Imported Single Engine Fighter Jet Contest

[Decklander]

Its a very bad example of a Light weight fighter. Pls see its dimensions and its ability to carry internal weapons.

 

[arnabmit]

Please provide link to the specifications... The proposed diagram shows 6 BVR, 2 WVR and 1 ground attack internal hardpoints. Total 9 internal hardpoints.

Its a very bad example of a Light weight fighter. Pls see its dimensions and its ability to carry internal weapons.

 

[Decklander]

Please provide link to the specifications... The proposed diagram shows 6 BVR, 2 WVR and 1 ground attack internal hardpoints. Total 9 internal hardpoints.

the pix above have the dimensions also shown. Can this be called light weight by any standards. Its wingspan is more than that of Mig-35 also. Its twin engined which means double the IR signature of a single engined aircraft.

 

[arnabmit]

Don't know... but articles on the net says that it will not have 2 engines, but a single variant of the T-50 engine.

the pix above have the dimensions also shown. Can this be called light weight by any standards. Its wingspan is more than that of Mig-35 also. Its twin engined which means double the IR signature of a single engined aircraft.

 

[p2prada]

the pix above have the dimensions also shown. Can this be called light weight by any standards. Its wingspan is more than that of Mig-35 also. Its twin engined which means double the IR signature of a single engined aircraft.

The Russians consider even aircraft like Mig-35 and EF as light fighters. According to the Americans, the 14 tonne empty weight F-35 is a light fighter too.

Anyway, the article speaks of a light fighter, but the pics and specs are that of a heavy fighter.

If the aircraft is powered by a single Item 30 engine, then the empty weight could be in the Rafale/EF class. Around 10-12 tonnes.

 

[arnabmit]

Yeah, Russian classification of T-50 is a "medium" fighter. God knows what they consider as heavy.

MiG had claimed that the LMFS will be 30% lighter than the T-50.

The Russians consider even aircraft like Mig-35 and EF as light fighters. According to the Americans, the 14 tonne empty weight F-35 is a light fighter too.

Anyway, the article speaks of a light fighter, but the pics and specs are that of a heavy fighter.

If the aircraft is powered by a single Item 30 engine, then the empty weight could be in the Rafale/EF class. Around 10-12 tonnes.

 

[p2prada]

The Russians consider the PAKFA to be a heavy fighter.

30% lighter is a Rafale/EF class fighter.

 

[Austin]

LMFS wont be funded this decade it would be next decade along with a new interceptor that RuAF chief talked about to replace Mig-31 link

This decade the funding as far as fighter goes is PAK-FA , PAK-Sha ( CAS fighter to replace Su-25 ) , PAK-DA bomber to replace Tu-95MS and later date Tu-160 and Tu-22M3.

Hence forth any new fighter will be a joint development of different design bureau like all design bureau has been brought under UAC , Although one or the other design beureau will take a lead role , For eg PAK-Sha is being spearheaded by Sukhoi and UCAV program is a joint Sukhoi Mig development.

 

[arnabmit]

Source for PAK-Sha please...

LMFS wont be funded this decade it would be next decade along with a new interceptor that RuAF chief talked about to replace Mig-31 link

This decade the funding as far as fighter goes is PAK-FA , PAK-Sha ( CAS fighter to replace Su-25 ) , PAK-DA bomber to replace Tu-95MS and later date Tu-160 and Tu-22M3.

Hence forth any new fighter will be a joint development of different design bureau like all design bureau has been brought under UAC , Although one or the other design beureau will take a lead role , For eg PAK-Sha is being spearheaded by Sukhoi and UCAV program is a joint Sukhoi Mig development.

 

[arnabmit]

The PAK FA medium-weight fighter program, which has been underway since 2002, is joined by MiG's lighter-weight aircraft project.

MiG's Fifth Generation Fighter Builds up New Momentum | Авиатранспортное обозрение

Russia considers SU-34 as a heavy fighter.

The Russians consider the PAKFA to be a heavy fighter.

30% lighter is a Rafale/EF class fighter.

 

[Austin]

Source for PAK-Sha please...

