Pakistan's Ideology and Identity crisis

[Vinod2070]

^^ Valid points. Quite refreshing to see such introspection.

We all need introspection to make ourselves a better country and nation. We have too much self pride for that mostly.

 

[smartindian]

you are wrong again, there is no "P" in arab language hence it should be named as bornabad :emot15::emot15:

it should be call nothing because there will be no Pakistan in the future

 

[nithyarjun43]

Purushapura - Peshawar, Suvastu - SWAT, Mai Kolachi - Karachi, Lohar Ghat - Lahore, Mulasthana - Multan, Oh dear has to come to this ! Funny looking at the geographical map it always reminded me of a land that acted as a drainage basin for an ancient monstrous river!

 

[Illusive]

It would be Baluchistan or maybe to please their Chinese masters they'd give it a chinese name, but i call them bhikaristan where even beggars wear suit in parliament.

 

[peacecracker]

Various radical Islamic Ideologies(Most of them have Agenda of World Domination etc ) are having a fertile environment in Pakistan for many decades now.I wonder,if these Ideologies will expand and Influence Muslims of Other Countries for eg:India,Turkey somewhat Moderate and Secular Ones.With the Saud Money on the Supply,these Arabs and Wanna-be Arabs will Make Earth a Hell(Generalizing and Not forgetting Sane among them whom are < 5% may be).These are Brainwashed Beyond Imagination.NO for any scope of Introspection. And Wherever they Go,They carry this Ideology,will keep themselves away from "Evil"(add any other religion/civilizations) promoting Ghetto Culture and Spread their version and starts demanding their "rights"(Google Anjem Chaudhary of islam4uk).

I believe Critic Websites like faithfreedom.org does stands some Value about religion,Especially Pakistan,Sudan etc.

 

[hit&run]

 

[ajtr]

My teacher taught me how to hate​

My Islamiat teacher had made it clear that anything Western or Indian was a sin. Jeans, western television and music were all sinful indulgences.

It is a myth that extremist Islamic ideology which is used to fuel conspiracy theories is only a threat to the desperately impoverished. The country's tendency to believe in xenophobic conspiracy theories cuts across the classes, advocated by perfectly 'normal' middle-class actors. Underneath the western façade of designer denims and a sporting British education, there exists a generation confused, suspicious of democracy, resentful of the West, and guilty for their inability to dedicate themselves to Pakistan's ascetic version of Islam.

The 'new' Islam

The country's imagination is arrested by pointed fingers. Every problem has a foreign enemy and every solution bans the foreign element. Pakistan is fostering an identity based on foreign enemies that unnecessarily blurs the lines between nationalism and religion. Pakistan's version of Islam appears to be based on prejudices against non-Muslims (benefiting only the powerful), despite the Holy Quran's staunch aversion towards intolerance. The enemies of Islam and Pakistan are the same: the Americans, Jews, Indians and even the divorced. This form of thinking is far removed from rationality, yet it manages to seep through the educated classes- why? Could it be that irrational thinking is rooted in our socialisation?

Conditioned to be irrational

This time it is not the media to blame; this form of irrational reasoning has been present for long. We're habitually being conditioned from childhood by our peers and families, but more importantly, we are irresponsibly being taught to think like this through our education.

My own inner-moral conflict began when I was nine years old. That day my Islamiat teacher had made it clear that anything Western or Indian was a sin. Jeans, western television and music were all sinful indulgences. Of course, Pakistani television was permissible. All the non-Muslims were destined to hell. The only road to express eternal bliss was the Islamic highway to Heaven, while the non-believers would perish at the merciless realms of hellish peripherals for the rest of eternity.

The reason was simple for my teacher; the West had succumbed to its desires. This was the work of the Devil. Therefore, such people deserved to be shunned and hated. There were many more such lessons, some not so direct by teachers, friends of family, other children and, local textbooks. Columnist Rubina Saigol argues that the Pakistani education system is continuously churning out generations that have learned to hate anything that does not fit into their 'box'.

(Mis)educating the educated

During my teaching years at a private college, I was surprised to see our Star World generation of 18 year olds distrust towards democracy, and fallacious Islamic beliefs. It was tragically apparent that despite the secular private education and global connectivity, these children were still living in a world where the West was the incompatible opposite of Islam.

A lecturer in college urged the students to support the Taliban in the war against terror, that we should 'fight' in whatever way we can. Peaceful lines of effective communication through assimilation with the global community as opposed to isolation was just not a good enough option. It was no surprise when all the students agreed with her.

