Kolkata Class Destroyers Update

[sayareakd]

i can see three ships

 

[J20!]

Israel should quickly supply Barak missile system to the Indian Navy so that these projects can be completed as early as possible. Otherwise we would be a laughing stock in front of chinese bloggers in this forum.

Come on dude. We're not as immature as we're made out to be. Well I'm not at least.

If it really were just the Barak systems missing, wouldn't INS Kolkata have begun sea trials already? HMS Daring began sea trials long before their Sea Viper SAM system came online, because MBDA hadn't ironed out all the bugs in their Aster 15's and 30's. Why isn't the Kolkata going out to sea to test the hundreds of other systems and sub-systems it operates?

 

[Payeng]

Weapon woes put Navy's modernisation programmes on hold

A fresh hunt for heavy torpedoes for its new line of warships and a setback in the delivery of new destroyers has the Indian navy reeling under pressure of delay in major modernisation programmes.

The process to acquire new torpedoes was set rolling recently after the first attempt to purchase the weapon got embroiled in controversies.

With Finmeccanica's conduct in the VVIP helicopter deal for the Indian Air Force coming under scanner, questions have been raised over the company's participation in other contracts though no punitive action has been taken against it by the government so far.

Acquisition

The acquisition of torpedoes was held back because the front runner, Black Shark torpedo, was being made by a Finmeccanica subsidiary called WASS.

Even though the ongoing $300 million project to procure 98 torpedoes has not been cancelled officially, the navy has issued Request for Information (RFI), re-launching the process to procure the weapons.

An evaluation committee had given an "all clear", but despite that the project had not moved further.

The German rival Atlas Elektronik had also raised questions about Black Shark's selection.

Sources said a fresh process of induction was initiated so that the torpedoes could be made available for all the warships and submarines in the pipeline – including Project 75(Scorpene), 15A (Kolkata class destroyers), 15B (follow on of Kolkata class

At the moment, navy warships are equipped with old Russian heavy torpedoes. The new torpedoes were also to be integrated with the French Scorpene submarines under construction.

Even as the torpedo issue was being sorted out, the navy was hit by the delay in project 15A for the construction of three Kolkata class destroyers.:fkidding:

The first ship of the class, being constructed at Muzgaon Dock Limited (MDL) in Mumbai, was scheduled to be delivered in July.

But technical problems were detected during the sea trials of the destroyers – the largest warships to be constructed and designed at MDL.

It is estimated that the project has been delayed by at least six months as the new destroyer would now be made available only by early 2014.

Project 15A, under which three destroyers have to be built, is already running two years behind schedule.

The revised deadline for the delivery of first ship was mid-2013. The project was going on track keeping up with the revised deadline but the snag was detected during the sea trials of the ship.

Weapon woes put Navy's modernisation programmes on hold | idrw.org

 

[WMD]

i can see three ships

well its a shipyard, so probably a lot of ships are there.
But I can distinguish only one Kolkata DDG.
The 2nd arrow which u have pointed, IMO points to the aft radar(BEL RAWL 02).
Besides the aft radar the other things that can be distinguished from the pic is a Oto Melara main gun, probably a 76mm gun in a stealth cupola though I hope its a Oto Melara 127/64 LW gun.
the silhouettes of AK-630 CIWS are also visible and the russian RBU-6000 are also in place. If the MF STAR has been mounted then I can't seen any of its faces, so I'd say its still not mounted.
Lastly even if we assume that these pics are indeed of Mar'13, still its not clear which of the 3 ships this one actually is. Its entirely possible that another ship of the class is more complete. So let's wait till July/Aug and the picture will be clearer.

