J20 Stealth Fighter

death.by.chocolate

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The canards of J20 are almost at the same plane of main wings, so the wave of overlying reflection is very small.

In fact stealth is not a mysterious tech, I believe to detect a stealth craft is not a matter for China/U.S./Russia, maybe even India and French could detect stealth.

The canards of J20 are almost at the same plane of main wings, so the wave of overlying reflection is very small.
Wrong, for two reasons first the canard is dihedral in lay person speak it is angled upwards.Close coupled canards are typically positioned above the wing an example of this arrangement is Rafale. This is the only way for a close coupled canard to generate lift for the wing. But since the wings of the J-20 is high mounted placing the canard above the wing wasn't an option for Chengdu. Chengdu designers had no choice so to achieve the right canard wing interaction they designed a dihedral canard that impacts the aircrafts supersonic performance(drag) and increases front aspect RCS.

Second, the canard is used for pitch control even in straight level flight it is continuously actuated by the flight computer. The actuation itself creates 'Doppler scintillation' increasing the aircrafts RCS.


In the below pictures is the stealth detector of China, it calculates the fluctuations of air background waves, then draw the track of stealth craft. Several years ago most cellphone stations in China already equipped the detector, that means enemy's stealth craft can be detected in Chinese territory, unless enemy destroy numberless cellphone stations, it sounds like a superiority of home ground.
And please don't get me started on Chinese 'stealth detector'. The system you described works on a refinement of the triangulation technique called wide area multilateration using time-difference-of-arrival (TDOA). Wide area multilateration systems like the Chinese copy of VERA can detect and track cooperating aircrafts. Unless you expect the Raptor to 'cooperate' in Chinese airspace its completely ineffective against US LO aircrafts.

We (US) do have the ability to detect LO radar observable aircraft using our AESA radar in combination with next generation sensors we've had it for sometime and I fully expect the system to be operationally deployed to coincide with induction of the J-20 or T-50.
 

Armand2REP

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The canards of J20 are almost at the same plane of main wings, so the wave of overlying reflection is very small.
The whole point of canards is to move the plane... duh. They do not stay at the same angle.

In fact stealth is not a mysterious tech, I believe to detect a stealth craft is not a matter for China/U.S./Russia, maybe even India and French could detect stealth.
To detect stealth you need power and complex search algorithms. With that you can find anything, question is will the power be enough from an airplane.

In the below pictures is the stealth detector of China, it calculates the fluctuations of air background waves, then draw the track of stealth craft. Several years ago most cellphone stations in China already equipped the detector, that means enemy's stealth craft can be detected in Chinese territory, unless enemy destroy numberless cellphone stations, it sounds like a superiority of home ground.
Why would cellphone towers detect fluctuations in the air? It has nothing to do with air disturbance nor would it even be in the communication bands of an F-22/35. Nothing to do with detecting stealth.
 
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Chinese may have gotten VERA-E via Pakistan?? A few J-20's used properly would still be a challenge even for the raptor.
 
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Nice article spark, the Chinese focus on reducing US naval might in the Pacific seems to be taking shape but many US allies and bases would still be available to US e.g Japan,Philipines,Australia,Guam.
 

Tshering22

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Nice article spark, the Chinese focus on reducing US naval might in the Pacific seems to be taking shape but many US allies and bases would still be available to US e.g Japan,Philipines,Australia,Guam.
I don't understand why Chinese want to be the USSR substitute and challenge US. Managing the world and policing it is such a headache. US found it easy since it has 2 ninny neighbours and is miles away from all the chaos whereas China is in the heartland of all nuisance, terrorism, corruption etc etc etc. If we were in US' geographical place, India would have been a heaven by now.
 

death.by.chocolate

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Don't you think that is a bit too much?
No it isn't as outrageous a notion as you think, the Super Hornet has recorded two simulated kills against the Raptor in WVR.
Close combat is a free for all death trap that must be avoided, one cannot preclude luck as a factor close in.

