Treasure worth over 1 Lac crore unearthed from padmanabhaswamy temple vault

[ganesh177]

1-lakh crores is 10 billion or 20 billion?? Brain is stuck.

22.4 billions is the gold price. Antique value in my guess will go beyond 80 billion.

 

[ganesh177]

I am not comfortable with the idea of giving the control of that treasure to the trustees of the temple ? What credibility they have ? Its not there personal wealth.
I wud suggest give govt the control of that treasure and use it for developing infrastructure, eradicating poverty by creating jobs.

 

[ganesh177]

That was 'to the point' but ive avoided that because its far easier to persuade people of what a charitable god would do rather than telling them outright that god doesn't exist and take away the wealth for better use.



Don't count on BBC showing it anytime soon.

I agree that artifacts should be preserved but regular gold items should be melted and used for development.

Melting the artifacts ? No offence, but thats foolish.

Let me explain, if there is a antique item worth 10 rs of gold, melting it will only give you 10 rs. But auctoning it internationally might give you 25, 30, 35 considering its antique value. And then using that say 30 rs for development, will make good business sense.

 

[Sabir]

Hindus decide what is sacrosanct and how many follow it.

In our places this is one of the most widespread belief and inviolable law governing temples.




Good move. Temple money should not be exposed to commercial purposes.

Agreed. Hindus should decide what is sacrosanct for them. Muslims will decide what is sacrosanct for them...so on...

The question remains HOW? How can we assume what you are saying is the opinion of all Hindus. Or you want to term all those opposing you as heretics? An old policy of the so-called defenders of faith....


About preserving the treasure it must be under control of the Government. Yes, there is risk because of corrupt people there. But the same risk is there if it is put under any Trust. Is there any guarantee some of the assets has not been already syphoned off or it will not happen in future....

Melting or Auctioning the treasure is a foolish idea. They should remain as they are. Government should issue AAA bonds backed by the trasures. As they are backed by real assets these bonds will have highest rating. And government has ample means to honour the bonds. (There are already so many bonds in market). The money should be utilised for long terem infrastructure development like roads, irrigation, education etc. Note, when such huge fund is injected in infrastructure it generates huge scope for employment. That in turns increase purchasing power of newly employed people which again boost up economy.

Nationalisation of all surplus asset of all religious organisation is preferable. Religious organisation should do what they are for. Education, infrastructure, upliftment of poors etc is not their business.

Yes, we are worried by the present state of corruption by the Babus and Netas...but that does not justify we will confuse what is responsibility of government and what is of someone else.....

 

[JBH22]

Vatican which is a state in its proper right has a proper banking system with more money than has been found to finance the growth and religious activities of Catholics.
We all know how Baptist church in USA have made lots of money so does Jehovah Witness they all have proper structure to finance and enhance growth of their churches.

Muslims get Petro dollars its not oblivious to anyone that funds to finance construction of Mosque once I've been to Mauritius some Sheikh goes there and gives millions to finance his religion.

Now I don't know the fuss about this treasure but I firmly believe this money should be spent for the advancement of Hindus not to be given to state where part of this money might go subsidise others..

 

[Virendra]

Now I don't know the fuss about this treasure but I firmly believe this money should be spent for the advancement of Hindus not to be given to state where part of this money might go subsidise others..

I disagree. Why only Hindus, because it was found in a temple? This is not someone's deliberate donation to a temple. Its a treasure.
Though it may have accumulated in one, we no longer live in dynasty empires. Being a secular society it goes to the society, regardless of the religion.
If the direct involvement of state is not relied upon, it can be put under a trust well represnted by the responsible figures from various parts of the society. But definitely not for just one religion.
Sadly the situation could soon be extremely volatile if there is a disagreement at socio political level about its ownership and use.

Regards,
Virendra

 

[JBH22]

I disagree. Why only Hindus, because it was found in a temple? This is not someone's deliberate donation to a temple. Its a treasure.
Though it may have accumulated in one, we no longer live in dynasty empires. Being a secular society it goes to the society, regardless of the religion.

