J20 Stealth Fighter

[badguy2000]

well, it is a paper,reposted from CD.
it is about the research of J20's supersonic crusing

http://lt.cjdby.net/thread-1084113-1-1.html
Fuel temperature analysis of advanced fighter aircraft
during supersonic cruise

ZHANG Xingjuan, ZHANG Zuoqi， GAO Feng
(School of Aeronautic Science and Engineering,
Beijing University of Aeronautics and Astronautics, Beijing 100191, China)
Abstract：Fuel is widely used as a heat sink for heat components of fighter aircraft. With the development of the integrated thermal management technology, fuel is utilized more efficiently to cool off especially for advanced fighter aircraft. Heat balance method has been used to build heat transfer mathematics modeling, and the timedependent fuel temperature changes during supersonic cruise were analyzed in this paper. The results show that, the recirculation of the fuel and the flight Mach number are major influential factors to the fuel temperature during supersonic cruise. The computation and simulation of the temperature of fuel in the fuel tank was carried out by using the program based on C software.
Key words: fuelï¼›temperatureï¼›heat resourceï¼›heat exchangeï¼›simulation

 

[Ray]

This is an Indian forum. Of that there is no doubt.

However, it is not a 'Hate Others' Forum.

It is basically to exchange ideas and thought and interpretation of events as seen by posters.

It does not mean that the Forum should encourage one's usage of unparliamentary language or race related slurs since that would indicate poor upbringing and grooming.

**********************

Look around and you see anger expressed every day. It is the most powerful and hurtful emotion we possess. Yet, the average person succumbs to it helplessly, even willingly, lapsing into insane emotional episodes now and again without thinking much about it. Many would defend anger as if it were an ally, a tool they would not and could not live without.

Anger is expressed by humanity in drastically different ways. Low-minded individuals take great delight in being angry toward others and expressing that anger in aggressive and violent ways—gang wars, robbery, vandalism and more. They deliberately use anger and violence to get what they want from life. Then there are the mass of generally law-abiding people who live a normal, working life but are seriously angry on the inside about one thing or another and express that anger regularly in their words and actions. They are simply angry at life, and they have neither the means nor the motivation to eliminate anger from their experience. Little do they know how negatively their anger affects their own consciousness.

Finally, there are those who are striving to follow spiritual principles but are at times unable to control their anger and as a result end up hurting others and breeching Hinduism's core principle of nonviolence, ahimsa, as well as creating new negative karmas to live through in the future. It is to these individuals, who are striving to control anger, even eliminate it from their pattern of behavior, that this article is addressed.

http://www.himalayanacademy.com/resources/bodhinatha/editorials/bd_vanak_2005-09-01_anger.shtml

 

[redragon]

Adux,
Let's assume PLA accepted that everything it has is a copy from USA/Russia or whatever, is there anything anyone can do to stop it from doing so?
And I guess your conclusion is PLA is not very impressive because it's a copycat?

 

[badguy2000]

Adux,
Let's assume PLA accepted that everything it has is a copy from USA/Russia or whatever, is there anything anyone can do to stop it from doing so?
And I guess your conclusion is PLA is not very impressive because it's a copycat?

perhaps he doesn't believe that China-made "copied " bullet can not kill indian soldiers.

 

[pmaitra]

well, guy, indeed you know litttle about the industry outside India.


it is the offical website of ZPMC, one Chinese companies most odinary people never hear of ,including CHinese . but it makes 85% of seaport heavy engineering facilities,including cranes.

http://www.zpmc.com/index.html

In fact, the crane which UK uses to build their AC HMS Elizbeth is also provided by ZPMC.
the cranes which USA uses to build their warship are also provided by ZPMC...
and the crane which Indian navy use to build your warship might be exactly provided by ZPMC too.

guy ,I am sure that you never know the name of Chinese manufacturer of electric generators which get billions-dollar order form India,although the manufacturer is also the first one which worked out Untral-supercritical eletric-generators in the world

Thank you Badguy2000, that is what I need to know.

I do not agree that India is behind PRC in the three sectors I mentioned:

• Locomotives
• Tractors, Earth-Movers, Bulldozers, Lorries, Dumpers, Heavy Load Carriers, Cranes
• Satellite Launch Vehicles

However, when you share links like you did, it helps me get a better idea and I must say I am impressed by this company ZPMC.

 

[p2prada]

perhaps he doesn't believe that China-made "copied " bullet can not kill indian soldiers.

That is the crux of the problem.

China is so good at copying that it has developed newer improved systems over it's predecessor. It may not make a difference to US or Russia because they make more advanced systems compared to China. But it affects countries like India, Japan, South Korea and Taiwan which cannot make the same systems without wide scale copying or buying those better systems from US and Russia which is quite expensive to counter China.