 

silkroad

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I don't understand why Chinese want to be the USSR substitute and challenge US. Managing the world and policing it is such a headache. US found it easy since it has 2 ninny neighbours and is miles away from all the chaos whereas China is in the heartland of all nuisance, terrorism, corruption etc etc etc. If we were in US' geographical place, India would have been a heaven by now.
Not many if any Chinese really want to challenge the US. It is the other way around. US has been trying to instigate civil war in China for many years. They have installed puppets in Taiwan and are trying to make it apart from China. They send navies scout our coast and sometimes provoke us all the time. They employed mops that kill our innocent civilians in Tibet and Xinjiang meanwhile their lying machine told the world a completely different story and make all the ignorant people support the murders.

Chinese certainly know peace is the only way we can be safe and we are not too stupid to understand confronting to a superpower like US is extremely dangerous. But the how to chose relationship is decided by the strong one and we are not strong. Around 60 years ago, various strong countries like UK, Japan, US and USSR either set colonies, invaded or instigated civil wars in China, and Chinese experienced various wars for almost 100 years. We suffered so much and still suffering from the past. We want peace more than anyone else. We want US military leave us alone, that is all.

I don't hate American people. I know you don't believe me but I think they have kind people meanwhile a even more monster government , that make a mass everywhere in the world, lucky not enough in China.

BTW, concerning the problem of my own country, we have nuisance and corruption for sure, but where did you get the idea that China is a heartland of terrorism? We do have terrorists killing our civilians but it was CIA who heartfeltly paid them, as they paid bin Ladin and Taliban 20 years ago.

I certainly respect your freedom to have friendship with USA. I am not an Indian and I certainly don't have the a slightest objection if you consider to invite Americans (or perhaps English back) to govern you as an effort to make India into a heaven (hopefully better than the ages of Mr. Gandhi). However, don' t blame me if you find your country go to the other way arround like Iraq today, because this is not recommendation. Good luck.
 
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I don't understand why Chinese want to be the USSR substitute and challenge US. Managing the world and policing it is such a headache. US found it easy since it has 2 ninny neighbours and is miles away from all the chaos whereas China is in the heartland of all nuisance, terrorism, corruption etc etc etc. If we were in US' geographical place, India would have been a heaven by now.
Chinese may not have chosen to be a substitute for USSR but they have become one thru their aggressive posturing and also thru their success. The Chinese rise has been positive until USA felt Chinese would interfere in US interests in the future, these interests are mainly economic and energy,resources etc... since these things are finite and demand will out strip supply this was bound to happen. Chinese did not help their case by continued aggressive posturing with their neighbors as well ant-satellite tests,carrier killing missiles etc... all of these things threaten US hegemony and threaten to shift the balance of power. Chinese nuclear proliferation was pardonable but their economic rise may not be??
 

silkroad

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I don't understand why Chinese want to be the USSR substitute and challenge US. Managing the world and policing it is such a headache. US found it easy since it has 2 ninny neighbours and is miles away from all the chaos whereas China is in the heartland of all nuisance, terrorism, corruption etc etc etc. If we were in US' geographical place, India would have been a heaven by now.
Not many if any Chinese really want to challenge the US. It is the other way around. US has been trying to instigate civil war in China for many years. They have installed puppets in Taiwan and are trying to make it apart from China. They send navies scout our coast and sometimes provoke us all the time. They employed mops that kill our innocent civilians in Tibet and Xinjiang meanwhile their lying machine told the world a completely different story and make all the ignorant people support the murders.

Chinese certainly know peace is the only way we can be safe and we are not too stupid to understand confronting to a superpower like US is extremely dangerous; espeically China has lent US almost 1 trillion dollars that we certainly are not stupid enough to throw the money away by launching a war with them. But the how to chose relationship is decided by the strong one and we are not strong. Around 60 years ago, various strong countries like UK, Japan, US and USSR either set colonies, invaded or instigated civil wars in China, and Chinese experienced various wars for almost 100 years. We suffered so much and still suffering from the past. We want peace more than anyone else. We want US military leave us alone, that is all.

I don't hate American people. I know you don't believe me but I think they have kind people meanwhile a even more monster government , that make a mass everywhere in the world, lucky not enough in China.

BTW, concerning the problem of my own country, we have nuisance and corruption for sure, but where did you get the idea that China is a heartland of terrorism? We do have terrorists killing our civilians but it was CIA who heartfeltly paid them, as they paid bin Ladin and Taliban 20 years ago.

