F-35 Joint Strike Fighter

[BON PLAN]

Wrong. That time limit that does not allow F-35 to fly at supersonic speeds for long durations is only applicable for the B and C versions. F-35C can fly at max speed of mach 1.3 for 50 seconds, F-35B can fly at supersonic speeds for 40 seconds. But the F-35A has restriction on supersonic flight time.

If I recall correctly, Lockheed Martin has developed a new coating to be used on the horizontal tail, which can sustain/tolerate higher temperatures than before, meaning it will help in supersonic flights when high temperature causes damage to F-35's RAM.

40 or 50 seconds....

 

[Blademaster]

40 or 50 seconds....

To be fair F-18s don't fly supersonic that much either because of fuel limitations and limited access to refuelers. So the main users of F-35Bs&Cs are the Naval & marine type that rarely fly at supersonic. Not a big deal to them.

 

[BON PLAN]

To be fair F-18s don't fly supersonic that much either because of fuel limitations and limited access to refuelers. So the main users of F-35Bs&Cs are the Naval & marine type that rarely fly at supersonic. Not a big deal to them.

For Air to Air mission, speed = less range available for opponent weapon system. So speed is not suddenly useless, even after the arrival of potent medium A to A missiles.

 

[Blademaster]

For Air to Air mission, speed = less range available for opponent weapon system. So speed is not suddenly useless, even after the arrival of potent medium A to A missiles.

Yes but keep in mind that the air forces over land have greater access to refuelers and emergency landing fields while out on the sea, the naval arms don't so they have to be careful about using up speed. They will only use speed when it is necessary to get out of dodge's way to preserve themselves. So planning would avoid the use of speed over mach 1 unless absolutely necessary.

 

[Super Flanker]

Why do you want me to hate a thing ?
I just see how LM failed to study and fine tune this bird. Where F16 was a technical success, built on a long road map of improvements, F35 goals were far too high from the beginning.
When they solve one software problem another one occurs !
And the frame is all but not amazing.

I am saying that you hate the F-35 because that is what I am thinking in my mind after reading so many of your ridiculous posts about the F-35 I have seen the previous discussions between you and other members (you know who I am talking about) on this thread and lot of your arguments about F-35 simply don't make sense to me. On the part about the F-35 then yes, I will wholeheartedly accept that there are issues in F-35 to this day but they are gradually being rectified, F-35 is lot more complex in terms of sensors than the F-16 so obviously it's more engineered than F-16 and therefore it will have more issues to it. It's a very good fighter, accept it or not, not my problem.

 

[Super Flanker]

40 or 50 seconds....

Keep in mind this restriction is only F-35C and F-35B, F-35A has no restriction on supersonic flight.

 

[Blademaster]

I am saying that you hate the F-35 because that is what I am thinking in my mind after reading so many of your ridiculous posts about the F-35 I have seen the previous discussions between you and other members (you know who I am talking about) on this thread and lot of your arguments about F-35 simply don't make sense to me. On the part about the F-35 then yes, I will wholeheartedly accept that there are issues in F-35 to this day but they are gradually being rectified, F-35 is lot more complex in terms of sensors than the F-16 so obviously it's more engineered than F-16 and therefore it will have more issues to it. It's a very good fighter, accept it or not, not my problem.

Then why does the Congress & USAF so want to curtail the numbers badly and dump it soon? I think the F-35s will be the "LCS" of the Air Force.

 

[Super Flanker]

Then why does the Congress & USAF so want to curtail the numbers badly and dump it soon? I think the F-35s will be the "LCS" of the Air Force.

Can you show me where the Congress and USAF has started that they want to cut down on F-35 orders? Even if it is true then it is most likely because the USAF wants to save up money, space and resources for the upcoming NGAD, I have read a report where USAF is eyeing to induct them in very large numbers.

 

[skunk works]

Then why does the Congress & USAF so want to curtail the numbers badly and dump it soon? I think the F-35s will be the "LCS" of the Air Force.

