NAL Saras, Regional Transport Aircraft (RTA) & Hansa Project

[biswaranjanrath.sipu]

Rather adding a refuelling probe will be a better option.

 

[hitesh]

Rather adding a refuelling probe will be a better option.

 

[sgarg]

Some Light weight Tubrofans instead of Turbo-prop ..

SARAS `S trubo-prop specification >>

Pratt & Whitney Canada PT6

Type: Turboprop
Length: 62 in (1,575 mm)
Diameter: 19 in (483 mm)
Dry weight: 270 lb (122.47 kg)
Air mass flow: 5.3 lb (2 kg)/second

The weight problem may be related to general technological issues (alloys, fabrication issues etc.). Aircraft manufacturing is a complex business. It requires significant research and manufacturing infrastructure. Even a simple plane like Saras proves to be difficult as a lot of manufacturing processes are required even for this type of plane.

Another reason could be lack of utility due to its short range.

 

[Kunal Biswas]

We don`t know about its range yet compare to other aircraft of its own class ..

 

[Zebra]

We don`t know about its range yet compare to other aircraft of its own class ..

Page 11 of ..........http://www.nal.res.in/pdf/saga-main.pdf

III. A Little About SARAS :

.....SARAS is a multi-role aircraft, pressurized for passenger comfort and is ca-
pable of flying upto a maximum speed of 550 Km/ hour at a cruise altitude of
7.5 km. It is designed to take off and land on short semi-prepared runways, which
exist in large numbers in India. It has advanced design features like modern state
of the art avionics, carbon fibre composite control surfaces, low drag wing, low
cabin noise because of rear-mounted turbo-prop engines, etc. The range varies
from 500 km to 2000 km depending upon the payload (500 km for 14 pax, 800 km
for 12 pax, 1400 km for 8 pax, 1700 for 6 pax and 2000 km ferry range with only
one crew)......

 

[sgarg]

The plane with 14 pax (1600 kg load) has only 500km range. I think this plane is not suitable for maritime recon as such plane requires higher range with similar payload.

The empty weight is too high compared to gross weight.

 

[sgarg]

We don`t know about its range yet compare to other aircraft of its own class ..

NAL has not been forthcoming with information. So the best guess is that the plane is not able to achieve design parameters.

 

[Kunal Biswas]

Thanks for sharing @Casper ..

PT3, and it will not fly until after NAL has test flown the modified PT1, he adds. The third prototype is about 500 kg (1,100 lb.) lighter than the original Saras,The new Saras will still be powered by Pratt & Whitney Canada PT6 engines, but NAL has limited the thrust. The lower thrust will reduce fuel burn, Chetty says, adding that the aircraft has no need for so much thrust.

Source : India's Modified Saras To Have Test Flight Soon | Defense content from Aviation Week

--------------------

The original design included a maximum take-off weight of 6,100kg and a maximum payload of 1,232kg. The first prototype which completed its maiden flight on May 29, 2004, was overweight at 5,118kg compared to the 4,125kg design specifications.

Source : Saras may fly in a fortnight - The Times of India

---------------------

I think they are focused on reducing weight ..

The plane with 14 pax (1600 kg load) has only 500km range. I think this plane is not suitable for maritime recon as such plane requires higher range with similar payload.

The empty weight is too high compared to gross weight.

 

[sgarg]

Let us say empty weight is 4600kg. Assuming the plane has fuel capacity of 1200kg and useful load capacity of 1600kg, we are looking at 4600+2800 = 7400 kg gross weight.

Since the engines can provide more thrust than needed, the higher weight is not a problem. So it is only a question of slightly enlarging and strengthening the wings.

 

[Raj Malhotra]

I think that NAL should be directed to collaborate with some Indian Pvt Sector company like Mahindra or TATA and bring Saras upto speed. Inspite of massive handholding, JVs and imported components, NAL & HAL have done everything possible to mess it up. I wonder if any possible excuse for delay except "Holy Cow" ate up the drawings is left.

