With Russian help, India to join ICBM big league soon

[Adux]

OK, fair enough. I just don't see the benefit to India to project its force there.

We will have interest in Atlantic at one point of time in the future, South America is area of particular interest to us. It is all but natural for any nation to yearn for the position your nation hold in this world.

 

[W.G.Ewald]

Oh, please spare me the bullshit. As an American, you have the cheek to call me, an Indian, hostile????

I called you that as an individual after your puerile response (re: high school geography) to my simple question regarding the range of the missile and potential targets. If you want to make an international incident of it, be my guest.:shocked:

And I am capable of using a globe of the world with a string cut to scale.

 

[W.G.Ewald]

We will have interest in Atlantic at one point of time in the future, South America is area of particular interest to us. It is all but natural for any nation to yearn for the position your nation hold in this world.

Getting perhaps more off-topic, I read that Britain will base in South Africa if future problems with Argentina arise.

 

[Adux]

Getting perhaps more off-topic, I read that Britain will base in South Africa if future problems with Argentina arise.

That would be good option for them, but I wonder if the British public have the stomach for one more Falkland ? Indian's are said to be looking at Madagascar and Oman for future Naval bases.

 

[W.G.Ewald]

If the US thinks, that it can rough shoulder us simply because they are the most powerful country in the world, then they are in for some suprises. We are democratic nation of our own right and might. We will not be pushed around, As long as you respect us, you are in calm waters.

Did you not hear Obama when he travelled around the world apologizing for the US after he was elected?

The President's Apology Tour - WSJ.com

(Well, he didn't go to Asia, apparently.)

From here, my impression is that India is viewed very favorably by Americans and the news media. It is not trivial that India is the largest democracy in the world.

 

[Adux]

Did you not hear Obama when he travelled around the world apologizing for the US after he was elected?

The President's Apology Tour - WSJ.com

(Well, he didn't go to Asia, apparently.)

From here, my impression is that India is viewed very favorably by Americans and the news media. It is not trivial that India is the largest democracy in the world.

No apologies required for any past stuff we might have done to each other. Americans are seen very favorably by a majority of Indians, except by the Islamist and Communist in our midst. We just dont like to be pushed around or be given a different yardstick. Like the NPT etc etc.; I am not the biggest fan of Obama, but atleast he had the guts to take on the true American enemy- Pakistan. If Bush had done the same in 2001-2005 time period, We all would be in far off better place.

 

[trackwhack]

I called you that as an individual after your puerile response (re: high school geography) to my simple question regarding the range of the missile and potential targets. If you want to make an international incident of it, be my guest.:shocked:

And I am capable of using a globe of the world with a string cut to scale.

Your question about what country would a 10K+ missile target would suggest you werent capable of using a globe.

Make what an International incident? This discussion? Who are you, the president or the pope? Take your elitist attitude back where you come from.

As a country, India has faced up to the hegemonic United States time and time again. The stand that your country has taken repeatedly in both supporting states like Pakistan and denying us our legitimate rights to development by imposing sanctions have failed - miserably. Your stance of supporting and breeding vitriole in Pakistan has resulted in the single biggest drain on American exchequer - a 10 year war which is still far from won. Your economy is in the dump, you are fast running out of genuine allies and your clutch on world affairs is on the decline.

The next 20 years is going to witness an irreversible shift in balance of power and there is nothing you can do about it - nothing except try to maintain a military advantage that will inevitably be used to meddle in our strategic interets. So do we think we need ICBM's that can hit every major city in the United States. Yes. How naive do you think we are?

 

[W.G.Ewald]

Your question about what country would a 10K+ missile target would suggest you werent capable of using a globe.

Make what an International incident? This discussion? Who are you, the president or the pope? Take your elitist attitude back where you come from.

