India's growing stakes in South China Sea

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China warns India, Vietnam, Philippines. So what? : Terminal 3

China warns India, Vietnam, Philippines. So what?


So China is unhappy? On Saturday, an important state-owned newspaper, 'China Energy News' reportedly warned India against dipping its toes in uncharted waters for unknown benefits.
"India's energy strategy is slipping into an extremely dangerous whirlpool," said a front-page commentary in the paper, which is published by the Communist Party mouthpiece the People's Daily, according to Reuters.
Both China and India had huge energy needs, which had led them to compete in some parts of the world and cooperate in others, it said. "But oil companies must have a bottom line, which is to follow international law and respect the structure of international relations."
"On the question of cooperation with Vietnam, the bottom line for Indian companies is that they must not enter into the disputed waters of the South China Sea.
"Challenging the core interests of a large, rising country for unknown oil at the bottom of the sea will not only lead to a crushing defeat for the Indian oil company, but will most likely seriously harm India's whole energy security and interrupt its economic development.
"Indian oil company policy makers should consider the interests of their own country, and turn around at the soonest opportunity and leave the South China Sea," it was quoted as saying.
Chinese anger is directed at the oil and gas exploration agreement between ONGC Videsh and PetroVietnam in the South China Sea. The agreement, signed during the recent visit to India by Vietnam's President Truong Tan Sang, says the Financial Times, interrupted "the positive mood music" from a high-profile visit to China by Nguyen Phu Trong, the head of Vietnam's ruling Communist Party. The timing seems to have upset China: the deal was signed in New Delhi on Oct. 12 – a day after Trong arrived in Beijing.
Relations between the ONGC and PetroVietnam date back to the 1980s, and ONGC is not the only multinational company interested in tapping offshore exploration opportunities in Vietnam, two facts that make Beijing's outburst perplexing.
China has also been warning Philippines off the South China Seas. On Monday, it called for "other countries" to respect its agreement with Vietnam on maritime issues, the state news agency Xinhua reports.
"The fact that China and Vietnam have agreed to settle maritime disputes through negotiations has nothing to do with a third party. We expect the third party to respect the efforts by the countries concerned to resolve the disputes through negotiations," Foreign Ministry spokesman Liu Weimin said at a daily press briefing.
Xinhua said Liu's comments came after the Philippines called for a multilateral approach, rather than a bilateral agreement, to resolve disputes over the South China Sea.
How relations between India and China develop is keenly watched in the West for obvious reasons. Some strategic experts in London, who deal with both India and China, advise caution on how to read Beijing's utterances on the ONGC-PetroVietnam deal. "I'd wait for a statement from the Chinese foreign ministry," said one who has recently returned from visits to Beijing and New Delhi.
According to him, the sense in New Delhi is that India will be much more competitive in how it deals with its largest trading partner – a view that also finds an implicit mention in the Chinese editorial. He also speaks of an acknowledgement in both Beijing and New Delhi of the need for greater investments to boost the economic partnership between the two countries.
Growing their economic relationship appears more imperative in the current global climate. But there are difficulties, as underlined by a report in today's (17th Oct) Financial Times by the paper's Beijing bureau chief Jamil Anderlini. He says there are reports that dozens of factory owners in the eastern city of Wenzhou – the first city to host private businesses when China liberalized in 1978 – have fled in recent weeks, leaving behind unpaid workers and "mountains of debt."
Wenzhou's problems, caused by a fall in global demand for Chinese goods, rising costs of production and unsustainable levels of debt, "are a sign that a hard landing is imminent for the nation," says the excellent report. There is speculation that China's economic growth model – based on exporting goods at prices that are unbeatable because of cheap labour, capital, energy and land – could be coming to an end.
""¦Minimum wages are rising more than 20 percent a year in many areas, and land is increasingly scarce and expensive. In addition, the government is reducing the supply of cheap credit and has moved to liberalise prices for energy and other utilities. Meanwhile, the flood of investment in new factories, roads, airports and housing estates that has been the main driver of growth looks increasingly unsustainable," the FT report says.
Here's Anderlini's report, A Workshop on the Wane.
To come back to Chinese utterances, according to the Journal of Energy Security, China's recent military/confrontational approach over the South China Sea reflects "a new reality geared to China's gaining self-confidence as a rising superpower in search of energy security in a multi-polar world beset with many uncertainties."
In addition, a bit of foreign distraction probably comes in handy when you are confronted with some real economic problems at home.
 

Tshering22

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Until this government is there, many soldiers'/sailors'/pilots lives are in danger in our defense forces.

Please remember brothers, before pointing fingers at me about "rationality" of my comment and crap like that, do remember; these soldiers, sailors or pilots could be your loved one as well. I have family in military and speak with that emotion. I am sure many of them here would somehow have connections too; a friend, a brother, an uncle, or even father or someone.

