Ceasefire Violation by Pakistan

[Yusuf]

We should also install those fire locating radars that we bought from the US post Kargil and install retaliatory fire capabilty if this continues without the Pakistanis doing anything about these terror attacks. A few retaliatory strikes would get them to their senses.

Wonder what the Israelis do to counter rocket attacks as they have been facing the Katushas for a long time. Apart from calling in Air strikes that is as that option might not be excercises by India.

 

[p2prada]

It seems to me that after every single border incident, the next move is to complain to Pakistan who umm and errr, promise to look into it and that is that until the next time. It' s about time Indian troops threw down a bucket load of counter-fire in their general direction and be damned to what anyone says. Would the Americans except it? Would the British except it? No and no... So why should the Indians except it?

Sir, any terrorist who crosses the border is killed. No prisoners taken. Even if a terrorist surrenders, he is killed. The only time terrorists are taken alive are when the CP instructs patrols to capture terrs for intelligence. That's it. This kind of reaction is reason enough for the terrs to hide behind their walls and fire their rockets.

Unfortunately, our military is not as capable as the American for taking immediate action. We don't have those Reaper drones that patrol the skies 24/7. Plus, a long border with 100s of towns and villages.

 

[Daredevil]

DD. The Israelis have built a new radar called the EL/M 2084. India has already ordered this radar. It's an AESA and is meant to track the launch point of an artillery shell or rocket and also the impact point.

I understand that we can install the radars. But my point was, how many of these radars can be installed across LOC (even if only in tactical positions) and what kind of artillery we are talking. Does they have capability to detect the hand-held RPG based rockets which have small fire power??. Also remember that, if we track the location from where the rockets are fired from, in real-time, the retaliation should also be in real-time, lest the terrorists move away from the location the moment they fire the rockets.

 

[p2prada]

We should also install those fire locating radars that we bought from the US post Kargil and install retaliatory fire capabilty if this continues without the Pakistanis doing anything about these terror attacks. A few retaliatory strikes would get them to their senses.

Wonder what the Israelis do to counter rocket attacks as they have been facing the Katushas for a long time. Apart from calling in Air strikes that is as that option might not be excercises by India.

Mate, we do have those retaliatory capabilities. Our 'friends' across the border remember Kargil very well.

The Israelis have counter battery systems in place. But, they don't fire them out of reaction. What if a shell hits a school or a hospital? We need to understand that terrs almost always use human shields.

The latest Israeli acquisition is the EL/M 8084.

There are other ways to handle this sort of scenario without resorting to their level. Terrs firing rockets is a sign of desperation. They are no longer capable of fighting their enemy mano a mano.

 

[p2prada]

I understand that we can install the radars. But my point was, how many of these radars can be installed across LOC (even if only in tactical positions) and what kind of artillery we are talking. Does they have capability to detect the hand-held RPG based rockets which have small fire power??. Also remember that, if we track the location from where the rockets are fired from, in real-time, the retaliation should also be in real-time, lest the terrorists move away from the location the moment they fire the rockets.

No, we cannot install these radars all across the border. But, RPGs can be tracked as long as they go up.

Anyways, its in our interest not to retaliate.

 

[Pintu]

Dear p2p , I think till now Israel's Trophy Active Protection System developed by Rafael can track successfully a RPG fired , since , it has passed its live test.

I agree , this is till not the time to retaliate. The coward terrorist always try to attack unarmed innocent civilians rather to face a trained and disciplined force.

Regards

 

[Daredevil]

No, we cannot install these radars all across the border. But, RPGs can be tracked as long as they go up.

Anyways, its in our interest not to retaliate.

Yes, we are grown like that, not to retaliate. Just bear the attacks and do nothing. Great.

 

[p2prada]

Dear p2p , I think till now Israel's Trophy Active Protection System developed by Rafael can track successfully a RPG fired , since , it has passed its live test.

I agree , this is till not the time to retaliate. The coward terrorist always try to attack unarmed innocent civilians rather to face a trained and disciplined force.

Regards

True mate.

Anyways, Rocket attacks by terrs are more or less harmless compared to the other forms of attacks. It's merely a tool to show that they are doing something for their cause. Terr attacks in Kashmir has reduced significantly since Kargil and 2004. Our fence helped.

 

[p2prada]

Yes, we are grown like that, not to retaliate. Just bear the attacks and do nothing. Great.

DD. This reaction is for civilians who are not aware mate. We don't retaliate in kind. It's simple to simply pick up a RPG and fire back. But, the consequences are dire. There is no point killing the small fish. We need to target the big fish.

If we retaliate now, all the years of progress we made since Kargil will be for naught. Peace across the border is very, very, very good for our armed forces and the Kashmiris. In the past, the terrs used to infiltrate in the cover of PA's artillery umbrella. We used to lose troops to the firing and more during attacks by these terrs. After the ceasefire, our troop fatalities have decreased considerably and the terrs fatality rate has increased.

