NATO Expansion: Threat to World Peace

Discussion in 'Europe and Russia' started by happy, Mar 4, 2014.

  1. sgarg

    sgarg Senior Member Senior Member

    Joined:
    Sep 9, 2014
    Messages:
    3,480
    Likes Received:
    980
    The USA prepared a war plan against USSR in the early eighties. This war plan included both economic war and military war. The economic war component of this plan was so successful that it caused the demise of USSR within a few years.

    The plan to "outspend" USSR in military spending was the smartest move by the Reagan administration.

    However what happened after USSR was humbled did not go according to plans. The complications created by breakup of USSR created additional need for financial resources which made the surge in military spending permanent. This in turn increased US national debt which ultimately resulted in the financial crisis of 2001.

    There has been a constant and ever-increasing divergence in the US empire from its stated main principle of "capitalist society". The economy is more and more dependent on State support (or money printing). While USA empire is choke-a-bloke with technical advances, its finances have NOT improved much since the financial crisis.

    The conclusion - The US empire made financial decisions in early 1980 which have boomeranged on it.
     
  2. Sameet Pattnaik

    Sameet Pattnaik Regular Member

    Joined:
    Jun 12, 2014
    Messages:
    123
    Likes Received:
    36
    Location:
    Dhule
    lets agree to disagree american are using covert tactics to cause harm to russsia !
     
  3. jouni

    jouni Senior Member Senior Member

    Joined:
    Jul 29, 2014
    Messages:
    3,900
    Likes Received:
    1,136
    Location:
    finland
    Norwegian daily: Nordics to step up security cooperation on perceived Russian threat | Yle Uutiset | yle.fi


    Norwegian daily Aftenposten reported Thursday on the defence cooperation agreement involving Finland, Sweden, Norway, Iceland and Denmark in an op-ed undersigned by their respective Defence Ministers. The background to the intensified collaboration was said to be the perceived threat posed by Russia.

    "The Russian aggression against the Ukraine and the illegal annexation of Crimea are violations of international law and other international agreements. Russia’s conduct represents the gravest challenge to European security. As a consequence, the security situation in the Nordic countries’ adjacent areas has become significantly worsened during the past year…. we must be prepared to face possible crises or incidents," the ministers wrote in the opinion piece.

    “We have to examine what Russia is doing, not the rhetoric coming from the Kremlin,” they added.

    They noted that the Nordic states represented in the missive plan to deepen cooperation in areas such as military exercises, acquisition of defence materiel, intelligence sharing and thwarting cyber attacks.

    The letter disclosed that the decision to intensify defence cooperation was taken during a meeting of Nordic defence ministers on March 10. The Baltic States will also be included in the community. The ministers indicated that the adrive to expand the group beyond the Nordics was discussed back in November 2014.

    “In November last year 12 nations met in order to prepare an extended defence cooperation: The Nordic counties plus the Baltic states, Poland, The Netherlands, Germany and Great Britain,” the op-ed stated.
     
  4. sgarg

    sgarg Senior Member Senior Member

    Joined:
    Sep 9, 2014
    Messages:
    3,480
    Likes Received:
    980
    It is interesting to watch these developments in Europe which are largely illogical and wasteful. Interesting to see even NATO is not enough for Nordic security and a new grouping is needed.
     
  5. SajeevJino

    SajeevJino Long walk Elite Member

    Joined:
    Feb 21, 2012
    Messages:
    5,880
    Likes Received:
    3,173
    Location:
    Inside a Cage
    .

    With idiots like Putin with damn number of Nukes who else feel secure, NATO is the only Hope


    Sitting near a nuclear tripwire, Estonia's president urges Nato to send troops to defend his country
     
  6. Gabriel92

    Gabriel92 Regular Member

    Joined:
    Aug 12, 2013
    Messages:
    817
    Likes Received:
    517
    Former soviet states have joined NATO because they don't want to belong to Russia. (They also don't want tomorrow "little green men" on their soil that's why they have joined NATO.) No country can prevent independent countries from choosing their allies.
    If Russia wants to stop other countries from joining NATO the best way would be to stop acting so aggressive.
     
    jouni likes this.
  7. Cadian

    Cadian Regular Member

    Joined:
    May 5, 2014
    Messages:
    824
    Likes Received:
    790
    Location:
    Russia, Ryazan
    [​IMG]

    These are speechless 30 characters.

    P.S. Russia comes to dominate Eastern Europe once more! Lol.
     
