DRDO, PSU and Private Defence Sector News

[Azaad]

No, 50.5% and 49.5% are the share of ownership of this company, that are the original investments from the 2 parties. The indigenous ratio or who contributes what components are daily operational issue. As an independent entity, the company can purchase any component from anyone. The different suppliers will only affect the product quality and financial performance of the company. As long as Brahmos is still produced by this JV, as the share holder of this JV, Russians will always be entitled to 49.5% of the profit.

Quoting Uncle Han here to highlight a few points.
The entire JV was conceived coz in the 1990s following the collapse of the USSR, for from Russia's PoV, they desperately needed money to monetise their defense industry by bringing to fruition their various ideas & projects conceived during the Cold War . The Russians approached the Chinese with the same aim in mind.

From our PoV, we needed a jump start to our defence ecosystem by targeting sophisticated projects which otherwise would be well beyond our reach & pocket requiring years of trial & error before we reached some sort of maturity in these systems.

The JV right since its inception was plagued by problems of work share as per the agreement signed where the Russians usually reneged from sharing information or curtailing our workshare requiring frequent interventions by both Delhi & Moscow which is why this JV could deliver as opposed to the PAKFA / FGFA which was plagued by similar problems which we couldn't reconcile.

The aim was always to master not just the design but also know why & know how of the various vital sub components of the entire system in due course of time which unfortunately got prolonged way more than we expected it to be, which is why the payoffs for the Russians apart from their share of the profits in the JV was substantial royalties with every assembly & component we indigenised.

This is precisely why you'd see substantial escalation in the costs of the very same Brahmos variant which inflation or fluctuations of forex couldn't justify & I'm referring to the recent past , say a decade ago, not what we may have procured 15 or 20 years ago.

This is also precisely why the costs of the same variant of Brahmos will record substantial escalation in this decade itself as we near closer to the 100 % indigenization mark which would involve our production of the RAMJET either from complete transfer of know how & know why or substantial amounts of it as the Russians who'd been turning down our requests for it over the decades now no longer have that kind of bargaining power & are / will be increasingly cash strapped going ahead .

You'd see the same being reflected in our increasing indigenization of the MKI & other Russian platforms & armaments which was inconceivable before the Ukraine war brushing aside Russian objections. The best part is they can't accept Dollars & we won't pay them in yuans. Those profits & royalties would be paid for in INR & / or UAE dirhams.

Sweet revenge for the constant milking & blackmail the Russians have subjected us to since the past 5-6 decades which turned especially ugly during the Admiral Gorshkov / INS Vikramaditya saga & the sub par navalised MiG-29Ks forced down our throats which marked the beginning of the end of our Russian romance.

 

[Samej Jangir]

Ukraine-Russia war is like god given signal to India. Who knows without that, how much more Russian maal would we induct in future.

The main reason for using Russian items is their TOT & willingness to allow India to reverse engineer. Russia does not impose restrictions and inspection regime like the USA which makes it better. India has been buying & indigenising Russian weapons for a long time

 

[Samej Jangir]

Quoting Uncle Han here to highlight a few points.
The entire JV was conceived coz in the 1990s following the collapse of the USSR, for from Russia's PoV, they desperately needed money to monetise their defense industry by bringing to fruition their various ideas & projects conceived during the Cold War . The Russians approached the Chinese with the same aim in mind.

From our PoV, we needed a jump start to our defence ecosystem by targeting sophisticated projects which otherwise would be well beyond our reach & pocket requiring years of trial & error before we reached some sort of maturity in these systems.

The JV right since its inception was plagued by problems of work share as per the agreement signed where the Russians usually reneged from sharing information or curtailing our workshare requiring frequent interventions by both Delhi & Moscow which is why this JV could deliver as opposed to the PAKFA / FGFA which was plagued by similar problems which we couldn't reconcile.

The aim was always to master not just the design but also know why & know how of the various vital sub components of the entire system in due course of time which unfortunately got prolonged way more than we expected it to be, which is why the payoffs for the Russians apart from their share of the profits in the JV was substantial royalties with every assembly & component we indigenised.

This is precisely why you'd see substantial escalation in the costs of the very same Brahmos variant which inflation or fluctuations of forex couldn't justify & I'm referring to the recent past , say a decade ago, not what we may have procured 15 or 20 years ago.

