INS Vikrant Aircraft Carrier (IAC)

[Indx TechStyle]

India Constructs Special Dock to Build High-Capacity Aircraft Carriers

 

[shiphone]

repost...

 

[Yumdoot]

India Constructs Special Dock to Build High-Capacity Aircraft Carriers

Your link says they will make a USD 270 million dry dock at existing premises of Cochin Shipyard.

But where is the space in Cochin?

http://i.imgur.com/VfoUFpM.jpg

 

[Indx TechStyle]

Your link says they will make a USD 270 million dry dock at existing premises of Cochin Shipyard.

But where is the space in Cochin?

http://i.imgur.com/VfoUFpM.jpg

Who am I to know?
I just posted the news. Rest will be managed by IN.

 

[Indx TechStyle]

Your link says they will make a USD 270 million dry dock at existing premises of Cochin Shipyard.

But where is the space in Cochin?

http://i.imgur.com/VfoUFpM.jpg

If said, IN may have any plan or space. BTW, who am I to know at first place? INS establishment will decide. I'm just poster of news.

 

[Yumdoot]

If said, IN may have any plan or space. BTW, who am I to know at first place? INS establishment will decide. I'm just poster of news.

Did some googling.

Fact is Cochin Shipyard can already make within existing facilities, ships of upto 125000 ton displacement. Their largest ship till date is 93000 ton plus tanker. So if the GoI decides it needs a Ford/Storm Class Carrier - well they can do it right here in Cochin.

Apparently there is plenty of space on the other side of the shipyard not visible in the earlier picture.

But the facility proposed currently is a wet dock, ship repairs kind of facility. See the details in the Page 18 and Page 30 of the pdf file linked:
environmentclearance.nic.in/writereaddata/EIA/290920156ALNDT21EIAEMP.pdf
http://environmentclearance.nic.in/writereaddata/EIA/290920156ALNDT21EIAEMP.pdf

2.9 Cost Estimates Capital cost estimations for ship lift, civil, mechanical and electrical work are worked out to be Rs.970Crores.

Also Page 3 & Page 9 of the attached tender:
cochinshipyard.com/nits/PROJ-ISRF-701-13A.pdf
http://cochinshipyard.com/nits/PROJ-ISRF-701-13A.pdf

Seems like they want to shift all repairs work out of the way such that the main ship building of bigger vessels is not obstructed.

 

[Yumdoot]

This is how they want to expand.

 

[salute]

I don't want him to end up in scrapyard!!!
When decommission ?

what ??? its a brit sh*t ship and you want to immortalize it , scrap it .

 

[Narasimh]

Where are the fighters for Vikrant? Mig 29s already criticized by CAG for poor standards and serviceability.
Tejas is still in testing and mk2 is not going to be ready until 2023. Till that time relying only on Migs will not be wise. Either it should induct LCA mk1s or just go for some other fighters.

 

[abingdonboy]

Where are the fighters for Vikrant? Mig 29s already criticized by CAG for poor standards and serviceability.
Tejas is still in testing and mk2 is not going to be ready until 2023. Till that time relying only on Migs will not be wise. Either it should induct LCA mk1s or just go for some other fighters.

The single engined N-LCA is NOT going to be the mainstay frontline carrier fighter for the IN, it just ins't suited to it. Navies all around the world use medium weight carrier fighters and the IN is no different (MiG-29K) they are no going to switch to using a single engined LIGHT fighter.

With the MiG-29K clearly facing serious issues (surprise surprise another Russian product in trouble), the most likely candidate is the Rafale-M that will already be serving in large numbers with the IAF and will be operate from the IN's STOBAR and CATOBAR carriers. The IN was forced to buy the MiG-29K as per the terms agreed with Russia for the sale of the Vikramditya to India.

 

[smestarz]

I would understand that N-LCA will also be based on the carrier, but the idea may be to have two different planes,
One squadron of MiG-29K and oie squadron of N-LCA with the N-LCA doing more CAPs than the MiG-29..Also N-LCA will also be shore based on some naval bases to protect the important naval base. For example they will be based in Goa to ensure protection of Karwar naval base from any air attack. There is proposal to shift Goa international airport to another place and thus this station can be complete air station. There is naval air station at cochin which was the cochin airport before (very close to the shipyard) but now they shifted it quite far from the city. Thus in a way now, Indian navy will take the entire maritime protection of Indian waters and this is a huge area considering India is a peninsula.
Naval Air base at Vizag, Goa and cochin are just a start. we might see more naval air stations soon.

The single engined N-LCA is NOT going to be the mainstay frontline carrier fighter for the IN, it just ins't suited to it. Navies all around the world use medium weight carrier fighters and the IN is no different (MiG-29K) they are no going to switch to using a single engined LIGHT fighter.