Note that all major arrests of terr leaders was after this period. The terrs are getting desperate. PA artillery guns are silent and the chances of terrs crossings have diminished. This nullifies their ability to communicate with their leaders, sleeper cells and other terr groups in India. Their inability to communicate by word leads them to use electronic media. This is how these guys get caught.

Due to a reduced ability to communicate effectively, many get caught. Some are bought and work as agents for RAW.

 

[Flint]

You guys seem to be missing the point. India DOES retaliate when fired upon, but only across the LOC.
People here are forgetting that before the LOC ceasefire, there used to be constant cross-border shelling from both sides.

This rocket came across the IB, which is rare if not unheard of, and so India would be foolish to retaliate without first asking some sort of explanation from the other side.

 

[Energon]

That's very strange. I don't think anything of this sort has happened before.

I was just about to say that. First, I'm not really sure how accurate these reports are. Generally the news from the frontiers of India isn't always reliable. Nevertheless, if this is new then it sets a whole new precedent and may very well open up a brand new can of worms.

 

[I-G]

110 ceasefire violations by Pak since 2006: Antony

110 ceasefire violations by Pak since 2006: Antony

Updated on Monday, July 27, 2009, 23:48 IST

New Delhi: 110 incidents of ceasefire violation from Pakistani side have taken place along the Line of Control (LoC) since 2006 in which nine Indian security personnel were killed, Government said on Monday.

A total of 110 incidents of ceasefire violations have taken place along the LoC in Jammu and Kashmir since 2006. These include 47 incidents of trans-LoC firing... Our troops have suffered nine fatal and 25 non-fatal casualties," Defence Minister A K Antony said in written reply to a question in Lok Sabha.

A maximum of 77 such incidents had taken place in 2008, 21 in the 2007 and 3 in 2006.

"Nine violations have taken place so far this year," he added.

Meanwhile, replying to another query, Minister of State for Defence M M Pallam Raju said that 690 officers and soldiers were killed on duty in the same period.

"54 officers, 62 Junior Commissioned Officers and 574 other ranks have been killed on duty since 2006," he said.

The Defence Minister said that Indian troops take strong action against any attempts to violate the LoC violation while maintaining adequate restraint to prevent escalation.

110 Ceasefire Violations by Pak Since 2006: Antony

 

[I-G]

Indian lodges protest over ceasefire violation by Pak troops

Updated on Wednesday, September 02, 2009, 21:00 IST Tagsak troops, ceasefire violation, Indian lodges protest

Jammu: India on Wednesday lodged a strong protest with Pakistan over the ceasefire violation by its troops who fired on a post along the Line of Control (LoC) killing a jawan in Poonch district of Jammu and Kashmir.

"We have lodged protest with the Pakistani counterparts through a hotline today in connection with the ceasefire violation and death of a jawan in Pakistani firing yesterday," a senior army official said.


"We apprised them of the situation and the circumstances in which one jawan was killed in the firing on the forward post around 0130 hours," he said, adding the Indian side was awaiting their reply.

Security forces have been asked to remain vigilant round the clock along the borderline in view of apprehensions of cross-border infiltration.

Lance Naik Dag Bahadur Gurum of 2/5 Gorkha rifle died in the Pakistani firing on Tipa post in Balnoi-Mendhar sector of Poonch district yesterday.

Indian lodges protest over ceasefire violation by Pak troops

 

[I-G]

Ceasefire violations by Pak have increased: Army chief
PTI 4 September 2009, 03:21pm IST


NEW DELHI: Army Chief Deepak Kapoor said the number of ceasefire violations by Pakistan Army has increased to enable militants to infiltrate into India before the onset of winter to "disrupt" the peaceful environment in Jammu and Kashmir.

"The attempts of ceasefire violation have increased because this enables infiltration to be carried out when the firing is on and can be used as a diversionary tactic. Their attempt is to infiltrate more and more people during ceasefire violation but we understand their tactics and take appropriate steps," he told reporters.

He was asked why ceasefire violations by Pakistan have increased besides rising incidents of infiltration by militants.

"Attempts will be made by the other side to try and disrupt the stable and peaceful environment in Jammu and Kashmir and to push in as many infiltrators as possible before the winter sets in. It is the trend that we are witnessing and the attempts of infiltration are going on," he said.

Kapoor was speaking after signing an MoU between the Indira Gandhi National Open University and the Indian Army on providing graduation degrees to its personnel below officer ranks (PBORs).

Ceasefire violations by Pak have increased: Army chief - India - NEWS - The Times of India

 

[I-G]

'India has right to respond to ceasefire violations by Pak'

Updated on Monday, September 07, 2009, 11:34 IST Tags:Omar Abdullah, Pakistan ceasfire violations

Rajouri (J&K): In the backdrop of recent ceasefire violations by Pakistan, Jammu and Kashmir Chief Minister Omar Abdullah has said India has the right to respond to them.

"It is our right to respond in case of ceasefire violations," he told reporters at an army function here yesterday.

He hoped that Pakistan will keep its promise of holding truce along the LoC as it has helped people on both sides.

