Pakistan Seeks New Service Rifle

Zulfiqar Khan

Regular Member
Joined
Apr 13, 2016
Messages
422
Likes
187
Sorry but why does PA need to replace G3 to begin with?
G3 isnt really that bad. It's very reliable and accurate. Our standard G3 rifles are upgraded. However the issue is; it performs poor-shit in close-range combat. The G3 performed very bad against insurgents. Not only that but the design itself is 60 years old. We're opting for an all-well rifle that can perform robust in all aspects.

Most likely FN-SCAR will be chosen.
 

republic_roi97

Senior Member
Joined
Sep 12, 2016
Messages
1,960
Likes
2,700
Country flag
Why don't you guys go for AK-103 or AK-400 or any other modernized AK series rifle ? Its reliable, cheap, works like charm and you already have experience on AKs so producing them in house might be easier and you can induct them in numbers much sooner. For regular infantry soldiers it would be the ideal thing. You can induct the more elite and sophisticated weapon like FN-SCAR for your SF and other commandos.

BTW, are you guys looking for specifically 5.56x45 rifles ??
 

IndianHawk

Senior Member
Joined
Sep 24, 2016
Messages
9,058
Likes
37,672
Country flag
Cost can range from probably $500-$1000 each rifle if produced indigenously and over $2000-$3000 if ordered.
That's too much difference.
Even as wage costs will be low in Pakistan man hour will increase due to inherent efficiency issues.
And then they will try to extract maximum royalty.
If direct order costs upwards 2k$ then don't expect local to cost less than 1500$
 

Zarvan

Regular Member
Joined
Apr 21, 2014
Messages
638
Likes
300
Why don't you guys go for AK-103 or AK-400 or any other modernized AK series rifle ? Its reliable, cheap, works like charm and you already have experience on AKs so producing them in house might be easier and you can induct them in numbers much sooner. For regular infantry soldiers it would be the ideal thing. You can induct the more elite and sophisticated weapon like FN-SCAR for your SF and other commandos.

BTW, are you guys looking for specifically 5.56x45 rifles ??
First we would have chosen AK-103 if it would have performed better than other rifles in the trials but it didn't. SCAR was the best performer than was Berretta. So we are talking for SCAR and Berreta and the one with best offer would be selected. But it seem SCAR would eventually win.
 

aditya g

Senior Member
Joined
Jan 14, 2014
Messages
1,962
Likes
4,651
Country flag
PA's rifle replacement is interesting to watch. I also feel it is unnecessary, as modern wars including the ones Pakistan is fighting are served well by humble AK-56.

I don't think any large army has successfully replaced rifles after the FN FN FAL and H&K G3 :tongue:

I am generalizing, but FAMAS, H&K G36, SA80, M16 and M4 all seem to have left users dissatisfied. The 5.56mm round itself has failed.
 

Zarvan

Regular Member
Joined
Apr 21, 2014
Messages
638
Likes
300
Yuck, like anybody would want to buy anything that says "Made in Pakistan".
We are exporting weapons to many countries. Our exports are increasing by every passing day. We are exporting Tanks and APC and Anza Anti Air Craft systems and Assault Rifles and Ammunition and also we have orders of Fast Attack Crafts and Patrol Boats as well as JF-17
 

Zarvan

Regular Member
Joined
Apr 21, 2014
Messages
638
Likes
300
PA's rifle replacement is interesting to watch. I also feel it is unnecessary, as modern wars including the ones Pakistan is fighting are served well by humble AK-56.

I don't think any large army has successfully replaced rifles after the FN FN FAL and H&K G3 :tongue:

I am generalizing, but FAMAS, H&K G36, SA80, M16 and M4 all seem to have left users dissatisfied. The 5.56mm round itself has failed.
Norway has replaced G3 with HK-417 and also other countries but some G3 are being used for Marksman role
 

Project Dharma

meh
Senior Member
Joined
Oct 4, 2016
Messages
4,836
Likes
10,862
Country flag
We are exporting weapons to many countries. Our exports are increasing by every passing day. We are exporting Tanks and APC and Anza Anti Air Craft systems and Assault Rifles and Ammunition and also we have orders of Fast Attack Crafts and Patrol Boats as well as JF-17
I guess Islamic countries want to support another Islamic country. Any country which wants to buy quality hardware will obviously not buy Pakistani. A few months ago, I bought Pakistani razor blades in the US and even half of them were dull. A country that cannot manufacture razor blades can obviously not manufacture quality weapons. QED
 

republic_roi97

Senior Member
Joined
Sep 12, 2016
Messages
1,960
Likes
2,700
Country flag
I don't know how Pakistan is going to manage with the cost of SCAR, I don't care if they are going to give a scar to every single men in the army, I bet that its not going to be 1/4th to 1/2 the price of the original rifle, these claims of low cost might just be bullshit to feed the media so that no body says that "Pakistan is basically buying weapons with the money that it should put for better economy and development". What sounds insane is a country with $8 billion budget is going to equip each and every soldier with FN-SCAR.

Anyways, good luck with induction of FN-SCAR.
 