As a country, India has faced up to the hegemonic United States time and time again. The stand that your country has taken repeatedly in both supporting states like Pakistan and denying us our legitimate rights to development by imposing sanctions have failed - miserably. Your stance of supporting and breeding vitriole in Pakistan has resulted in the single biggest drain on American exchequer - a 10 year war which is still far from won. Your economy is in the dump, you are fast running out of genuine allies and your clutch on world affairs is on the decline.

The next 20 years is going to witness an irreversible shift in balance of power and there is nothing you can do about it - nothing except try to maintain a military advantage that will inevitably be used to meddle in our strategic interets. So do we think we need ICBM's that can hit every major city in the United States. Yes. How naive do you think we are?

I think you have a big chip on your shoulder, little man, with a list of grievances that have nothing at all to do with me.

 

[W.G.Ewald]

Colubus Day

And the genocide of millions of Native Americans will not have happened, a near wipe out of a complete civilization and race of people.

But not before the Native Americans introduced the Europeans to tobacco... resulting in millions of deaths.

 

[asianobserve]

But not before the Native Americans introduced the Europeans to tobacco... resulting in millions of deaths.

Yes you could say that but don't forget the diseases that Europeans brought to the New World wiping even more Indians...

 

[trackwhack]

I think you have a big chip on your shoulder, little man, with a list of grievances that have nothing at all to do with me.

At least make an attempt to come up with something intelligent when responding.

 

[Yusuf]

My reply was to a post clearly hostile to the US in terms of nuclear targeting. Do you really think Pakistan should be obliterated? Does India view the US on a par with Pakistan? Many posts on this forum are extremely skewed with impotent rage towards Pakistan; does this attitude bleed over into Indians' view of the USA?

By the way, I wish you all a Happy Columbus Day! Were it not for Columbus trying to find India, the USA might not exist today.

Indians are generally hostile against the Pakis. May be not the very common folk who are more bothered about earning their daily bread. But educated class, forum world is filled with hatred for Pakis and not without reason.

India and US are natural partners as they keep saying. America is viewed favorably in India even more so than the Europeans as many polls have show .

India is not a first strike nuclear state. We cannot keep the US targeted permanently with hot nukes. We don't do that even with the Pakis or Chinese.

The only reason India to go ICBM is pride, prestige and may be hedge against uncertain and unknown enemy.

 

[Adux]

But not before the Native Americans introduced the Europeans to tobacco... resulting in millions of deaths.

I realy dont care what happened to the Native Americans, not my people not my concern. That said, blood isnt easily washed off.

 

[JayATL]

I hope hostile and belligerent people like you are not determining India's foreign policy now or in the future.

No its not the norm Ewald. Every country ( its a minority in India) has its version of neo cons or in this case US haters. rest assured they type their insane theories while being first in line to try the new US styled coffee houses

 

[JayATL]

At least make an attempt to come up with something intelligent when responding.

he did- you were too stuck on stupid to get it. all you want to do is rant about the US on a subject matter you clearly are ignorant about.

 

[Rahul Singh]

What country would India target at 10000 Km?

Weapons of strategic deterrence or so-called 2nd strike weapons can't be stored at predictable locations (around international border/ controlled border) and so far despite having no-first-use policy, we don't have missiles that can be kept and launched from wherever we want and that means that our second-strike capability is at at serious risk and at bare minimum, mercy of the enemy if you will. So to strengthen the credibility of our second-strike doctrine, we need true ICBMs and SL-ICBMs so that we can strike inside China wherever we want to, wherever we want from.

Seeker in ballistic missile ? First time i am hearing about this.

Can anyone tell me how does it work ?

Was about to raise the same question, so glad you raised. I seriously fear, some of our defense journalist have yet to learn difference between Guided and Ballistic missiles.

 

[Galaxy]

We will develop 10,000-16,000 KM BM after Agni V/VI (But it won't be disclosed), Also Anti Satellite Missile after AD-1,2.

Everything is not disclosed on public domain due to many reasons. 8)

 

[JayATL]

Does the US give Pakistan some weapons which cannot be used in the war on terror? Yes. Does India protest it mildly? Yes. Are these game changers? NO.

