Know Your 'Rafale'

[Indx TechStyle]

Have you ever seen Jack and the Beanstalk? Rafale is the Beanstalk. JF-17 is the little termite Jack stepped on to get to it.

Though I know that you don't know about me but I have been familiar with your posts and knew that you were inactive. So, welcome back my friend.

Secondhand F-16's are just better than even new Rafale's, in term of quality, measures and operational permutes wartime and in every perspective it's better than this.

Range Winner: F-16
The F-16 can fly 280 nautical miles farther than the Dassault.

Relative to Class Averages:
Fighter Plane: 869.5 nm

Rafale: +1,130.5 nm

F-16 : +1,410.5 nm

Wrong it's f-18 super hornet which can be called better than Rafael in some physical aspects. It's far more advanced than F-16 fighting falcon.

And for range, both are going to play different roles as India has, planning to buy and developing other fighter planes with longer ranges to penetrate deep.

US general praises PAF pilots’ skills

I don't think you need any certificate from USA about your skills.
It's same as that when Sri Lankans were jumping because Indians praised them in a naval exercise.
Another pakistani member was badly insulted over this. I hope you won't repeat the same. Be proud of your country because of own merits and not certification from others.

Pakistan received 40 batches of fresh su-35's,

I have warned you earlier man. Don't propagate false news.
Sukhoi 35 is yet to be exported to any country and it's first customer is going to China by end of 2016.
Pakistan has even not completed negotiations for it plus it's an expensive machine for your country.

How can you receive it without signing the deal?
It's simply false.

 

[Pulkit]

Yes mate!!!!

Dekho mate, military exercises tu hu gain aab bus unki dukan seh shopping kerni baqi hain

Shopping k liye rokda bhi chahiye hota hai....udhaari mnai chalti....

Of course, these costs would be in the billions, but I think we would some how persuade them or will try some sudden arrangements to negotiate a deal in terms of discounts a little much than expected. But, if the oil prices rose chances are less. But, I am still hoping

Please share an insight how you plan to pay to any of it.... you must be having something in mind..... Koi khajana haath lagne wala hai kya???

Mate, anything can be possible as Russia has joined hands with Pakistan as a friend, after a long long time. So, our military, army personnel has gone there for these discussions regarding military equipments, and so there this exercise which is going on was also discussed there, and today they just arrived and we warmed welcome them. Yes, you are right, without signing a deal, it's not possible, but good way gesture can be possible. So, they lease some 5 su-35 of them as friendship gesture on basis of normal payback. Hope so.

Su-35???? oh ok.... keep up the hopes....

 

[Indx TechStyle]

Mate, anything can be possible as Russia has joined hands with Pakistan as a friend, after a long long time.

Mark my words, nobody is your friend, just national interests.

Take advantage suck up the blood like a mosquito as much as you can and then, follow up other till you yourself reach their levels.
That's called the Foreign Policy.

 

[Filtercoffee]

After the su-24 debacle with Turkey what do you think the Russian federation should apply it's resources to help the pakistan state?

 

[Bahamut]

Real aspect: Regarding real aspect, every country is trying to become enough defensible from inside, that's what I have learned much from Russia our new friend. :biggrin2:

You just had a single exercise with them ,just get off the sky now.Russia public said that it support the India version of the attack.Relationship building take years ,not a few months .Russia Pakistan relationship has just started.You are no where close to being friends ,especial since your support for Wahhabi extremist

 

[Indx TechStyle]

Yeah, you are right mate, both countries such as America and Russia has somehow that policy for competing with each other in arm's selling race and opening arms market where they see the chances are high of profit. Countries like us suffer and get caught in their net.

Real aspect: Regarding real aspect, every country is trying to become enough defensible from inside, that's what I have learned much from Russia our new friend. :biggrin2:

Other country in the similar league is China.
For India, we just invest your half in percentage on Defense Procurement in percentage and decline it every year (still high and increases in numbers, economy is fast. LOL.).
Share of Defense imports was cut down by 25% (now targeted for 60% more) and exports doubled.
India will soon be one of largest arms buyers and sellers at the same time.
I don't think Pak stands anywhere in space tech.
So, India can enter the league after crossing $5 trillions, with more defense budget, scientific research budget, developmental and space budget.

 

[SANITY]

Yes mate!!!!

Dekho mate, military exercises tu hu gain aab bus unki dukan seh shopping kerni baqi hain

So the Musalman mulk understands the importance non-musalmans. Islamiyat not helping the progress of musalmans. Go on and shop.

 

[Filtercoffee]

We will see what the future holds for Pakistan and I greatly wish that your internal problems are resolved. See all the tech in the world came from somewhere, someone's mind or a collective; do you think the timeline can be that generous to a cordened off section of the old country? Since you are behind enemy lines?

 

[republic_roi97]

Mate, we know the consequences of its cost and maintenance, but what if we try only 5 to check how much it costs and what it takes into maintenance's? Then prepare budget for those 5, and then after we think to order more or less further in future.

