India Japan ASEAN's Indo Pacific Alliance to keep China in check ?

[sorcerer]

I doubt even you know what you meant there....

If thats your stall..I wont push you.

 

[CCTV]

They are being reasonable and not being stupid enough to stirr up so many things at same time.

See, that is the difference between dreaming and reasonable.

 

[sorcerer]

See, that is the difference between dreaming and reasonable.

Glad that you understood

 

[ice berg]

The idea of an alliance, is not to punish China "militarily" in case of conflict with one. But to forge a union, to have a united front against China as a deterrence.

Currently, all these countries have a grouse against China because of its belligerence and utter disregard for diplomacy and peaceful dispute resolution

My suggestion: India, Japan and ASEAN should start economic co-operation to reduce trade with China, and defence co-operation to exchange high tech equipment to deter China.

And what will the "union" do when push comes to shove? If China has no disregard for diplomacy and peaceful dispute resolution then there will be a shooting war long since. When was the last time PLA went to war? So much for your theory.

Dude, you still dont get it.

China is the largeste tradepartner to ASEAN including India. Trade creates jobs.It puts your kid in to school. Stopping trade with Chine in the middle of global economical crisis? I know this is a defence forum, but surely some basic knowledge about economy is expected? And I am not even started to ask you HOW you gonna replace China.. Any idea how much China imports on an annual basis? You gonna pay for the loss of trade from your own pocket? Exactly what you do for a living again? I am real curious.
High tech is not gonna deter China. Just ask Japan, or India.

 

[CCTV]

Glad that you understood

Have a good dream then, but be reasonable next time.

 

[arnabmit]

@sorcerer

You do know about the 50 cent party.. don't you? 50 Cent Party - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

It started with domestic operations, but have now gone international. Among these 2, one is an inexperienced trainee, another a mentor.

By engaging them in a discussion you are only fattening up their pay check. They will desperately say anything and everything to hijack a thread on any anti-china issue and steer you off topic.

Best to ignore them completely.

 

[CCTV]

@sorcerer

You do know about the 50 cent party.. don't you? 50 Cent Party - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

It started with domestic operations, but have now gone international. Among these 2, one is an inexperienced trainee, another a mentor.

By engaging them in a discussion you are only fattening up their pay check. They will desperately say anything and everything to hijack a thread on any anti-china issue and steer you off topic.

Best to ignore them completely.

Only 50 cent will respond to an anti China issue?

Then, can I call you a 50cent member from India?

 

[Tronic]

India, ASEAN, Japan all border China, and are victims of increasing belligerence from China regarding territorial disputes.

India, Japan and ASEAN should form a Indo-Pacific Alliance to ensure that they will all support each other in case of anyone's territorial dispute with China.

How is this idea ?

No one has the will for such an alliance. With China, the goal is to make money. The Japanese and many members of ASEAN have the US as a military shield against China, but the effort there is to throw a curtain on any such military posturing and just focus on making money. The problem with many in India is that they wish to go all gung-ho over every issue. I think India, and more importantly, Indians, should start playing a lot smarter by re-introducing the Hindi-Chinni bhai bhai and focus on expanding trade and economy, while keep sharpening your sword in the back room in case you need to defend yourself against aggression. Indians wish to brandish swords and scream anti-China stuff on the top of their lungs.. I just don't see the point. A sword should stay sheathed until it needs to be used. When it comes to China, Indians should start thinking from the brain, rather than sentimentally from their heart.

 

[Yusuf]

India, ASEAN, Japan all border China, and are victims of increasing belligerence from China regarding territorial disputes.

India, Japan and ASEAN should form a Indo-Pacific Alliance to ensure that they will all support each other in case of anyone's territorial dispute with China.

How is this idea ?

Not a new idea Sirji christianed by me about 3 years ago on DFI as SAPTO-South Asia Pacific Treaty Organization

http://defenceforumindia.com/forum/...pacific-treaty-organization-2.html#post197790

 

[Das ka das]

Not a new idea Sirji christianed by me about 3 years ago on DFI as SAPTO-South Asia Pacific Treaty Organization

http://defenceforumindia.com/forum/...pacific-treaty-organization-2.html#post197790

More proof YB is a RAW agent :cool2:

 

[sorcerer]

@sorcerer

You do know about the 50 cent party.. don't you? 50 Cent Party - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

It started with domestic operations, but have now gone international. Among these 2, one is an inexperienced trainee, another a mentor.

By engaging them in a discussion you are only fattening up their pay check. They will desperately say anything and everything to hijack a thread on any anti-china issue and steer you off topic.

Best to ignore them completely.

It was fun, late night and they were hyped up than chicks on a prom night.
If this is the way they defend their borders without reason.. then we gonna be all over them.

 

[Ray]

AS Mr KC Singh IFS has said that one does not have to go to war, one has to just shore up solid the diplomatic and economic foundations and ties with all peripheral countries of China.

Ring-a-ring o' roses,
A pocket full of posies,
Husha! Husha,
China fall down.

 

[thakur_ritesh]

There is, if I may say, an informal alliance in place. Centers around India, US, ASEAN, Japan and most notably and a country we tend to miss out on, Australia. As a matter of fact, and something that has gone unnoticed in the Indian media, Australia of late has come quite hard on the Chinese immigrants in Australia, very specific legislations passed against them. Basing of the American marines need not be overlooked, either. Quite a contrast to the days of Kevin Rudd.