This is also precisely why the costs of the same variant of Brahmos will record substantial escalation in this decade itself as we near closer to the 100 % indigenization mark which would involve our production of the RAMJET either from complete transfer of know how & know why or substantial amounts of it as the Russians who'd been turning down our requests for it over the decades now no longer have that kind of bargaining power & are / will be increasingly cash strapped going ahead .

You'd see the same being reflected in our increasing indigenization of the MKI & other Russian platforms & armaments which was inconceivable before the Ukraine war brushing aside Russian objections. The best part is they can't accept Dollars & we won't pay them in yuans. Those profits & royalties would be paid for in INR & / or UAE dirhams.

Sweet revenge for the constant milking & blackmail the Russians have subjected us to since the past 5-6 decades which turned especially ugly during the Admiral Gorshkov / INS Vikramaditya saga & the sub par navalised MiG-29Ks forced down our throats which marked the beginning of the end of our Russian romance.

I agree with first part that the JV was mostly a means of paying Russia good money to help its economy while also getting needed technology to India. But the 2nd part regarding Ukraine war is absurd. India had already indigenised Su30s by FY2015 when engines were indigenised. Su30 itself was a project of progressive indigenisation & nothing to do with Su30. Russian even leased Akula submarines in 2000s despite not facing any wars. This shows that Ukraine war has no effect. Even Brahmos was indigenised to a good extent by 2020 itself, much before the Ukrainian war

 

[Samej Jangir]

The issue wasn't the quantity but the fact that we import from the US as I recall it.

USA is not a net exporter of oil. Yes, it is net exporter of Natural gas. But in terms of oil, USA is a net importer. The sales done by USA is merely an exchange of grades & convenience of shipping due to 2 reasons:
1) USA produces ultra light oils from shale field while in conventional fields, it produces medium grade. It is better to sell the grades which are in excess than put extra efforts in refining due to cost
2) It is better to ship to foreign countries rather than transport using rail from East to West coast & vice versa due to costs.

But if you look at total quantity of oil imported vs exported, USA is net importer. It is the thick canadian tar sands which is the excess import quantity

 

[Chinmoy]

What does it mean in layman terms?

In layman terms, ADE is doing insurance for the manufacturer of the UAV in case of a crash or accident of the system.

 

[NoobWannaLearn]

In layman terms, ADE is doing insurance for the manufacturer of the UAV in case of a crash or accident of the system.

Do we know for which UAV?

 

[patriots]

Do we know for which UAV?

Only 2 active uav project s with ade
1. Tapas
2. Archer ng

 

[NoobWannaLearn]

 

[Smoothbore125mm]

these are looking good but there is very big problem they are indian made

 

[DumbPilot]

Posting this here for its relevance to our scenario for tomm some wise guy in either the services or DRDO may well conceive the bright idea of developing these items.

On the flip side, doesn't this have use once the EW equipment blocking GPS is taken care of? Infact, even as a preemptive strike, these may find a LOT of use when GPS blocking equipments are not put up in the first place.

In a scenario with an enemy like Pak/China, our armed forces are not as incompetent or handicapped as Ukraine's. Making a low collateral SDB can be a great asset: because it can be carried in more numbers per sortie and because it is precise due to GPS.

 

[Samej Jangir]

On the flip side, doesn't this have use once the EW equipment blocking GPS is taken care of? Infact, even as a preemptive strike, these may find a LOT of use when GPS blocking equipments are not put up in the first place.

In a scenario with an enemy like Pak/China, our armed forces are not as incompetent or handicapped as Ukraine's. Making a low collateral SDB can be a great asset: because it can be carried in more numbers per sortie and because it is precise due to GPS.

Obviously, guided bombs have their own use. India also ahs many variants of guided bombs. However, the civilian GPS guidance is not really useful against strong adversary. Military GPS which likely changes frequency regularly like AESA can be useful. But USA does not give it to Ukraine for fear of being monitored & studied by Russia

 

[Arihant Roy]

Tender for integration of RIII with Su-30MKI.

 

[patriots]

 

[Arihant Roy]

Not the proper thread to post this but since there was some discussion on Abrams, Challenger 2 and Leo 2A6, I thought might as well post here.

