India Cold Start Doctrine and Pakistan's Tactical Nukes

[Indx TechStyle]

don't blame pakistan for soviet invasion in afghanistan.

We blame Pakistan for instability and Taliban in Afghanistan which is absolute truth. If Afghans are suffering today, its only & only because of Pakistan.

jinah made the right decision because congress already rejected our rights.

Which rights Congress rejected? There was no dispute.
Problem is Muslims were living and moving in their own worlds. They didn't fought for India's freedom but Khalifa of Turkey. Then they rejected democracy, demanded to become ruling class.

It wasn't their "right" in anyway. Nor getting land for making Pakistan was ever their right either.

muslims were clever and they planned for a seperate homeland.

Theives!! Territorial thieves.

i don't care if you call us mughals or biharis or afghans.

We don't call you anything. We still call you a part of India. It's you guys who are hell bent on proving yourself Turks & Arabs.

There are even pathetic Pakistanis who even declare that Pakistan was never a part of India. For saying this, they even call India an artificial nation and undermine a thousands of years old civilization which has stayed on earth even before Christianity and Islam came into existence.

fact is we made the right decision.

History of wars with India, state of your nation and deaths due to terrorism clearly reflects how right you were.

Ever since creation you guys have been trying to compete with India and spending too much on military.

look at india today.

If you come out of your echo chamber and really look at India today, you'd know that Jinnah was an idiot and his theory about Muslim suppression was futile.

Crimes against oppressed are a news in India, not Pakistan. They are as common as daily schedules.

there is no major political party of muslims in india.only few small political parties.

Wadda F? Except BJP, entire group of India's national and almost entire group of India's big regional parties are highly pro Muslim.

In some states, Hindus themselves have to struggle practicing their beliefs. Muslims have exceptional relaxations.

we wanted our share in india.we are very happy in pakistan.

Everyone may be happy in a bubble created by ministry of propaganda. But when the bubble bursts, it hurts really.

You have seen yourself multiple times in life, how long you gonna take to realize.

corruption will end soon.country wants to progress now.

If you wanted to progress actually, you wouldn't have been increasing defense budget even after this huge economic crunch.

Your country is actually reaching culmination. Not going to exist for long or will be left as a lower middle income one for decades now.

bengalis defended lahore in 65 and they defended well.it was unfortunate that we lost bangladesh but we are still one unit.

Pakistan which Jinnah founded ceased to exist on December 14, 1991. Current one you got is a crisis state with no definition.

we have many problems in our country but we are together against any external threat.last night,iaf sent large package of fighter jets towards border.my question is what do you want now? you should de escalate.you are sending large package of fighter jets very frequently.this is not cool.

Your jihad isn't very cool either.
If you actually wanted to say that "we can defend at any cost", first ask Qureshi to stop crying to UNSC for help.

 

[garg_bharat]

"Pakistan which Jinnah founded ceased to exist on December 14, 1991"

I think you want to say 1971.

 

[garg_bharat]

Indx TechStyle,

I do not think Pakistan stopped existing in 1971. That will be a very wrong conclusion.
This game is part ideology part geopolitics.

You have to enter into the mind of people like Musharaff to understand this game.

One must understand enemy's ideology and methods very carefully before drawing any conclusions.

Pakistan's troubles originate in the last twenty years, not before. The start was overt nuclearization of India in 1998.

Pakistan needs to have a very aggressive stance to get what it wants. If Pakistan is forced into a protective shell, it loses.

 

[Bhadra]

don't blame pakistan for soviet invasion in afghanistan.jinah made the right decision because congress already rejected our rights.muslims were clever and they planned for a seperate homeland.i don't care if you call us mughals or biharis or afghans.fact is we made the right decision.look at india today.there is no major political party of muslims in india.only few small political parties.we wanted our share in india.we are very happy in pakistan.corruption will end soon.country wants to progress now.bengalis defended lahore in 65 and they defended well.it was unfortunate that we lost bangladesh but we are still one unit.we have many problems in our country but we are together against any external threat.last night,iaf sent large package of fighter jets towards border.my question is what do you want now? you should de escalate.you are sending large package of fighter jets very frequently.this is not cool.

Your leaders the generation earlier were not at all wise in creation of Pakistan by rejection of the principles of "Rule by Majority" - the democratic principle followed the world over. Those who stayed back are much happier and much powerful in a "pluralist democratic setup" under a constitution than any minority group in Pakistan can ever dream of. That continued inherent tendency not to accept "democratic principles" is the root of all major ills of Pakistan.

