MMRCA news and discussions.

[khatarnak]

Furthermore, it is not advisable to rely only on single country for your sourse of defence equipments.

 

[AJSINGH]

IAF is not considering only the cost of the equipment. They are considering the cost of the equipment in its whole life. IAF's past experience is not good in terms of spares. Russian equipments are cheap but overall cost of life is not that much cheap.



Sorry sir, I know that we have invested in Brahmos by 50%. But Russians were not provided the tech of their part on time. They DID delay in ToT.

I did not say that ToT was not completed for T90, I just said that it was delayed. Understand the words first.

What would you say about Gorshkov?? I doubt that the conditions may remain the same and they will delay the induction of MMRCA as well.

cost is an issue .IN cannot afford new ac worth 8-10 billion dollars and wait for 7-10 years . Russian will very diliver Mig 35 on time because they know that IAF does not depend on russian weapons anymore .

 

[ppgj]

Furthermore, it is dangerous to rely only on single country for your sourse of defence equipments.

indian armed forces still have russian equipment to almost 80% of their inventory. what is dangerous about it?

 

[AJSINGH]

Furthermore, it is dangerous to rely only on single country for your sourse of defence equipments.

we are buying weapons form other countries too , for example Israel , now USA . what i am trying to say is better stick with russia when it comes tof ire power . and we are doing it . keep USA and israle happy in international market by transport or a2a refullers etc . American foregin policy is very shaky they will spare no time in chaning attitude towards inida , if india goes againt their wishes in international market

 

[khatarnak]

American foregin policy is very shaky they will spare no time in chaning attitude towards inida , if india goes againt their wishes in international market

I do agree with you. no US fighter aircraft........
Thanks for your opinion about US policy.

 

[khatarnak]

indian armed forces still have russian equipment to almost 80% of their inventory. what is dangerous about it?

i did not mean that it is dangerous.... i wanted to say that we should not stick to only one country.

 

[ppgj]

i did not mean that it is dangerous.... i wanted to say that we should not stick to only one country.

it does not matter whether you depend on one or two. what you need is those who can stand by you all the time and their equipment meets the requirements of our armed forces.

 

[StealthSniper]

Furthermore, it is dangerous to rely only on single country for your sourse of defence equipments.

Ah, we relied on the Russians for like 30 years and so far we are still friends with them. From what I have been reading, their has been alot of talk about this and that but no evidence to prove it. If you are going to say something prove it, and don't say this or that just to make yourself feel better. Give a link or source and then we can have a basis to go from.

And I will comment on your earlier post.

 

[Sridhar]

because freach themselves say so . if u know more can u provide us with more information ? plus already russian second variant of ZHUK will entre filght test and production , have u heard anything about french asea radar
that is called intelligent guess . not like yours pointing out other mistake. if u have anything to add plz do otherwise hold your opinions

people are supporting rafale but it is the most expensive jet at fly away cost plus radar is not better than the ZHUK ASEA radar

---------------------------------------------

Originally Posted by AJSINGH

people are supporting rafale but it is the most expensive jet at fly away cost
​

Wrong! Typhoon is the most expensive aircraft in the MMRCA competition.

plus radar is not better than the ZHUK ASEA radar
​

Do you have a link that says so?
---------------------------------------------------
Originally Posted by enlightened1

Wrong! Typhoon is the most expensive aircraft in the MMRCA competition.

Do you have a link that says so?

-----------------------------------------

​

freanch radar is not et fully developed , even french say so , whereas ZHUK radar is in the second variant development phase . we dont know much about french radar anyway but we do of russian radar and some intelligent guess work can ne made , which points that russian radar is as of now superior

can u provide a link to prove me wrong ?

------------------------------------------------------

Originally Posted by AJSINGH

freanch radar is not et fully developed , even french say so , whereas ZHUK radar is in the second variant development phase . we dont know much about french radar anyway but we do of russian radar and some intelligent guess work can ne made , which points that russian radar is as of now superior

can u provide a link to prove me wrong ?
​

If you claim something , you should back it up when asked.How you came to a conclusion when you don't know much about French Radar.
Sell your intelligent guess work somewhere else.

And watch your spelling mate.

------------------------------------------------------------------

Originally Posted by Sridhar

If you claim something , you should back it up when asked.How you came to a conclusion when you don't know much about French Radar.
Sell your intelligent guess work somewhere else.

