Interview with Saturn CEO


Senior Member
Dec 17, 2009
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Lack of production load can make a unique company into the mediocre

Saturn today - without exaggeration, the best engine-building enterprise in Russia. Here work is underway on the basic, crucial for the industry programs such as the creation of engines for aircraft and a fifth-generation regional airliner Sukhoi Superjet 100. On the current state of affairs in the enterprise "MIC" said its leader Ilya Fedorov.

- In early February, in Rybinsk with the participation of Deputy Prime Minister Sergei Ivanov held a meeting on the program creating the engine SaM146. What are the outcomes of the meeting? How to develop the program? What causes the delay in the delivery of engines?

- Today we're late for those dates that were set initially for two years, and for those who reflect the real situation - for six months. The discrepancy between the production schedule for engines with aircraft delivery schedule is from 8 to 9 months. After the change of major shareholder and major shareholder "Saturn" is now the state, and the arrival of the new team the first thing we did - stop lying and declared how much we can really do the engines. At that time - half of the engine in a month. The production was absolutely not prepared to release SaM146. Many things are made on the experimental production. It's hard to say why such a delay, but most likely, there was no certainty the possibility of certification, were not understood volumes of aircraft, for at least six months, the delay was due to the fact that there were no funds for the program. We even had to borrow about one million euros from the French.

Then we received a budget in the form of loans, the State's obligations to banks (the main bank with us - VTB), has increased company's share capital amounting to 5.2 billion rubles. Since then we have "gone".

Today, Saturn can produce in a month for two engines. The immediate task - 4-5 engines by the middle of next year and in the future - out of 150 engines per year. So this year we are doing 12-13 engine SaM146, in the following - 48-50, then - 90 and exit at 150. Under these volumes purchased equipment, provided the necessary funds.

Sergei B. Ivanov, and just came to understand what the current status of the program and adequately whether the current leadership of the enterprise. I understand that he was convinced of our abilities. We provided him with the figures, which today is, frankly described disadvantages and problems, until technical issues, and most of bottlenecks: Shoulder first, second and third stages of the compressor at low pressure. Indeed, their way with us weak, and we ordered 20 sets from the French, which should suffice until then, until we begin to do them yourself in the necessary quantities.

- What's the problem with the blades?

- The fact that nobody has ever worked in Russia with the western material for a working single-crystal turbine blades of low pressure. SaM146 - is in fact a civil engine of the fifth generation. Domestic Material JS does not provide such a blade configuration - on SaM146 it is very thin and tall, such enormous temperatures in the coldest part of the engine - much more than a thousand degrees. In addition, he is not certified by international standards. Accordingly, we had to work with the western material, it needs to comply strictly with the technology, simply re-learn. After all, this blade is not shed, and grown. I would not want to open our secrets, but it is really very difficult. Shoulder monocrystalline, with a fixed macrostructure. That is the main problem that exists today - technology. During the manufacture of blades occurred failure temperature and "took" money. Also, some changes in engine design, something had to redo it. It is normal for the process of testing. But now we come to the fact that the design freeze.

- When completed certification of engines?

- Certification will be held in late May, and the completion of testing, we need no more than two months - during which time we will deal mainly with the preparation of reports.

- Sami test procedures have been completed?

- We still have a few percent. It is necessary to make an average throw of birds, long-equivalent cyclic tests and tests on the fan blade breakage. Preliminary tests on the blades break, we have performed, now with the French agree on what engine we will do it for certification. We constantly work are 8 engines in the past more than 20 partitions, that is, in fact, the tests we have done 30 engine.

Personal file

Fedorov, Ilya Nikolaevich

Born January 31, 1955 in Dubna, Moscow Region. In 1978 he graduated from the Serpukhov Higher Military Command School, specializing in Aircraft Operation. From June 1978 to May 2001 he served in the Army Air Force. After military service, served in the industrial sector in Russia a number of management positions, led by OAO Service PROMINVEST "and OAO" Dubninskaya Machine Building Plant. N. Fedorov. From January 2009 to the present day - Deputy Director General of the Criminal Code "JDC", from August 2009-the first head of NPO Saturn, as managing director. He is fluent in French and English.

- Now about the engine for the fifth generation fighter aircraft. On the one hand, states that he made on the basis of the AL-31, on the other - that is a fundamentally new engine. What are its principal novelty?

- If we add on 15-20 per cent of traction, the motor is, by definition, can not be old. That is, it made major structural changes. Once again, the engine, which we supply for the Su-35 - product 117S - this is not the engine that is installed on the T-50. The engine for the aircraft of the fifth generation of the other harness, the most important - there is a completely different system of governance and this imposes a very serious impression. How many new details on? 20 per cent.