  8. Rowdy

    Rowdy Co ja kurwa czytam! Senior Member

    Joined:
    Sep 6, 2014
    Messages:
    3,256
    Likes Received:
    3,046
    Location:
    Milky Bar
    :lol:
    30 shades of unbelievable bullshit
     
    apple likes this.
  9. Gabriel92

    Gabriel92 Regular Member

    Joined:
    Aug 12, 2013
    Messages:
    817
    Likes Received:
    517
    Yes,sure as if the Eastern Europeans will again accept a bunch of commies psychopaths killers/rapists invade their land.
    Anyway as i said erlier,if Russia wants to prevent other countries joining NATO,they should stop acting aggressively towards Easter european countries and stop threatening to nuke some countries.
     
    apple likes this.
  10. Sakal Gharelu Ustad

    Sakal Gharelu Ustad Detests Jholawalas Moderator

    Joined:
    Apr 28, 2012
    Messages:
    7,119
    Likes Received:
    7,729
    That was some serious BS. Do you even know the reason behind 2001 crisis was related to dot com bubble burst!
     
    apple likes this.
  11. jouni

    jouni Senior Member Senior Member

    Joined:
    Jul 29, 2014
    Messages:
    3,900
    Likes Received:
    1,136
    Location:
    finland


    Stay out of Estonia, our little brothers. Otherwise we will not be responsible of consequencies.
     
    apple likes this.
  12. Cadian

    Cadian Regular Member

    Joined:
    May 5, 2014
    Messages:
    824
    Likes Received:
    790
    Location:
    Russia, Ryazan
    Nato's Russian city
    By Neal RazzellBBC World Service
    • 25 June 2015
    [​IMG]

    Estonia is one of the countries in Eastern Europe where US tanks, artillery and other military equipment will soon start arriving, Defense Secretary Ash Carter said on Tuesday in the Estonian capital, Tallinn. But there is one community in Estonia that may have mixed feelings about these new US deployments.

    Nato has a Russian city. It's called Narva and its main feature is a 12th Century castle overlooking the Narva River. Climb to the top and you can peer down on its ancient nemesis - the fortress of Ivangorod that sprawls along the opposite bank. This spot has long been a place of conflict between east and west. Today, Ivangorod and its fortress are in Russia. Narva and its castle are in Estonia, which means they're in the EU and Nato.

    But Narva's people are almost entirely - and often resolutely - Russian.

    [​IMG]
    The view of Ivangorod from the Estonian side of the border
    Note the Russian television on in seemingly every home, lobby and restaurant. Note the statue of Lenin on the castle grounds. And the Soviet tank on a stone plinth by the river. And the crowd laying flowers by it on Victory Day - when Russians everywhere celebrate the Nazi defeat in 1945.

    A concert on that day last month featured a lot of flags. There were Russian ones, with white, blue and red bars. And Soviet ones, with a golden hammer, sickle and star set against a bright red banner. But there was not one blue, black and white Estonian flag.

    "They have their own traditions," one man told me.

    I even saw a flag used by the Russian rebels in the Ukrainian city of Donetsk. Donetsk is a sister city to Narva. The guy with its flag said its people need support - "they're being bombed right now".

    [​IMG]
    Narva in numbers
    • Third largest city in Estonia - population of 58,000
    • Ethnic Russians make up 83% of the population, ethnic Estonians make up 4%
    • More than 36% of the population has Russian citizenship, 47% has Estonian citizenship
    Source: Narva municipality

    [​IMG]
    Could what's happening in Donetsk happen here, I asked.

    "It's very much possible," he said. "Estonia is somewhere out there," gesturing west. "We're on our own. The government only remembers us before election days."

    There's a history here. To liberate Narva the Soviets bombed it flat. They then moved in tens of thousands of Russian civilians. To build - or as many Estonians see it - to occupy. Estonia only regained independence in 1991 with the collapse of communism. It has since had a sometimes awkward relationship with its Russians, who make up a quarter of the total population. Some don't have equal citizenship or voting rights. The president once told the BBC there's no more reason to speak Russian in Estonia than Japanese or Urdu. For him to even speak Russian, he said, would legitimise 50 years of Soviet brutalisation.

    So Russians don't always feel the warm embrace of the Estonian state. And it's not as if they're so busy getting rich they don't notice. Narva has seen better days. The giant factories that once employed so many sit empty. Plants grow out of the bricks. An affable middle-aged man named Slava Konovalov helped me slip into an abandoned textile mill where his mother used to work. He remembers the deafening noise of the place when he came to see her as a boy. Now, the only sounds were our voices echoing around a vast courtyard, the crunch of rubble beneath our feet and the caw of a lone ornery crow.

    [​IMG]
    An abandoned textile mill in Narva
    Slava's mum was one of those Russians who moved here after the war. When she got her first paycheck she thought there was a mistake. She was earning three times as much as she did back home in Russia. It was no mistake. Narva, Slava said, was a good place to be Russian. Today, that's less true. Russians in Estonia are still doing better economically than Russians in Russia. But compared to their countrymen in Estonia, they're doing worse. Slava, a local official with figures to hand, says people in Narva on average earn a third less than Estonians in general.