Russia to Field New Ground Attack Jet | Defense | RIA Novosti
Russian air force to order Su-25 replacement

"This new type of ground attack aircraft has been included in the state arms procurement programme," says Col Gen Alexander Zelin, an aide to Russian defence minister Anatoly Serdyukov and until May the commander of its air force. "It will be put in service by 2020."

The new aircraft will be equipped with an advanced radar, feature elements of stealth technology and also be able to use short runways.. It will replace the modernised Su-25SM.

 

[Austin]

MiG LMFS is not a cancelled project. It is a proposed project touted to be the russian answer to F-35. Design very similar to AMCA.

MiG-LMFS design proposals

Fan Boy Drawing by Paralay

 

[arnabmit]

Thanks... Did you coin the name PAK-Sha? Didn't find the name anywhere.

Russia to Field New Ground Attack Jet | Defense | RIA Novosti
Russian air force to order Su-25 replacement

 

[Austin]

Sha in Russian just means ground attack/CAS ......no I didnt but Paralay did

 

[p2prada]

MiG's Fifth Generation Fighter Builds up New Momentum | Авиатранспортное обозрение

Russia considers SU-34 as a heavy fighter.

It is not a source. It is just some bungling journo.

PAKFA is a 34 tonne MTOW fighter. It is actually at the same level as a Su-27, which was a 33 tonne MTOW fighter.
MKI is 4 tonnes heavier. Su-34 is also a heavy fighter, but carries more fuel and equipment. If you want a real comparison, just look at the engine thrust levels of these fighters to compare. Su-27 has 25 tonnes of thrust. Su-34 has 27 tonnes of thrust. MKI has 25 today and may go up to 27 or 29 later on. PAKFA has 30 tonnes today and will eventually have 35 tonnes. Hence a heavy fighter.

EF is a 25 tonne MTOW fighter, hence medium. Thrust is at 18 tonnes.

LCA is a 13 tonne MTOW fighter, hence light. Thrust is at 9 tonnes.

F-35 is a 31 tonne MTOW fighter, but its thrust level is at 20 tonnes, at a level comparable to EF. Something like the Su-34, with greater MTOW, but lesser thrust.

 

[Devil's Lawyer]

We have always done this with radars. Even Greenpine.

Later it will be Indianized and we may licence produce it.

AGREE! The fact is somewhere we can not reverse engineer like the way chinese managed to and thats why we see the blogs calling their products as blah blah!

For me what matter most is being able to defend my nation and not the way how we acquire those capabilities.


Now i will like to answer in briefly abt the RCS specs of Tejas mk1 it is said that in clean configuration will have rcs of 1/3 of standard jet

And rcs of standard jet for india and russia is MIG 21 that RCS = 1m2 (frontal) and 2 m2 from diferent side angles

now with underslung weapon it will be over 3 .

Tejas may match f-16 blk 50 in terms of avionics in future but the fact remains just because you have all the spices to cook chicken tanduri at home doesn't mean it can match the taste of having at Chandni chowk.

Tejas will be a decent fighter craft good anough to see JF_17 and other outdated jets of paf so its purpose is served.

Now the focus should be on DRDO's sluggish approach in developing it because it take atleast 4-5 years to master a jet and paf is using jf-17 but we are yet to see tejas mk2 which is what we want and tejas mk1 too is not in enough quantities to get trained.

DRDO is digging grave for the Indian pilots by lizzy lazzying around and trust me its now 1.4 billion dollar into the project but much more than that add to that cost we are paying for mirage upgrades since IAF have no option left. 2.2 billion dollar for 51 jets (we have lost 3 jets in crashes since so i guess the cost will reduce now from by 120 million plus)


The delays have meant the Tejas has sucked billions out of the development funds for IAF now please DRDO act for the nation instead of putting your ass in bath tubs enjoying the death of Indian Pilots.


Why don't we create a page where we can take out our frustration against DRDO ??

 

[Devil's Lawyer]

$95 Million for one radar sounds very high.
BTW there is no delivery date for the EL/M-2052 radar mentioned in the SIPRI db,
also no delivery date mentioned for the derby and p-5 missiles for SPYDER SAMs (as u mentioned in SPYDER thread), just deliver was supposed to begin in 2011.(writing from memory, can't access the sipri db, being updated)

Well actually even i don't have much idea about that but i did heard that Israel has said yes to help India develop Radar and in that run may have provided Elta 2052 where it will help India to reverse engineer it when needed.