 

[arnabmit]

well its a shipyard, so probably a lot of ships are there.
But I can distinguish only one Kolkata DDG.
The 2nd arrow which u have pointed, IMO points to the aft radar(BEL RAWL 02).
Besides the aft radar the other things that can be distinguished from the pic is a Oto Melara main gun, probably a 76mm gun in a stealth cupola though I hope its a Oto Melara 127/64 LW gun.
the silhouettes of AK-630 CIWS are also visible and the russian RBU-6000 are also in place. If the MF STAR has been mounted then I can't seen any of its faces, so I'd say its still not mounted.
Lastly even if we assume that these pics are indeed of Mar'13, still its not clear which of the 3 ships this one actually is. Its entirely possible that another ship of the class is more complete. So let's wait till July/Aug and the picture will be clearer.

 

[arnabmit]

None of the combat systems have been installed, it isn't even finished being painted.

And what is the source of your insider news?

Yeah, you can build it, but you can't fit it out.

Says who? If we cant then who will?

Delay result of babus not contracting or budgeting for subsystems... again shipyards unable to fit them out.

Tech and management was outsourced to DCNS. So it is a DCNS failure through and through.

Three examples of inability to indigenously fit out hulls you build.

If you want to debate, then please come up with credeble sources to your claim. Else please stop making weird statements.

 

[Armand2REP]

And what is the source of your insider news?

The photo of an unfitted hull missing comms, data link, nav and relay antennas.

Says who? If we cant then who will?

Says Italy... Whoever you hire to come in and finish it.

Tech and management was outsourced to DCNS. So it is a DCNS failure through and through.

Really??? The MDL material package was only signed in December. It took FinMin 8 years to realise they need sensors, propulsion, periscopes and torpedoes.

If you want to debate, then please come up with credeble sources to your claim. Else please stop making weird statements.

Please come with something to refute, you can't because these are facts.

 

[arnabmit]

For the Kolkata class destroyers, they have already undergone SATS. Some defects were found, so they are back in harbor. Please check facts.

Do you have any links of India hiring Italy to finish IAC?

I have no problem in being proved wrong if you can provide any credible links.

The photo of an unfitted hull missing comms, data link, nav and relay antennas.



Says Italy... Whoever you hire to come in and finish it.



Really??? The MDL material package was only signed in December. It took FinMin 8 years to realise they need sensors, propulsion, periscopes and torpedoes.



Please come with something to refute, you can't because these are facts.

 

[Shaitan]

Well, this is how they looked in 2011. Two of them have the MF-STAR on. But I think its only the shell, because its empty in recent pics.

 

[Shaitan]

And it's not just the Barak 8. All of Indian ships are consistently SLOW after the hull is launched. Look slow Shivalik class, Kamorta class, are after launch.

 

[Armand2REP]

For the Kolkata class destroyers, they have already undergone SATS. Some defects were found, so they are back in harbor. Please check facts.

Do you have any links of India hiring Italy to finish IAC?

I have no problem in being proved wrong if you can provide any credible links.

Uh... Kolkata still doesn't have a single activated unit. It takes MDL 160 months to activate a destroyer while DCN does it in 70. That is a fail in anyone's book.

I never said they would... it would most likely be DCNS since Italy is on the shit list.

I have no problem being proven wrong if you can provide any credible links, but that would kind of hard for you since it takes India twice as long as any Western shipyard to activate a ship.

 

[TrueSpirit]

Do you have any links of India hiring Italy to finish IAC?

Well, India bought only the Air-Defence-Ship design by Fincantieri, Italy. Not sure, if that is being used though.

 

[arnabmit]

Maybe I am not understanding you correctly... What do you mean by "not a single activated unit"? I told you, all the lead ship went for SATS... that's sea trials, some faults were found, so its back in the dock for correction. same correction is being applied to the other 2 units as well. Also, till the time Barak 8 comes in, all the sensors and sensitive equipment are kept dismounted from the hull so that they do not undergo weather corrosion.

Once Barak 8 comes in, it would take approx just 3 months integration to go for the final SATS & WATS.

Uh... Kolkata still doesn't have a single activated unit. It takes MDL 160 months to activate a destroyer while DCN does it in 70. That is a fail in anyone's book.

I never said they would... it would most likely be DCNS since Italy is on the shit list.