 

[kstriya]

After 16 Years and Rs 300 Crore, Civil Aircraft Dream Crashlands

Published January 20, 2016


SOURCE: EXPRESS NEWS SERVICE



India’s most ambitious civilian aircraft project has been given a quiet burial. Rs 300 crore was spent on the project, started way back in 1999 to build an indigenous 14-seater aircraft that was expected to put India in the big league and pave the way for the development of bigger passenger airplanes in future.

Bengaluru-headquartered National Aeronautics Limited (NAL) has stopped all work on Saras, the mutli-role aircraft that was named after the Indian crane. The planes already built have remained grounded and those working on the project have been redeployed.

NAL is part of the Council for Scientific and Industrial Research (CSIR) headed by the prime minister.

Confirming that work on the project has been completely stopped, NAL director Shyam Chetty told Express: “Funding for the project stopped from December 31, 2013, but the work went on much beyond. Eventually, we had to stop the work when we ran out of lab funds. It was a Rs 300 crore project.”

“People who were working on the Saras project were redeployed for other projects where skills sets required are similar as NAL takes up lots of work in the strategic sector,” he said.

The aircraft made its maiden flight in 2004, but the project has always been plagued with glitches. Weight was a major concern as the aircraft was overweight by 1,000 kg. In fact, during the maiden flight, all seats except three — for two pilots and a flight test engineer — were removed to bring down the weight.

A turning point for the project was when a Saras aircraft on test flight crashed in 2009, killing two pilots and a flight test engineer from the Indian Air Force. IAF’s Aircraft and Systems Testing Establishment located close to the HAL airport in Bengaluru was conducting tests and the aircraft was carrying out an ‘engine relight’ procedure when it crashed. The project never fully recovered from that crash.

The Director General of Civil Aviation (DGCA) came out with a report 18 months after the crash. “The DGCA report made it clear that there were no problems with the aircraft or its design. However, those heading CSIR at that point were not too keen on the project, so it never received the kind of encouragement it should have got,” a former NAL officer who was associated with the project told Express. “The flight testing resumed in 2012. But, we had only one aircraft.”

The IAF had evinced keen interest in the aircraft as it could have been used to train its transport pilots. NAL was also hoping to find other buyers as the aircraft was being built for multiple roles. There was even a plan to develop a 80-seater plane based on Saras’ success.

“This was India’s first project to design and develop a civilian aircraft. At one point, around 600 people, including those from NAL, Hindustan Aeronautics Limited (HAL) and private sector were working on it,” the former NAL officer said.

“Now, all that work seems to have gone for a waste as the aircraft and the infrastructure created for the purpose are rendered useless.” Currently, two aircraft – one fully built and the other nearly complete – are parked at NAL’s Belur campus in the city.

NAL had built two aircraft and was in the process of making a third one using composite materials to reduce the weight. Saras also flew at air shows in the city. In fact, NAL was able to address the weight issue to some extent in the third aircraft that never took to the skies. In the second one, they used a more powerful engine. Saras aircraft were powered by Pratt and Whitney engines.

The NAL director still seemed hopeful that the project may be revived in future. “Even now we are maintaining the aircraft and we hope that the project will be revived,” he added. Those in the know of the developments, however, are not that optimistic. According to them, the message from the government is very clear – it is not willing to invest in a project that is taking far too much time.

Sources said NAL officials recently gave a detailed presentation to Science and Technology Minister Harsh Vardhan, who is also vice-president of CSIR. “The minister did not give any assurance,” a source said.

 

[kstriya]

WTF, this project should be brought to its conclusion. We can spend thousands of crore rupees on other projects with time delay and our scientific community has come out with respectable results. The research done on Saras could be utilized in an indigenous passenger aircraft..

 

[Shaitan]

WTF, this project should be brought to its conclusion. We can spend thousands of crore rupees on other projects with time delay and our scientific community has come out with respectable results. The research done on Saras could be utilized in an indigenous passenger aircraft..

Seriously, I have heard they were going to fly it again like 4 years ago. If they have no urgency to get this work, can this.

 

[aditya g]

This is precisely the conclusion that this project deserves. I hope that NAL is wound up or merged with hal as well.