US gives " some weapons" to Pak but they come with tons of stipulations added to the deal- like the F16 deal where they are not allowed to use it on India (purely defensive), not allowed to fly it across its borders and with a "kill switch" on it. Read up about the disgraceful deal Pakistan signed with US on the F16's they recently acquired someday on Google.

Now the reason they do is because the US views it as a "bakshis (gift)", small token in other words. Just like India gave the genocide killers in Sri Lankan govt some naval ships I thought I read awhile back-and helped out with some military hardware. Why does India do that? Because it's trying to get in favor (of sorts) with Sri Lanka. It's a form of playing strategic politics...

Bottom line: It's not to antagonize India and Indian govt knows it all too well. That's why you don't hear but a " mild' protest from the Indian govt about it. To take such moves as the reason to rail against the US is naive thinking.

 

[Rahul Singh]

India has indigenous seeker for only Nag missile.

What other missiles you are talking about ? ABM uses Russian seekers.

Seeker of ABM is designed and developed by IMARAT (RCI) --a DRDO lab situated in Hyderabad.

The Research Centre, Imarat (RCI), Hyderabad, another DRDO unit, provided the navigation, electromechanical actuation systems, the seeker on board the interceptor,

No its not the norm Ewald. Every country ( its a minority in India) has its version of neo cons or in this case US haters. rest assured they type their insane theories while being first in line to try the new US styled coffee houses

I have read this thread and related posts and agree that at points they sound outrageous. But that said, they are not entirely, we Indians are not wary of US but we have not dropped guard either. Believe me, Indians agreeing with does not make a minority.

 

[thakur_ritesh]

W.G.Ewald,

You should have come to indian forums when bush was the president, when the indo-US civil nuke deal happened and should have seen for yourself how pro-US could the indians be. When our PM was full of praise for bush and said India loves bush, he wasn't off course by a big margin, I believe PM is yet to develop that sort of rapport with Obama still, though Obama does come across quite courteous to the PM and the PM reciprocates that, what could also be said is bush took extra interest in developing relations with India and that increased the expectations on part of India way too much than should have.

When Obama took to office and things like G2 after bush having invested a lot on indo-US relations, Obama making a visit to SE-asia which prominently figured japan and china and not India, Obama telephonically calling up 20 world leaders and not the PM were all played up big time in the media and didn't go down well at all and there was a big swing in the perception, not so much towards the US, but certainly towards the Obama administration.

Obama administration tried to buck the trend and make amends by first hosting PM on the first ever state visit under his presidency but by then the expectations had taken such a beating that not many were taking this more than symbolism at best, with little substance, which is what it was portrayed as in the indian media. The real change came in post the Obama visit last year, since there has been a change in perception and outlook towards the US.

One good thing Obama has done is, he has brought down the expectation levels, which was a must for this relationship to prosper, which will take its own sweet time, since we Indians take our own time to new things, new ideas.

As far as ICBMs that can target the US main land and subs which can loiter in the high seas near the US, well times change, so do interests. India and the US not so long back were in the opposing camps, hurriyat conference being created or insurgency being supported in kashmir in the name of freedom struggle arent too much of a distant memories for indians to get over with, who knows what tomorrow has in store, so the motto is to be ready for any eventuality. All it will require is a hard nut as the president of the US and another hard nut as the PM here and divergent indo-US interests as is happening with sino-US relations today, and US then looking to create a counter weight to India, though for the next 2 decades I don't see why India needs to be as aggressively pursuing opposing interests, for now we need to talk out our differences and sort them out, which we anyway are.

One thing is for sure, with the way the indian foreign policy is now being framed, if not in a decade's time but certainly in two decade's time India will quite aggressively pursue its interests, things that might not be of interest to other world powers and for the immediate and for the next two decades india will never be a UK, or a japan, or a pakistan to the US, if it is so perceived.