israel, bringing IAF’s declared total to 16
https://www.timesofisrael.com/two-m...in-israel-bringing-iafs-declared-total-to-16/

 

[asianobserve]

U.S. to Withhold F-35 Fighters From Turkey, Trump Says
https://www.wsj.com/articles/u-s-to-withhold-f-35-fighters-from-turkey-trump-says-11563304669

 

[BON PLAN]

https://aviationweek.com/defense/f-...m=email&elq2=09a3dc83a4544392bd14f00ee601f7f1

 

[BON PLAN]

https://www.wsj.com/articles/u-s-to-withhold-f-35-fighters-from-turkey-trump-says-11563304669
U.S. to Withhold F-35 Fighters From Turkey

 

[abingdonboy]

https://www.ft.com/content/d75f8baa-a8cc-11e9-b6ee-3cdf3174eb89

Game. Set. Match.

No F35 for NATO ally and F35 project member Turkey after they purchased S400.

If anyone still thinks F35s are even in the table for India they are beyond delusional.

India will not be getting any foreign 5th gen fighters, at most it will work with foreign partners for the AMCA (in a similar way to early days of LCA) but that’s about it.

AMCA is the future.


Dassualt has a huge opportunity here to leverage their presence in India onto AMCA

 

[abingdonboy]

See how Americans are pushing around their TREATY ally?

Is this the future you want for india? Every time you see a “analyst” shilling for an American OEM remember this reality.

You don’t own American equipment, you merely lease it from them.

 

[asianobserve]

See how Americans are pushing around their TREATY ally?

Is this the future you want for india? Every time you see a “analyst” shilling for an American OEM remember this reality.

You don’t own American equipment, you merely lease it from them.

Don't confuse things. It's Turkey who has not been acting like a treaty ally. Turkey wants to have everything including the enemy of the treaty. The Americans and NATO have been giving Turkey all the opportunities to back down from the brink but megalomaniac Erdo thinks he is invincible. So I certainly think Turkey has overstepped the line here.

 

[IndianHawk]

Don't confuse things. It's Turkey who has not been acting like a treaty ally. Turkey wants to have everything including the enemy of the treaty. The Americans and NATO have been giving Turkey all the opportunities to back down from the brink but megalomaniac Erdo thinks he is invincible. So I certainly think Turkey has overstepped the line here.

If turkey was a treaty ally why didn't USA agreed to transfer patriot technology to turkey?

Russia agreed for tot with s400 sell.

It's pretty simple actually. Turkey was never an ally merely an obedient vessel. The moment it demanded ally like tech sharing US showed true colours .

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[BON PLAN]

If anyone still thinks F35s are even in the table for India they are beyond delusional.

AMCA is the future.

Dassualt has a huge opportunity here to leverage their presence in India onto AMCA

I fully agree .

 

[asianobserve]

If turkey was a treaty ally why didn't USA agreed to transfer patriot technology to turkey?

Russia agreed for tot with s400 sell.

It's pretty simple actually. Turkey was never an ally merely an obedient vessel. The moment it demanded ally like tech sharing US showed true colours .

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Is France required to transfer Rafale TOT to Turkey because they're NATO allies? Weapons tech are proprietary matters and no NATO partner is required to give them away to fellow partners.

What a NATO partner is required to do is mutual defense.

 

[IndianHawk]

Is France required to transfer Rafale TOT to Turkey because they're NATO allies? Weapons tech are proprietary matters and no NATO partner is required to give them away to fellow partners.

What a NATO partner is required to do is mutual defense.

Well if you can't provide what your ally wants then the ally can buy it someplace else.


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[asianobserve]

Well if you can't provide what your ally wants then the ally can buy it someplace else.


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Germany immediately stationed Patriot batteries in Turkey after Turkey made known its need for it through NATO. But it was never about aerial threats for Erdo. Turkey instead Turkey wants the Patriot technology so that it can make its own and compete against the US for buyers. This is what started it all. Now, if you're the US would you give up your cutting edge tech to Turkey that surely would be used to compete against you?

