C-17 Globemaster III (IAF)

pmaitra

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IL-76 can not do this low level delivery. IL76 is not that versatile or flexible
Not required. Ilyushin-76 can deliver from a greater height. Low altitude flights always make aeroplanes vulnerable to MANPADs. Majority of aircraft lost during the Soviet-Mujahideen War were during low level flights, a significant number of them during take off and landing. Also, up in the mountains high-altitude vertical air-dropping makes more sense than doing a low level air-drop which requires flat land, which you won't find much in the Himalayas.

Don't know what you mean by versatile or flexible.

Ilyushin Il-76 Candid/Soviet VDV Airborne Operations - YouTube

Also, capacity wise: C-130 (length ~98 feet) < Il-76 (length ~152 feet) < C-17 (length ~174 ft).
 

Blackwater

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Not required. Ilyushin-76 can deliver from a greater height. Low altitude flights always make aeroplanes vulnerable to MANPADs. Majority of aircraft lost during the Soviet-Mujahideen War were during low level flights, a significant number of them during take off and landing. Also, up in the mountains high-altitude vertical air-dropping makes more sense than doing a low level air-drop which requires flat land, which you won't find much in the Himalayas.

Don't know what you mean by versatile or flexible.



Ilyushin Il-76 Candid/Soviet VDV Airborne Operations - YouTube

Also, capacity wise: C-130 (length ~98 feet) < Il-76 (length ~152 feet) < C-17 (length ~174 ft).


by versatile and flexible i mean IL-76 can not fly that low on slow speed and remain stable...
 

pmaitra

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by versatile and flexible i mean IL-76 can not fly that low on slow speed and remain stable...
I believe C-17s can also do high altitude air-drops and that is what is required in the Himalayas. Low altitude airdrops have limited scope. Also, in the Himalayas, you don't want to fly low. C-17 will come handy when inserting troops, because of their capacity, and they will be used for high-altitude airdrops (Kunal correct me if I am wrong).
 

Adux

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??????????what u mean
What you are trying to say about quick airdrop using a low flying to supply different combat loads including vehicles, this is a speciality of the C-130 and C-17s. Where they can deliver equipments such as bmp, when there is no landing strip available, one bugger even went to the extent of saying, they will be shot down. I wonder when was the last time somebody supplied in the middle of the effin battlefield. What you suggested, requires intelligence as well as an open mind on the side of the other party to understand its value, he simply doesnt have what is required.

Himalaya's isnt just mountains, without even a acre of flat land available. Unfortunately Geography is also not his strong suit, dont waste your time.
 

asianobserve

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I wonder when was the last time somebody supplied in the middle of the effin battlefield.

I can think of the Battle of Khe Sanh. US Marines successfully defended their base from Gen. Giap's siege due in no small part to the ability of the USAF to resupply the base in the middle of a siege...



Some helicopters and C130s were destroyed in the base (there was a short improvised runway) by enemy artillery. After winning the battle the Americans however quietly vacated the base.
 
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Payeng

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India may go for 6 to 8 more C-17s : Boeing Defence Chief

Dennis Muilenburg, president and chief executive of Boeing Defense, Space & Security in his recent interview to a leading aviation website (Aerospace and Aviation News | Aviation Industry & Airline Statistics | flightglobal.com) has said that India might order 6 to 8 more C-17s, but soon cleared that this number have been discussed only in public and Interest has been shown by India , nothing more then that .

On Question of not getting MMRCA contract , he told they were disappointed to lose India's fighter competition, but are expecting more orders from India and India is interested in Apaches and Chinooks , while he also hinted that India will place more orders for, eight P-8I that India already has ordered and he expects orders for four more P-8I .

In June last year India had signed an agreement with the US government to buy 10 C-17s with an option for 6 more , and first aircraft will be delivered to India in 2013 and last in 2015 , Air Chief Marshal Norman Anil Kumar Browne recently have told a defence website that IAF is interested in 10 more C-17s but original agreement has option for only 6 . but follow up order might be on cards in 2013 .

IAF is very happy :) with scheduled delivery of all the six C-130J aircraft by Lockheed Martin and this is the first time that the IAF has received its aircraft from a foreign supplier without delay :borat:, on or before time, and without any additional demands on cost.India will be its second biggest customer of C-17s even with current 10 orders .
India may go for 6 to 8 more C-17s : Boeing Defence Chief | idrw.org
I hope the report is indicating 16+6/8 C-17s , definitely need is more Strategic lift capability.
 

Patriot

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Re: India may go for 6 to 8 more C-17s : Boeing Defence Chief

These additional C-17s suppose to be assist our upcoming two mountain strike corps in North East. It will be an incredible force multiplier.

IMO we should also consider getting the naval version of C-130s in tune of 12 numbers for our Tri-Service command.

 

Bhadra

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I can think of the Battle of Khe Sanh. US Marines successfully defended their base from Gen. Giap's siege due in no small part to the ability of the USAF to resupply the base in the middle of a siege...



Some helicopters and C130s were destroyed in the base (there was a short improvised runway) by enemy artillery. After winning the battle the Americans however quietly vacated the base.

Good video . 200 thousand and more sorties and so much explosive. Hats off to Viet Congs who held on
 
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Immanuel

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Deliveries start next year for C-17 as well. We need to order another 20 of these, the pic looks awesome :)

:thumb:
 

Shaitan

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The first Indian Air Force C-17 Globemaster III, which came together in a 'major join' ceremony today at Longbeach, California, will make its first flight in December this year. Was a fun event -- Indian Embassy, senior Indian Air Force and local politicians noisily drove ceremonial rivets into the aircraft to consecrate the 'major join' milestone.

