Indian Air Force: News & Discussions

[Tshering22]

What do you all make of this? There is a development going on where Embraer has reached out to TATA and the IAF for joining the C-390 as a partner country with rights to make the transporter C-390 (slightly bigger than C-130) in India.

Brazil is already partnering with Portugal and Argentina on this. It looks pretty potent and very much suits us geopolitically.

Brazil is a friendly country, a fellow BRICS member, and has a strong aerospace sector with zero conflicts with us.

Do you think IAF will take the gamble? Apparently they said that we need 80 medium transport jets in the coming years.

 

[Starlight]

Please excuse some grammatical errors in the previous post.

 

[Fatalis]

The IAF currently has the following SAMs in its inventory:

1. Pechora* - 25 squadrons (being modernised)
2. Akash - 07/15 squadrons
3. Spyder - 18 squadrons
4. MRSAM - 02/18 squadrons
5. S-400 - 03 /05 squadrons

In near future (~5-10 years) Pechoras will be retired and most probably replaced by Akash-NG.

The number should look something like this in next 7-10 years:
1. Akash - 15 squadrons
2. MRSAM - 18 squadrons
3. Spyder - 18 squadrons
4. S-400 - 5 squadrons
5. Akash-NG - 15-25 squadrons
6. ERADS - 07-10 squadrons

 

[jai jaganath]

The IAF currently has the following SAMs in its inventory:

1. Pechora* - 25 squadrons (being modernised)
2. Akash - 07/15 squadrons
3. Spyder - 18 squadrons
4. MRSAM - 02/18 squadrons
5. S-400 - 03 /05 squadrons

In near future (~5-10 years) Pechoras will be retired and most probably replaced by Akash-NG.

The number should look something like this in next 7-10 years:
1. Akash - 15 squadrons
2. MRSAM - 18 squadrons
3. Spyder - 18 squadrons
4. S-400 - 5 squadrons
5. Akash-NG - 15-25 squadrons
6. ERADS - 07-10 squadrons

What was the order size for mrsam by iaf how has been delivered and how much order expected ?

 

[johnj]

The IAF currently has the following SAMs in its inventory:

1. Pechora* - 25 squadrons (being modernised)
2. Akash - 07/15 squadrons
3. Spyder - 18 squadrons
4. MRSAM - 02/18 squadrons
5. S-400 - 03 /05 squadrons

In near future (~5-10 years) Pechoras will be retired and most probably replaced by Akash-NG.

The number should look something like this in next 7-10 years:
1. Akash - 15 squadrons
2. MRSAM - 18 squadrons
3. Spyder - 18 squadrons
4. S-400 - 5 squadrons
5. Akash-NG - 15-25 squadrons
6. ERADS - 07-10 squadrons

I seen some pics of old russian aam converted in to SAM, what about those ?

 

[skunk works]

US Air Force C-17 flying out of Pathankot right now.

 

[patriots]

I seen some pics of old russian aam converted in to SAM, what about those ?

That was an in house project of iaf
No data on their trials

 

[Blackmamba]

I seen some pics of old russian aam converted in to SAM, what about those ?

India Has Successfully Upgraded Air Defense to Use the R-27 And R-73 Missiles | Defense Express (defence-ua.com)
India Has Successfully Upgraded Air Defense to Use the R-27 And R-73 Missiles

Defense Express
[email protected]
February 16, 2023
971 0

The SAMAR-2 air defense system launcher / Open source photo

The development combines two options: to shoot down targets at low altitude and eventually to get rid of stockpile of Soviet air-to-air missiles
The Indian Air Force (IAF) is preparing for serial production and deployment of the SAMAR-1 anti-aircraft missile complex, designed for the R-73E missiles with infrared guidance.
The first batch of five such SAM systems is already ready to be delivered to one of the combat units of the Indian Air Force, while the IAF expects further orders for the SAMAR-1. This became known during the Aero India 2023 exhibition in Bangalore, which will last from February 13 to 17, as Janes reports.

Read more: Ukraine Will Receive Fewer Leopard 2 Tanks than Partners Promised

India's SAMAR-1 air defense system at Aero India 2023 exhibition / Image provided by Janes
It is noted that the developers of the SAMAR-1 are the 7th and 11th repair bases of the Indian Air Force (BRD) as well as India’s private defense enterprises Simran Flowtech Industries and Yamazuki Denki.
The first presentation of the SAMAR-1 took place back in March 2021, when this SAM system was based on the six-axle ZyL-131 chassis. During the DefExpo 2022 exhibition, a new version was presented on the local Ashok Leyland Stallion 4×4 chassis. It is claimed that the Indian military conducted 17 launches with the SAMAR-1 during tests before adopting.