The only way to counter China is to stay technologically ahead when it comes to Taiwan, Japan and South Korea. However India can counter China with or without technological parity in the long run because we are the only country other than US in the interim and the only country in the long term which can challenge China morally and economically.

@Adux
The J-10 is more in tune with J-9 and Saab Viggen than Lavi. It appears the Chinese used Israeli help in the form of design softwares, computers and some other technologies to make J-10 rather than carbon copy the Lavi design. The Chinese failed at J-9, but succeeded with J-10. Also the J-9 indicates the presence of a strong design capability among the Chinese even if they did need outside assistance for J-10.

 

[pmaitra]

Marvelous post!

Thanks, even if it was sarcastic.

But I have several questions to ask.

First, How do you define "beat"?

You can beat in many ways:

• Market Share
• Popularity
• Annual turnover
• Use of technology

[this is an inexhaustive list]

I am sure many of these companies would 'beat' their Chinese counterparts in some way while being 'beaten' in some other way.

Second, do you mean if Chinese companies don't "beat" Indian companies, then Indian companies perform better than Chinese ones? If so, then can you tell me how many Indian companies have "beaten" Chinese companies?

Not necessarily. I am aware PRC has a MAGLEV while India does not. However, there are news articles (see below) that do not flatter Chinese locomotive manufacturers. Both PRC and India collaborate with foreign companies, and I do not think the best Chinese companies in the three sectors I mentioned make products that are better than those made by their Indian counterparts. I could be wrong, but we could start with the best Chinese electric locomotive company if you'd like, or the best Chinese lorry manufacturer and compare with its Indian counterpart.

I am sure you realise that I won't take claims that insinuate India is way behind PRC in manufacturing without a debate based on evidence.

You must know the story of Pakistan's railways. Our western neighbors were duped by their bestest allies !


The collapse of Pakistan Railways
By Malik Tariq
Published: September 20, 2010

A snippet

Trials conducted on Chinese Group 3 locomotives revealed that while their fuel consumption was higher the hauling power was much less than the specifications listed jointly by the manufacturers. Their performance was worse than the existing 30 to 40 year old locomotives.

The 64 Chinese locomotives, based on vintage Russian technology, had an additional impact for spare parts procurement valued at $15 million annually, making them the most expensive locomotives ever procured by Railways. Earlier, the annual allocation for maintenance and repair would never exceed $10 million for the total fleet of 530 locomotives.

But our neighbors could'nt refuse !

More recently, in 2009-2010, an additional order for 75 brand new locomotives has been placed with the same Chinese middleman Dong Feng Trading House (DFTH) and Mishan Locomotives Works, the manufacturer.

(The source is one of Pakistan's premier newspapers)

By the way, I have never heard of any of the companies you mentioned except Tata.

Now you have a list of companies. Just like Badguy2000 mentioned ZPMC, I looked it up and was impressed. You too can look up these companies at your free time and find out more about them.

 

[Ray]

perhaps he doesn't believe that China-made "copied " bullet can not kill indian soldiers.

Why?

Indians have powerful juju than the Chinese?

 

[Ray]

Quote Originally Posted by nimo_cn View Post
By the way, I have never heard of any of the companies you mentioned except Tata.

Maybe where you live, it is not that accessible to the world at large.

 

[Adux]

@Adux
The J-10 is more in tune with J-9 and Saab Viggen than Lavi. It appears the Chinese used Israeli help in the form of design softwares, computers and some other technologies to make J-10 rather than carbon copy the Lavi design. The Chinese failed at J-9, but succeeded with J-10. Also the J-9 indicates the presence of a strong design capability among the Chinese even if they did need outside assistance for J-10.

Chinese J-10 'benefited from the Lavi project'
By Robert Hewson
19 May 2008


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Russian aerospace engineers have confirmed to Jane's that China's Chengdu J-10 fighter aircraft benefited from significant, direct input from Israel's Lavi programme - including access to the Israel Aircraft Industries (IAI) Lavi aircraft itself.

In a number of interviews Jane's has talked at length with several engineers, designers and technical specialists - some of whom have been working with their Chinese counterparts for decades and have had first-hand experience on Chinese military projects. They have provided detailed accounts of the assistance given to various Chinese manufacturers and their military aircraft projects. This has included extensive design and performance modelling, wind-tunnel testing and advanced aerodynamic design input.

Senior Russian engineers who spoke to Jane's recalled their many visits to Chengdu, and elsewhere in China, some of which began in the 1980s. Jane's was told how Chengdu officials of the highest level stated how they had one of the IAI Lavi prototypes in their facilities. Describing his conversations with Chengdu concerning possession of a Lavi aircraft, one Jane's source commented: "I did not consider that to be a revelation ... doesn't everyone know that already?"