Zulfiqar Khan

Regular Member
Joined
Apr 13, 2016
Messages
422
Likes
187
Yuck, like anybody would want to buy anything that says "Made in Pakistan".
You could tell FIFA and other prestigious international corporations, governing bodies and ect... that

You could also tell that to countries like Iran, Iraq, Saudi Arabia, Nigeria, Oman, Qatar, Syria, Bahrain, Sri-Lanka, Myanmar, Morocco, Malaysia or Turkey (which just recently ordered 100 trainer jets from Pakistan) which regularly imports from Pakistan - you can thank those countries for doubling our exports every year.

POF Exports itself jumped up to 325% in one year alone.

POF exports to the US itself has surged and is quickly racing to become a major competitor in the US gun market.

 

Zulfiqar Khan

Regular Member
Joined
Apr 13, 2016
Messages
422
Likes
187
I don't know how Pakistan is going to manage with the cost of SCAR, I don't care if they are going to give a scar to every single men in the army, I bet that its not going to be 1/4th to 1/2 the price of the original rifle, these claims of low cost might just be bullshit to feed the media so that no body says that "Pakistan is basically buying weapons with the money that it should put for better economy and development". What sounds insane is a country with $8 billion budget is going to equip each and every soldier with FN-SCAR.

Anyways, good luck with induction of FN-SCAR.
It doesn't happen overnight...

It would cost around $75 Million dollars a year for 3-4 years. It'll be produced in batches.
 

Project Dharma

meh
Senior Member
Joined
Oct 4, 2016
Messages
4,836
Likes
10,862
Country flag
I was mostly trolling Zarvan, thanks for the links. The price tag looks compelling and good for POF that they are able to manufacture and export to Western countries. IOF should learn and emulate. I'll have to get my hands on 9mm and try it out next time I travel to a more gun friendly state.
 

Project Dharma

meh
Senior Member
Joined
Oct 4, 2016
Messages
4,836
Likes
10,862
Country flag
You could tell FIFA and other prestigious international corporations, governing bodies and ect... that

You could also tell that to countries like Iran, Iraq, Saudi Arabia, Nigeria, Oman, Qatar, Syria, Bahrain, Sri-Lanka, Myanmar, Morocco, Malaysia or Turkey (which just recently ordered 100 trainer jets from Pakistan) which regularly imports from Pakistan - you can thank those countries for doubling our exports every year.

POF Exports itself jumped up to 325% in one year alone.

POF exports to the US itself has surged and is quickly racing to become a major competitor in the US gun market.

Liking the reviews of the mp5 clone. It seems very well built, accuracy and reliability are excellent. Do you know if there are any 9mm semi auto guns as well?

Lastly, read what one reviewer posted, this is what POF has to contend with in the private market in developed countries.

The new kid on the block is from Pakistan. That didn’t exactly light my fire. I’ll admit now that I had to get over some of my preconceived notions. Not that I have anything against the people pf Pakistan…. When I was a kid, though, I bought knives made in Pakistan. They were cheap, plentiful, and all-but-useless. That’s why I bought them. They were junk, priced like junk, and that was a great thing for a teenager on a limited budget. And that’s what I expected of the POF, honestly—nothing more than a cheap copy.

The throw-away-knives are easily identified as junk. You can see the (lack of) quality. These guns look good. In the interest of fair journalism, I shelved my prejudices and gave them a fighting chance. Who knows? I thought, Maybe these guns might work. At the very least they would make great range toys.
 

Immanuel

Senior Member
Joined
May 16, 2011
Messages
3,555
Likes
7,476
Country flag
What I know is FN SCAR is leading the trials and SCAR is more than willing to sell us with TOT not only that they are also offering DMR and a smaller version to replace MP5.
all the leading trials aside, your nation cannot afford this weapon on bulk, neither will FN offer TOT. You'll end up with the Turkish rifle as it will also pass trials and will be available cheaper
 
Last edited:

Immanuel

Senior Member
Joined
May 16, 2011
Messages
3,555
Likes
7,476
Country flag
Cost is not known yet but we are getting them with TOT and permission to export
Complete hogwash, you'll end up with licence to assemble and no way for exporting, why would FN do that when they have a fully capable line here in Belgium with enough orders and capacity to keep the line busy. They don't even have to compete price wise, their product is that good. No company in such a strong position will do such a thing, allowing exports from another line will lead to closing of factories in Belgium, no go while the Govt. here try to keep the jobs going. Dream on.
 

republic_roi97

Senior Member
Joined
Sep 12, 2016
Messages
1,960
Likes
2,700
Country flag
Complete hogwash, you'll end up with licence to assemble and no way for exporting, why would FN do that when they have a fully capable line here in Belgium with enough orders and capacity to keep the line busy. They don't even have to compete price wise, their product is that good. No company in such a strong position will do such a thing, allowing exports from another line will lead to closing of factories in Belgium, no go while the Govt. here try to keep the jobs going. Dream on.
Like I said, they all love to get humiliated, always presenting empty claims and HOAX, just like Su-35, these guys consider others to be fools while thinking that they themselves are the king of the world.
 

Latest Replies

Global Defence

New threads

Articles

Top