They are not curtailing it by any definition. Nearly a 1000 are on order. The sensor fusion and radar package are benchmark setters, and is very popular with export customers (who are critically evaluating it and still selecting despite the cost)
It's a deadly, successful system and we underestimate it at our own cost m

 

[Blademaster]

Can you show me where the Congress and USAF has started that they want to cut down on F-35 orders? Even if it is true then it is most likely because the USAF wants to save up money, space and resources for the upcoming NGAD, I have read a report where USAF is eyeing to induct them in very large numbers.

See here:

https://www.bloomberg.com/news/arti...it-with-a-35-cut-in-2023-u-s-budget#xj4y7vzkg

https://militarywatchmagazine.com/a...xs-prioritising-combat-readiness-over-stealth

Cancel Plans to Purchase Additional F-35 Joint Strike Fighters and Instead Purchase F-16s and F/A-18s | Congressional Budget Office

Background The F-35 Joint Strike Fighter program is the military's largest aircraft development program. As a stealthy aircraft, the F-35 is difficult for adversaries to detect by radar and other air defense sensors. The program is producing three versions of that aircraft: the conventional...

www.cbo.gov

 

[Blademaster]

They are not curtailing it by any definition. Nearly a 1000 are on order. The sensor fusion and radar package are benchmark setters, and is very popular with export customers (who are critically evaluating it and still selecting despite the cost)
It's a deadly, successful system and we underestimate it at our own cost m

They had plans for 2400 units then reduced to 1700s and now to 1000s. The 450 F-35s they have right now is only basic combat capable not capable of conducting strike missions only air to air combat and basic combat patrol.

 

[Super Flanker]

See here:

https://www.bloomberg.com/news/arti...it-with-a-35-cut-in-2023-u-s-budget#xj4y7vzkg

https://militarywatchmagazine.com/a...xs-prioritising-combat-readiness-over-stealth

Cancel Plans to Purchase Additional F-35 Joint Strike Fighters and Instead Purchase F-16s and F/A-18s | Congressional Budget Office

Background The F-35 Joint Strike Fighter program is the military's largest aircraft development program. As a stealthy aircraft, the F-35 is difficult for adversaries to detect by radar and other air defense sensors. The program is producing three versions of that aircraft: the conventional...

www.cbo.gov

Like I said earlier, the reason the US is curtailing it's original F-35 orders is more likely because of the fact that they are going to induct NGAD in large numbers. I just checked up on how many NGAD the USAF is planning on acquiring and I came across many articles saying that there will be a first nominal purchase of 200 NGAD along with 1000 wingmen. I wouldn't disagree that the F-35 has some issues with it such as software bugs, issues with regards to the airframe but with time all these issues are being resolved. In my opinion the USAF does not want to spend all its budget in maintaining a huge @$$ fleet of F-35s, the F-35 has been exported to many nations such as NATO allies though, they want to save up for the upcoming NGAD when it enters service from the 2030s onwards as the F-22's replacement as an air superiority fighter.

 

[johnj]

Like I said earlier, the reason the US is curtailing it's original F-35 orders is more likely because of the fact that they are going to induct NGAD in large numbers. I just checked up on how many NGAD the USAF is planning on acquiring and I came across many articles saying that there will be a first nominal purchase of 200 NGAD along with 1000 wingmen. I wouldn't disagree that the F-35 has some issues with it such as software bugs, issues with regards to the airframe but with time all these issues are being resolved. In my opinion the USAF does not want to spend all its budget in maintaining a huge @$$ fleet of F-35s, the F-35 has been exported to many nations such as NATO allies though, they want to save up for the upcoming NGAD when it enters service from the 2030s onwards as the F-22's replacement as an air superiority fighter.

I don't think USAF is curtailing it's original F-35 orders for NGAD but may be, may be for B21 & considering wingman concept.
USAF wanted around 1500[1700] f35s and an air superiority fighter around 750+
USAF need 750 NGADs & NGAD is to replace all air superiority fighter in USAF, including f22, f15c/d & f15ex.

 

[Corvus Splendens]

P&W made a killing making the F135 engines. Now they are being given a contract to make new engines to replace the old ones before the life cycle ends. F-35 orders are being reduced in favor of other aircraft. Despite all it's supposed issues, the F-35 is an export hit. It's the new F-16, and it'll be in production for a long time.