These schools and colleges were not fortified Madrassas. They were English medium schools, attended by all students who had traveled to the West in the summers. The location was not rugged but the well-planned city of Islamabad. The teachers were not beady-eyed bearded old man, but thirty-something working mothers. Poverty was not the reason for the student's attendance, it was affluence.

It is clear that violence and intolerance has not been working to Pakistan's benefit. The only real hope for peace is learning to tolerate and communicate effectively.

It is time to use our imaginations wisely.

 

[ajtr]

How pathetically low can you go​

A picture has been doing the rounds on email purporting to show the debauchery of Balochistan Chief Minister Nawab Aslam Raisani. It shows a smiling Raisani with his head on the shoulders of a young, T-shirt clad girl. The picture has actually been culled from the Facebook page of Express News, where it was posted - for what exact news reason we do not know - on October 1. The poster of the photograph (we are not sure whether from within Express News or one of its 'community') claims it was taken at a party in Islamabad, the obvious implication being that Raisani was drunk and coming on to the girl.

As of now there are over 700 comments beneath the photograph which mostly range from downright abusive of Raisani (and generally all "ayyash" [debauched] politicians) to calls to "kill the lech." Most are unprintable. But even worse are the comments reserved for the girl, whose moral character was openly questioned, whose body language was sleazily analyzed and who, thanks to one commenting woman (!), was immediately and conclusively dubbed a "call girl."

We too were forwarded the photograph and link but decided there was no reason to carry such an obviously salacious piece of character assassination. No matter what one might think of Raisani and his political antics, this was clearly, we figured, none of our business... Until we received an anguished email from a friend of the girl, with proof, to set the record straight.

So guess what that poor, poor girl's name is: Aana Hassan Raisani. Yes, she is Aslam Raisani's own teenage daughter, who attends school in Islamabad. And the photograph of a father expressing innocent affection for his daughter was apparently taken at their home. Seeing how such an innocent (and private) moment was twisted and presented as one of alleged depravity by no-doubt the most depraved of people themselves, made me almost sick to my stomach. And I have a fairly strong stomach. Then the outrage took over.

In addition to Aana's friend who emailed us, a bunch of her other friends and classmates are now taking on the commenting sad fucks on the Facebook page itself. According to the friend who emailed us, Aana herself has been so severely traumatised by this event and the venom spewed about her and her father, that she has gone incommunicado. Nevertheless students from three schools in Islamabad plan to protest on Tuesday against this amazingly sleazy episode.

We have consciously decided not to republish the photograph. But if you have the stomach, read the comments under the photograph again to see how sick, perverted and corrupted the minds of the people in this country have become. To heap abuse on and defame someone without a shred of evidence or even a modicum of common decency, to be ready to draw the most perverted of inferences without a second thought, really, what can one say about such sad excuses for human beings? But what it also indicates is how quickly Pakistanis are willing to believe the worst about political figures, a function, I would submit, more of the environment we have all had a hand in creating than of anything the politicians themselves have done or do.

As for Express News, which ultimately bears responsibility for the content on its page, well may be it should just take its onanistic being and go screw itself.

On being a Pakistani man​

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Imaduddin Ahmed

Another Independence Day has gone! Yes, we lost our more democratic half and there's quite a bit of turmoil here and there, but we'e here and we can say "Up Yours India!" and that's what counts, right?

Well, besides being here, what do we Pakistanis have to show for ourselves? Two things that spring to mind are a few sporting achievements (a confidence booster for Pakistani male virility) and the Muslim-nuclear bomb, coupled with a few missiles – which means we'e good at erecting phallic tools that cause massive explosions (testimony to the fact that we're not afraid of showing India how large our collective might is).

One wonders what the state might have accomplished had our army-worshipping culture not been so preoccupied by male sexual insecurities. But it sheds a sympathetic light on our predilection for imprisoning our women within four walls; men are also victims of their own chauvinism.

While we're on the topic, let me issue a warning to you, women new to Pakistan: imprison yourselves during Independence Day! Oh, and by the way, welcome.

Don't be tempted by the lure of free open-air concerts; don't be charmed by the thousands of young exuberant men performing wheelies on their motorbikes. No, your foolhardy courage won't prove me wrong and change people's thinking in a night. (Unless you collectively organise with other women to "take back the night.") I also urge my male readers to stay in. Read on and see why.