 

[IndianHawk]

Germany immediately stationed Patriot batteries in Turkey after Turkey made known its need for it through NATO. But it was never about aerial threats for Erdo. Turkey instead Turkey wants the Patriot technology so that it can make its own and compete against the US for buyers. This is what started it all. Now, if you're the US would you give up your cutting edge tech to Turkey that surely would be used to compete against you?

Turkey didn't just wanted missile but technology to make missile as well. USA Can't provide that so what is the point of alliance for turkey?

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[Immanuel]

See how Americans are pushing around their TREATY ally?

Is this the future you want for india? Every time you see a “analyst” shilling for an American OEM remember this reality.

You don’t own American equipment, you merely lease it from them.

Well only enuchs won't push back against this sort of nonsense. Turkey under Erdo is increasingly a bigger shitholes and ardent Puki lovers.

They should be kicked out of NATO for all I care. Fuck an ally.

 

[Immanuel]

If turkey was a treaty ally why didn't USA agreed to transfer patriot technology to turkey?

Russia agreed for tot with s400 sell.

It's pretty simple actually. Turkey was never an ally merely an obedient vessel. The moment it demanded ally like tech sharing US showed true colours .

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Ally doesn't mean you get to fondle the testicles. To give out sensitive tech to unwashed abduls is silliness.

 

[Immanuel]

https://www.ft.com/content/d75f8baa-a8cc-11e9-b6ee-3cdf3174eb89

Game. Set. Match.

No F35 for NATO ally and F35 project member Turkey after they purchased S400.

If anyone still thinks F35s are even in the table for India they are beyond delusional.

India will not be getting any foreign 5th gen fighters, at most it will work with foreign partners for the AMCA (in a similar way to early days of LCA) but that’s about it.

AMCA is the future.

Dassualt has a huge opportunity here to leverage their presence in India onto AMCA

Dassault first has to deliver the Rafale and hope for a second order.

Second, as far as AMCA goes, Dassault has nothing to offer.

 

[BON PLAN]

Dassault first has to deliver the Rafale and hope for a second order.

Second, as far as AMCA goes, Dassault has nothing to offer.

Dassault can offer in offset for a second deal (may be bigger than 36) or MMRCA2.... to assist HAL for designing AMCA.

 

[Immanuel]

Dassault can offer in offset for a second deal (may be bigger than 36) or MMRCA2.... to assist HAL for designing AMCA.

AMCA design atleast for now is frozen and vendor selection for suppliers is ongoing, ( this should be done by end of year)

https://www.theweek.in/news/india/2...fighter-engine.html?__twitter_impression=true

I think Thales (radar, OSF or EW suite) & Safran (joint engine) could be of more help but for now GE engines will power the initial prototypes probably followed on by the F414 EPE (since HAL/ADA/IAF are quite comfy with GE engines and higher thrust versions are easily available) Also the Israelis are the IAF's favorite go to when we can't get past some hurdles like home made radars, jammers etc.

A big point will also be Kaveri but even in vanilla K-9 version it is not ready to power the LCA let alone LCA Mk-1a, MK-2 or AMCA.

 

[BON PLAN]

AMCA design atleast for now is frozen and vendor selection for suppliers is ongoing, ( this should be done by end of year)

https://www.theweek.in/news/india/2...fighter-engine.html?__twitter_impression=true

I think Thales (radar, OSF or EW suite) & Safran (joint engine) could be of more help but for now GE engines will power the initial prototypes probably followed on by the F414 EPE (since HAL/ADA/IAF are quite comfy with GE engines and higher thrust versions are easily available) Also the Israelis are the IAF's favorite go to when we can't get past some hurdles like home made radars, jammers etc.

A big point will also be Kaveri but even in vanilla K-9 version it is not ready to power the LCA let alone LCA Mk-1a, MK-2 or AMCA.

The LCA design is frozen for years. That doesn't mean it can't be optimised. The skill of Dassault is well known, specially for Delta.

About Kaveri, very few news in France.... I don't know if it goes in the right direction or not.