Also i will like to say that in pk defence there are lot of experienced guys and please if they can come over here will be great as personally i think that we should stick to Indian platforms let them bark and come over here if they wish to else do whatever.

The mods please make this platform a evolved one now where we can see nations like russia vietnam and other south east and friend nation coming and expressing their views. and i think until we see a strong leadership unlike MMS we are not going to change the way Indian organization function

 

[ersakthivel]

AGREE! The fact is somewhere we can not reverse engineer like the way chinese managed to and thats why we see the blogs calling their products as blah blah!

For me what matter most is being able to defend my nation and not the way how we acquire those capabilities.


Now i will like to answer in briefly abt the RCS specs of Tejas mk1 it is said that in clean configuration will have rcs of 1/3 of standard jet

And rcs of standard jet for india and russia is MIG 21 that RCS = 1m2 (frontal) and 2 m2 from diferent side angles

now with underslung weapon it will be over 3 .

Tejas may match f-16 blk 50 in terms of avionics in future but the fact remains just because you have all the spices to cook chicken tanduri at home doesn't mean it can match the taste of having at Chandni chowk.

Tejas will be a decent fighter craft good anough to see JF_17 and other outdated jets of paf so its purpose is served.

Now the focus should be on DRDO's sluggish approach in developing it because it take atleast 4-5 years to master a jet and paf is using jf-17 but we are yet to see tejas mk2 which is what we want and tejas mk1 too is not in enough quantities to get trained.

DRDO is digging grave for the Indian pilots by lizzy lazzying around and trust me its now 1.4 billion dollar into the project but much more than that add to that cost we are paying for mirage upgrades since IAF have no option left. 2.2 billion dollar for 51 jets (we have lost 3 jets in crashes since so i guess the cost will reduce now from by 120 million plus)


The delays have meant the Tejas has sucked billions out of the development funds for IAF now please DRDO act for the nation instead of putting your ass in bath tubs enjoying the death of Indian Pilots.


Why don't we create a page where we can take out our frustration against DRDO ??

read MSD WOLLEN's article in ADA tejas website before putting out big sentences like'

DRDO is digging grave for the Indian pilots by lizzy lazzying around and trust me its now 1.4 billion dollar into the project but much more than that add to that cost we are paying for mirage upgrades since IAF have no option left. 2.2 billion dollar for 51 jets (we have lost 3 jets in crashes since so i guess the cost will reduce now from by 120 million plus)


The delays have meant the Tejas has sucked billions out of the development funds for IAF now please DRDO act for the nation instead of putting your ass in bath tubs enjoying the death of Indian Pilots.

IAF didnot contribute a single penny for tejas development.


The RCS of Tejas is supposed to be one of the lowest for 4.5th gen fighters.The RCS reduction methods and shaping techniques used on Tejas is same as that used in RAFALE and TYPHOON which were designed a decade earlier than Tejas.

No one knows any accurate RCS figures. If you want to know how to avoid the increase in RCS of Tejas with external weapon load, please google SILENT EAGLE F-15 program undergoing in US.

It is no rocket science to put minimal RCS external weapon pods in Tejas.
Don't spread the dark light of ignorance. Try to know something before freely abusing an organization.

 

[Kunal Biswas]

His post may contain heavy dose of Sarcasm ..

read MSD WOLLEN's article in ADA tejas website before putting out big sentences like'

IAF didnot contribute a single penny for tejas development.


The RCS of Tejas is supposed to be one of the lowest for 4.5th gen fighters.The RCS reduction methods and shaping techniques used on Tejas is same as that used in RAFALE and TYPHOON which were designed a decade earlier than Tejas.

No one knows any accurate RCS figures. If you want to know how to avoid the increase in RCS of Tejas with external weapon load, please google SILENT EAGLE F-15 program undergoing in US.

It is no rocket science to put minimal RCS external weapon pods in Tejas.
Don't spread the dark light of ignorance. Try to know something before freely abusing an organization.

 

[ersakthivel]

His post may contain heavy dose of Sarcasm ..

none of it is based on facts on the ground.