Pakistani Leadership again rejected the idea of democracy and "Rule of Majority" in 1970-71 and the result was a second partition of Pakistan. That was the end of idea of a "Homeland for Indian Muslims" and idea of "Two Nation Theory" - the very foundation of Pakistan.Jinnah was buried deeper the second time.

The tradition of rejecting the "Rule of Majority" now spearheaded by Pashtuns, Baloch, Sindhi and Mohajirs against majority of Pakjabies will again lead to third, fourth and fifth partition of Pakistan. The idea of "Exclusivity" has no end.

The saddest part is that you all will cry but none of you will be admitted again in the pous club called India at any cost. At the same time you will not be able to live, whatever may be the form, without India , its lands, waters, her languages, culture, traditions and ethos. Since you are not Indians you have no right over those but will not live without those.
This state of affairs does not speak well of your so called "wise" yelders.

 

[Indx TechStyle]

"Pakistan which Jinnah founded ceased to exist on December 14, 1991"

I think you want to say 1971.

Yeah, typo mistake. Sorry

Indx TechStyle,

I do not think Pakistan stopped existing in 1971. That will be a very wrong conclusion.
This game is part ideology part geopolitics.

That's what I'm saying. The ideology which founded Pakistan collapsed with secession of east Pakistan.
An identity crisis started after that which led to high level propaganda perpetrated on Pakistani people by their establishment and an identity crisis & confusion about history & heritage.

You have to enter into the mind of people like Musharaff to understand this game.

One must understand enemy's ideology and methods very carefully before drawing any conclusions.

Pakistan's troubles originate in the last twenty years, not before. The start was overt nuclearization of India in 1998.

Pakistan needs to have a very aggressive stance to get what it wants. If Pakistan is forced into a protective shell, it loses.

Pakistan's economic troubles started in 90s. With Indian military nuclear program and increased military spending, they were forced to invest higher amount of resources than they should.

Ideological crisis started long back after 1971.

 

[Bhadra]

COLD START DOCTRINE - SUBHASH KAPILA ENUNCIATION
The Indian Political Parameters
​

* Political will to use offensive military power.

* Political will to use pre-emptive military strategies.

* Political sagacity to view strategic military objectives with clarity.

* Political determination to pursue military operations to their ultimate conclusion without succumbing to external pressures.

* Political determination to cross nuclear threshold if Pakistan seems so inclined.

* “Cold Start Strategy” with its inherent character of mobile warfare using mechanized military formations, and especially where defensive formations may be called upon to undertake such operations, may at times involve some loss of territory in plains warfare. Some temporary loss of territory to be accepted.

 

[Bhadra]

COLD START DOCTRINE - SUBHASH KAPILA ENUNCIATION
Strategic Military Objectives​

* Shift from capturing bits of Pakistan territory in small scale multiple offensives to be used as bargaining chips after the cease fire.

* Focus on the destruction of the Pakistani Army and its military machine without much collateral damage to Pakistani civilians.


All the three armed forces have to synergise operations towards destruction of the Pakistan Army as it is that which enslaves Pakistan, impedes democracy in Pakistan and indulges in military adventurism against India, including proxy wars and terrorism.

 

[binayak95]

I am grateful to Jinnah - it's better we are rid of that cancerous cist of territory called Pakistan today.

Since Ashoka's time, the entire area, Afghanistan and Pakistan, have been a cesspool of insurrections and instability.

Ashoka rose to prominence for violently crushing a rebellion in Gandahar; and ever since then, the area has been ungovernable. Its Geography - a badlands crisscrossed by thousands of small mountain ridges and ranges is impossible to police and maintain control over.

Everyone has tried their luck in the area, the Delhi Sultanate, the Mughals, the Sikhs, the British, the Russians, and now the Americans.

Had this territory been a part of our nation, it would have sapped us of all our economic and political will.

Better we are rid of it.

Even better, we should do what Rome did to Carthage.

 

[Bhadra]

COLD START DOCTRINE - SUBHASH KAPILA ENUNCIATION
Imperatives of Cold Start Doctrine
​

* Dedicated Air Force Close Air Support and Dedicated Ground Attack Squadrons: The Indian Air Force (IAF) would have a very crucial and critical role to play in the successful implementation of this new war doctrine. The “Cold Start” eight or so “battle groups” cannot undertake “blitzkrieg” type military operations without an overwhelming air superiority and integrated close air support.