Demonstration of the Indian SAMAR-1 air defense system on the ZIL-131 chassis in 2021 / Open source photo
The SAMAR-1 has two R-73 launchers and an optical-electronic guidance station, the declared firing range is up to 10-12 km. The target height is not revealed, only it is indicated that "hitting targets at low altitude".
The similar in design is the SAMAR-2 SAM system, designed for firing R-27ET missiles with infrared guidance. The declared firing range is up to 20 km (although when shit in "air-to-air" format, the R-27ET launch range is up to 90 km). The 8-axle Tatra T815 vehicle is used as the chassis that houses a launcher for two missiles, fire control equipment and a generator. The APU-470M is used as a guide. Plans to put SAMAR-2 into service with the Indian Air Force are still unknown.

Indian SAMAR-2 air defense system for the R-27ET missiles / Open source photo
According to open sources, the IAF has purchased about 4,700 R-73 missiles and several hundred R-27 missiles since 1987, which will apparently now be used as ammunition for the SAMAR systems. Air defense systems of this type will close the niche of short-range air defense equipment for the Indian Air Force, and at the same time will be a way to "attach" a stock of old Soviet missiles.

 

[silverghost]

India Has Successfully Upgraded Air Defense to Use the R-27 And R-73 Missiles | Defense Express (defence-ua.com)
India Has Successfully Upgraded Air Defense to Use the R-27 And R-73 Missiles

Defense Express
[email protected]
February 16, 2023
971 0

The SAMAR-2 air defense system launcher / Open source photo

The development combines two options: to shoot down targets at low altitude and eventually to get rid of stockpile of Soviet air-to-air missiles
The Indian Air Force (IAF) is preparing for serial production and deployment of the SAMAR-1 anti-aircraft missile complex, designed for the R-73E missiles with infrared guidance.
The first batch of five such SAM systems is already ready to be delivered to one of the combat units of the Indian Air Force, while the IAF expects further orders for the SAMAR-1. This became known during the Aero India 2023 exhibition in Bangalore, which will last from February 13 to 17, as Janes reports.

India's SAMAR-1 air defense system at Aero India 2023 exhibition / Image provided by Janes
It is noted that the developers of the SAMAR-1 are the 7th and 11th repair bases of the Indian Air Force (BRD) as well as India’s private defense enterprises Simran Flowtech Industries and Yamazuki Denki.
The first presentation of the SAMAR-1 took place back in March 2021, when this SAM system was based on the six-axle ZyL-131 chassis. During the DefExpo 2022 exhibition, a new version was presented on the local Ashok Leyland Stallion 4×4 chassis. It is claimed that the Indian military conducted 17 launches with the SAMAR-1 during tests before adopting.

Demonstration of the Indian SAMAR-1 air defense system on the ZIL-131 chassis in 2021 / Open source photo
The SAMAR-1 has two R-73 launchers and an optical-electronic guidance station, the declared firing range is up to 10-12 km. The target height is not revealed, only it is indicated that "hitting targets at low altitude".
The similar in design is the SAMAR-2 SAM system, designed for firing R-27ET missiles with infrared guidance. The declared firing range is up to 20 km (although when shit in "air-to-air" format, the R-27ET launch range is up to 90 km). The 8-axle Tatra T815 vehicle is used as the chassis that houses a launcher for two missiles, fire control equipment and a generator. The APU-470M is used as a guide. Plans to put SAMAR-2 into service with the Indian Air Force are still unknown.

Indian SAMAR-2 air defense system for the R-27ET missiles / Open source photo
According to open sources, the IAF has purchased about 4,700 R-73 missiles and several hundred R-27 missiles since 1987, which will apparently now be used as ammunition for the SAMAR systems. Air defense systems of this type will close the niche of short-range air defense equipment for the Indian Air Force, and at the same time will be a way to "attach" a stock of old Soviet missiles.

Russian equipment is getting obliterated in the Ukraine war. We on the other hand keep adding Soviet-era stuff. It sometimes appears that the Indian army doesn't expect to fight any war hence they don't care what type of equipment we have.

 

[JBH22]

Russian equipment is getting obliterated in the Ukraine war. We on the other hand keep adding Soviet-era stuff. It sometimes appears that the Indian army doesn't expect to fight any war hence they don't care what type of equipment we have.

Yes western made weapons are not getting wrecked.
Please keep such simplified logic to youtube not on this forum.

 

[DumbPilot]

Not related to Indian Air Force per se, but I think this is how we conduct drills, if we have gained anything from exercises with the USAF and co

 

[karn]

India Has Successfully Upgraded Air Defense to Use the R-27 And R-73 Missiles | Defense Express (defence-ua.com)
India Has Successfully Upgraded Air Defense to Use the R-27 And R-73 Missiles

Defense Express
[email protected]
February 16, 2023
971 0

The SAMAR-2 air defense system launcher / Open source photo

The development combines two options: to shoot down targets at low altitude and eventually to get rid of stockpile of Soviet air-to-air missiles
The Indian Air Force (IAF) is preparing for serial production and deployment of the SAMAR-1 anti-aircraft missile complex, designed for the R-73E missiles with infrared guidance.
The first batch of five such SAM systems is already ready to be delivered to one of the combat units of the Indian Air Force, while the IAF expects further orders for the SAMAR-1. This became known during the Aero India 2023 exhibition in Bangalore, which will last from February 13 to 17, as Janes reports.