Pray for our armed personnel's safety (which is now non-existent) and make a steely resolve that you will help kick out this traitor party out of power in 2014. That will be the victory of entire India. The main opposition is not strong enough, but they are at least not pure evil incarnates like the Maino Mafia. They've transformed the nation into an underworld rule.
 

niceguy2011

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What a news , what a joke? LOL

China unhappy, so, Viet come to us. Phillipinese go to US.


China warns India, Vietnam, Philippines. So what? : Terminal 3

China warns India, Vietnam, Philippines. So what?


So China is unhappy? On Saturday, an important state-owned newspaper, 'China Energy News' reportedly warned India against dipping its toes in uncharted waters for unknown benefits.
"India's energy strategy is slipping into an extremely dangerous whirlpool," said a front-page commentary in the paper, which is published by the Communist Party mouthpiece the People's Daily, according to Reuters.
Both China and India had huge energy needs, which had led them to compete in some parts of the world and cooperate in others, it said. "But oil companies must have a bottom line, which is to follow international law and respect the structure of international relations."
"On the question of cooperation with Vietnam, the bottom line for Indian companies is that they must not enter into the disputed waters of the South China Sea.
"Challenging the core interests of a large, rising country for unknown oil at the bottom of the sea will not only lead to a crushing defeat for the Indian oil company, but will most likely seriously harm India's whole energy security and interrupt its economic development.
"Indian oil company policy makers should consider the interests of their own country, and turn around at the soonest opportunity and leave the South China Sea," it was quoted as saying.
Chinese anger is directed at the oil and gas exploration agreement between ONGC Videsh and PetroVietnam in the South China Sea. The agreement, signed during the recent visit to India by Vietnam's President Truong Tan Sang, says the Financial Times, interrupted "the positive mood music" from a high-profile visit to China by Nguyen Phu Trong, the head of Vietnam's ruling Communist Party. The timing seems to have upset China: the deal was signed in New Delhi on Oct. 12 – a day after Trong arrived in Beijing.
Relations between the ONGC and PetroVietnam date back to the 1980s, and ONGC is not the only multinational company interested in tapping offshore exploration opportunities in Vietnam, two facts that make Beijing's outburst perplexing.
China has also been warning Philippines off the South China Seas. On Monday, it called for "other countries" to respect its agreement with Vietnam on maritime issues, the state news agency Xinhua reports.
"The fact that China and Vietnam have agreed to settle maritime disputes through negotiations has nothing to do with a third party. We expect the third party to respect the efforts by the countries concerned to resolve the disputes through negotiations," Foreign Ministry spokesman Liu Weimin said at a daily press briefing.
Xinhua said Liu's comments came after the Philippines called for a multilateral approach, rather than a bilateral agreement, to resolve disputes over the South China Sea.
How relations between India and China develop is keenly watched in the West for obvious reasons. Some strategic experts in London, who deal with both India and China, advise caution on how to read Beijing's utterances on the ONGC-PetroVietnam deal. "I'd wait for a statement from the Chinese foreign ministry," said one who has recently returned from visits to Beijing and New Delhi.
According to him, the sense in New Delhi is that India will be much more competitive in how it deals with its largest trading partner – a view that also finds an implicit mention in the Chinese editorial. He also speaks of an acknowledgement in both Beijing and New Delhi of the need for greater investments to boost the economic partnership between the two countries.
Growing their economic relationship appears more imperative in the current global climate. But there are difficulties, as underlined by a report in today's (17th Oct) Financial Times by the paper's Beijing bureau chief Jamil Anderlini. He says there are reports that dozens of factory owners in the eastern city of Wenzhou – the first city to host private businesses when China liberalized in 1978 – have fled in recent weeks, leaving behind unpaid workers and "mountains of debt."
Wenzhou's problems, caused by a fall in global demand for Chinese goods, rising costs of production and unsustainable levels of debt, "are a sign that a hard landing is imminent for the nation," says the excellent report. There is speculation that China's economic growth model – based on exporting goods at prices that are unbeatable because of cheap labour, capital, energy and land – could be coming to an end.
""¦Minimum wages are rising more than 20 percent a year in many areas, and land is increasingly scarce and expensive. In addition, the government is reducing the supply of cheap credit and has moved to liberalise prices for energy and other utilities. Meanwhile, the flood of investment in new factories, roads, airports and housing estates that has been the main driver of growth looks increasingly unsustainable," the FT report says.
Here's Anderlini's report, A Workshop on the Wane.
To come back to Chinese utterances, according to the Journal of Energy Security, China's recent military/confrontational approach over the South China Sea reflects "a new reality geared to China's gaining self-confidence as a rising superpower in search of energy security in a multi-polar world beset with many uncertainties."
In addition, a bit of foreign distraction probably comes in handy when you are confronted with some real economic problems at home.
 