That is just not feasible friend in that budget allocation, unless you start spending more than 20-30 billion USD on defence and then subsequently update your setup to accommodate russian hardware by spending millions if not billions. According to your point if view, which I understand, you'd go for a jet that is completely alien to your air force in terms of every components and ammunition by spending millions of dollars in upgrading your air force and then another expenditure of millions if not a billion on buying weapons system that too for just 5 aircrafts? not recommended to do so, instead you guys would be better off buying more f-16 with AESA radars or even j-10s and other chinese version of sukhoi. Not only they would come cheaper, but also you'd have to spend less in terms of upgradation of your hardware and procurement of weapons system.

Conclusion, SU-35 doesn't make any sense.

 

[Indx TechStyle]

Mate, don't worry, as 2015 was our starting. I agree, we were lacking behind, but now Pakistan’s economy continued to pick up in Fiscal Year 2015 as economic reform progressed and security improved. Inflation markedly declined, and the current deficit narrowed with favorable prices for oil and other commodities. Despite global headwinds, the outlook is for continued moderate growth as structural and macroeconomic reform deepens. Persistence will be required to overcome longstanding structural impediments to investment and enable faster growth, and mate we are embarked firmly on the path of realizing our vision to turn Pakistan into a regional hub connecting the different regions. And also mate, we are open to business and foreign investment and our economy has achieved an impressive turnaround and is poised for rapid growth( Example is CPEC) . As you know why? Because Pakistan’s economy is on an upswing as it pursues the most investor friendly policies in the region. :biggrin2:

The main advantage what Pakistan has over India is younger population and higher growth outlooks when India becomes old in next 30 years and population starts declining.
But at first place, India has a sharp edge in infrastructure, tech, international relations, laws and most important: Political Will.

BTW, please do not use word Regional. I'm sick of it. Find out global perspective.

 

[bose]

Have you ever seen Jack and the Beanstalk? Rafale is the Beanstalk. JF-17 is the little termite Jack stepped on to get to it.

Hi, after a long time !!

I was baiting him, I know the difference ... and you took it seriously...:biggrin2:

 

[aditya10r]

The main advantage what Pakistan has over India is younger population and higher growth outlooks when India becomes old in next 30 years and population starts declining.
But at first place, India has a sharp edge in infrastructure, tech, international relations, laws and most important: Political Will.

BTW, please do not use word Regional. I'm sick of it. Find out global perspective.

but by no means pakistan will be superior to india in any positive index.

 

[Screambowl]

The Rafale gets bad reviews based on three reasons, all of which will be explained here.
1. The Rafale is highly priced. This is actually due to the fact that the French Armee de l'Air (French Air Force) wanted a plane that could fit the roles of "seven planes in one" (directly translated from the words of a top ranking French official). This would explain the high price.
2. The Russians and the EU (especially the UK), the proponents of the Sukhoi Su-35, MiG 35, and the Eurofighter Typhoon are in utter disappointment over the Rafale's win in the MMRCA and want to destroy its reputation.
3. (This one "piggybacks" off of the second reason.)French company, Dassault, had originally been a part of the Eurofighter consortium before pulling out due to disagreements with other partner nations and corporations. When they pulled out, the Eurofighter-backing nations were surprised to see that Dassault had actually designed a more potent aircraft than they had and wanted to crush the Rafale's export prospects. This is why India would buy this so-called "inferior" jet.:biggrin2:.

In any case, it is technologically superiar than your Jhaant Fu**** Thunder 17

 

[Scarface]

New,or rather old , I don't know how to classify it but follow up Rafale orders are off the table quoting the Defence minister

http://timesofindia.indiatimes.com/...-match-china-experts/articleshow/54466421.cms

we also..need think about a attack jet..craft.
A-10 Thunderbolt or su-39 attack plane..what not we have..

this two plane.. is awesome.. history.. to counter enemy air defense with full ground forces.. ..
us use a-10 against both Gulf War..and Afghanistan also in War against terrorism..
same way
rus use su39 in Chechen war..,south oscetia,and Ukraine..


..and Chinese J20 is under development not success..
just like PAK-FA...stealth jet of Russia so chill.. Chinese jet wrack...

so Rafael is not great but very Usefull..more than su-30 mki.

J-20 has finished development stage,prototype stage and started serial production,it's a huge success considering China and USA are currently the only countries with 5th Gen aircraft in production.

I am yet to find single capability that J-20 can offer that makes it capable of tackling Rafale.

Regards

And you never will,the Chinese won't divulge anything regarding it's new fighter,keeping your enemies guessing is a great strategy when it comes to conventional capabilities,of course it's nothing espionage can't solve

US especially has been following J-20 closely

USAF pilots believe it's already more than a match for US 4th gen aircraft and could even match the F-22/F-35 in the future,so I don't think Rafale will do good in against the J20

https://news.usni.org/2014/11/05/u-s-pilots-say-new-chinese-stealth-fighter-become-equal-f-22-f-35

 

[Scarface]

India signs $9bn deal to buy French fighter jets
World's biggest arms importer agrees to buy 36 jets, ending 18 months of wrangling over terms.