* Achieve overall air superiority so as to paralyse the enemy’s Air Force or render it so ineffective as to be unable to seriously affect the area of operations of the “Cold Start” offensive “battle groups”.

* Dedicate a fair portion of its combat assets for the air defence of the Indian homeland.

* Earmark dedicated close air support and ground attack squadrons in direct support of the “battle groups”.

* Navy Aviation Support and amphibious operations deep in the enemy’s rear.

* Conventional Short Range Battle Field Missiles (SRBM) and Cruise Missiles . Conventional SRBMs and cruise missiles. application of long range devastating fire power.

* ICBM back up would be necessary to ward off external coercive pressures.

* Employment of :

* Special Forces
* Air Assault Divisions.
* Air Cavalry brigades.
* Light infantry divisions with air-transportable combat power.

* Logistic Support For Cold War Doctrine.

* Army's own aviation assets for logistics support.

 

[Bhadra]

I am grateful to Jinnah - it's better we are rid of that cancerous cist of territory called Pakistan today.

Since Ashoka's time, the entire area, Afghanistan and Pakistan, have been a cesspool of insurrections and instability.

Ashoka rose to prominence for violently crushing a rebellion in Gandahar; and ever since then, the area has been ungovernable. Its Geography - a badlands crisscrossed by thousands of small mountain ridges and ranges is impossible to police and maintain control over.

Everyone has tried their luck in the area, the Delhi Sultanate, the Mughals, the Sikhs, the British, the Russians, and now the Americans.

Had this territory been a part of our nation, it would have sapped us of all our economic and political will.

Better we are rid of it.

Even better, we should do what Rome did to Carthage.

Yes, I am also grateful to Jinnah for taking half the scum of Ganga Jamuni with him to be punished, orphaned and made second grade citizens in Pakistan. They have been castigated as permanent " Refugees (Muhajirs) and in every walk of life they have to prove themselves to be Pakistani. They were the root cause of partition as the Punjabis, Pashtuns, Sindhis and Baloch never wanted any partition.

Unfortunately, the other half of Ganga - Jamuni left over in India are today still creating all problem - you name it - Babri Masjid, Teen Talaq, Uniform civil Code, Madrasa, ghettos, cow slaughter, blackmailing all political parties, fundamentalism, Wahhabism etc. How can they leave their cultural underpinnings.

So far control over Pakistan is concerned, I am sure they are going to be governed by "Indian Cold Start" henceforth. The start has been made and it is no longer possible to kill the doctrine by anyone including Congress as they have done from 2004 to 2013. Now the people will demand it.

However, any one who climbs up the throne of Pakistan chants "india India" and any one who is thrown down again chants "India India".....

 

[Bhadra]

COLD START DOCTRINE - SUBHASH KAPILA ENUNCIATION
Military Challenges to Pakistan​

* India’s “surprise” factor in terms of when, where and how “Cold Start” battle group would be launched.

* Fighting the air-battle in an environment where the IAF has a significant superiority in numbers and quality of numerical strength.

* Devising a credible anti-ballistic missile defence.

* Re-constitution of Pakistan’s “strike corps” and its three ‘Army Reserve’ formations which were so far configured and located to take on India’s three “Strike Corps”.

* When and how does Pakistan’s nuclear deterrent and its doctrine of “First Use” comes into play.

* How to offset India’s overwhelming long range artillery fire support.

* How to counter India’s force projection capabilities deep in Pakistan’s rear.

 

[Megalomaniac]

I don't understand how Pakistani will use their Nasr? Forget the transportation, the moment they are moved out of their storage facility, our systems will know. Brahmos will finish them quickly. or Pinaka MBRL is also useful if they are within range.

 

[Shiv sagar]

i am very sorry to discuss it here.actually i am banned on that particular thread.indian members requested my ban to mods.i think you should give us chance to speak.we can't solve our problems if we remain hostile towards each other.

Who are you to solve India Pak issues? Stop living in a fool's paradise. The only issue between India and pakistan is of terrorism sponsored by pakistan and we are helping to get your terrorist, jannath asap. So my advice to you is to fck off

 

[garg_bharat]

I don't understand how Pakistani will use their Nasr? Forget the transportation, the moment they are moved out of their storage facility, our systems will know. Brahmos will finish them quickly. or Pinaka MBRL is also useful if they are within range.