In fact this takes me to an article once posted by @Yusuf on how way back in 90s Indians and the Americans were working on how India needs to extensively work it's way though in the SEA region, the results of which we see, though one would have wished for something lot more concrete, but the recent needling by the Chinese won't go unanswered, and one should expect India to be a lot more focused in the region than ever before.

Japan, as we all know, longs for such an alliance in place. Has been very keen on engaging Indians in the region for long. Also, there has been a section within the ASEAN which has, as has been reported quite a few times, keen on active Indian engagement in the region. The American interest in the region, if mentioned, would be an understatement by all means.

If there is a short coming, it is largely because of India, we have been very non-committal. As has been the case so many times, we shy away from taking strong meaningful stands, also not to over look, within the government, there is a section, quite influential backed by some very important figures within the civil society, who on purpose want India to lie low, and keep a distance from the Americans, and overlook the acts of the Chinese.

India needs to take the call, let us just say, if such an alliance has to take shape, the second rug leadership will come from India. The only hassle seems to be Russia in all this. China and our trade relations are not seen much of a problem, we have enough options to by-pass them.

 

[Yusuf]

There is, if I may say, an informal alliance in place. Centers around India, US, ASEAN, Japan and most notably and a country we tend to miss out on, Australia. As a matter of fact, and something that has gone unnoticed in the Indian media, Australia of late has come quite hard on the Chinese immigrants in Australia, very specific legislations passed against them. Basing of the American marines need not be overlooked, either. Quite a contrast to the days of Kevin Rudd.

In fact this takes me to an article once posted by @Yusuf on how way back in 90s Indians and the Americans were working on how India needs to extensively work it's way though in the SEA region, the results of which we see, though one would have wished for something lot more concrete, but the recent needling by the Chinese won't go unanswered, and one should expect India to be a lot more focused in the region than ever before.

Japan, as we all know, longs for such an alliance in place. Has been very keen on engaging Indians in the region for long. Also, there has been a section within the ASEAN which has, as has been reported quite a few times, keen on active Indian engagement in the region. The American interest in the region, if mentioned, would be an understatement by all means.

If there is a short coming, it is largely because of India, we have been very non-committal. As has been the case so many times, we shy away from taking strong meaningful stands, also not to over look, within the government, there is a section, quite influential backed by some very important figures within the civil society, who on purpose want India to lie low, and keep a distance from the Americans, and overlook the acts of the Chinese.

India needs to take the call, let us just say, if such an alliance has to take shape, the second rug leadership will come from India. The only hassle seems to be Russia in all this. China and our trade relations are not seen much of a problem, we have enough options to by-pass them.

Yes all that stops a formal alliance is for India to realize its own shortcomings and also the benefits of such an alliance at least in the middle term next 20-25 years. India has to stop his whole shit about maintaining independent foreign policy which has got is nothing so far. Not to say that we should become a lackey of anyone as we have not seen countries like Germany becomes lackeys of the US.

China knows no ethics, not laws, no treaties nothing. It is brutal and its efficient in its brutality.

We will not see US soldiers on Indian soil even if such an alliance comes around. We will see sharing of bases, and sharing means India providing some access to US ships, aircrafts etc which is not going to violate our sovereignty in any regard. Well not like how the Chinese violate our sovereignty every other time.

 

[roma]

India Japan South Korea Australia and if possible N Zealand would be much better - and if possible only vietnam from asean.

Asean politically has no direction as each of the 10 members has their own opinion and pulls apart and not in unison - plus economically they are slaves to china ....first task would be to get them to think of economic alternatives aother than china - IF that can be done - unlikely in the near future - so asean is not worthy of the joint group against china - when each of them faces the naval might of china , then individually we can assess each case - the only exception would be vietnam which has some guts and vision so they are the exception

with japan s korea australia - you will get international audience to what you are saying !

secondly, @Yusuf , (bhai-saheb) , their response to their so called "enemy " china - is that it is a useful enemy which theey sometime use to counter-weight the usa when they feel the latter is getting too influential - so there are differing perceptions about china and prc is an expert in seeping through the cracks of such perceptions to gain an irremovable foot-hold - so asean albeit a political organization in name whose main effectiveness is in collective bargaining in ECONOMIC negotiations eg with the eurpean union , usa , tarriffs etc, then they band together becuse most of them with the exception of laos and burma have large enough critical mass population sizes which are of equitable economic status

someone will say that indon is poor and singapore super-rich - but what i mean is that if you add up the population of rich in indonesa and indeed elsewhere you will find larger than the pop of singapore so as societies , they are economically VERY compatible - but religiously and ethnically they are as far apart as black and white - and the religious differences have serious political implications eg malaysia support for the palestinians vs singapore's closeness to Israel first militarily and since 1990 even diplomatically - so politically it's not a union at all

but please - im not saying dont try - by all means do try if you wish - but im merely saying we'd get much further with the other group and results-wise will be a better ratio to effort than with asean where you will go round the bush and perhaps achieve little in comparison .

 

[Yusuf]

No matter how they may be divided, they are all united by a common concern and enemy, China @roma

 

[prohumanity]

I really don't think any such alliance can happen. When they spied on the World..who they trusted..5 eyes..all anglo-saxon countries....not including even Japan or Phillipines..more likely alliance will be between Russia, India, China ,Indonesia, Brazil ...and may be Japan eventually in it. They will be so tied economically that war will become impossible.