I have no problem being proven wrong if you can provide any credible links, but that would kind of hard for you since it takes India twice as long as any Western shipyard to activate a ship.

 

[TrueSpirit]

It's a fact that Indian shipyards are slow in launching, activating & commissioning ships. Do we need to reiterate the reasons....but still, we have some of the best & most heavily-densely armed platforms in the region, when compared to our adversaries.

 

[natarajan]

but we need to improve and hope antony gets this things into his mind

 

[Armand2REP]

Maybe I am not understanding you correctly... What do you mean by "not a single activated unit"? I told you, all the lead ship went for SATS... that's sea trials, some faults were found, so its back in the dock for correction. same correction is being applied to the other 2 units as well. Also, till the time Barak 8 comes in, all the sensors and sensitive equipment are kept dismounted from the hull so that they do not undergo weather corrosion.

Once Barak 8 comes in, it would take approx just 3 months integration to go for the final SATS & WATS.

All of them didn't go for sea trials.

In all, sensors and equipment were never installed.

 

[abingdonboy]

The latest news I have from a freind I the defence industry who will be attending the P-15A commisioning (he attends all such events) is that the date is set for mid/late August 2013. Within the next few weeks the BARAK 8s will be delivered from Israel. It remains to be clear whether these will be fitted prior to the ship's commisioning or a few weeks/months later but he tells me the IN are 100% certain the system will be onboard before the end of 2013- all the wiring is in place, it is simply a case of "plugging in" the VL-cells.

Bare in mind the T-45 class of RN destroyers were launched, commissioned and even deployed on patrols without CIWS so it is not unheard of for a ship of this size to be commissioned without certain weaponry.



Wrt delays- yes the likes of the P-17,P-15A and IAC-1 have all been plagued by delays but be certain their predecessors will all be completed in a fraction of the time- this is a certainty. The likes of the P-17 and P-15A were built using traditional methods- the P-17A and P-15B will make use of modular construction techniques, the IAC-1 faced very specific and unique circumstances that led to delays most notably a road traffic collision that wrote off one of the ship's gearboxes that added many months if not years onto the project as these are bespoke products and thus a replacement was not available for a LONG time. Needless to say such freak accidents will not happen in the future.

As Indian shipyards gain expertise, expand, revamp and pump in capital the only way is up and construction timelines being slashed.

 

[abingdonboy]

Uh... Kolkata still doesn't have a single activated unit. It takes MDL 160 months to activate a destroyer while DCN does it in 70. That is a fail in anyone's book.

I never said they would... it would most likely be DCNS since Italy is on the shit list.

I have no problem being proven wrong if you can provide any credible links, but that would kind of hard for you since it takes India twice as long as any Western shipyard to activate a ship.

It only takes India twice as long RIGHT NOW because India is still using outdated methods of construction and Indian shipyards have never worked on such complex projects such as the P-17,P-15,IAC-1 and the likes. Western shipyards have the luxury of decades of such expertise in their pocket and are all using the latest construction methods.

India is still playing catchup just like on the tank and fighter a/c front. Have no doubt though that India will catch up sooner rather than later.


Understand this bro-everyone has to start somewhere and if it was easy everybody would do it!!

 

[Armand2REP]

It only takes India twice as long RIGHT NOW because India is still using outdated methods of construction and Indian shipyards have never worked on such complex projects such as the P-17,P-15,IAC-1 and the likes. Western shipyards have the luxury of decades of such expertise in their pocket and are all using the latest construction methods.

India is still playing catchup just like on the tank and fighter a/c front. Have no doubt though that India will catch up sooner rather than later.


Understand this bro-everyone has to start somewhere and if it was easy everybody would do it!!

Start somewhere? It only took 120 months to activate the Delhi class. You are going backwards.

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[natarajan]

india is just started with shipbuilding unlike european or usa who were doing it for centuries,just from 2000 we have started constructing little sophisticated ships,but it needs to avoid this kind of problem but issue is netas are not worrying and just concentrating on coming back to power in 2014