LCA TEJAS MK1 & MK1A: News and Discussion

[Steven Rogers]

Yeah. So my initial point was that one of the reasons for keeping Tejas design simple was to make control laws simples. That 'might' have lead to some 'probable' loss in aerodynamics. Never said it's a bad fighter. You would also know that in the initial design phase, Tejas did have canards, and the reason for dropping them was simplicity in design.

You could have added that all this is just your hypothesis than starting a new cringe debate...

 

[ersakthivel]

Sir with due respect ...I know the above points mentioned by you.....
I just tried to say that Tejas mk1a can't fulfill the requirements of a medium fighter jet......so we need mwf ...
The question was why only 83 mk1a.......
Tejas LCA is to replace mig21 and mig27......is not it .....

TEJAS MK1a IS NOT built TO MEET THE NEEDS OF MEDIUM WEIGHT FIGHTER.

IAF needs 100s of tejas mk1A sized fighter for tactical roles,

It has 300 odd heavy Su 30 mki

100 odd rafales and upgraded mig 29s in bit low weight category,

mirage 2000 and Tejas mk2 in 200 plus numbers occupy the next weight and pay load category,

tejas mk1A occupies the next weight class of tactical fighters badly needed for

combat air patrols,
Quick Reaction Teams,
tactical support for our troops in combat,
SEAD roles in support of armour columns,
interdiction of enemy lines
recon.

you cant sustain IAF budget by employing Su 30 MKI and rafale fr above roles, they are needed for other roles in deep strike and sea control

even in these roles tejas can cover the whole of of pakistan, and mos critical battle areas of LAC in Tibet,

I am yet to see any IAF sortie outside tejas range in the whole of IAF history,

USAF too uses the same F16, F15 , F18 three different weight class of fighters fr it needs,

So beware of Twitter food bloggers
faking as aerospace experts ,
who plonk all fake news on Tejas

All these

"point defence fighter"
"simple design because of first attempt"
"45 minute endurance"
"limited to indian airspace"
"no space for avionics"
"carries only 3 tons"

nonsense

are

gems are borne out of regarding such fakes as experts

 

[Dessert Storm]

You could have added that all this is just your hypothesis than starting a new cringe debate...

Are you politely saying that my understanding of control laws is flawed?

 

[Steven Rogers]

Are you politely saying that my understanding of control laws is flawed?

No,but starting a whole new trigger which was shelved years back...

 

[ersakthivel]

You could have added that all this is just your hypothesis than starting a new cringe debate...

lets leave it at that,

I have made my points,

he too has made his points,

my points are facts based on ten years of following credible leads on tejas program and my understanding of mil aviation.

people reading my posts end up lot wiser on general military aviation,

I dont spread the dark light of lies ,

like many do on tejas(believe me Tejas attracts the highest percentage of fake EGGSputise of all fighters, often bordering on madness)



He too has his own FOE to post rebuttals.

 

[Dessert Storm]

lets leave it at that,

I have made my points,

he too has made his points,

my points are facts based on ten years of following credible leads on tejas program and my understanding of mil aviation.

people reading my posts end up lot wiser on general military aviation,

I dont spread the dark light of lies ,

like many do on tejas(believe me Tejas attracts the highest percentage of fake EGGSputise of all fighters, often bordering on madness)



He too has his own FOE to post rebuttals.

You are interrupting my interaction with another forum member? You ain't the mod.

 

[ersakthivel]

You are interrupting my interaction with another forum member? You ain't the mod.

I thought I was sharing my own thoughts with a forum member,

sorry to hv interrupted you,

carry on with your convo,

best of luck

 

[ersakthivel]

Glorious pic by @hvtiaf

 

[vishnugupt]

So please stop misdirecting public with statements like,

"Maybe because it was an attempt, a long time after Marut, on designing a fighter. They would have wanted to get the max out of a simple design (you see the canards in MK2 now),

without too many control surfaces. This would make the control laws 'relatively' simple to write, test, refine and at the same time make the design less likely to fail.

All this might have resulted in a compromise on aerodynamics (F 35 ain't too nimble either, dosen't mean it's bad). "

A word about control laws tejas CLAWS ,

SAAB tried to develop this tech for grippenC and failed, SAAB's failure led to crash of wo grippen protoypes , leading to test pilots hurrying into retirement,

Then SAAB outsourced this critical tech to a US firm in Gripen C,

Even in nGripen NG , the same US firm is developing this CLAWS , fly by wire tech.

But ADA 's reliable and efficient RSS fly by wire CLAWS has drawn accolades from pilots around the world,

And now ISRO's shuttle prototypes, and future shuttles are relying on the same tech to land from space,

The reason ADA and NAVY, IAF are confident about short timelines fr Tejas mk2, TEDBF, AMCA is this indigenous CLAWS expertise by developed by ADA fr Tejas mk1.

Also both tejas mk2, and AMCA will have the same wing loading like tejas mk1,

In aerodynamics, wing loading is the total mass of an aircraft divided by the area of its wing.

This low wing loading enables fighters to take off and land with high loads from high altitude himalay airfield like LEH.