- Always said that the main feature of the fifth generation engine - the application of new materials. They are used in the engine, which is now installed on the T-50?

- The engine, which now flies the T-50, essentially no new material. Him and you will not make a new material - this would completely rearrange and the cold part, and the gasifier. And from the perspective we realize that the engine of the second phase will be created using completely different materials. We know what these materials, as they need to do. No need to invent anything here, look at the engine for the F-22 - and all will become clear. What is the status today, based on our industry, we represent. Therefore be a very big job. Moreover, as announced and Anatoliyovich President Dmitry Medvedev and Sergei Chemezov, it will be a joint project with India. So, most likely, when you create the engine of the second phase will be used not only domestic materials. Expected to use both the external and the internal structural elements of non-metal parts, composites. This will get more temperature, more speed, more weight. The aircraft will be easier, he will have a higher thrust-weight ratio and, accordingly, he will be able to carry a heavy load.

- During a meeting with members of the Sukhoi Design Bureau was argued that the engine for the T-50 of the first phase was obtained quickly and easily, so, in particular, and the engine started for the Su-35. In what way could it be done quickly and easily?

- Maybe, in terms of aircraft, it was obtained easily, but we have another 9 months ago there was no certainty that we can quickly create an engine for T-50. Only a major concentration of effort and a number of operational decisions have allowed him to do. In particular, to work on this engine has been fully allocated to our Moscow site, the general designer of this engine Yuvenalievich appointed Yevgeny Marchuk. Moreover, we actually took responsibility for the automatics and have done much for the "temp", which is not in the best condition. The problem was, and that construction can be improved to infinity, but we cut the process at some stage. All this has been given enough hard work. But today, "Saturn" at this stage of development, when there is confidence that we can work quickly and efficiently.

- When creating the second phase of the engine as you see the cooperation with MMPP "Salut"? In what format it might be?

- First, there is a presidential decree on the establishment of an integrated enterprise based on "Salute" with the participation of the Omsk Motor-Building Association. This is reality. "Salute" - a great company with a wonderful director. Yury Eliseev living plant, and I have great respect for him. But the "Salute" - a company that makes the same engine as UMPO. And as far as I know, the engines of production UMPO much cheaper. Suffice it to compare wages for "Salute" in Ufa: in Moscow, she once every two and a half, three above. But as director of "Saturn" I can not comment on the situation at the plant.

- Still, the creation of the engine of the second phase, in your opinion, involves pooling all the resources of the country associated with engine-?

- And without this could not create anything. I, as deputy director of the Joint new engine corporations know well the state of design bureaus and production, which may participate in this hard work. "Saturn" or KB Aviadvigatel today alone can not build a motor for the second phase of the PAK FA. Either the state, but this requires very seriously enhance design potential, laboratory facilities and so on. So, when I was still only in the JDC, our concept was just to concentrate. But I would take care of yourself to attach great importance to our competition with the "Salute". You go to the Design Bureau "Salyut" and see how they work, what they do. I do not want to comment on, just go and look. KB in engine building - is a testing center, a large unit on aerodynamics, dynamics, strength testing, certification. Great number of specialists in materials science. And I know that today there are only two "live" CB this level - it Aviadvigatel "and" Saturn ". Unfortunately, the unimportant things in Samara. So we should simply assess where the country has a full-fledged design office and what they can do. My policy is not to evaluate others. I praise his. And if someone from the directors will speak about the situation at Saturn, I will firmly oppose.

- Ends with the creation of the engine AL-55. Are there any problems with it or everything goes smoothly?

- There is never a smooth birth of the engine, the more established for three years. This engine is not easy. We are the first time in many, many years doing a power plant for a single-engine aircraft. And this is quite different requirements for reliability, service, quality. And while we are limited to price, because the engine must be cheap. After all, it is intended for educational and combat aircraft, and do not say so, make it unique. The problem is that people who signed the contract in due time, maybe a little mistake on the money. Money is not enough, have to do for his, that is for the state. Nevertheless, the engine is, it turned out, was certified aircraft with this engine. Now there are two issues: the resource, and weight. Activities in this area developed, at some stage we will deal with the weight already have design study. The same goes for the resource. It should be easy to test, and now we are doing that with CIAM. Big problem with AL-55 no. There is a shift in time.

- Apart from India, is there any other foreign prospects this engine?