It is not possible to independently verify the Russian comments. The charge of Lavi technology transfer has been made before, but this time the claims come from individuals with sustained personal experience of the programme. Both Chinese and Israeli officials have long refuted any purported links between the J-10 and the Lavi.

Image: China's J-10 (Internet)

234 of 785 words
© 2008 Jane's Information Grou

http://www.janes.com/news/defence/jdw/jdw080519_2_n.shtml

 

[Adux]

perhaps he doesn't believe that China-made "copied " bullet can not kill indian soldiers.

It can, Chinese are a huge threat to Indians, But dont claim your products as superior or indigenous over here. It is not. We will call you out on it. Your AWACS is a complete copy of the Phalcon A-50I , which the Israeli's sold you covertly when Americans sanctioned them.

This is an Indian forum. Of that there is no doubt.

However, it is not a 'Hate Others' Forum.

It is basically to exchange ideas and thought and interpretation of events as seen by posters.

It does not mean that the Forum should encourage one's usage of unparliamentary language or race related slurs since that would indicate poor upbringing and grooming.

I dont not hate any race or particular people, but just as BR, Def.pk, WAB, militaryphotos.net and all others, allow their respective core people, ie people who shares their world view and interest, a greater leeway than others,(ever tried pro-pakistan line in BR, or pro-Islamic in WAB, or pro-India line in def.pk?) No Pakistani or Chinese should be allowed to do undue **** waving here, This is an Indian forum, India and her interest come first. You can take BR as a very good example here.
There is nothing un parlimentary about Chicoms, they are our enemies and should be treated as such, especially Chinese fanboy's, people of the stature of Xinhui can be treated differently, and they behave differently than these chicoms. Did you see, the moment I wound them up, their true nature came out, their disdain and contempt for India and Indians. No other forum tolerates this on their core audience.

 

[Minghegy]

Official news: J20 has a one piece big display on the panel.

So it should be this one:

Rather than this two pieces panel appeared several years ago:

 

[Minghegy]

The biggest problem with Indians right here, self-righteous to the point of cutting down your own for others let alone enemies, as for what it means you can google it,

You are not Indian?
Self-righteous is a good behaver, see global retail theft barometer

Please post the link

*add the link: http://www.globalretailtheftbarometer.com

 

[Ray]

dont not hate any race or particular people, but just as BR, Def.pk, WAB, militaryphotos.net and all others, allow their respective core people, ie people who shares their world view and interest, a greater leeway than others,(ever tried pro-pakistan line in BR, or pro-Islamic in WAB, or pro-India line in def.pk?) No Pakistani or Chinese should be allowed to do undue **** waving here, This is an Indian forum, India and her interest come first. You can take BR as a very good example here.
There is nothing un parlimentary about Chicoms, they are our enemies and should be treated as such, especially Chinese fanboy's, people of the stature of Xinhui can be treated differently, and they behave differently than these chicoms. Did you see, the moment I wound them up, their true nature came out, their disdain and contempt for India and Indians. No other forum tolerates this on their core audience.

I am sure they can be taken on with facts and not with anger or abusing them in unparliamentary language.

If one can do so, it will be a a greater win.

You call the Chinese enemy. Fine. Of course, there are many who would prefer to state instead that they are 'adversaries'.

If their 'true colours' get exhibited (of course, with limits of decency), then would that not be knowing your 'enemy', which is an important tenet in warfare?

Notwithstanding, we can exhibit a slight moderation in our language since it would help keeping the forum interactivity a pleasure for posting as also would do much to help the Moderators.

BR is independent of DFI and they are entitled to their ways. It is no baseline for the DFI.

Xinhui is no greatshakes either. A visit of his posts will show how he is batting for the same country you find as an 'enemy'. It will be noticed that he cannot brook hard facts that are negative of China.

 

[nimo_cn]

Maybe where you live, it is not that accessible to the world at large.

Right. My failing to heard of some unknown Indian companies makes me disconnected with this world.

India must be the center of the world.

 

[Ray]

Right. My failing to heard of some unknown Indian companies makes me disconnected with this world.

India must be the center of the world.

India is not the centre of the world. Indians have never claimed it to be so.

I thought China was the only country and people in the world to display such a misplaced arrogant attitude.

Zhōngguó (simplified Chinese: 中国; traditional Chinese: 中國, Mandarin pronunciation: [tʂʊ́ŋkwɔ̌]) through dynastic changes is what you all call China.

This translates traditionally as "Middle Kingdom," or as "central country."

I think you have conveniently forgotten who calls themselves as the 'Central Country' or go beyond that arrogance it delude themselves that it is the "Middle Kingdom"!!!!!!!