WTF, this project should be brought to its conclusion. We can spend thousands of crore rupees on other projects with time delay and our scientific community has come out with respectable results. The research done on Saras could be utilized in an indigenous passenger aircraft..

 

[HariPrasad-1]

Bad news. Revive it and make it operational.

 

[kstriya]

300 crores is peanuts for India, we should invest in this project. Let private sector be part of this project. We will need at least 200 regional aircrafts in next decade which will be brought from western producers a big loss of forex. We need this project to succeed even the armed forces will need to replace the Dornier and small AN's.

 

[kstriya]

Saras Headed For Project Cancellation?

Published February 3, 2016


SOURCE: SP Guide Publications



Six years after a fatal crash of the second prototype aircraft, the Saras light civil aircraft programme could be headed for closure if sources are to be believed. After several stops and starts, it is likely that the prototypes may still fly, though the future of the project is almost definitely sealed. After a six-year grounding following a devastating March 2009 crash that killed its three-man IAF test crew, the National Aerospace Laboratory, in coordination with the IAF’s Aircraft & Systems Testing Establishment (ASTE) have failed to muster enough confidence to put the aircraft back in the air.

As reported earlier by SP’s, the ASTE had begun ground trials of the modified PT1N platform around December last 2013, and has undergone a rigorous routine of ground handling, turning and taxi trials, including static systems trials. Former NAL chief and aerospace guru Prof. Roddam Narasimha recently spoke out about the various programmes, and said that the proposed the Regional Transport Aircraft (RTA) could spearhead a much needed new wave in Indian capabilities alongside the Saras.

“It should be a turbo-prop aircraft, executed in a public-Private Partnership (PPP) mode, preferably as part of a global consortium, and should be viewed as a common “civil-military” platform that would also address the transport aircraft needs of the Indian Air Force in terms of the Avro and AN-32 replacements, thus generating the numbers and associated economic viability needed to make it successful,” he said. The Saras technologies, however, could be infused into other programmes including the regional transport aircraft and national civil aircraft.

 

[kstriya]

Saras Headed For Project Cancellation?

Published February 3, 2016


SOURCE: SP Guide Publications



Six years after a fatal crash of the second prototype aircraft, the Saras light civil aircraft programme could be headed for closure if sources are to be believed. After several stops and starts, it is likely that the prototypes may still fly, though the future of the project is almost definitely sealed. After a six-year grounding following a devastating March 2009 crash that killed its three-man IAF test crew, the National Aerospace Laboratory, in coordination with the IAF’s Aircraft & Systems Testing Establishment (ASTE) have failed to muster enough confidence to put the aircraft back in the air.

As reported earlier by SP’s, the ASTE had begun ground trials of the modified PT1N platform around December last 2013, and has undergone a rigorous routine of ground handling, turning and taxi trials, including static systems trials. Former NAL chief and aerospace guru Prof. Roddam Narasimha recently spoke out about the various programmes, and said that the proposed the Regional Transport Aircraft (RTA) could spearhead a much needed new wave in Indian capabilities alongside the Saras.

“It should be a turbo-prop aircraft, executed in a public-Private Partnership (PPP) mode, preferably as part of a global consortium, and should be viewed as a common “civil-military” platform that would also address the transport aircraft needs of the Indian Air Force in terms of the Avro and AN-32 replacements, thus generating the numbers and associated economic viability needed to make it successful,” he said. The Saras technologies, however, could be infused into other programmes including the regional transport aircraft and national civil aircraft.

Another dumb decision if news correct, I wish if one private sector company could be roped in and sell at least 30 aircrafts to IAF

 

[Abhi9]

NAL SARAS spotted in IAF colors doing ground runs . PIC credit-Bharat Rakshak
IT seems that funding that was frozen around 2013 might have come through Modi's Make in India initiative. May be we will hear something soon. New propeller can be seen

 

[sasum]

NAL SARAS spotted in IAF colors doing ground runs . PIC credit-Bharat Rakshak
IT seems that funding that was frozen around 2013 might have come through Modi's Make in India initiative. May be we will hear something soon. New propeller can be seen

How old is this picture? Is it before the cancellation of the project? If Saras is revived, there surely be mention in mainstream media.