The day we get treasure from a church or mosque and the same reasoning is applied then let's see but in the mean time its for Hindus

If the state is not relied upon for its use, it can be put under a trust well represnted by the responsible figures from various parts of the society. But definitely not for just one religion.
Sadly the situation could soon be extremely volatile if there is a disagreement at socio political level about its ownership and use.

Found in Hindu temple meant for Hindus for me its plain simple

 

[Virendra]

Temple is to worship, not to decide ownership of a treasure. Its money without an owner; is treasure - plain simple.
I don't deny the possibility that there'd be reservation from Christians/Muslims if something like this is found in a Church or Mosque tomorrow. However it doesn't alter my stand. I still believe it is to be for the whole society (regardless of where its found) and not just one religion.

Regards,
Virendra

 

[KS]

Did i mention hindu temple in my post ?

The thread is about treasure in a Hindu temple. So don't fault me for assuming anything.

I said break down all hidden chambers and distribute to poor...wealth rotting away in utter wastage when many people die due to hunger in our country.

Again there is a word called Heritage in English vocabulary. You dont sell your "Heritage". Simple.

what would god do ? keep money in hidden chambers or distribute to poor.

How many days the poor will sit and eat the money. God also will not want anyone getting a free lunch. Let them work and eat.

it was also tradition for wife to be burned along with husband...why has it been banned and accepted by you ? it was also tradition to not touch lower caste...why has it been banned and accepted by you ?

god doesn't give two shits about money and tradition argument is bs.

There is a difference between social traditions and religious traditions. Sati is a social tradition that became outdated by the 19 th century and had to be done away with. Religious traditions will not become out of date anytime.

Get that.

 

[JBH22]

Temple is to worship, not to decide ownership of a treasure. Its money without an owner; is treasure - plain simple.
I don't deny the possibility that there'd be reservation from Christians/Muslims if something like this is found in a Church or Mosque tomorrow. However it doesn't alter my stand. I still believe it is to be for the whole society and not just one religion.

Regards,
Virendra

The state or central govt has no MORAL right to take over this treasure but then I agree the treasures should go to a National museum but then since it has been found in a Hindu temple this money should go to help poor Hindus or for the maintenance of that temple

 

[KS]

I am not comfortable with the idea of giving the control of that treasure to the trustees of the temple ? What credibility they have ? Its not there personal wealth.
I wud suggest give govt the control of that treasure and use it for developing infrastructure, eradicating poverty by creating jobs.

According to Indian law the Trustee or the Head Tantri is the caretaker of the temple properties on behalf of the Lord.

Idols have been recognised to be juristic persons in Hindu law, which personifies the deity as a legal person. A Hindu idol is recognised by courts as a juristic entity having a judicial status, and its interests are attended to by a person who is in charge of the deity and who under law is its guardian or manager.

The property in question belongs to the idol as a juristic person and the possession and management of the same are vested with the guardian or the manager.

Link

Moreover the Trustees of the Temple have taken proper care of the treasure for centuries..There is no place for doubting their integrity.

 

[KS]

Melting the artifacts ? No offence, but thats foolish.

Let me explain, if there is a antique item worth 10 rs of gold, melting it will only give you 10 rs. But auctoning it internationally might give you 25, 30, 35 considering its antique value. And then using that say 30 rs for development, will make good business sense.

Sorry to say but your idea of auctioning is equally foolish.

You don't talk commercial terms on Lord's property. That treasure has enormous amount of cultural,religious, heritage value for Hindus and you just dont do anything you wish with them.

Those religious treasures must be preserved for posterity.

Credit for the below post - Chachachoudhary from IDF.

Dude my post was sarcastic. Now, tell me have we exhausted all our resources that we now depend on temple properties to be sold for welfare of people. You claim to be a Hindu. Now, do you know why gold offerings are made to presiding deities? Do you know that every Hindu temple housing "Kuladevata" has its treasure of varying amount. Do you know why it is important for Hindus to do this. Remember, even under our constitution HINDUS have full right to practice their religions with all their beliefs and customs.