I certainly respect your freedom to have friendship with USA. I am not an Indian and I certainly don't have the a slightest objection if you consider to invite Americans (or perhaps English back) to govern you as an effort to make India into a heaven (hopefully better than the ages of Mr. Gandhi). However, don' t blame me if you find your country go to the other way arround like Iraq today, because this is not recommendation. Good luck.
 
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Armand2REP

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Not many if any Chinese really want to challenge the US. It is the other way around. US has been trying to instigate civil war in China for many years. They have installed puppets in Taiwan and are trying to make it apart from China. They send navies scout our coast and sometimes provoke us all the time. They employed mops that kill our innocent civilians in Tibet and Xinjiang meanwhile their lying machine told the world a completely different story and make all the ignorant people support the murders.
Uh... not. US hasn't done anything to promote instability of China. If they wanted to, they could have made it fall several times since Tienanmen. China's rise has been on the back of US consumer wallets. Cut off that cash cow and CCP is cut at the knees. US could easily have left it to the earlier sweatshop countries.

Chinese certainly know peace is the only way we can be safe and we are not too stupid to understand confronting to a superpower like US is extremely dangerous; espeically China has lent US almost 1 trillion dollars that we certainly are not stupid enough to throw the money away by launching a war with them. But the how to chose relationship is decided by the strong one and we are not strong. Around 60 years ago, various strong countries like UK, Japan, US and USSR either set colonies, invaded or instigated civil wars in China, and Chinese experienced various wars for almost 100 years. We suffered so much and still suffering from the past. We want peace more than anyone else. We want US military leave us alone, that is all.
So what are you complaining for? US military doesn't do anything to you except try to get SIGINT. It is time to let Taiwan go, they are several generations removed now.
I don't hate American people. I know you don't believe me but I think they have kind people meanwhile a even more monster government , that make a mass everywhere in the world, lucky not enough in China.
They make a big enough mess in China. Have you ever defecated after eating KFC China? Total mess....

BTW, concerning the problem of my own country, we have nuisance and corruption for sure, but where did you get the idea that China is a heartland of terrorism? We do have terrorists killing our civilians but it was CIA who heartfeltly paid them, as they paid bin Ladin and Taliban 20 years ago.
US pay Uighers? lol
 

silkroad

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Uh... not. US hasn't done anything to promote instability of China. If they wanted to, they could have made it fall several times since Tienanmen.
Well, US has made a number of color revolutions, and only idiot and lier would say they kindly exclude their effort from China. Read Wikileaks, US and Australians were considering deploy forces to China.

China's rise has been on the back of US consumer wallets. Cut off that cash cow and CCP is cut at the knees. US could easily have left it to the earlier sweatshop countries.
It is true China's development is benefit from its export of US. But it is they buy our good because they think its worth to pay.. We pay our work for their money and we don't owe them anything. In opposit, they owe almost 1 trillion USD. Further more, it is not a reason US has the right to redraw Chinese boundary.

So what are you complaining for? US military doesn't do anything to you except try to get SIGINT. It is time to let Taiwan go, they are several generations removed now.
Every time of boundary redrawing are accompanied with bloods. It is an aggressive behavior to redraw other countries boundary. If Chinese are nasty enough to promote some Indian Muslim to take a province, declare independence and drive away non-Muslims, that would make a civil war inside India and millions people would be killed. If you like this happen, perhaps you should consider to invite English back to India and I am sure no Chinese will interfere your business. But doing this to China is not much different from launching a war to someone that never offend you.

US pay Uighers? lol
The leader of the Uighers organizer was a former criminal in China and USA forced China to release her as a prerequisite that China become a member of WTO. Futhermore, US National Endowment for Democracy publicly support her all the activities. You laugh don't change the fact.
 

Armand2REP

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Well, US has made a number of color revolutions, and only idiot and lier would say they kindly exclude their effort from China. Read Wikileaks, US and Australians were considering deploy forces to China.
Do they ever deploy to China? Do they ever get CIA dissemination officers getting caught in China? Never heard of such a thing.