Boss war is not a video game.
Leave it to experts.

 

[Bhadra]

I don't understand how Pakistani will use their Nasr? Forget the transportation, the moment they are moved out of their storage facility, our systems will know. Brahmos will finish them quickly. or Pinaka MBRL is also useful if they are within range.

COLD START DOCTRINE - SUBHASH KAPILA ENUNCIATION
Pakistan’s Nuclear Deterrent and the Myth of Pakistan’s Low Nuclear Threshold
​

The Indian political leadership and its national security establishment fed on US academia planted stories (probably officially inspired) of Pakistan nuclear deterrent and Pakistan’s low nuclear threshold have been inordinately awed by its fearful consequences.

* Pakistan has declared that it will go for nuclear strikes against India when a significant portion of its territory has been captured or likely to be captured. Secondly, when a significant destruction of the Pakistani military military machine has taken place or when Pakistani strategic assets (read nuclear deterrent) are endangered.

* India’s “Cold Start” war doctrine does not seem to be allowing Pakistan to reach at the above conclusions by indulging in deep long range penetrative strikes.

* The Indian doctrine seems to be aimed at inflicting significant military reverses on the Pakistan Army in a limited war scenario short of a nuclear war.

* Nuclear war fare is not a “commando raid” or “command operation” with which its present military ruler is more familiar. Crossing the nuclear threshold is so fateful a decision that even strong American Presidents in the past have baulked at exercising it or the prospects of exercising it.

* Pakistan cannot expect that India would sit idle and suffer a Pakistani nuclear strike without a massive nuclear retaliation.

* Pakistan’s external strategic patrons can coerce or dissuade both sides to avoid a nuclear conflict, but once Pakistan uses a nuclear first strike no power can restrain India from going in from its nuclear retaliation and the consequences for Pakistan in that case stand well discussed in strategic circles. Pakistan would stand wiped out.

 

[Arsalan123]

We blame Pakistan for instability and Taliban in Afghanistan which is absolute truth. If Afghans are suffering today, its only & only because of Pakistan.

Which rights Congress rejected? There was no dispute.
Problem is Muslims were living and moving in their own worlds. They didn't fought for India's freedom but Khalifa of Turkey. Then they rejected democracy, demanded to become ruling class.

It wasn't their "right" in anyway. Nor getting land for making Pakistan was ever their right either.

Theives!! Territorial thieves.

We don't call you anything. We still call you a part of India. It's you guys who are hell bent on proving yourself Turks & Arabs.

There are even pathetic Pakistanis who even declare that Pakistan was never a part of India. For saying this, they even call India an artificial nation and undermine a thousands of years old civilization which has stayed on earth even before Christianity and Islam came into existence.

History of wars with India, state of your nation and deaths due to terrorism clearly reflects how right you were.

Ever since creation you guys have been trying to compete with India and spending too much on military.

If you come out of your echo chamber and really look at India today, you'd know that Jinnah was an idiot and his theory about Muslim suppression was futile.

Crimes against oppressed are a news in India, not Pakistan. They are as common as daily schedules.

Wadda F? Except BJP, entire group of India's national and almost entire group of India's big regional parties are highly pro Muslim.

In some states, Hindus themselves have to struggle practicing their beliefs. Muslims have exceptional relaxations.

Everyone may be happy in a bubble created by ministry of propaganda. But when the bubble bursts, it hurts really.

You have seen yourself multiple times in life, how long you gonna take to realize.

If you wanted to progress actually, you wouldn't have been increasing defense budget even after this huge economic crunch.

Your country is actually reaching culmination. Not going to exist for long or will be left as a lower middle income one for decades now.

Pakistan which Jinnah founded ceased to exist on December 14, 1991. Current one you got is a crisis state with no definition.

Your jihad isn't very cool either.
If you actually wanted to say that "we can defend at any cost", first ask Qureshi to stop crying to UNSC for help.

pakistan exist today.why do you think that you deserves all land? there is no logic.there were different groups living in india and even today,muslims can't speak anything against major indian political parties.is this fair? and you know about food problems and religion problems.british took india from muslims and not from hindus.you are lucky to have a big country and we are unlucky to have such a smaller country.british did injustice in partition but that's okay.that's fine.i think with kashmir,everything will calm down but not on indian terms.there are also people living in pakistan.we can't think about india every time.so much corruption unemployment here but at least we can do whatever we want in our country.you are making fun of jinnah but he did a great job.nothing happened on 1991. do you want pakistan to abandon kashmir just like bangladesh? this will not happen.i don't care about jehad.i am sick and tired of all blames on us.they aren't true.

