Tension high between Turkey, Greece in Eastern Mediterranean

TheTurk

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Erdogan's international policies are the consequence of his perception of his country. He wants to have a region "under Turkish influence" and found that since the European Union won't accept Turkey's accession (unfair IMO), the Middle East makes the perfect alternative.

But the only way to enter the Middle Eastern politics is to try and prove that you are a pious Muslim - the ideal Muslim. Erdogan was already conservative when he was the mayor of Istanbul and was well-known for conservative personal views. However, there is a long road between conservative and downright radical, that he may seem to have covered since his political ascendance 17 years ago.

The problem is, instead of focusing on policies centred around his region, the man has started picking up fights and intervening in matters that are way beyond his scope of understanding or control. Turkey has been a valued member of NATO and is one of the few countries that is licensed to manufacture the F-16 jet under license. Turkey has access to cutting edge electronic warfare systems from USA and other European countries and can easily collaborate with these powers to develop their own systems.

But because of one stupid insistence of the Russian S-400 missile (which is the best in the market), he lost the trust of the entire NATO. It is a matter of time before NATO votes Turkey out if he continues with this attitude. To make it worse, Erdogan has been lashing out at everyone in the region - Israel, Egypt, Lebanon, Greece, the UAE, Armenia and Cyprus. While each of these countries is no match for Turkey (except Israel), when combined together, they can economically and militarily join hands and deliver some serious punishment to Erdogan's ego.

The sad part about all this is that the common Turks are not being heard. Correct me if I am wrong, but the educated and capable Turkish youth is leaving the country.

As someone for whom the entire world is a working space and has spent quite some time in Turkey, I feel sad. Before Erdogan's extra-regional aggressions, I had a great time in your country - the food, the music, the cultural aspects, the general warmth of the common Turkish people were all quite nice.

Let's hope he at least mends his fences with all those countries that he picked on, including us Indians. I don't know what has gotten into him to pick on us who are over 3000 Kms away from his furthest borders.
erdogan isn´t pious. he is a münafiqun. His religion is mighty dollar and his god is mammon
 

shade

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So u mean to say he has no lust for 72 hoors?
He lives in a fucking Palace in Turkey, you bet if he wants he can have 72 virgin hoors on earth itself.
The guy has basically become Sultan Padishah over there by taking advantage of the Turki's religion being repressed by secular military dictatorships over the years.
Now he is enriching himself, his sons, his son-in-laws etc etc.
Eventually his behavior will be made public, and with Soros/CIA style stunts Turkey will be pushed into hard left liberalism.
 

mattster

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All Muslim countries eventually become autocratic regimes even if they are democratic by history or by colonial heritage. this is because Islam itself does not place much importance on personal individual rights. it only demands compliance. So its the perfect environment for a ruthless strongman or dictator.
 

SKC

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All Muslim countries eventually become autocratic regimes even if they are democratic by history or by colonial heritage. this is because Islam itself does not place much importance on personal individual rights. it only demands compliance. So its the perfect environment for a ruthless strongman or dictator.
Very True! Till 50's Leaders of Arab Nations and north African countries used to laugh on idea having regressive Islamic practices in their countries. They used to claim there is no place for full body hijab and other woman holding policies there. But now see almost each of them have all short of policies in full swing.
Democracy is only in name, families controlling whole country.
 

Tshering22

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Eventually, his behaviour will be made public, and with Soros/CIA style stunts Turkey will be pushed into hard left-liberalism.
Nope.

Turks will never be attracted to left liberalism. You need to understand the Turkish mindset and the cultural fabric.

The two sides there are:

1) Islamists
2) Turkic nationalists (ranging from the irreligious to Tengriists)

Erdogan as we all know belongs to the set mentioned in (1).

Unlike the Western definition of LEFT and RIGHT wing that we refer to in general conversations, Turkish political scenario is a lot similar to India's and doesn't stick to that categorization.

There is not Left or Right in the traditional sense.

Hindu Nationalism is not a religious movement; it is a cultural movement as Hindu/Buddh/Sikh/Jain are not religions but different spiritual paths from the same source. Dharmic societies don't have a shariah-equivalent and neither are Gita/Tripitaka/Guru Granth Sahib/Kalpasutra expected to become the foundations of national law.

