JF-17 Thunder / FC-1 Xiaolong

[farhan_9909]

 

[farhan_9909]

 

[sayareakd]

so after all these years how many sold to third country ? or even China ?

 

[farhan_9909]

so after all these years how many sold to third country ? or even China ?

this is a fighter aircraft not some sabji as if we could sell 2-3kg per day

Reasons

*Neither Pakistan nor china has still a grab over the world major aircraft exporters like russia,usa and france.they are older and reliable.hence it is hard for us to achieve our first export
*Sri lanka as per there media will replace order in 2013 mid
*JFT still need to be matured.its been only 5 years jft is in service
*Rafale and gripen took more than 10 years to secure first customer despite the fact that they are older into this business
*Don't expect any JFT export before 2016(when the aircraft is mature and JFT III enters service..egypt might be among the first) except sri lanka

 

[farhan_9909]

Feb. 7, 2013 - 06:35PM | By Usman Ansari
ISLAMABAD — Pakistan is integrating its nuclear-capable Hatf VII/Vengeance VII Ra'ad air launched cruise missile onto its JF-17 Thunder aircraft, but analysts are unsure if this signifies a nuclear deterrence role for the aircraft.

Air Commodore Khalid Mahmood at the JF-17 Project Management Office said integration work was ongoing with Chinese and Pakistani weapons, and that "most weapons have been integrated".

"Ra'ad and the H-4 [glide bomb] will be for the Block I and Block II" aircraft currently in or about to enter service, not just the forthcoming Block III variant, he said.

Former Air Force pilot and analyst Kaiser Tufail said, "It makes good sense to get on with the wiring as well as flight trials of these weapons on the JF-17 at this stage. For one thing, all subsequent production aircraft would have the mod integrated from the outset and there will be no need for retrofits that also result in long down times at the flight lines. Secondly, the whole process is lengthy and it was about time we started it."

He added, "Possibly, by the time the mods are in place on the JF-17, the first of the older Mirages would be retiring."

The Mirage III carries the Ra'ad and is the delivery platform for Pakistan's airborne arm of its nuclear deterrent. Its avionics were upgraded in the 1990s under the Retrofit Of Strike Element (ROSE) program.

They have been in service for many years, however, and are approaching the end of their useful lives.

Most recent major military developments have aimed to strengthen the nuclear deterrent, such as the unveiling of the Hatf IX/Nasr battlefield ballistic missile and the submarine-launched variant of the Babur cruise missile.

However, analysts are uncertain if the airborne arm of the nuclear triad is set to be similarly strengthened with the introduction of the JF-17 in this role.

Tufail said the Ra'ad's integration onto the JF-17 would be very beneficial.

"It would certainly add to PAF's [Pakistan Air Force's] stealthy ingress capability [due to low cross-section of the cruise missile], considering that the parent aircraft do not have it," he said.

However, Mansoor Ahmed, from Quaid-e-Azam University's Department of Defence and Strategic Studies, and who specializes in Pakistan's national deterrent and delivery program, is unconvinced that replacement of the Mirages with the JF-17 is imminent.

"The Mirage is a tested and well-integrated platform, it would take some time to have the Thunder in large numbers to do the job", he said.

"Secondly, how good are the Thunder's ground attack/avionics capabilities compared to the ROSE Mirages?"

Tufail, who flew the Mirage operationally, does not see the Ra'ad-capable Mirages as "less credible as a nuclear deterrent in any way."

"However, the JF-17 would certainly be a better and more modern platform, about which there should be no debate. As and when the JF-17s attain full operational capability with the Ra'ad, that role will be withdrawn from the Mirages, but that is not to mean that the Mirages would be retired — they do a lot more than just carry Ra'ads," he said.

"The Mirages would be retired as they outlive their airframe hours or run out of spares support, which I see starting to happen over the next five years or so."

Depending on the material state of the Mirage aircraft, Ahmed said they should give the PAF enough time to bring the Block III variant of the JF-17 into service, which is to have an improved avionics suite.

Mahmood said the avionics suite of the Block III variant is not yet finalized as the PAF is "looking for something to give more operational capability, and still examining avionics options."

A perennial issue for the JF-17 has been the question of the continued availability of its powerplant. Currently, it is powered by a Russian Klimov RD-93.

It has been speculated for some time that the JF-17 will eventually be powered by a Chinese engine, a possible thrust vector control (TVC) variant of the Guizhou WS-13 Taishan.

Mahmood, however, would only say that the engine "depends on customers," and that "we have options with regards to engines; we're not restricted."

Tufail is unconvinced a TVC variant is a necessity at present.

"Personally, I don't see the JF-17 as a 'do-all' fighter, and I feel that it needs other areas to be looked at for modifications, rather than just follow fads," he said.

"TVC helps in air combat maneuvering, whose days are numbered, if one goes by the technological developments underway. If that be true, it would make much more sense to focus on enhancing BVR [beyond visual range] capabilities, including radar and weapons, which need to be constantly upgraded during the life of an aircraft."