Abdullah said the army will return to the barracks only when the situation improves in the state.


"Stay of the army depends on the ground situation and as the situation improves the army will definitely go back to barracks in Jammu and Kashmir," he said.

Without pointing to any political party or organisation, he alleged that some vested elements were hell-bent upon creating an atmosphere of mistrust against Army and advocating revocation of Armed Forces Special Powers Act (AFSPA) and recalling army back to barracks.

The opposition Peoples Democratic Party (PDP) and separatists are demanding revocation of the AFSPA and Disturbed Areas Act (DAA) in Jammu and Kashmir and subsequent troops withdrawal from the state.

Bureau Report

`India has right to respond to ceasefire violations by Pak`

 

[IBRIS]

Pakistani forces fire rockets at India, BSF retaliates

Pakistani forces on Friday night fired two rockets towards Indian territory which fell in agriculture fields in two adjacent villages, drawing retaliation from BSF using machine guns.

There was, however, no casualty on the Indian side in the Pakistani action, BSF Inspector General Himmat Singh said.

Singh said Pakistan fired rockets which landed in an open area at villages Modhey and Dhoneya Khurd at around 10 pm after which the BSF troops hit back by opening fire from machine guns.

He said BSF authorities got in touch with their Pakistani counterparts for a flag meeting where India would lodge a strong protest against the action.
Pakistani forces fire rockets at India, BSF retaliates- Hindustan Times

 

[Vladimir79]

Pakistan breaks LOC ceasefire

Pakistan rejected Indian allegation


Sunday, 25 Oct, 2009 India alleged that a soldier was wounded in the disputed region of Kashmir by shots fired from Pakistani side of LoC.

Pakistan rejected on Saturday an Indian allegation that shots had been fired from its side of the Line of Control into the disputed region of Kashmir.

Military spokesman Maj-Gen Athar Abbas said the Indian allegations were ‘baseless’.

Earlier, an Indian army officer said that an Indian soldier was wounded in the disputed territory by shots fired from Pakistani side of LoC, calling it a violation of a ceasefire.

‘A couple of bursts of gunfire came from Pakistani posts. We returned the fire and a bullet hit our soldier, wounding him,’ Brig Gopala Krishnan Murali said. ‘It’s a ceasefire violation.’

The incident, which was brief, took place in Mendhar sector, 175km southwest of Srinagar, he said.

Indian and Pakistani troops have observed a ceasefire in the region since November 2003. However, there have been isolated shooting incidents in the past.

More than a dozen militant groups have fought Indian forces since 1989, seeking independence for the Muslim-majority state or its merger with Pakistan.—Agencies

DAWN.COM | Pakistan | Pakistan rejected Indian allegation

 

[prahladh]

Why is it that we are not able to put an end to this LOC firings atleast. If we can't convince them on these issues how can we make them stop Funding terrorism.

 

[ppgj]

Why is it that we are not able to put an end to this LOC firings atleast. If we can't convince them on these issues how can we make them stop Funding terrorism.

rimser,
as you know for ages now it is very difficult to convince PA. you can convince only those who are sincere not those who deliberately do it.
i guess it is a strategy PA has worked with chinese. remeber the incursions on our north/eastern borders which has increased significantly.
pakistan army suffers from its phobia of an indian threat which is self imagined. in the present atmosphere when they have to take units from their eastern borders to fight elsewhere(under american pressure) the fear has intensified. to keep india busy and not to threaten pakistan in its vulnerable state it seems logical to me that they are resorting to indiscriminate firing along IB and LOC while asking the chinese to do the bidding for them by incursions.

 

[sivadreams]

5th ceasefire violation as Pak troops fire at two border posts

Tuesday , Dec 22, 2009 at 0956 hrs

BSF foiled major infiltration bids by militants to cross into Indian territory as Pakistani troops fired at two forward posts in the Samba sector in the wee hours on Tuesday, in the fifth case of ceasefire violation within a week.

A BSF patrol party noticed some movement of militants at two posts - S M Pur and S M Pur-one - in Ramgarh subsector of Samba and challenged the militants, police officials said.

Pakistani troops then opened fire and the BSF retaliated and the exchange between the two sides continued intermittently for half-an-hour.The militants later fled.

Inspector General of BSF, Jammu frontier, A K Sarolia said a red alert has been sounded in the entire border line with Pakistan and patrolling intensified.

The militants, he said, did not succeed in infiltrating into Jammu and Kashmir.

Pakistani troops had also opened fire at around 2240 hrs last night at Kandral border outpost along the international border, drawing retaliation from BSF personnel.

In a pre-dawn attack on Sunday, border outposts at Londi and Bobiya were targeted and at a flag meeting held. India had lodged its protest against ceasefire violation.

On Saturday, a BSF jawan was killed and two others were injured in cross border firing at Kranti post near LOC in Poonch.

There have been 28 incidents of such ceasefire violations till November 25 by Pakistan along the Line of Control.

During the last four years there have been 129 incidents of ground ceasefire and 43 air space violations by Pakistan.