And watch your spelling mate.
​

can you prove me wrong ?

----------------------------------------------------

It is You claimed Rafale's RADAR is not better than Zhuk RADAR , When enlightened1 asked you said it is your intelligent guess(crap) , even though you don't know much about that French radar.

When i pointed it out as a MOD you are asking me to prove it . Why Should we.

It is You started it , So You have to prove your claims.

And moreover don't preach me , What i should DO.

 

[khatarnak]

Ah, we relied on the Russians for like 30 years and so far we are still friends with them. From what I have been reading, their has been alot of talk about this and that but no evidence to prove it. If you are going to say something prove it, and don't say this or that just to make yourself feel better. Give a link or source and then we can have a basis to go from.

And I will comment on your earlier post.

Fully agreed with you. I am just focusing on the recent experiences we had with russians. I am not opposing the russians or their equipments but our recent experiences are not good.

 

[StealthSniper]

well, i do not prefer russian aircraft after considering the following recent deals with russia. i believe they are not much reliable in terms of keeping their own words.

1. admiral gorshkov (failed to deliver on time, rised price toooo much)
2. brahmos (ToT)
3. MBT T90 (ToT which delayed production at avadi)
4. delay in delivering aircrafts for AWACS
5. delay in upgradation of Migs
:thumbs_thmbdn:

1. If you read around and study the initial contract on the Gorshkov, the indian side also didn't assess the work that needed to be done on the carrier to make it sea worthy for another 30 years. And the rise in price is because the Russians are replacing everything and nothing comes for free. And the failure to deliver on time is a fault of both countries. India wants better stuff, Russia can do it but it changes things.

2. What's wrong with the Bhramos. Who the heck is going to give you the technology Russia gave India when it comes to cruise missiles. Yes it might of been a little delayed but again we might have gotten nothing so I don't see what your getting at.

3. Again at the end of the day we are using the tanks and they work fine. Delays happen with any defence contract but we gained alot of information and everything is fine. I don't see America giving us armor technology for the Abrams.

4. Again we got the AWACS and we got the technology. I don't see how a delay in anything makes Russia a bad partner. Sure they could of made thing faster but it's our first AWACS and we are learning as we go.

5. You have to also remember Russia is still getting back on it's feet in regards to upgrading their own production lines. Russia is slowly trying to modernise it's facilities and I think that's why they probably had the delays they did. But from what I see everything that has been delivered works fine, and I'm sure the Russians will work with the Indians considering they have for a long time.

 

[AJSINGH]

people are supporting rafale but it is the most expensive jet at fly away cost plus radar is not better than the ZHUK ASEA radar

---------------------------------------------

Originally Posted by AJSINGH

people are supporting rafale but it is the most expensive jet at fly away cost
​

Wrong! Typhoon is the most expensive aircraft in the MMRCA competition.

plus radar is not better than the ZHUK ASEA radar
​

Do you have a link that says so?
---------------------------------------------------
Originally Posted by enlightened1

Wrong! Typhoon is the most expensive aircraft in the MMRCA competition.

Do you have a link that says so?

-----------------------------------------

​

freanch radar is not et fully developed , even french say so , whereas ZHUK radar is in the second variant development phase . we dont know much about french radar anyway but we do of russian radar and some intelligent guess work can ne made , which points that russian radar is as of now superior

can u provide a link to prove me wrong ?

------------------------------------------------------

Originally Posted by AJSINGH

freanch radar is not et fully developed , even french say so , whereas ZHUK radar is in the second variant development phase . we dont know much about french radar anyway but we do of russian radar and some intelligent guess work can ne made , which points that russian radar is as of now superior

can u provide a link to prove me wrong ?
​

If you claim something , you should back it up when asked.How you came to a conclusion when you don't know much about French Radar.
Sell your intelligent guess work somewhere else.

And watch your spelling mate.

------------------------------------------------------------------

Originally Posted by Sridhar

If you claim something , you should back it up when asked.How you came to a conclusion when you don't know much about French Radar.
Sell your intelligent guess work somewhere else.

And watch your spelling mate.
​

can you prove me wrong ?

----------------------------------------------------

It is You claimed Rafale's RADAR is not better than Zhuk RADAR , When enlightened1 asked you said it is your intelligent guess(crap) , even though you don't know much about that French radar.

When i pointed it out as a MOD you are asking me to prove it . Why Should we.