Ambassador N. Parthasarathi, Consul General of India, San Francisco said, "This momentous occasion, where we see India's first C-17 take shape, further strengthens our growing relationship. As India strives to become a global reservoir of highly skilled and technologically sophisticated manpower, we will witness an escalating technology transfer, collaborative joint research and development, and co-production of defense items between our two countries."

The guy I enjoyed listening to more was Congressman Dana Rohrabacher who subjected Pakistan to a tonguelashing, saying the Indian C-17 deal represented a step towards a joint fight against 'radical Islam' and Pakistan's support of it (I've got his brief speech on video, and will upload it shortly). It stirred things up a bit in what was otherwise a light, formal affair :), also attended by India's Air Attache Air Commodore Sanjay Nimesh.

The first of the ten Indian C-17s will be delivered to India in May-June 2013. All ten aircraft will be delivered by the end of 2014 and will be based out of Hindan Air Force Station on Delhi's outskirts. The C-17 contract, worth $4.116-billion, does not have a formal options clause, though the IAF is contemplating contracting for 6-10 more aircraft once deliveries begin next year. For Boeing's only big military airplane facility, it's a precarious situation. The C-17 line will proceed to shut down by the end of 2014, which gives the IAF a fairly brief window to decide on follow-on orders. The IAF C-17 factors only a few small changes to the one being supplied to the USAF -- these, presumably, are communications and CISMOA-protected equipment.

A batch of 20 IAF pilots and 10 loadmasters are currently undergoing contractual training at Altus, Oklahoma with the USAF.

Livefist: First Indian C-17 Comes Together
 

Neil

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Deadline pressure on IAF to order more C-17s

In a ceremony at Boeing's Long Beach factory in California, enlivened by an anti-Pakistan tirade by local Congressman Dana Rohrabacher, the first of 10 C-17 Globemaster III airlifters ordered by the Indian Air Force (IAF) moved a step closer towards completion.

Indian diplomats and air force officers, Boeing officials and local politicians participated in the so-called "major join" ceremony, driving in ceremonial rivets to conjoin the C-17's wings and body. India's first C-17 has actually begun to look like an aircraft.



"Today, we are practically riveting together the relationship between the United States and India," proclaimed N Parthasarathi, India's consul general in San Francisco, who had been invited to the ceremony.
Even more theatrical was local Congressman, Representative Dana Rohrabacher, an anti-Pakistan hawk, who thundered that the C-17 was a tool that would help "most important ally" India "defeat the forces of evil", specifically "radical Islam and a China that would seem to be an adversary rather than a friend."

Earlier this year, Rohrabacher had sponsored a bill in the US Congress calling for the right to self-determination in Pakistan's restive province of Balochistan.

For Rohrabacher, the big issue here is local employment, not Pakistan. The C-17 production line, which creates some 5,000 jobs at Long Beach (and another 17,000 elsewhere in the US), will shut down by end-2014 after building India's 10 C-17s and the US Air Force's last seven aircraft. This has forced a deadline on the IAF, which plans to order at least six more C-17s, but only after evaluating its operational performance when it joins the IAF fleet next June. A top Boeing executive today told Business Standard unless additional international orders came in, Sept ember 2013 would be the cut-off date for the IAF to order additional aircraft. After that date, the process of shutting down the production line would begin.

"As of now, India would need to take a decision on additional C-17s by the third quarter of next year. There are other countries that are expressing interest in the C-17. If they place an order, India's deadline would extend," says Mark Kronenberg, Boeing's international business development chief.

The IAF's Rs 22,800 crore ($4.12 billion) purchase of 10 C-17s will make it the largest operator of C-17s outside the US. The aircraft will allow the army to swiftly reinforce threatened sectors along the remote, Himalayan, northern border. It can fly 74 tonnes of stores over 4,500 kilometres, landing on a one-kilometre stretch of hard, unpaved mud. The C-17 can also deliver paratroopers on to an objective. Since its full load of 134 fully equipped paratroopers weighs less than 10 tonnes, the aircraft's range increases to over 10,000 kilometres. A company of paratroopers can be delivered without refuelling as far as London, or the Australian city of Darwin.

The C-17 will replace the obsolescent Russian IL-76 airlifter, which has served the IAF since the early 1980s but is now unreliable. The IAF is impressed with the C-17's abilities, especially after June 20, 2010. During trials in Ladakh, in the oxygen-thin air of that hot summer day, the IL-76 was unable to land even without a payload. The C-17, to the IAF's delight, landed and took off with 30 tonnes on board.

The C-17 was procured through the US government's Foreign Military Sales (FMS) programme, with New Delhi and Washington signing the contract in June 2011. Under this, Boeing will deliver the first five C-17s next year, with another five following in 2014. The IAF is raising a new unit —81 Squadron, based in Hindan, outside Delhi — for the C-17, a decision that some criticise as lacking a sense of history.

"There is already an illustrious former squadron —19 Squadron — that was number-plated (retired) 20 years ago. Why don't they re-raise 19 Squadron, so that its history is passed on and kept alive? In October 1962, on the eve of the China war, 19 Squadron airlifted light tanks to Ladakh, which fought gallantly to defend Chushul.

In the 1980s, 19 squadron flew over 20,000 sorties to support the Indian army in Sri Lanka," points out IAF historian, Pushpindar Singh. The IAF is readying to receive the C-17 with 10 flight crews, each consisting of two pilots and a loadmaster, being trained at an US Air Force base in Altus, Oklahoma.

A novelty in India's C-17 purchase is a "performance-based logistics" contract that the IAF has signed with Boeing.

This binds Boeing to ensure that some 85 per cent of the C-17 fleet is always available and ready for operations. Boeing will position spares and maintenance personnel for this, drawing not just on depots in the US, but on a "virtual fleet" that includes the six other forces that operate the C-17.



Deadline pressure on IAF to order more C-17s | idrw.org
 

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