It is true China's development is benefit from its export of US. But it is they buy our good because they think its worth to pay.. We pay our work for their money and we don't owe them anything. In opposit, they owe almost 1 trillion USD. Further more, it is not a reason US has the right to redraw Chinese boundary.
You owe the American consumer your economy. Half of everything Deng's vision built was payed for by it. If China didn't fund the US deficit, they wouldn't be so generous in the amount of slack they allow in the Chinese TRADE deficit. That is something China cannot afford to lose. The $800 billion of US debt China owns is only a drop in the bucket to the total US taxpayers hold.


Every time of boundary redrawing are accompanied with bloods. It is an aggressive behavior to redraw other countries boundary. If Chinese are nasty enough to promote some Indian Muslim to take a province, declare independence and drive away non-Muslims, that would make a civil war inside India and millions people would be killed. If you like this happen, perhaps you should consider to invite English back to India and I am sure no Chinese will interfere your business. But doing this to China is not much different from launching a war to someone that never offend you.
If you wanted to retake Taiwan you should have done it in your Maoist militaristic phase. You failed miserably in the airwar over the Straights, no point in reliving defeat. You can't politically afford to do it now.

The leader of the Uighers organizer was a former criminal in China and USA forced China to release her as a prerequisite that China become a member of WTO. Futhermore, US National Endowment for Democracy publicly support her all the activities. You laugh don't change the fact.
Criminal for wanting change after watching her people slaughtered at Ghulja... sorry don't buy that as a criminal offence.
 

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right sir but can you tell me where be china in 2016

are you sure 2016 well if he is saying 2016 then it means 2020 at least
Think i read it somewhere, not sure though.. & yes, you can for sure expect delays in the project. In India delays & projects, whether military & non-military, are like a happily married couple. They stay together. Only difference is that they make others following the projects unhappy.. Btw don't forget the PAK-FA. it is also an indian project.. I am sure by 2016 the PAK-FA project would also have advanced quite a lot....
 
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silkroad

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Do they ever deploy to China? Do they ever get CIA dissemination officers getting caught in China? Never heard of such a thing.
We were talking about destabilizing China , weren't we? Isn't it obvious enough their discussed force deployment is a backup plan, not for they found any possible invasion from China, but for the case their destabilization failed?

Of course there no CIA officer caught in China, either in the other countries that color revolution occurred. But this can be barely used as an argument that CIA don't engage the activity overthrowing authority in other country. Both retired CIA officer and their released documents revealed their secret war in 60s by training and deploying secret army of Dalai Lama in 60s. There was no way to no what CIA was doing in China in 60s and we won't expect CIA release their recent documents about how they lead their color revolution. But we have murdered thousands of victims of innocent civilians so far and there would be more if we don't prevent them doing this.

Perhaps you don't want to deny your hostility toward Chinese so there is no point to convince you about this matter. My original reply was to someone who don't understand why China want to build military against the superpower USA. It is for our safety, for preventing more suffering. If you want to make fun from our suffering, there perhaps other Indians who don't share the fun with you because they might understand that might lead terrible hatred between the two nations for generations. Except few warmongers, no one can win anything from such hatreds no matter how their opponent suffer.

You owe the American consumer your economy. Half of everything Deng's vision built was payed for by it. If China didn't fund the US deficit, they wouldn't be so generous in the amount of slack they allow in the Chinese TRADE deficit. That is something China cannot afford to lose. The $800 billion of US debt China owns is only a drop in the bucket to the total US taxpayers hold.
India is welcome to replace the role of China if it is good for them. I sincerely hope India could develop better than China.

If you wanted to retake Taiwan you should have done it in your Maoist militaristic phase. You failed miserably in the airwar over the Straights, no point in reliving defeat. You can't politically afford to do it now.
Well, 80 years ago, no one could afford political cost to claim the colony back from the English, when they were strong enough to keep their flag away from sunset. But I guess Mr. Gandhi wouldn't accept your advice if you told him the same thing in that time. Neither do we. because we know superpower never last forever.

Criminal for wanting change after watching her people slaughtered at Ghulja... sorry don't buy that as a criminal offence.
When someone make lies, like Jews destroying Germany or Chinese slaughtering, their purpose is nothing different from Nazi Germany. There are slaughtering of thousands Chinese civilians in China, but it was from the Islamic fundamentalists to other Chinese. And if it is your fun to support them, I don't expect any kind will from you. But how other Indians could benefit anything from anything from our suffering by siding with those Americans who organized the incidents is another thing.
 

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