With the MiG-29K clearly facing serious issues (surprise surprise another Russian product in trouble), the most likely candidate is the Rafale-M that will already be serving in large numbers with the IAF and will be operate from the IN's STOBAR and CATOBAR carriers. The IN was forced to buy the MiG-29K as per the terms agreed with Russia for the sale of the Vikramditya to India.

 

[shiphone]

Fact is Cochin Shipyard can already make within existing facilities, ships of upto 125000 ton displacement. Their largest ship till date is 93000 ton plus tanker. So if the GoI decides it needs a Ford/Storm Class Carrier - well they can do it right here in Cochin.

CSL owns two dry docks (260 and 275 meter long)...the shorter one is mainly for the ship building and the other for the repairing...

obviously the 40000 tons/ 260m long Carrier-IAC is very close to the dry dock limitation...it's impossible to assemble a 100000 tons/ 340+ meter carrier in either docks of current CSL, even a 60000 tons/ 300 meter one...

-------------
on the other hand, Indian navy has been building a 290m long dry dock in the home port of western fleet in Mumbai for quite a while...when it is done, the dock could contain 260m INS Vikrant ,280m INS Vicramaditya and future 60000 tons class one for the all level docking repair job...

 

[smestarz]

Give DM parrikar some time and he will sort this issue out. The surprise part that you dont know is Rafale M has had 5 accidents out of 45 in service. MiG-29K had just one accident, that was by Russian plane on Russian carrier,.. pilot error.. So in a way, MiG-29K has a better safety record as per statistics .. You did not expect that did you?

The single engined N-LCA is NOT going to be the mainstay frontline carrier fighter for the IN, it just ins't suited to it. Navies all around the world use medium weight carrier fighters and the IN is no different (MiG-29K) they are no going to switch to using a single engined LIGHT fighter.

With the MiG-29K clearly facing serious issues (surprise surprise another Russian product in trouble), the most likely candidate is the Rafale-M that will already be serving in large numbers with the IAF and will be operate from the IN's STOBAR and CATOBAR carriers. The IN was forced to buy the MiG-29K as per the terms agreed with Russia for the sale of the Vikramditya to India.

 

[kstriya]

The single engined N-LCA is NOT going to be the mainstay frontline carrier fighter for the IN, it just ins't suited to it. Navies all around the world use medium weight carrier fighters and the IN is no different (MiG-29K) they are no going to switch to using a single engined LIGHT fighter.

With the MiG-29K clearly facing serious issues (surprise surprise another Russian product in trouble), the most likely candidate is the Rafale-M that will already be serving in large numbers with the IAF and will be operate from the IN's STOBAR and CATOBAR carriers. The IN was forced to buy the MiG-29K as per the terms agreed with Russia for the sale of the Vikramditya to India.

Naval variant of F35 is twin engine ?

 

[HariPrasad-1]

repost...

View attachment 9579 View attachment 9580 View attachment 9581 View attachment 9582 View attachment 9583

Stealthy Design is clearly visible.

 

[Yumdoot]

@shiphone thanks for the picture. I too had been looking at the Environment Assessment report and the Cochin extension is definitely being build up as a Repairs facility.

I also admit I made a mistake in that Cochin Shipyard has not made a 93000 ton displacement vessel. The tonnage quoted in the documents was in deadweight.

But if for reference you take the Queen Elizabeth class at 65500 tonne at 280 meter length at waterline, and the way they build it in piecemeal manner with no room to spare at Rosyth Dry Dock No. 1. Then doesn't the Mumbai facility (at 290 meters) seem smaller for the often speculated 65000-70000 tonne carrier that Indian Navy wishes to make? So whether the Indian Navy wishes for a 100000 tonne carrier or a 65000 tonne carrier, most likely they will have to make a still different dry dock facility. Unless they are planning to make too many of the 40000 tonne kind (seems very unlikely to me considering the SSNs we are willing to make to protect that many 40000 tonne type carriers).

http://www.queenelizabethcruises.net/hms-queen-elizabeth-aircraft-carrier/

The newest Queen Elizabeth aircraft carrier is being built in (or rather assembled from) 9 huge sections (construction work is done at 6 different shipbuilding yards around the UK – Rosyth, Portsmouth, Govan, Devon, Tyne and Wear, Birkenhead), then parts are transported onto sea-going barges to the Rosyth’s shipyard Babcock (dry-dock No1) to be welded together. Similar method is being used to build the newest largest cruise ships as well. Rosyth is located north of Edinburgh, it’s dry-dock 1 was specially-extended to fit the Royal Navy Future Aircraft Carrier (CVF) – the dock’s entrance was enlarged, dredging is also under way at Portsmouth (their home base) to make the existing channel deeper and wider.

http://www.scotlandsplaces.gov.uk/record/rcahms/79567/rosyth-hm-dockyard/rcahms?item=1129586
&

 

[Yumdoot]

However if you look at the picture of the proposed International Ship Repair facility at Cochin (my post no. #1687). That project pic also shows the one of the existing Dry Docks which can serve as a reference.