The JF-17 is only rated to plus 8g, and for this reason Tufail said "the JF-17 cannot fully exploit the TVC potential, which a 9g aircraft can do far better."

Analyst Usman Shabbir of the Pakistan Military Consortium think tank said the JF-17 airframe "can certainly handle more than +8g, but the restriction is in place to increase the airframe life."

He said this "may be increased in later variants where more composites are used to increase airframe strength and reduce the overall weight."
Despite Missile Integration, Nuke Role Unlikely for Pakistan’s JF-17 | Defense News | defensenews.com

 

[farhan_9909]

Raa'd Air Launched Cruise Missile
Range 350km

PSed

 

[Defcon 1]

Raa'd Air Launched Cruise Missile
Range 350km

PSed

Why does that pic mentions PL5 II as a weapon of JF17? Didn't pakistan get MAA-1A for that purpose?

 

[farhan_9909]

Why does that pic mentions PL5 II as a weapon of JF17? Didn't pakistan get MAA-1A for that purpose?

few MAA-1A evaluated but not purchased.waiting for MAA-1B.

Pakistan will get MAA-1B not A but in future

 

[Defcon 1]

few MAA-1A evaluated but not purchased.waiting for MAA-1B.

Pakistan will get MAA-1B not A but in future

So why PL5 is mentioned in the pic?

 

[farhan_9909]

So why PL5 is mentioned in the pic?

Because we don't have MAA-1b yet

and the above picture is not by PAF officially but rather by najam

 

[farhan_9909]

Pakistan will procure Brazilian-made Mectron MAA-1B Piranha 2 short-range infrared-guided air-to-air missiles to arm its Chinese-made JF-17 fighters, according to Pakistani press reports on 5 November. The procurement is reportedly for 100 missiles at a cost of USD108 million.


Pakistan had taken delivery of the MAA-1A Piranha 1 version of this missile in 2010 and had signed a letter of intent to order the more advanced MAA-1B. The reported order would be the first known export sale for the MAA-1B, currently planned to enter service with the Brazilian Air Force in 2012.

Pakistan to order Brazilian MAA-1B air-to-air missiles - Jane's Missiles and Rockets

Pakistan never recieved MAA-1A and the deal of 108millions USD was only for Mar-1 anti radiation missile.this was repeatedly confirmed by H khan

Pakistan will recieve MAA-1B in future.excat date is not unknown may be this year or next year

 

[average american]

I wonder just how compatable systems like this are,, and how well they work,, modern aircraft are very complex and sopisticated, has any one out there have any hands n experience. I know the US spends billions to just upgrade all its planes to just to deal with new kinds of missiles and bombs but then we have a lot of planes. The Rocket is a very short range dog fighting rocket where all tests of the MAA-1 to date have been flown against flare targets suspended from parachutes dropped by helicopters.

 

[Decklander]

Kitnay booray din aagayeh hain Pakistan kay. Chinese maal bhi nahin mil raha ab woh koi bhi gandhgi khareed rahay hain.

 

[farhan_9909]

MAA-1b is almost comparable to python 4

though in real term cost slightly more than python 4

 

[Armand2REP]

MAA-1b is almost comparable to python 4

though in real term cost slightly more than python 4

Did you hear that on PD? Unless you know G rating, off-boresight angle, speed, range, burn and focal plane... you don't have a clue.

 

[farhan_9909]

Did you hear that on PD? Unless you know G rating, off-boresight angle, speed, range, burn and focal plane... you don't have a clue.

Well Pakistan already had a choice of IRIS-T.but we selected MAA-1B.because we may even fund the R-darter ng wvr program and has already bought mar-1 from brazil.

and we had no other choice since PL-9C is not for export

 

[SilentKiller]

Meanwhile H khan has confirmed that JFT will undergo Raa'd ALCM and H-2 SOW tests in AWC and later on integration

Psed picture of JFT carrying
2xRaa'd ALCM(Each upto 35-40kt)for nuclear strike
2xlt-2 LGB
2x SD-10A
2xPL5IIE

Lol edited pics..
anyhow if it makes u happy...no issues

 

[farhan_9909]

MAA-1B is a 4th generation WVR
A-Darter in development is a 5th generation..which is the one paf will buy in bulk number if Ban from PL-9C is not lifted in 2016-17 for JFT III

More info in the link but i cant understand the language
IAE faz ensaio do míssil MAA-1B Piranha II | Poder Aéreo - Informação e Discussão sobre Aviação Militar e Civil

 

[farhan_9909]

Lol edited pics..
anyhow if it makes u happy...no issues

It doesnt make us happy but you should read my post i said "PSed" already which means photoshopped

 

[SilentKiller]

lol...
please don't compare J-17 with saab Gripen, as gripen is far better.
u still don't have any BVR for j-17

and please correct some figures for saab.
Thrust/weight: 0.97 and not 0.90 as mentioned by you
Wing area: 30.0 m² (323 ft²) and not 25.54 sq m
Maximum speed: Mach 2 (2,204 km/h, 1,372 mph) at altitude and not 1.8 mach as mentioned by you