India's SAMAR-1 air defense system at Aero India 2023 exhibition / Image provided by Janes
It is noted that the developers of the SAMAR-1 are the 7th and 11th repair bases of the Indian Air Force (BRD) as well as India’s private defense enterprises Simran Flowtech Industries and Yamazuki Denki.
The first presentation of the SAMAR-1 took place back in March 2021, when this SAM system was based on the six-axle ZyL-131 chassis. During the DefExpo 2022 exhibition, a new version was presented on the local Ashok Leyland Stallion 4×4 chassis. It is claimed that the Indian military conducted 17 launches with the SAMAR-1 during tests before adopting.

Demonstration of the Indian SAMAR-1 air defense system on the ZIL-131 chassis in 2021 / Open source photo
The SAMAR-1 has two R-73 launchers and an optical-electronic guidance station, the declared firing range is up to 10-12 km. The target height is not revealed, only it is indicated that "hitting targets at low altitude".
The similar in design is the SAMAR-2 SAM system, designed for firing R-27ET missiles with infrared guidance. The declared firing range is up to 20 km (although when shit in "air-to-air" format, the R-27ET launch range is up to 90 km). The 8-axle Tatra T815 vehicle is used as the chassis that houses a launcher for two missiles, fire control equipment and a generator. The APU-470M is used as a guide. Plans to put SAMAR-2 into service with the Indian Air Force are still unknown.

Indian SAMAR-2 air defense system for the R-27ET missiles / Open source photo
According to open sources, the IAF has purchased about 4,700 R-73 missiles and several hundred R-27 missiles since 1987, which will apparently now be used as ammunition for the SAMAR systems. Air defense systems of this type will close the niche of short-range air defense equipment for the Indian Air Force, and at the same time will be a way to "attach" a stock of old Soviet missiles.

Honestly this seems more like a wartime modification (desperate measures) rather than something you keep around in peacetime.. Every hour that missile spends on that rack reduces its already diminished lifespan.

 

[MirageBlue]

Honestly this seems more like a wartime modification (desperate measures) rather than something you keep around in peacetime.. Every hour that missile spends on that rack reduces its already diminished lifespan.

Why? Those are AAMs that were designed to withstand the high g-forces that they're likely to experience in flight. Just having them on pylons on a SAM will not reduce their life span.

In fact, it is an extremely smart move to utilise AAMs that still have substantial life left. As the Houthi rebels showed, even jury rigged R-73 and R-27 missiles were a huge threat to the Saudi and UAE coaliation fighters over Yemen.

 

[karn]

Why? Those are AAMs that were designed to withstand the high g-forces that they're likely to experience in flight. Just having them on pylons on a SAM will not reduce their life span.

In fact, it is an extremely smart move to utilise AAMs that still have substantial life left. As the Houthi rebels showed, even jury rigged R-73 and R-27 missiles were a huge threat to the Saudi and UAE coaliation fighters over Yemen.

Like I said desperate measures .
There is a reason every modern air defence missile is containerized .. Keeping those missiles exposed to the elements reduces their operational life .

 

[AnantS]

Like I said desperate measures .
There is a reason every modern air defence missile is containerized .. Keeping those missiles exposed to the elements reduces their operational life .

yea even i had same thought why they are not containerized? or is it because they are not going load missile always, only in case of exigencies. And that design helps in quicker manual loading, without needing extra infra for loading containers.

 

[karn]

yea even i had same thought why they are not containerized? or is it because they are not going load missile always, only in case of exigencies.

Why build a containerised system for a missile whose operational life is almost done .. This is fine if we get into an attritional shit fest like ukraine, after the frontline AD is diminished these can be brought out ..

 

[AnantS]

Why build a containerised system for a missile whose operational life is almost done .. This is fine if we get into an attritional shit fest like ukraine, after the frontline AD is diminished these can be brought out ..

not necessary, given infestation of strike drones in today's scenarios - they are good for passive air defence also with frontline troops.

 

[karn]

not necessary, given infestation of strike drones in today's scenarios - they are good for passive air defence also with frontline troops.

Agreed on the drones.
This is airforce though .. All the short range AD systems are with the army.

 

[AnantS]

Agreed on the drones.
This is airforce though .. All the short range AD systems are with the army.

Even in case of air force. Could be complement to their air defence locations. I hope they distribute a rugged containerized system for army too.

 

[johnj]

not necessary, given infestation of strike drones in today's scenarios - they are good for passive air defence also with frontline troops.

Passive air defence using R-73 is not a good idea becz drone can spot air defense first and can destroy or evade it, manpads is better, and most of low cost drone flies lower altitude reducing the passive air defense effeteness. Active AD is better becz it can handle large no.of targets.
In the case of AF, it provide multi layer protection, and help to destroy incoming cruise missile, ALCM, standoff missile etc.