I would not like to comment, notwithstanding your view, to comment if you are 'disconnected' or not. It remains your prerogative and and your honest appraisal of yourself to feel you are 'disconnected'.

 

[nimo_cn]

India is not the centre of the world.

I thought China was the only country and people to claim such arrogant attitude.

Zhōngguó (simplified Chinese: 中国; traditional Chinese: 中國, Mandarin pronunciation: [tʂʊ́ŋkwɔ̌]) through dynastic changes is what you all call China.

This translates traditionally as "Middle Kingdom," or as "central country."

I think you have conveniently forgotten who calls themselves as the 'Central Country' or go beyond that arrogance it delude themselves that it is the "Middle Kingdom"!!!!!!!

Then what is the logic behind such wild claim as "Maybe where you live, it is not that accessible to the world at large" because I said I haven't heard of those Indian companies?

I never claimed China is the center of world, neither would I say something like "Maybe where you live, it is not that accessible to the world at large" if you haven't heard of some Chinese companies like CSR, SANY, CNR, etc.

 

[nimo_cn]

Thanks, even if it was sarcastic.


You can beat in many ways:

• Market Share
• Popularity
• Annual turnover
• Use of technology

[this is an inexhaustive list]

I am sure many of these companies would 'beat' their Chinese counterparts in some way while being 'beaten' in some other way.



Not necessarily. I am aware PRC has a MAGLEV while India does not. However, there are news articles (see below) that do not flatter Chinese locomotive manufacturers. Both PRC and India collaborate with foreign companies, and I do not think the best Chinese companies in the three sectors I mentioned make products that are better than those made by their Indian counterparts. I could be wrong, but we could start with the best Chinese electric locomotive company if you'd like, or the best Chinese lorry manufacturer and compare with its Indian counterpart.

I am sure you realise that I won't take claims that insinuate India is way behind PRC in manufacturing without a debate based on evidence.

Now you have a list of companies. Just like Badguy2000 mentioned ZPMC, I looked it up and was impressed. You too can look up these companies at your free time and find out more about them.

The fact that it is India that is importing massive products from China just proved India is way behind PRC in manufacturing. If the situation is reversed, then China is behind.

By the way, if I recall it correctly, India imported metro from China last year.

 

[Ray]

Then what is the logic behind such wild claim as "Maybe where you live, it is not that accessible to the world at large" because I said I haven't heard of those Indian companies?

I never claimed China is the center of world, neither would I say something like "Maybe where you live, it is not that accessible to the world at large" if you haven't heard of some Chinese companies like CSR, SANY, CNR, etc.

The operative word, if you have missed to observe, was 'maybe' in my post that you quote.

Maybe means:

#1 (a.) Possible; probable, but not sure.
# 2 (adv.) Perhaps; possibly; peradventure.
# 3. (n.) Possibility; uncertainty.

You could have thereafter clarified and put any uncertainty to rest and not claim that India was the Centre of the world!! That claim of yours is rather obtuse, if not droll.

You have not claimed China is the 'centre of the world', but that historical arrogance enshrined in the name and ethos that Zhōngguó signifies the centre of the world i.e. Middle Kingdom come out clearly with that attempted sarcasm enshrined in your statement - 'India must be the center of the world. ', wherein you expect all to know of even insignificant products produced in China!!

Do forgive me, while India as a country may trade with China, I would steer clear since I have been duped with some Chinese products that have proved to be rather shoddy an attempt to make a quick buck and totally defraud the customer by dangling the bait of their being cheap.

Enough said!

 

[p2prada]

I dont not hate any race or particular people, but just as BR, Def.pk, WAB, militaryphotos.net and all others, allow their respective core people, ie people who shares their world view and interest, a greater leeway than others,(ever tried pro-pakistan line in BR, or pro-Islamic in WAB, or pro-India line in def.pk?) No Pakistani or Chinese should be allowed to do undue **** waving here, This is an Indian forum, India and her interest come first. You can take BR as a very good example here.
There is nothing un parlimentary about Chicoms, they are our enemies and should be treated as such, especially Chinese fanboy's, people of the stature of Xinhui can be treated differently, and they behave differently than these chicoms. Did you see, the moment I wound them up, their true nature came out, their disdain and contempt for India and Indians. No other forum tolerates this on their core audience.

You don't realize it but you are degrading the quality of the forum and killing this thread.

Our enemies are CCP and not every Chinese fanboy who shows up here. If you don't like how things work here then go to those "better" forums instead of trying to teach the mods and gurus here on how to run their forum.

http://www.janes.com/news/defence/jdw/jdw080519_2_n.shtml

It says design consultancy from Israel. Nothing wrong with that cause we got it from France, Britain and US. I personally think Lavi to J-10 story has been exaggerated a lot. The J-10 has it's roots with Saab Viggen rather than Lavi.