This is advice that I wish had been dispensed last year to myself, my Turkish friend, Bade, and our Kenyan friend, Jenn. So does Michelle, a former colleague of mine. One Pakistan Independence Day in 2006 was what it took to send her, with her Harvard degree, packing back to the States.

I was excited to participate in the Independence Day festivities – more to celebrate what can be than what has been. I bought Pakistani jhandas to accessorise my car and friends with; our flag, after all, isn't bad as far as flags go: it has symbols of hope and optimism and a white stripe to remind us that we'ree meant to celebrate (what's left of) our pluralistic mix.

So it was that Jenn, Bade and I started our night of the 14th on that note – celebrating Lahore's lesser known diversity in an African bar in downtown Lahore. After liberating a few of the bar's assets in the company of nationals from Kenya, Chad, Tanzania and Nigeria, we made our way to Race Course Park, keen as I was to show off Pakistan's hyped up pop-music industry (which I had to mention was doing better than India's).

Once we arrived, Bade, in her enthusiastic mood to share in the national jubilation, took my Pakistani jhanda, threw it over her shoulders, took hold of Jenn's hand and ran towards the performer's stage, cutting through the audience at a rapid pace. I walked behind, gleaming with pride that my friend had the confidence to run through a crowd of Pakistani men. What follows is Bade's recount in an email she wrote to her friends the following day:

'Though Jenn preferred to watch the concert from the back, I pulled her into the crowd till we ended up in a circle of men. She said, "They are going to touch us," and just then I felt hands all over my body. A man was trying to snatch my bag while another was pulling my kameez under the Pakistan flag covering my shoulders. I fell on the ground with some men on me. Imad hit one of the men, only then did the onlookers take any action: to restrain the two men from harming each other! We started to walk back with a crowd of hundreds of men following us. They all had stupid smiles on their faces. Jenn tried to explain what had happened to the policemen sitting next to the gate of Race Course Park. They had the same stupid smiles on their faces until Imad told them whose grandson he was [and they then they escorted us back to our transportation, warding off the crowd of following men.]

'I spent the night looking at my half torn kameez and crying . . . The next day I was feeling calmer. I told the story to some Pakistani friends. They advised me not to go to public concerts ever again and not to go out alone, especially at night. They told me stories of other women facing harassment every day. I thought I would find humanity and spirituality in Pak-istan, but here I am in this Muslim society where attacking two women in the middle of hundreds of people is considered normal and unpreventable. I refuse to understand the logic that imprisons women indoors, just because men have uncontrollable animal instincts.'

A day that I had so hoped would be one in which I could share my national pride with foreign friends turned out to be the night in which I most loathed my nation.

The journey back home was filled with Jenn's unhelpful venting. She endlessly criticised Pakistani men, as she cited example after example of men on the street propositioning her or masturbating when she was alone on public transportation. However, she apologised for me, explaining that since I had been raised in Britain I was educated, and that her African friends were surprised that I was a Pakistani man because I was 'gentle' and 'respectful'. Rather than rebut her condescending statements, I half-welcomed being disassociated from the label 'Pakistani man'.


When I later visited my friend in her native Istanbul, a shopkeeper advised her to be careful of Pakistani men, having had a bad experience with his sister's husband.We have a bad rep, chaps.
In 59 years not only have we forsaken human development for more macho and irrelevant ambitions, we've nurtured the most beastly tendencies to women. Women leave our country in disgust.

I'm going to join our women indoors this 14th August and rethink masculinity and what it can mean to be a Pakistani man. You're welcome to join us, chaps.

 

[jatkshatriya]

if this is what they teach in their schools.....no hindu living in pakistan can ever be loyal to that country....Our govt shud give citizenships to all hindus living in pakistan as life there for hindus will be that of second class citizens

 

[peacecracker]

They are living in a Land where they look up on India to Oppose Whatever India Stands For.They are soulless arabic slaves .

 

[The Messiah]

if this is what they teach in their schools.....no hindu living in pakistan can ever be loyal to that country....Our govt shud give citizenships to all hindus living in pakistan as life there for hindus will be that of second class citizens

i disagree.

who are we to grant citizenship to others based purely on religion ? when i see a pakistani i dont see which religion he is.

why should we care what happens to citizens of another country ?

 

[mayfair]

why should we care what happens to citizens of another country ?

Remember that when you talk about Palestinians.

 

[sesha_maruthi27]

Former military ruler Pervez Musharraf has admitted that Pakistan had trained underground militant groups to fight in Kashmir, the first such admission by a top leader of the country.