India has signed a deal to buy 36 Rafale fighter jets from France for around $8.7bn, the country's first major acquisition of combat planes in two decades and a boost for Prime Minister Narendra Modi's plan to rebuild an ageing fleet.

The first ready-to-fly Rafales are expected to arrive by 2019 and India is set to have all 36 within six years.

French Defence Minister Jean-Yves Le Drian signed the agreement with his Indian counterpart, Manohar Parrikar, in New Delhi, on Friday, ending almost 18 months of wrangling over terms between New Delhi and manufacturer Dassault Aviation.

Parrikar said the deal would "significantly improve India's strike and defence capabilities".

Air force officials have warned for years of a major capability gap opening up with China and Pakistan without new state-of-the-art planes, as India's outdated and largely Russian-made fleet retires and production of a locally made plane was delayed.

India had originally awarded Dassault with an order for 126 Rafales in 2012 after the twin-engine fourth-generation fighter beat rivals in a decade-long selection process, but subsequent talks collapsed.

Modi, who has vowed to modernise India's armed forces with a $150bn spending spree, personally intervened in April 2015 to agree on the smaller order of 36 and give the air force a near-term boost as he weighed options for a more fundamental overhaul.

But an industry expert says the deal does not stand to benefit India.

"I don't think it's a good deal," Bharat Karnad, a research professor in national security studies at the Centre for Policy Reseach, told Al Jazeera.

"The original deal was for 126 aircrafts for a sum of $12-15bn. If you look at 36 being bought for $9bn without any transfer of technology, it ends up being a solution to ensure the health of the aviation sector in France.

"The aircrafts are far too few to have a great operation significance in war."

Al Jazeera's Natacha Butler, reporting from Paris, said there was a lot of lobbying that took place behind the scenes to make this deal happen.

"It's a big deal indeed for France and is expected to create up to 5,000 jobs here," she said.

"The 36 planes will be built here before being sent to India ready for service. At many stages, it looked as if it wasn't going to be signed but the French government and President Francois Hollande have been very instrumental and lobbied hard over the years."

'Mark of recognition'
Friday's agreement is a major vote of confidence in the Rafale, which had long struggled to find buyers overseas, despite heavy lobbying efforts by the administration of President Hollande.

Hollande hailed the deal as recognition of France's aviation industry.

"The agreement ... is a mark of the recognition by a major military power of the operational performance, the technical quality and the competitiveness of the French aviation industry," Hollande said in a statement.

India says its locally made Tejas fighter, which took to the skies in July 33 years after it was cleared for development, will form a major part of its future fleet, but Parrikar has also said that India needed 100 new light combat aircraft by 2020 to replace Russian MiG-21s.

India is the world's biggest arms importer, and despite Modi's pledge to build a local manufacturing base, foreign defence firms view India as one of the most lucrative markets as Western states trim defence budgets.

Tensions have flared up between Pakistan and India following the Uri attack last week that killed 17 soldiers in Indian-administered Kashmir.

Pakistan Prime Minister Nawaz Sharif, at his UN General Assembly address on Wednesday, said he did not want an "arms race with India". But Eenam Gambhir, India's UN diplomat called the neighbours "a terrorist state", blaming the neighbouring country of planning the attack in Uri.

http://www.aljazeera.com/news/2016/...-buy-french-fighter-jets-160923102728743.html

Rafale was a diplomatic formality because our previous government made a big offer with their wide mouths

I don't think any more will follow

 

[Scarface]

In any case, it is technologically superiar than your Jhaant Fu**** Thunder 17

There is no comparison

J-17 is 3.5gen tier aircraft,barely 4th if they modernize it,hell it's derives from a 3rd gen airframe of the MiG 21.

Rafales will swat it out of the sky

 

[Drsomnath999]

well at last very glad to see rafale deal is signed & i am more happy atleast my good efforts to collect info about rafale is not wasted .It would benefit anyone who wants to know tit bit about this great plane

welcome to IAF rafale

CHEERS

 

[ezsasa]

Incase not posted yet, break-up of the deal.....
looks like cost of the aircrafts itself is not even 50% of the deal value + 10 year maintenance support + 75% availability clause....

 

[Scarface]

Incase not posted yet, break-up of the deal.....
looks like cost of the aircrafts itself is not even 50% of the deal value + 10 year maintenance support + 75% availability clause....

View attachment 10495

I didn't just miss it,I've been looking for it for a long time and it has evaded me,

The only place I've read this split is on Facebook pages with citations of "a source inside the (insert authority here)"

Any reliable source ?

 

[ezsasa]

I didn't just miss it,I've been looking for it for a long time and it has evaded me,

The only place I've read this split is on Facebook pages with citations of "a source inside the (insert authority here)"

Any reliable source ?

picked it from shiv aroor @livefist