Hindu nationalism respects sages but won't see a bunch of sadhus or rishis or granthis or monks ruling the country (contrary to the nonsensical Monk-military alliance in Myanmar and Monk-politician alliance in Sri Lanka).

Turkic nationalism is similar in many ways.
  1. There is no shariah equivalent
  2. There is no demand for adherence to one book but rather a umbrella of legends and customs
  3. Turkic cultural and religious/spiritual identity is one and the same; doesn't matter if one is agnostic, but will still be Turk nationalist regardless because he/she would proudly adhere to the cultural and customary norms
There are communist parties in both Turkey and India, but they are essentially just anarchists and anti-national separatist elements misusing the political freedoms of democracy. The so-called Left in both these countries has no interest in the nation's progress or identity.

At best Turkish political sides can be defined as:

1) Cultural
2) Islamist
3) Foreign-influenced communist

But the traditional Left-Liberal and Right-Conservative definitions are not applicable here.

That being said, Turkey would do very well under Turk nationalists who would shed the hubris of trying to become another Ottoman Empire.
 

Tshering22

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erdogan isn´t pious. he is a münafiqun. His religion is mighty dollar and his god is mammon
Whatever he is, he seems to be doing pretty well with the Islamists. If he is not a pious man (religious), then he has got good acting skills to pretend to be one. Lashing out at countries far away is getting him all the brownie points in unrelated warzones like Gaza and West Bank in Israel, Chechnya in Russia, Kashmir in India, Mindanao in Philippines, etc.
 

TheTurk

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Whatever he is, he seems to be doing pretty well with the Islamists. If he is not a pious man (religious), then he has got good acting skills to pretend to be one. Lashing out at countries far away is getting him all the brownie points in unrelated warzones like Gaza and West Bank in Israel, Chechnya in Russia, Kashmir in India, Mindanao in Philippines, etc.
Erdogan is Illuminati member. a member of the middle eastern shriner masonic lodge.
 

Tshering22

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Erdogan is Illuminati member. a member of the middle eastern shriner masonic lodge.
Do you see Turkish people electing another ruler in the coming years or do you see a complete transition of Turkey into a form of 'Republican single-party' governance model?
 

Dessert Storm

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Nope.

Turks will never be attracted to left liberalism. You need to understand the Turkish mindset and the cultural fabric.

The two sides there are:

1) Islamists
2) Turkic nationalists (ranging from the irreligious to Tengriists)

Erdogan as we all know belongs to the set mentioned in (1).

Unlike the Western definition of LEFT and RIGHT wing that we refer to in general conversations, Turkish political scenario is a lot similar to India's and doesn't stick to that categorization.

There is not Left or Right in the traditional sense.

Hindu Nationalism is not a religious movement; it is a cultural movement as Hindu/Buddh/Sikh/Jain are not religions but different spiritual paths from the same source. Dharmic societies don't have a shariah-equivalent and neither are Gita/Tripitaka/Guru Granth Sahib/Kalpasutra expected to become the foundations of national law.

Hindu nationalism respects sages but won't see a bunch of sadhus or rishis or granthis or monks ruling the country (contrary to the nonsensical Monk-military alliance in Myanmar and Monk-politician alliance in Sri Lanka).

Turkic nationalism is similar in many ways.
  1. There is no shariah equivalent
  2. There is no demand for adherence to one book but rather a umbrella of legends and customs
  3. Turkic cultural and religious/spiritual identity is one and the same; doesn't matter if one is agnostic, but will still be Turk nationalist regardless because he/she would proudly adhere to the cultural and customary norms
There are communist parties in both Turkey and India, but they are essentially just anarchists and anti-national separatist elements misusing the political freedoms of democracy. The so-called Left in both these countries has no interest in the nation's progress or identity.

At best Turkish political sides can be defined as:

1) Cultural
2) Islamist
3) Foreign-influenced communist

But the traditional Left-Liberal and Right-Conservative definitions are not applicable here.

That being said, Turkey would do very well under Turk nationalists who would shed the hubris of trying to become another Ottoman Empire.
Don't agree to your POV on Dharma and law.
'Gita/Tripitaka/Guru Granth Sahib/Kalpasutra expected to become the foundations of national law'

Kautilya ascribed a lot of importance to ‘dharma’. According to him, ‘the ultimate source of all law is dharma’.
 

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