- Of course. And not only foreign, but also on our airplanes. We tested it initially on the MiG-AT, in the future you can see AL-55 and Yak-130. It is also a combat trainer aircraft, and if you do not have enough thrust of existing engines, you can try and AL-55.

- And China has an interest in this engine?

- While we do not know.

- How do you see the market of marine power plants?

- We are very seriously engaged in this direction, but today we have no orders. Continuing any game with Ukraine. We have established a specialized company, Turborus ", there is a small office in St. Petersburg, which deals with this problem, but again there is no funding. "Saturn" - a big company, it can do everything. But we are not engaged in "pushing" contracts, a task Oboronprom and the military. Our task - to fulfill the order.

- How do you manage to overcome the crisis?

- To overcome the crisis seriously, and if it were not for government support in the form of increasing the share capital and loan guarantees, the "Saturn" would long ago have not been as serious organization. The crisis is overcome by minimizing the costs - this is understandable, increase in volumes - no matter what. This year we grew by 20 percent by volume of production in comparison with the 2009-m. In the future, are also going to increase volumes. However, the main - it public support. But the budget should be spent just for the purposes for which they are allocated. Assistance will be given a targeted, specific projects, rather than under the wage payment. With wages ourselves understands. For example, the program allocated SaM146 serious money. But we still need some 8.4 billion rubles to enter the volume production of 150 engines per year. And that means, I hope the state will be allocated.

- In what time frame do you want?

- During the next three years. Roughly speaking, they simply need to purchase equipment, machine tools. Training center for retraining people servicing this engine, we have created, it opened on March 11. But machines do not have enough. It is necessary to procure machining centers, equipment for single-crystal casting. Manufacturers - Germany, Switzerland, partly - Japan.

- To create the fifth-generation military engine also need to re-equipment?

- Yes, something must be unique. The equipment for applying metallic coatings, equipment associated with electrochemistry. But we need not only machines, but also new solutions, we are working together with major scientific organizations, such as the Kurchatov Institute. Equipment for the implementation of new technologies, we will also perform together. March 30, for example, we open a center for the production of monolithic tools with nanostructured coatings. Equipment manufactured for him at the Kurchatov Institute. It is important to understand that the machines on the critical areas of military engine programs, such as electrochemistry, himfrezerovanie equipment, to allow non-metallic aggregates, including shovels, we Americans do not sell. It is necessary to do themselves.

- And what time frame for this need?

- Again, this depends on the funds. Allocate money - we quietly start buying equipment. On "Saturn," no problem with the speed of manufacture. There are problems with money. Resources, and we say to them we have such a thing will create for such a time. Want faster - let us more money.

- Personnel issue for enterprises is relevant?

- Of course. A lot of people. This is a joke, of course, but nevertheless "Saturn", as almost all companies within the industry, pererazmeren. For a number of employees - about 20 thousand - need more work. We train specialists in our Rybinsk State Aviation Technological Academy, we take a lot of people from Samara State Aerospace University - the most in my opinion, the best high school on aerospace topics, preparing a mid-level professionals in our college, located in Rybinsk. Workers are preparing ourselves, in our new center. The problem is that staff should redeploy. Leaves our bestseller - D-30KP/KU and people are liberated. On the street they throw, we can not. They need to take work. Some of them will go on "Saturn - Gas Turbines", there is a very serious increase in power plants. So as such, lack of personnel, we do not feel we have a very good indicator of middle age - a little over 40 years. Personnel enough.

- And the future?

- Ten years will suffice. "Saturn" need more work, more orders. If you do not give a lot of work, "Saturn" will become commonplace by how many. The task of our state - Georgia, Georgia and Georgia "Saturn" work. The company Snecma at the same staff as we do, the annual volume of production - 4 billion euros. This is a great deal. We were up this far.

- What are your plans for profit and production for this year?

- We expect 16 billion volume. Profits will depend on how much we, roughly speaking, knock off the state for the use of credit. Because virtually all the profit we eat payment on loans. The main problem today - the restructuring of previously accumulated debt. He is very big, and we are now with Andrei Reus Georgievich engaged alignment of financial models. The main tasks for this year - Certification SaM146 in May, the output of production engines in June and further production of two engines per month, and the adoption and implementation of the financial model for sanitation companies, which will restructure and reduce debt burdens. Volumes are important, but today, our profit is dependent on the solution of these problems. In addition, Saturn is now living LEN-technology. We completely rebuilt under lean production. This is serious work. While LEN-technologies are being introduced at the site where will be SaM146, later extended to others.

Ilya Cedars

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