    Local grievances can add up and the Estonian government believes the Kremlin is already trying to use them to undermine the state. This is obvious, the government communications director, Ilmar Raag, told me. Russian television is hostile, he said, fabricating stories and exaggerating problems. He doesn't believe it has yet created a fifth column eager to rise up and break away, as in Ukraine. But there are unnerving signs.

    He asked young people in Narva who their leader was. Their answer? Vladimir Putin.

    "If Putin would say to this population - you should do something hostile - then no-one knows what will happen," Raag said.

    [​IMG]
    Estonia recently held its largest-ever war gaming exercise
    For his part, Putin throws his hands up at such talk. He told an interviewer earlier this month, "Only an insane person and only in a dream can imagine that Russia would suddenly attack Nato."

    The Estonians are not betting on his sanity. They recently held their largest-ever war games and are one of the few countries to meet its Nato commitment to spend 2% of GDP on defence. They've also launched a campaign to bolster what they call the country's "psychological defences" against Russian misinformation. It includes civics classes in schools and a new Russian-language TV station... with a studio in Narva.

    The campaign's success will be measured over years. Meanwhile, if Putin does want to cause trouble inside Nato, he's got material to work with.

    Listen to Neal Razzell's radio documentary, Estonia's Russian Problem, on Assignment, on the BBC World Service. You can find transmission times on the same page.

    Subscribe to the BBC News Magazine's email newsletter to get articles sent to your inbox.

    http://www.bbc.com/news/magazine-33258667


    Bonus:
     
  13. jouni

    jouni Senior Member Senior Member

    Joined:
    Jul 29, 2014
    Messages:
    3,900
    Likes Received:
    1,136
    Location:
    finland
    Lets see what the smart brains at fsb/gru/vdv come up regarding Narva. I bet it is tougher nut to crack than Prague '68, Kabul '79, Vilnius '91, Krim '14 and Donetsk '14....or Georgia '08
     
    apple likes this.
  14. Cadian

    Cadian Regular Member

    Joined:
    May 5, 2014
    Messages:
    824
    Likes Received:
    790
    Location:
    Russia, Ryazan
    USA said Russia will "attack" Baltics, that means it "will". After 08/08/08 Georgia, they said Ukraine will be next. So did happened. Pro-American coups in both countries are just coincidences, which do not worth a discussion.

    http://www.washingtontimes.com/news/2008/oct/12/europes-next-war/?page=all
     
  15. jouni

    jouni Senior Member Senior Member

    Joined:
    Jul 29, 2014
    Messages:
    3,900
    Likes Received:
    1,136
    Location:
    finland
    Quite accurate article. I am sorry that you see this as a US vs Russia hegemony fight. With that logic, your neighbors have only bad choices: stay poverish and corrupt, or become Russias enemy.
     
  16. Cadian

    Cadian Regular Member

    Joined:
    May 5, 2014
    Messages:
    824
    Likes Received:
    790
    Location:
    Russia, Ryazan
    No, this is YOUR logic, not mine. YOU say that keeping ties with Russia is equal to "stay poverish and corrupt", even when there is example of Ukraine as the most fresh one. I don't understand you, I don't understand at all.
     
  17. jouni

    jouni Senior Member Senior Member

    Joined:
    Jul 29, 2014
    Messages:
    3,900
    Likes Received:
    1,136
    Location:
    finland
    I was this week three days in Russia. We have a cross border program of transferring know-how. I can clearly see that in many fields you are 20-30 years behind EU. You and Ukraine BOTH need co operation with EU to close the gap. You need co operation, not concepts of spheres of influence from hundred years ago. This is 2015, not 1937.
     
  18. rock127

    rock127 Maulana Rockullah Senior Member

    Joined:
    Aug 12, 2009
    Messages:
    9,337
    Likes Received:
    12,971
    Location:
    India
    Huh :confused1:

    Who created the above map?
     
  19. Cadian

    Cadian Regular Member

    Joined:
    May 5, 2014
    Messages:
    824
    Likes Received:
    790
    Location:
    Russia, Ryazan
  20. pmaitra

    pmaitra Moderator Moderator

    Joined:
    Mar 10, 2009
    Messages:
    33,274
    Likes Received:
    19,486
    Location:
    EST, USA
    EU is going to collapse, but not before that pathetic excuse of a currency regime called EuroZone. The myth of European values had already collapsed when European countries took the help of their prostitutes in boosting GDP. :lol:
     
    rock127 likes this.

Share This Page