 

[Blademaster]

I don't think USAF is curtailing it's original F-35 orders for NGAD but may be, may be for B21 & considering wingman concept.
USAF wanted around 1500[1700] f35s and an air superiority fighter around 750+
USAF need 750 NGADs & NGAD is to replace all air superiority fighter in USAF, including f22, f15c/d & f15ex.

Ha ha ha ha not happening. Only in their dreams. They might be able to afford 300 NGADs max and around 1200 F-35s Block 4 or higher.

 

[johnj]

Ha ha ha ha not happening. Only in their dreams. They might be able to afford 300 NGADs max and around 1200 F-35s Block 4 or higher.

True.
Considering the unit cost & 178 f22, 300 NGAD sounds great.
300 NGAD & 1200 F-35 plus new alliances is enough to keep US global dominance in future.

 

[StealthFlanker]

They had plans for 2400 units then reduced to 1700s and now to 1000s. The 450 F-35s they have right now is only basic combat capable not capable of conducting strike missions only air to air combat and basic combat patrol.

You are confused between the total planned procurement number of USA military and the planned procurement number of USAF aka US airforce and the total number of F-35 that are already built world wide
The whole US military plan to buy 2380 F-35, in which 1700 is F-35A (belong to USAF) , 420 is F-35B (belong to marine corp) and 260 is F-35C ( belong to USN). They plan to buy in many lots span over decades till 2044
The total number of F-35 already built and delivered by LM to US and ally nation is 900+.
There is already more F-35 fly than the number of (J-20 + Su-57)*2

Fact Sheet: F-35 Joint Strike Fighter - Center for Arms Control and Non-Proliferation

The F-35, known as the Lightning II, is a Joint Strike Fighter that performs fighter, strike and ground attack roles in a single combat airframe common to the Air Force, Marines and Navy. The F-35 was designed to be a jack-of-all-trades, created to execute multiple missions and replace multiple...

armscontrolcenter.org

 

[Blademaster]

P&W made a killing making the F135 engines. Now they are being given a contract to make new engines to replace the old ones before the life cycle ends. F-35 orders are being reduced in favor of other aircraft. Despite all it's supposed issues, the F-35 is an export hit. It's the new F-16, and it'll be in production for a long time.

It may be an export hit but it will turn into buyer’s remorse quickly if maintenance issues are not resolved.

 

[Blademaster]

You are confused between the total planned procurement number of USA military and the planned procurement number of USAF aka US airforce and the total number of F-35 that are already built world wide
The whole US military plan to buy 2380 F-35, in which 1700 is F-35A (belong to USAF) , 420 is F-35B (belong to marine corp) and 260 is F-35C ( belong to USN). They plan to buy in many lots span over decades till 2044
The total number of F-35 already built and delivered by LM to US and ally nation is 900+.
There is already more F-35 fly than the number of (J-20 + Su-57)*2
View attachment 201454

Fact Sheet: F-35 Joint Strike Fighter - Center for Arms Control and Non-Proliferation

The F-35, known as the Lightning II, is a Joint Strike Fighter that performs fighter, strike and ground attack roles in a single combat airframe common to the Air Force, Marines and Navy. The F-35 was designed to be a jack-of-all-trades, created to execute multiple missions and replace multiple...

armscontrolcenter.org

There’s no confusion. To get the ball rolling pentagon agreed to purchase f-35s while the development program wasn’t done. As a result about half of the F-35s produced remain limited in their combat capabilities and may not be able to upgraded to full combat capabilities.

 

[StealthFlanker]

There’s no confusion. To get the ball rolling pentagon agreed to purchase f-35s while the development program wasn’t done. As a result about half of the F-35s produced remain limited in their combat capabilities and may not be able to upgraded to full combat capabilities.

. The total procurement number never reduced from 2400 to 1700, let alone down to 1000. You were confusing between different numbers
Besides:
1- purchasing aircraft in IOC is common practical, literally, every single aircraft nowaday is purchased like that.
2-what stopping IOC F-35 from being upgraded to FOC?