SADAKHUSH

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viet's top leader sign agreement at China, Japan ground their F-15.
so, tell me who is back off ? LOL
Vietnam also signed agreement with India and it will be implemented whether you like it or not. We are all curious about your obsession with LOL.
Can you explain it? Are you on opium or take a laughing pill in the morning?
 

niceguy2011

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Vietnam also signed agreement with India and it will be implemented whether you like it or not. We are all curious about your obsession with LOL.
Can you explain it? Are you on opium or take a laughing pill in the morning?
u had opium today?
u and ur boss had different agreements with another company, which one will be implemented?LOL
 

J20!

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I love idiotic chicoms
Well I don't like stupid Indians who tresspass in CHINESE territorial waters. Only the Indians would be stupid enough to intervene in a territorial dispute that does not concern them. I hope for the poor IN sailors, their leader's chest thumping doesn't get them killed for something that would have been better left alone.
 

nrj

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Well I don't like stupid Indians who tresspass in CHINESE territorial waters. Only the Indians would be stupid enough to intervene in a territorial dispute that does not concern them. I hope for the poor IN sailors, their leader's chest thumping doesn't get them killed for something that would have been better left alone.
Tell that to chinese soldiers in PoK & India controlled JK, Arunachal. Maybe Indians will stop SCS operation if chinese stop trespassing in our land.
 

agentperry

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Well I don't like stupid Indians who tresspass in CHINESE territorial waters. Only the Indians would be stupid enough to intervene in a territorial dispute that does not concern them. I hope for the poor IN sailors, their leader's chest thumping doesn't get them killed for something that would have been better left alone.
our interest in china is not for hegamony. killing a billion chinese pandas and then burying them will reprive our fossil fuel reserve. quite scientific.

science loving chinese wish to co-operate? huh why asking? sure they will.
 

J20!

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our interest in china is not for hegamony. killing a billion chinese pandas and then burying them will reprive our fossil fuel reserve. quite scientific.

science loving chinese wish to co-operate? huh why asking? sure they will.
I don't know what you're saying, but i'll tell you what i'm saying. Any naval confrontation in the SOUTH CHINA SEA, will not end well for the indian navy and its personel, deep down, bebeath all the boasting and bravado, you know hundreds of indian sailors will lose their lives over nothing, think about their children and families. This isn't a discussioon about "PoK & India controlled JK, Arunachal", this is about disputed waters near the Chinese territory. The PLAN holds the upper hand in every concievable way in those waters...
 

SHASH2K2

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I don't know what you're saying, but i'll tell you what i'm saying. Any naval confrontation in the SOUTH CHINA SEA, will not end well for the indian navy and its personel, deep down, bebeath all the boasting and bravado, you know hundreds of indian sailors will lose their lives over nothing, think about their children and families. This isn't a discussioon about "PoK & India controlled JK, Arunachal", this is about disputed waters near the Chinese territory. The PLAN holds the upper hand in every concievable way in those waters...

And you forgot that there is one more Ocean thats know and Indian ocen and The Indian navy holds the upper hand in every concievable way in those waters...

will not end well for the Chinese navy and its commercial ships , deep down, bebeath all the boasting and bravado, you know hundreds of chinese sailors will lose their lives over nothing, think about their children and families.
 

J20!

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And you forgot that there is one more Ocean thats know and Indian ocen and The Indian navy holds the upper hand in every concievable way in those waters...

will not end well for the Chinese navy and its commercial ships , deep down, bebeath all the boasting and bravado, you know hundreds of chinese sailors will lose their lives over nothing, think about their children and families.
Don't be childish. One: Chinese ships are not drilling and surveying in your territorial waters and only pass through INTERNATIONAL WATERS IN THE INDIAN OCEAN, we do not drill in or survey waters you claim. Two: The PLAN is in the Indian Ocean to protect its shipping, not to protect ILLEGAL surveying in soveriegn territory. Three: Since you seem to be a classic fanboy who seems to think their military is the best in the world, I guess you don't care about the unnecesary violence that will be caused by Indian stupidity...
 

SHASH2K2

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One: Chinese ships are not drilling and surveying in your territorial waters and only pass through INTERNATIONAL WATERS IN THE INDIAN OCEAN, we do not drill in or survey waters you claim.
what are you people doing in POK then. playing ping pong I guess ?
and what makes you think that chinese are only one race in the world who are born to make 100 % prefect claim. YOur claim is claim and Vietnamis claim is a blame ?

Two: The PLAN is in the Indian Ocean to protect its shipping, not to protect ILLEGAL surveying in soveriegn territory.
Care to define that please. claim doesnt mean it become sovereign territory . Just because its name is south china se it doesnt become chinese territory. If yes then whole Indian ocean is our sovereign territory .