It also gives the fighter a sharp nose pointing ability via ITR,

SO Tejas mk2, AMCA fly by wire software will rely on the tried , tested and proved to be excellent CLAWSD effort of Tejas mk1,

canards are just additional surfaces for vortex aiding and short take off landing devices, that will require some modification of CLAWS

"

Don't pay attention, some members here, are suffering from inferiority complex so they often come with nonsense. They even once said, Tejas mk1 can't be deployed at forward bases.
There is so much of information available regarding Tejas on internet. If a person, qualified 5th standard mathematics can easily count Tejas performance on his left hand fingers but some people simply fails to do so.

Another possible reasons could be that IAF/Dalaals has already damaged Tejas reputation to bottom but thanks to MOD/DRDO/Fans, now Tejas reputation is on recovery path.

 

[vishnugupt]

Sir with due respect ...I know the above points mentioned by you.....
I just tried to say that Tejas mk1a can't fulfill the requirements of a medium fighter jet......so we need mwf ...
The question was why only 83 mk1a.......
Tejas LCA is to replace mig21 and mig27......is not it .....

Why only 83 mk1a ?? They don't need even these 83
Our Armed forces are suffering from "Self defeating personality disorder"
If they become self-sufficient then on what ground they will cry?? Or how people feel pity on them? Who will pay their family bills? Who will pay kickbacks??

 

[Dessert Storm]

Don't pay attention, some members here, are suffering from inferiority complex so they often come with nonsense. They even once said, Tejas mk1 can't be deployed at forward bases.
There is so much of information available regarding Tejas on internet. If a person, qualified 5th standard mathematics can easily count Tejas performance on his left hand fingers but some people simply fails to do so.

Another possible reasons could be that IAF/Dalaals has already damaged Tejas reputation to bottom but thanks to MOD/DRDO/Fans, now Tejas reputation is on recovery path.

So you are the judge. You are wrong.

 

[Dessert Storm]

To the naysayers.....from the horse's mouth.

 

[vishnugupt]

So you are the judge. You are wrong.
View attachment 62285

Neither, I was referring to you nor @patriots but there is full of loose analysis going on this forum regarding Tejas, Su-30mki, or any local products as mention by @ersakthivel.

All these

"point defence fighter"
"simple design because of first attempt"
"45 minute endurance"
"limited to indian airspace"
"no space for avionics"
"carries only 3 tons"

There could be some deficiencies, you may find if you compare it with western contemporary but don't forget all these machines built on requirements given by the Armed forces, Maybe Armed forces don't need such capabilities on particular machines.

 

[ersakthivel]

To the naysayers.....from the horse's mouth.

ha,, ha,,,

to an anxious guy, who was fed on fake news on tejas

The horse's mouth says,,

we will ensure it will be modern,
that means it will always be UPGRADED with
state of art sensors & weapons,

Since ADA has full command over its CLAWS, & RSS flight profile & digital fly by wire tech, Mission computer, stores release software, radar integration,

Tejas can field any new sensor & weapon that comes up,

like F16 upgraded with f35 tech in F21

and even laser pod getting added to it.

F16's aerodynamics is 5 decades old,

but addition of state of the art engines,
sensors , weapons,

it is as contemporary as ever,

The reason SU 30 MKI is fielding all kind of weapons from brahmos, to astra to Rudram

is

HAL owns the mission computer and stores release software

SU 30 MKI's fly by wire effort has large indian inputs,

Even its flight manuals were written in india

thats why Brahmos can be added to SU 30 MKI by HAL,

ANd IAF is confident of putting UTTAM AESA on it, because su 30 mki radar computer is also indian.

because they have the complete aerodynamics, avionics, sensor package of SU 30 MKI in their Palm,

Thats the reason russian airforce impressed with Indian SU 30 MKi effort has ordered 64 sets of SU 30 MKI's mission , radar computers from HAL to be fielded in theie SU 30 SM

thats why indigenous weapon platforms can be continuously kept contemporary,




same will be done by DRDO ADA for tejas

 

[Dessert Storm]

Neither, I was referring to you nor @patriots but there is full of loose analysis going on this forum regarding Tejas, Su-30mki, or any local products as mention by @ersakthivel.


There could be some deficiencies, you may find if you compare it with western contemporary but don't forget all these machines built on requirements given by the Armed forces, Maybe Armed forces don't need such capabilities on particular machines.

In my previous posts in this subject, I have broadly said the following (even if there are certain shortfalls):
1. Speed up MWF.
2. Support ORCA.
3. Mk1As, MWF should be bought in big numbers to plug squadron numbers.
4. "MMRCA is dead. Long live the Indian MMRCA". In this context, I did note you statement @daya 'name of MWF has been changed to MK2'.

 

[Dessert Storm]

ha,, ha,,,

to an anxious guy, who was fed on fake news on tejas

The horse's mouth says,,

we will ensure it will be modern,
that means it will always be UPGRADED with
state of art sensors & weapons,

Since ADA has full command over its CLAWS, & RSS flight profile & digital fly by wire tech, Mission computer, stores release software, radar integration,

Tejas can field any new sensor & weapon that comes up,

like F16 upgraded with f35 tech in F21
and even laser pod getting added to it.