As I have already said, instead of laying its hand on the so carefully preserved treasures of a temple, govt should try to recover the black money in the system, get it from the swiss accounts, confiscate the properties of corrupt politicians, mafias, and when govt has exhausted all these options, it should make an appeal to the hindu community to donate the temple property.

Is it not ironic that when trillions of dollars are lying around with the full knowledge of a puppet prime minister and a malignantly corrupt ministers, we are talking about temple properties for welfare of people.

Tell me when govt can honour agreements made with maharaja of Kashmir and preserve article 370 for kashmir, agreement with Nizam of hyderabad, then why should govt. not honor the agreement made with royal family of travancore which guaranteed independent autonomous functioning of this temple? Should Hindus be taken for granted?

Let govt dissolve all agreements relating to kashmir, confiscate all properties belonging to mosques, churches, gurudwaras, and buddhist stupas and then think of temple property.

On the other hand, hindu temples have been utilizing the cash offerings for various welfare schemes.

 

[KS]

The question remains HOW? How can we assume what you are saying is the opinion of all Hindus. Or you want to term all those opposing you as heretics? An old policy of the so-called defenders of faith....

Just follow the Religious Traditions that your forefathers cherished. Simple. I mean Religious tradition, not social traditions which need to evolve with time.

About preserving the treasure it must be under control of the Government. Yes, there is risk because of corrupt people there. But the same risk is there if it is put under any Trust. Is there any guarantee some of the assets has not been already syphoned off or it will not happen in future....

Because the Temple Trust has taken care of this treasure for centuries with utmost care and moreover the Supreme Court has also taken an inventory of the items. Maybe they can be audited once in 5 years or so. But the control of the treasure must not in any case go to the Government.

That will spell doom for the Lord's treasure.

Melting or Auctioning the treasure is a foolish idea. They should remain as they are. Government should issue AAA bonds backed by the trasures. As they are backed by real assets these bonds will have highest rating. And government has ample means to honour the bonds. (There are already so many bonds in market). The money should be utilised for long terem infrastructure development like roads, irrigation, education etc. Note, when such huge fund is injected in infrastructure it generates huge scope for employment. That in turns increase purchasing power of newly employed people which again boost up economy.

All this looks good, but as I said and continue to say the Lord's money cant be used for any commercial purposes and these not only have a religious significance but an immeasureable amount of cultural and heritage value.

I cant fathom how minds can even think of doinf something with these precious artifacts and that too discovered in a temple ?

Nationalisation of all surplus asset of all religious organisation is preferable. Religious organisation should do what they are for. Education, infrastructure, upliftment of poors etc is not their business.

Yes, we are worried by the present state of corruption by the Babus and Netas...but that does not justify we will confuse what is responsibility of government and what is of someone else.....

Why fix a system that is not broken and is working smoothly ?

Today the different temple trusts run an awesome amount of charity work from free educations, subsidized higher education, multi-specialty hospitals from the assets they have and it seems to be working well for the people ? Why nationalize it and damage them ?

 

[KS]

I disagree. Why only Hindus, because it was found in a temple? This is not someone's deliberate donation to a temple. Its a treasure.
Though it may have accumulated in one, we no longer live in dynasty empires. Being a secular society it goes to the society, regardless of the religion.
If the direct involvement of state is not relied upon, it can be put under a trust well represnted by the responsible figures from various parts of the society. But definitely not for just one religion.
Sadly the situation could soon be extremely volatile if there is a disagreement at socio political level about its ownership and use.

Regards,
Virendra

Ofcourse the trust will contain only Hindus. What nonsense is this ?

Why should a Xian or a Muslim be even included in a 'Temple' trust to manage the assests of the Lord whom they dont even recognize as Lord ?

When Hindus are nominated to manage the Waqf or the Parish properties you may expound this argument..Till then there will be no takers for such an absurd,malicious idea.

Temple is to worship, not to decide ownership of a treasure. Its money without an owner; is treasure - plain simple.
I don't deny the possibility that there'd be reservation from Christians/Muslims if something like this is found in a Church or Mosque tomorrow. However it doesn't alter my stand. I still believe it is to be for the whole society (regardless of where its found) and not just one religion.