Three: Since you seem to be a classic fanboy who seems to think their military is the best in the world, I guess you don't care about the unnecesary violence that will be caused by Indian stupidity...
woooooooooo . stupid I just replied to your posts using your sentences. Perhaps you are too dumb to realize that.
 

agentperry

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j20 do you know anythinga bout brahmos. anything that plan will launch can be confronted with sams. but brahmos is one of the kind supersonic curise missile. nothing is there to confront it because its one of its kind. false ego you may withhold but a IN ship and PLAN ship 290 kms away heading towards eachother and launching respective missiles, plan antiship missile can be countered by sams with IN but supersonic cruise missile by in is not another antiship missile. plan ship will be destroyed.

if you have anything to counter it provide it HERE...
 

niceguy2011

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j20 do you know anythinga bout brahmos. anything that plan will launch can be confronted with sams. but brahmos is one of the kind supersonic curise missile. nothing is there to confront it because its one of its kind. false ego you may withhold but a IN ship and PLAN ship 290 kms away heading towards eachother and launching respective missiles, plan antiship missile can be countered by sams with IN but supersonic cruise missile by in is not another antiship missile. plan ship will be destroyed.

if you have anything to counter it provide it HERE...

How can u do with those miissle, how many of them? is those missles can stop PLA visit dehi or make them more agressive? LOL
 

Yusuf

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SCS is "claimed" as territorial waters by China, its not accepted as such by the world. It's a matter of perception. Tomorrow China will claim Hawaii. China can claim all that they want.
 

nrj

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SCS is "claimed" as territorial waters by China, its not accepted as such by the world. It's a matter of perception. Tomorrow China will claim Hawaii. China can claim all that they want.
Actually China claims the territory only when someone else is exploring it. PRC has never declared its precise extent of territorial claims. They've not issued particulars of their SCS ambit.
 

J20!

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what are you people doing in POK then. playing ping pong I guess ?
and what makes you think that chinese are only one race in the world who are born to make 100 % prefect claim. YOur claim is claim and Vietnamis claim is a blame ?



Care to define that please. claim doesnt mean it become sovereign territory . Just because its name is south china se it doesnt become chinese territory. If yes then whole Indian ocean is our sovereign territory .



woooooooooo . stupid I just replied to your posts using your sentences. Perhaps you are too dumb to realize that.

It's obvious that you can also see that this "muscle flexing" by India is unnecesary and foolish. Why do you keep bringing up POK in a thread about India's misadventures into Chinese territory? And dont give me that "China claims EVERYTHING" crap. Taiwan, Vietnam, the Philipines and other ASEAN countries have territorial disputes in those waters as well. Just because China is the most powerful among them does not mean China is the party to blame. China has been trying to solve the SCS disputes diplomatically, we have not gone all "gun ho", tryna flex our muscles with silly naval showings of force, unlike Vietnam and the Philipines have, but Indians here blame us all the same. Why would you survey and drill and send warships into waters claimed by multiple countries? It is reckless and shows a lack of respect for the lives that will be lost in any arising conflicts because of it. Go drill in the Indian ocean or something and leave us alone. And I'm sure you know that claiming that India could win in any naval confrontation in the SCS with the PLAN, is just bravado. If you can, tell me how you could...
 

maomao

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It's obvious that you can also see that this "muscle flexing" by India is unnecesary and foolish. Why do you keep bringing up POK in a thread about India's misadventures into Chinese territory? And dont give me that "China claims EVERYTHING" crap. Taiwan, Vietnam, the Philipines and other ASEAN countries have territorial disputes in those waters as well. Just because China is the most powerful among them does not mean China is the party to blame. China has been trying to solve the SCS disputes diplomatically, we have not gone all "gun ho", tryna flex our muscles with silly naval showings of force, unlike Vietnam and the Philipines have, but Indians here blame us all the same. Why would you survey and drill and send warships into waters claimed by multiple countries? It is reckless and shows a lack of respect for the lives that will be lost in any arising conflicts because of it. Go drill in the Indian ocean or something and leave us alone. And I'm sure you know that claiming that India could win in any naval confrontation in the SCS with the PLAN, is just bravado. If you can, tell me how you could...
Great you have answered all your queries yourself......you have a good sense of being guilty conscious. As per next confrontation with China let me tell you one thing for sure that - The Jackass traitor Nehru your ally is long dead for good, we do not believe that Chinese are our-brothers, we will not restrict ourselves at defending posts and pickets will use everything we have, and will not allow any self styled Nehru to remain alive if he/she messes with armed forces; moreover, this time AF will be used extensively....Now you can imagine how good your PLA will fare against us (If Indian forces are given free hand) as compared to Vietnam which went all out against PLA. I leave it to your imagination the rout PLA will face in the absence of traitor Nehru and ilks.
 

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