F16's aerodynamics is 5 decades old,

but addition of state of the art engines,
sensors , weapons,

it is as contemporary as ever,

same will be done by DRDO ADA for tejas

I thought u said we were done. You are making it personal now. If you still need to engage fine. It seems you lack comprehension on what is being posted and what your reply is. The same has been pointed out in my previous posts too (mis-directed missile) And you seem to be self-worshipper too.

people reading my posts end up lot wiser on general military aviation,

These are the statistics '1.13 likes per post'. Many people would have got wiser but they don't seem to appreciate it. I agree the problem is with them not you.

 

[vishnugupt]

In my previous posts in this subject, I have broadly said the following (even if there are certain shortfalls):
1. Speed up MWF.
2. Support ORCA.
3. Mk1As, MWF should be bought in big numbers to plug squadron numbers.
4. "MMRCA is dead. Long live the Indian MMRCA". In this context, I did note you statement @daya 'name of MWF has been changed to MK2'.

We are on the same page Brother. We all want to see Tejas mk2 as soon as possible.

I did note you statement @daya 'name of MWF has been changed to MK2'.

Yes, I said it, and the result you can see is IAF gave a requirement of 114 MMRCA recently. Had IAF allowed ADA to call Tejas MK2 an MWF then How would it be possible for IAF to justify MMRCA requirement.
Kuch samjhe @daya

 

[aerokan]

I thought u said we were done. You are making it personal now. If you still need to engage fine. It seems you lack comprehension on what is being posted and what your reply is. The same has been pointed out in my previous posts too (mis-directed missile) And you seem to be self-worshipper too.

These are the statistics '1.13 likes per post'. Many people would have got wiser but they don't seem to appreciate it. I agree the problem is with them not you.
View attachment 62288

We all joined a forum almost a decade back when a like is worth a lot and is not easy to come by. We made lot of enemies then for supporting modi against congress and now just for criticizing modi. One thing that hasn't changed much is the ability to speak straight without political correctness bullshit. Now a days, every post gets lot of likes if you praise whatever modi does or simply posting stuff that satisfies our indian ego.. truth be damned.

In his case.. he defended Tejas against all dalals and several forum members who wallowed in self-doubt. Many forum members learned a lot of technical stuff from his posts when he was active. I can vouch for that and we do appreciate it.

All you need to get likes is open India-China thread and post some favorable news and you will get atleast 10 likes per post on an average. Not much effort is needed. Anyways.. i expected better from you than simple diik measuring contest.. i mean 'like' measuring contest. Good luck with your like hunting!!!

 

[aerokan]

Yeah. So my initial point was that one of the reasons for keeping Tejas design simple was to make control laws simples. That 'might' have lead to some 'probable' loss in aerodynamics. Never said it's a bad fighter. You would also know that in the initial design phase, Tejas did have canards, and the reason for dropping them was simplicity in design.

As far as i remember.. it's not to keep control laws simple.. they dropped the canards from the design because they didn't add much value for the short length of the fighter while adding a lot of weight and RCS to the MK1 model. This is after wind tunnel studies. They achieved the lift of canards (although not 100%) by raising leading edges higher compared to the rest of the wing. That is one of the great achievements of LCA design team. experts can explain better.

 

[ersakthivel]

I thought u said we were done. You are making it personal now. If you still need to engage fine. It seems you lack comprehension on what is being posted and what your reply is. The same has been pointed out in my previous posts too (mis-directed missile) And you seem to be self-worshipper too.

These are the statistics '1.13 likes per post'. Many people would have got wiser but they don't seem to appreciate it. I agree the problem is with them not you.
View attachment 62288

Didn't know forum has such fancy tools,
I was a regular here a long time ago.

Carry on with your Big Data mining and analysis

I thought u said we were done. You are making it personal now. If you still need to engage fine. It seems you lack comprehension on what is being posted and what your reply is. The same has been pointed out in my previous posts too (mis-directed missile) And you seem to be self-worshipper too.

These are the statistics '1.13 likes per post'. Many people would have got wiser but they don't seem to appreciate it. I agree the problem is with them not you.
View attachment 62288

Dif

I thought u said we were done. You are making it personal now. If you still need to engage fine. It seems you lack comprehension on what is being posted and what your reply is. The same has been pointed out in my previous posts too (mis-directed missile) And you seem to be self-worshipper too.

These are the statistics '1.13 likes per post'. Many people would have got wiser but they don't seem to appreciate it. I agree the problem is with them not you

I thought u said we were done. You are making it personal now. If you still need to engage fine. It seems you lack comprehension on what is being posted and what your reply is. The same has been pointed out in my previous posts too (mis-directed missile) And you seem to be self-worshipper too.

These are the statistics '1.13 likes per post'. Many people would have got wiser but they don't seem to appreciate it. I agree the problem is with them not you.
View attachment 62288