According to GarupanH, Abrams M1A2 turret has inferior protection to KE vs T-90A.


610 mm RHA vs 900+ mm RHA

UK MoD figures put M1A1 KE figure at 650 mm RHA.

Depending on the angle of impact, the T-90A's turret front composite armor can be equal to 900 mm-960mm against APFSDS and 1,250mm-1,450mm against HEAT. These figures are inclusive of K5 ERA.

Infact, both Challenger 2 and Leo 2A6 don't fare well when it comes to armour protection of both turret and glacis vs T-90A.


Dorchester used by Chally 2 offers 550 mm RHA vs KE and 1000 mm vs HEAT.


Indian T-90S uses improved version of Kanchan as the composite NERA filler vs the original Russian insert.

 

[SwordOfDarkness]

1

Not the proper thread to post this but since there was some discussion on Abrams, Challenger 2 and Leo 2A6, I thought might as well post here.

According to GarupanH, Abrams M1A2 turret has inferior protection to KE vs T-90A.


610 mm RHA vs 900+ mm RHA

UK MoD figures put M1A1 KE figure at 650 mm RHA.

View attachment 250359

View attachment 250361

Depending on the angle of impact, the T-90A's turret front composite armor can be equal to 900 mm-960mm against APFSDS and 1,250mm-1,450mm against HEAT. These figures are inclusive of K5 ERA.

Infact, both Challenger 2 and Leo 2A6 don't fare well when it comes to armour protection of both turret and glacis vs T-90A.


Dorchester used by Chally 2 offers 550 mm RHA vs KE and 1000 mm vs HEAT.


Indian T-90S uses improved version of Kanchan as the composite NERA filler vs the original Russian insert.

AFAIK Abrams has much more protection than quoted, esp in turret - Hull is a known weak point, both upper and lower plates, atleast untill M1A2SepV3.
IIRC frontally its around 900 mm, plus its side protection is mmuch higher than Russian tanks.

 

[Smoothbore125mm]

do anyone knows the status of :
drdo aip
p75a
prahaar ballistic missile
project kusha
ak203 production
luh
more powerful engines developed for rustum/archer ng

 

[Arjun Mk1A]

do anyone knows the status of :
drdo aip
p75a
prahaar ballistic missile
project kusha
ak203 production
luh
more powerful engines developed for rustum/archer ng

DRDO AIP -- Will be going to be fitted in Kalvari Class during its refit. (Undergoing Testing)
P75A - No Public information available. But lot of building blocks are getting ready.
Prahaar - Prahaar is older version. Pralay is the new toy and we are acquiring them.
Project Kusha - Some tender started, I think.
AK203 - Highly classified. But few pics circulating regarding the AK203.
LUH - LSP
Rustom/Archer ng - No idea.

 

[Smoothbore125mm]

DRDO AIP -- Will be going to be fitted in Kalvari Class during its refit. (Undergoing Testing)
P75A - No Public information available. But lot of building blocks are getting ready.
Prahaar - Prahaar is older version. Pralay is the new toy and we are acquiring them.
Project Kusha - Some tender started, I think.
AK203 - Highly classified. But few pics circulating regarding the AK203.
LUH - LSP
Rustom/Archer ng - No idea.

why is ak203 classified though its just a rifle to be used by army and nothing much in it is state of the art i guess

 

[Arjun Mk1A]

why is ak203 classified though its just a rifle to be used by army and nothing much in it is state of the art i guess

IRRPL is the Schrodinger AK plant. We can assume either the production is going on nor there is no production, as a result of its fate being linked to a random subatomic event that may or may not occur

 

[Blood+]

1

AFAIK Abrams has much more protection than quoted, esp in turret - Hull is a known weak point, both upper and lower plates, atleast untill M1A2SepV3.
IIRC frontally its around 900 mm, plus its side protection is mmuch higher than Russian tanks.

I heard somewhere that the front turret armor blocks in the latest trenches of Abrams now weighs more than a block of RHA of equivalent volume!! So of course, the base armor will have superior protection value as compared to the base armor of T-90A of 90s vintage. But when you add the heavy ERA into the equation (assuming they do work), they won't be too far off.
I wonder how protective our locally sourced T-90S are since those have different armor package.