Musharraf's candid remarks came days after he announced his return to active politics from London where he has been living in self-imposed exile.

"They (underground militant groups to fight against India in Kashmir) were indeed formed," Musharraf told German magazine Der Spiegel in an interview.

Asked why did Pakistan train militant underground groups to fight India in Kashmir, the former President said

Nawaz Sharif's apathy to the Kashmir issue was one of the reasons, so was the fact that the world had turned a blind eye to the dispute.

"Yes, it is the right of any country to promote its own interests... when India is not prepared to discuss Kashmir at the United Nations and is not prepared to resolve the dispute in a peaceful manner," Musharraf claimed.

"The (Nawaz Sharif) government turned a blind eye because they wanted India to discuss Kashmir," he said.

Musharraf indicated he had no regrets for the Kargil intrusion, that led to an armed conflict with India in 1999, and argued that each country had a right to promote its national interest.

Musharraf slammed the international community, particularly the West, for persistently ignoring the Kashmir issue, and for singling out Pakistan for all blames.

"The West was ignoring the resolution of the Kashmir issue, which is the core issue of Pakistan. We expected the West -- especially the United States and important countries like Germany -- to resolve the Kashmir issue. Has Germany done that?" the former Pakistan military ruler asked.

Musharraf launched his political party the All Pakistan Muslim League in London and announced his intention to contest the 2013 election.

"The West blames Pakistan for everything. Nobody asks the Indian prime minister, why did you arm your country with a nuclear weapon? Why are you killing innocent civilians in Kashmir? Nobody was bothered that Pakistan got split in 1971 because of India's military backing for Bangladesh. The United States and Germany gave statements, but they didn't mean anything," he said.

Musharraf, who overthrew Sharif's government in a bloodless coup in 1999, had also as Army chief presided over the Kargil misadventure that had threatened to scale up into a full-fledged war between India and Pakistan.

 

[The Messiah]

Remember that when you talk about Palestinians.

where have i said we should grant Indian citizenship to them ???

 

[jatkshatriya]

i disagree.

who are we to grant citizenship to others based purely on religion ? when i see a pakistani i dont see which religion he is.

why should we care what happens to citizens of another country ?

Well.....ofcourse where will the hindus go....there are no other hindu states in the world...india is a democracy and secular state...why the hell did we then interfere in Bangladesh..we shud have let them be killed...what is a nation...a group of people in boad sense living under a constitution..a constitution reflects the morals and code of conduct of the citizens as well as what they stand for...india stands for freedom...isnt it.....such subjugated Hindus do not have any other country to look for accept india.....Read that bloddy article..just imagine a hindu student sitting in a class where a teacher is openly mocking his beliefs...he will not be living a life in such a situation.....Israel protect jews whereever and however it may...and i praise it for that...US and europe protect christians however and wherever it may....The entire islamic countries protect the muslim cause....where will the hindus, sikhs ,and other religions of the subcontinent go.....india shud definitely invite all those hindus, sikhs and christians living in pakistan if they are being treated as second class citizens...and democracy is what the people want..aint it....u get a vote done on this issue and even u know that the majority will be in protecting the second class citizens of pakistan

 

[The Messiah]

Well.....ofcourse where will the hindus go....there are no other hindu states in the world...india is a democracy and secular state...why the hell did we then interfere in Bangladesh..we shud have let them be killed...what is a nation...a group of people in boad sense living under a constitution..a constitution reflects the morals and code of conduct of the citizens as well as what they stand for...india stands for freedom...isnt it.....such subjugated Hindus do not have any other country to look for accept india.....Read that bloddy article..just imagine a hindu student sitting in a class where a teacher is openly mocking his beliefs...he will not be living a life in such a situation.....Israel protect jews whereever and however it may...and i praise it for that...US and europe protect christians however and wherever it may....The entire islamic countries protect the muslim cause....where will the hindus, sikhs ,and other religions of the subcontinent go.....india shud definitely invite all those hindus, sikhs and christians living in pakistan if they are being treated as second class citizens...and democracy is what the people want..aint it....u get a vote done on this issue and even u know that the majority will be in protecting the second class citizens of pakistan

why ?

pakistani hindu is as much an enemy as pakistani muslim as far as im concerned. europe and usa dont protect any religion. they had the chance to migrate to India during partition and chose pakistan...similarly millions of muslims chose India instead of pakistan.

every country based on religion goes down the gutter.

country first religion second.*

religion shouldn't count according to me.