It is You started it , So You have to prove your claims.

And moreover don't preach me , What i should DO.

fair enough. do u know more about french radar technology. last time i checked. i proved my claims by saying that russian radar is ahead because the second variant is in test flight stage . whereas even the first variant of french radar is not yet in rafales in french air force . wat we do not know about french radar is the detection range or how many targets it can track and engage . so my guess is pretty accurate unless more someone sheds more imformation on french radar
and i proved my claims . now your turn to prove me wrong ?

 

[enlightened1]

freanch radar is not et fully developed , even french say so , whereas ZHUK radar is in the second variant development phase . we dont know much about french radar anyway but we do of russian radar and some intelligent guess work can ne made , which points that russian radar is as of now superior

AJSingh the onus is on you to provide a link, because you were making an outlandish claim without proof. As Sridhar has said nobody asked you for your supposedly intelligent guess. I'll take that as a failure in providing sufficient proof. The requirement in the tender is that the fighter should have an aesa radar. The rafale wouldn't have made it past the technical evaluations if it didn't have an aesa radar.

because freach themselves say so . if u know more can u provide us with more information ? plus already russian second variant of ZHUK will entre filght test and production , have u heard anything about french asea radar
that is called intelligent guess . not like yours pointing out other mistake. if u have anything to add plz do otherwise hold your opinions

Once again you blow more hot air than substance. It will be better if you could attach a few strings to your balloons instead of making claims you can't back with facts & asking everyone else to provide links. It takes the standard of the forum down

If you like others spoon feeding you so much, enjoy it while you're at it.

Dassault will send two Rafales equipped with the new generation active electronically scanned array (AESA) radars for flight trials to India in September, the head of military aircraft, Eric Trappier said.

"India is a marathon, not a sprint," he said, referring to India's international tender for 126 medium range multi-role combat aircraft.
here

 

[Sridhar]

fair enough. do u know more about french radar technology. last time i checked. i proved my claims by saying that russian radar is ahead because the second variant is in test flight stage . whereas even the first variant of french radar is not yet in rafales in french air force . wat we do not know about french radar is the detection range or how many targets it can track and engage . so my guess is pretty accurate unless more someone sheds more imformation on french radar
and i proved my claims . now your turn to prove me wrong ?

common , I expected more form you . You had enough of your time.

Just because there is a second variant for the Russian radar , The French one has become inferior? Is it just about naming a variant?

You don't know about the detection range , how many targets it can track and engage , yet your intelligence knows it is inferior.

You proved your intelligence here , nothing else.

 

[Vladimir79]

If you like others spoon feeding you so much, enjoy it while you're at it.

Still doesn't say squat about the actual specs of Rafale's radar. We know Zhuk-AE's inside and out. RBE2 is a mystery. That is a little peculiar considerng it is being developed by Thales.

 

[enlightened1]

Still doesn't say squat about the actual specs of Rafale's radar.

But I never claimed that I knew the specs of the RBE-2. I was just showing AJSingh that the RBE-2 was fully developed..as he was claiming the opposite.

We know Zhuk-AE's inside and out. RBE2 is a mystery.

So? Don't tell me that just because the specs of the RBE-2 are unknown that it becomes less capable than the Zhuk.

That is a little peculiar considerng it is being developed by Thales.

Point being?? We already know that both radars have passed the technical evaluations..successfully.

 

[Vladimir79]

But I never claimed that I knew the specs of the RBE-2. I was just showing AJSingh that the RBE-2 was fully developed..as he was claiming the opposite.

So? Don't tell me that just because the specs of the RBE-2 are unknown that it becomes less capable than the Zhuk.

Point being?? We already know that both radars have passed the technical evaluations..successfully.

Point being we know Zhuk-AE comes with weather mapping mode. RBE-2 does not based on the modes listed and most likely doesn't since all the other competitors were taken by suprise. Considering that is an RTF requirement, it is not ready.

 

[Sridhar]

Point being we know Zhuk-AE comes with weather mapping mode. RBE-2 does not based on the modes listed and most likely doesn't since all the other competitors were taken by suprise. Considering that is an RTF requirement, it is not ready.

This is not confirmed yet. Igorr (Defunct Humanity Blogger) has himself said this .

I have posted it here already in the same thread.

 

[enlightened1]

Intersting stuff from Shiv Aroor's blog:

 

[Vladimir79]

Nice brochure that we have seen before... no details.