Regards,
Virendra

The possiblity is less than finding camels in Antarctica. Don't kid yourself mate.

This treasure is plioan and simple the Lord's property and as per Indian constitution should be managed by the Lord's legal representative on earth - the Head Tantri of the Temple.

 

[KS]

sel delete

 

[KS]

While there is no bar on spending the treasure found in Sree Padmanabhaswami Temple for public welfare, only the temple authorities, including the erstwhile Maharaja of Travancore, is competent to decide how it should be spent, according to the former Chairman of the Indian Council of Historical Research, M.G.S. Narayanan.

Speaking to The Hindu on Tuesday, Dr. Narayanan welcomed Kerala Chief Minister Oomen Chandy's statement that the treasure belonged to the temple. He said Mr. Chandy deserved appreciation for foiling attempts by certain vested interests to create confusion in the minds of people about the ownership of the treasure.

Claims being made by self-styled experts and historians were not based on documentary evidence. They were coloured by political and communal bias, he said.


There was documentary evidence to prove that the treasure belonged to the temple. The Travancore Manual, prepared by Nagamayyah in the early 20 thcentury, made it clear that the temple administration was under the management of "ettara yogam" (a group of eight-and-half persons), and this was interpreted by many historians to mean eight Brahmins and a member of the Travancore royal family.

Dr. Narayanan read out passages from the manual, which said the temple enjoyed annual revenue of Rs.75, 000, and it was independent of the government. The manual also indicated that the temple coffers contained huge quantities of money, gold and precious stones, being "offerings of ages."

"There can be no doubt about the ownership of the temple and its wealth. Only the temple authorities, including the former Maharajah of Travancore, can decide how its money could be spent," he said, according to documents studied by scholars.

However, Dr. Narayanan conceded that the instrument of accession governing Travancore's integration with the Indian Union was not examined to find out if there was anything relevant to this issue. He felt that unlike several temples from where huge caches of gold and other valuable were plundered, the valuables kept in the vaults of Sree Padmanabhaswami Temple and a few other temples in other parts of the State remained beyond the reach of invaders because they could not get past the Western Ghats. Another reason was that no one, including the king, dared to steal temple property those days since it was widely considered a heinous sin.

Dr. Narayanan believed that the treasure must be offerings from devotees as well as from the king himself. Besides his usual offerings to the deity, the king also made offerings to atone for the grabbing of the valuables by his army from less powerful kings and their wealthy subjects in neighbouring places during armed invasions that were not unusual those days.

However, he said, it would not be correct to contend that since the temple wealth included valuables seized during conquests, it should be treated as "people's money." This was because all valuables, including those from the king, became temple property once they were offered to it.

Rubbishing the claim that the treasure should be brought under the purview of the Indian Treasure Trove Act, Dr. Narayanan said only unclaimed valuables came under its ambit. "The valuables belonged to the temple, which is a private property of which its deity is the legal entity. Its authorised trustees who manage its affairs are the competent authority to decide how its wealth should be spent."

The Hindu : News / National : Treasure belongs to temple, says M.G.S. Narayanan

 

[Virendra]

Ofcourse the trust will contain only Hindus. What nonsense is this ?
Why should a Xian or a Muslim be even included in a 'Temple' trust to manage the assests of the Lord whom they dont even recognize as Lord ?
When Hindus are nominated to manage the Waqf or the Parish properties you may expound this argument..Till then there will be no takers for such an absurd,malicious idea.
The possiblity is less than finding camels in Antarctica. Don't kid yourself mate.
This treasure is plioan and simple the Lord's property and as per Indian constitution should be managed by the Lord's legal representative on earth - the Head Tantri of the Temple.

I don't think money is an asset of the Lord. If it is, he wouldn't want it for himself anyways or for only a fraction of his pupil.
That money is sans owner and I don't see any reason to assign religious tag to it. Money found in such a manner is to help the society and the poor, but not on religous lines.
If it was hard earnt money of a hindu who deliberately wants to spend it on his religion or caste no body can challenge that, but such is not a case here. No one knows who earned it and how. And there is no malice in my idea. I'm only talking of the greater good here.