 

[jatkshatriya]

why ?

pakistani hindu is as much an enemy as pakistani muslim as far as im concerned. europe and usa dont protect any religion.

every country based on religion goes down the gutter.

ofcourse any pakistani hindu loyal to pakistan is our enemy...but a pakistani hindu who is loyal to india is not our enemy...and i can guarantee you if they tech that stuff in basic school they cannot win the loyalty of hindus...u imagine if indian school texts start teaching that hinduism is superior to islam or christianity instead of teaching that all religions lead to god and are equal will the minorities be able to be loyal to India..dont think so....if india is declared a Hindu state will the minorities be loyal to india?..Pakistan is a declared Islamic state..Hindus shud not suffer just because they couldnt cross the border in 1947..... ..if u think the west doesnt protect and promote western culture and christianity then i dont have anything to debate....yes thay are secular and i respect them for it..protecting christians is not equal to killing other religions....India shud allow all Pakistani minorities specially hindus caz only their religion and way of life is being mocked there ...Caz They expect this from India and have evry right to expect this from india and If India cannot do this for them..for the very people whose ancestors fought for its freedom (which it wouldnt i know caz the politicians donot have time from thinking how to win the next elections..how to balance the majority and minority sentiments)then india have no right to be a secular nation representing freedom

 

[The Messiah]

ofcourse any pakistani hindu loyal to pakistan is our enemy...but a pakistani hindu who is loyal to india is not our enemy...and i can guarantee you if they tech that stuff in basic school they cannot win the loyalty of hindus...u imagine if indian school texts start teaching that hinduism is superior to islam or christianity instead of teaching that all religions lead to god and are equal will the minorities be able to be loyal to India..dont think so....if india is declared a Hindu state will the minorities be loyal to india?..Pakistan is a declared Islamic state..Hindus shud not suffer just because they couldnt cross the border in 1947..... ..if u think the west doesnt protect and promote western culture and christianity then i dont have anything to debate....yes thay are secular and i respect them for it..protecting christians is not equal to killing other religions....India shud allow all Pakistani minorities specially hindus caz only their religion and way of life is being mocked there ...Caz They expect this from India and have evry right to expect this from india and If India cannot do this for them..for the very people whose ancestors fought for its freedom (which it wouldnt i know caz the politicians donot have time from thinking how to win the next elections..how to balance the majority and minority sentiments)then india have no right to be a secular nation representing freedom

is a traitor in my book and i would have the same view if any Indian muslim was loyal to pakistan.

there are similar texts during bjp reign that twisted history and made the muslims look like the devil himself.

why should we do anything for pakistanis ? we already have problems with poverty why should be look after another countries citizen.

answer this -> which is more important for you country or religion ?

 

[Rebelkid]

What do you suppose we should do with the Pakistani Hindus who refuse to go back to Pakistan ?

answer this -> which is more important for you country or religion

Do you love your mother more or your father more ? please stop asking Ridicules questions

The point is you have not experienced the feeling when your own state starts demonizing your own religion. This is when your caught up i the question do i go with the religion i love or do i go with the country who demonizes my riligion. Although we should not invite hindus form other countries but if they do come here for protection we MUST give them citizenship(if they are willing) and protection.

And no they are not traitors, when the state does not respect them and consider them as equals there is a possibility that Hindus won't consider Pakistan as their country too..

 

[The Messiah]

What do you suppose we should do with the Pakistani Hindus who refuse to go back to Pakistan ?

If they are trouble makers then deport them to land of pure....if they're productive individuals then keep them.

My point is we should not be inviting people based on religion.

Do you love your mother more or your father more ? please stop asking Ridicules questions

The point is you have not experienced the feeling when your own state starts demonizing your own religion. This is when your caught up i the question do i go with the religion i love or do i go with the country who demonizes my riligion. Although we should not invite hindus form other countries but if they do come here for protection we MUST give them citizenship(if they are willing) and protection.

And no they are not traitors, when the state does not respect them and consider them as equals there is a possibility that Hindus won't consider Pakistan as their country too..

who i love more my mother or father ? honestly i can answer who i love more and wont give a politically correct answer. no one person can love two people equally.

so according to mother and father logic you are saying mother is India and father is hinduism ? then what is islam,christianity, sikhism etc uncle and aunties ?

if some people are not being treated well then they can apply in un or in any country (including India) to get refugee status and leave pakistan. why would we invite them ?