Then there may be one outside chance that the new Cochin facility itself may end up combining the proposed workstations/repairs berth. After all the Dry Dock No. 1 of rosyth also can be divided up into two distinct dry docks. In our case we could be combining two workstations to clearly exceed the existing facilities. But I agree this is only an outlier idea.

Even for this they will have to intal dry dock gates and order some really big Cranes and extend the even the proposed facility by 50% to 100%. Major major works.

Fortunately the water front is good 800 meters long so a North South oriented Dry Dock at Cochin could do everything that anybody can imagine.

For comparison IAC Vikrant is 40000 tonne at 262 meters waterfront. Ford Class is closer to 317 meters at waterline for above 100000 tonne. Queen Elizabeth as linked above is 65500 tonnes at 280 meters.

 

[Narasimh]

The single engined N-LCA is NOT going to be the mainstay frontline carrier fighter for the IN, it just ins't suited to it. Navies all around the world use medium weight carrier fighters and the IN is no different (MiG-29K) they are no going to switch to using a single engined LIGHT fighter.

With the MiG-29K clearly facing serious issues (surprise surprise another Russian product in trouble), the most likely candidate is the Rafale-M that will already be serving in large numbers with the IAF and will be operate from the IN's STOBAR and CATOBAR carriers. The IN was forced to buy the MiG-29K as per the terms agreed with Russia for the sale of the Vikramditya to India.

N-LCA definitely features in Navy's force structure around carrier operations. Else it would not have sunk its money into it and diligently follow its progress.
Till now it operated subsonic harriers, so N-LCA will be much more capable LF. Also we are a regional power with adversaries being our neighbors. Unlike US or France which wage war thousands of miles away from its shores, our wars will be in the vicinity, so long range fighters not that essential. So LCA has its place in the navy.

But as for medium fighters go, Migs though great fighters, are not very reliable. If Russian Navy starts inducting them soon, then things might change but till then Navy has to look for other options like sea-gripen, F-18 or the Rafale

 

[Gessler]

The Vikrant will most probably be carrying both MiG-29K and the NLCA. But the squadron composition will be interesting to see. Either way, we can be fully sure about 1 squadron of Fulcrums, the 2nd squadron might either fully consist of NLCAs, or it could be a composite squadron that operates both types.

But I can't be sure about this either way just yet, because a composite carrier-based fighter squadron is rare and mostly unheard of in any modern CAW. Just not all that efficient from both mission & logistics perspective.

The thing about CAWs is that there is limited space as it is and each aircraft you have needs to give it's maximum. It's always better to have a single fighter type especially for (relatively) small carriers like ours.

One MiG-29K can fly farther, longer, and carry more payload than one NLCA. So on a one-to-one basis, you don't want to keep NLCA onboard just as an "indigenous trophy". It would be a tactical waste. I don't really buy the argument presented by some people on other forums that NLCA takes up less space in the hangar deck than a 29K, while it's true Tejas has a smaller footprint than Fulcrum, that is more than offset by the former's lack of folding wings.

On top of that, you'll have to train & maintain pilots, ground crew as well as armorers for the two aircraft separately. I would go for a full fighter compliment entirely based around the MiG any day.

However, the indigenous industry must be supported - plus it doesn't hurt to have an alternative in case the MiGs fail/are not available. A plausible solution is that we can rotate squadrons...

Currently only INAS 303 operates the MiG-29K. I think we can expect one more Fulcrum squadron, together with an NLCA squadron.

INAS 303 can take care of all 29Ks for Vikramaditya (those serving onboard, as well as those on shore, undergoing maintenance etc.). The 2nd squadron can operate half of it's Fulcrum fleet on Vikrant while the remainder of the fighter compliment can be served by the NLCA squadron. This way, a sizable number of both 29Ks and NLCAs will also be available for shore-based duties at all times.

This is a solution to keep both 29Ks and Tejas in service with the Vikrant CAW - but from my moderate perspective, this all looks like an unnecessary exercise. Maybe it's because I don't get IN's thinking (no one seems to....they just think up something and believe this is what must be IN's plan).

@abingdonboy Your thoughts, mate?

 

[Mrd indian]

Going by the uploaded pic, i belive ins vikrant is not going to be ready for trails as declared by year end.
Lot of things are pending as can be seen in the pics.