Edit: As said above, if that money is proven as accumulated donation of ages, temple trust has to decide how to spend it. If the case is otherwise, there has to be a neutral committe for the same.

 

[KS]

KOCHI: The opening of the cellars at the Sree Padmanabha Swamy Temple seems to have opened up a fresh controversy.

Taking a Uturn from his earlier stance, Justice C S Rajan the observer appointed by the Supreme Court for the inventory of the treasure trove on Tuesday evening claimed that he did not disclose any details regarding the valuables found in the cellars of the temple.

Justice Rajan told reporters here on Tuesday that the treasure might belong to the temple as it had been presented to the deity by the rulers of the erstwhile Travancore kingdom. So, it did not come under the Treasure Trove Act. He said that he was wonderstruck at the sight of precious stones, gold and silver in the cellars. On opening the B cellar, which is believed to be the richest of all, Rajan said a decision could be taken only after seeking the opinion of the chief priest of the temple and others. Unlike the other cellars, opening the B cellar might be a difficult task as it was situated inside the Nalambalam, he said and added that there was not any trench connecting the cellars and the sea, as was widely believed.

He said the details of each valuable had been recorded in a scientific method. But the exact value of the treasure might vary from the figures that appeared in the media, he said. "The Supreme Court has not asked us to assess the value of the treasure," he said. In the evening, however, he took a Uturn following criticisms from some corners on his public statements.

Rajan told Express that he had not divulged any details regarding the value of the treasure. "I said nothing on the issue. I just said I stood awestruck at the sight of the treasure," Justice Rajan said. "We will file our report to the apex court, that's all," he said.

Kerala: Justice Rajan makes a U-turn | Sree Padmanabhaswamy temple | | The New Indian Express

 

[KS]

I don't think money is an asset of the Lord. He wouldn't want it anyways.
Money found in such a manner is to help the society and the poor, but not on religous lines.
If it was hard earnt money of a hindu who deliberately wants to spend it on his religion or caste no body can challenge that, but such is not a case here. No one knows who earned it and how.

It is the case. It is the Lord's property.Period.

Please read the earlier posts.

Moreover no one needs to dictate to the Temple trust (which is the legal care-taker of the Lord's property) as to spend on what. They know better.

Do you know that the money from Sabarimala Temple is used to finance Haj subsidy in Kerala when the Temple itself has not enough facilities to look after the devotees. Why should any Hindu allow such an act ? Do the Waqf properties are used in any welfare schemes for the Hindus ?

Sorry but your statement does not have any legal/moral merit and is just full of emotion and is biased by the Macaulay mindset that Hindus are to be taken for granted, Well not anymore.WE KNOW OUR RIGHTS AND WILL ASK FOR OUR POUND FOR FLESH.

We don't want a rupee from the Waqf or the Parish properties.Just leave our treasures alone for the Temple to take care of it.

 

[JBH22]

I don't think money is an asset of the Lord. He wouldn't want it anyways.
Money found in such a manner is to help the society and the poor, but not on religous lines.
If it was hard earnt money of a hindu who deliberately wants to spend it on his religion or caste no body can challenge that, but such is not a case here. No one knows who earned it and how.

Then can you claim that it was non Hindu who put this treasure in a Hindu Temple come on do not be delusional in order to maintain a facade of secular. A Vishnu Statue was found there its certainly not a christian or muslim who would have made it and kept it in a Hindu temple,its plain logic

It is the case.

Please read the earlier posts.

Moreover no one needs to dictate to the Temple trust (which is the legal care-taker of the Lord's property) as to spend on what. They know better.

Do you know that the money from Sabarimala Temple is used to finance Haj subsidy in Kerala when the Temple itself has not enough facilities to look after the devotees. Why should any Hindu allow such an act ? Do the Waqf properties are used in any welfare schemes for the Hindus ?

Sorry but your statement does not have any legal/moral merit and is just full of emotion and is biased by the Macaulay mindset.

That's because Hindus have got the habit of accepting all this sh!t