 

[aghamarshana]

pakistan exist today.why do you think that you deserves all land? there is no logic.there were different groups living in india and even today,muslims can't speak anything against major indian political parties.is this fair? and you know about food problems and religion problems.british took india from muslims and not from hindus.you are lucky to have a big country and we are unlucky to have such a smaller country.british did injustice in partition but that's okay.that's fine.i think with kashmir,everything will calm down but not on indian terms.there are also people living in pakistan.we can't think about india every time.so much corruption unemployment here but at least we can do whatever we want in our country.you are making fun of jinnah but he did a great job.nothing happened on 1991. do you want pakistan to abandon kashmir just like bangladesh? this will not happen.i don't care about jehad.i am sick and tired of all blames on us.they aren't true.

There comes the real Arsalan. From whom did British take India?Muslims? Rofl.
Hindustan it was. Hindustan it is. Hindustan it'll be.
Hindustan is Land of Hindus.
Deal with it,man. And trust me,we'll reclaim wat is ours.

 

[Indx TechStyle]

pakistan exist today.

Leftover of 1971 crisis exists today, ideological Pakistan has collapsed with failure of two nation theory and it's irrefutable.

why do you think that you deserves all land? there is no logic.

Logic involved is simple. Islam is not a part of Dharmic civilization.

there were different groups living in india and even today, muslims can't speak anything against major indian political parties.is this fair?!

What makes you think Muslims have no say in India? They have exceptional privileges for personal laws, can give any statement deserving sedition and even escape being minorities.

and you know about food problems and religion problems.

We both have different scale of problems, different scales for measuring them and different rate of improvement. So, let's not compare.

british took india from muslims and not from hindus.

British took India from both groups.

There is no point why another Chandragupta Maurya wouldn't have been born even Hindus themselves wouldn't have revolt.

you are lucky to have a big country and we are unlucky to have such a smaller country.

We are unlucky actually to get divided and getting all geographical advantages dumped.
We didn't get such big country after freedom. We re-integrated our states with Union after that throughout years.

british did injustice in partition but that's okay.that's fine.

British gave 30%+ territory to just 23% Muslims.

i think with kashmir,everything will calm down

That's why you are stupid. Kashmir was never unrest before 80s unless you started your jihad.

but not on indian terms.

We will see.

there are also people living in pakistan.we can't think about india every time.

Who asked you guys to do so? It's your nation's aim to prove itself the "rival" of my nation while vice versa isn't true.

so much corruption unemployment here but at least we can do whatever we want in our country.

Pathetic joke, Pakistan isn't even a proper democracy. Even that improper semi authoritarian rule was substituted by military for 32 years.

you are making fun of jinnah but he did a great job.

He is sole responsible person for millions of deaths during partition and after that (Islamic extremism) in India, Pakistan and around the world.

nothing happened on 1991.

1971*

do you want pakistan to abandon kashmir just like bangladesh? this will not happen.

We are watching, probably why you guys are ready to put Kashmir quagmire on backfoot and talk terrorism (India's terms of relations) first.

i don't care about jehad.i am sick and tired of all blames on us.they aren't true.

Keep crying, your leaders and your people have openly endorsed, encouraged and waged your stupid suicidal religious battle on innocent people. That's not a blame, many of you still take pride in it.

Eventually, you guys are going to pay heavily for every single drop of blood.

 

[darshan978]

pakistan exist today.why do you think that you deserves all land? there is no logic.there were different groups living in india and even today,muslims can't speak anything against major indian political parties.is this fair? and you know about food problems and religion problems.british took india from muslims and not from hindus.you are lucky to have a big country and we are unlucky to have such a smaller country.british did injustice in partition but that's okay.that's fine.i think with kashmir,everything will calm down but not on indian terms.there are also people living in pakistan.we can't think about india every time.so much corruption unemployment here but at least we can do whatever we want in our country.you are making fun of jinnah but he did a great job.nothing happened on 1991. do you want pakistan to abandon kashmir just like bangladesh? this will not happen.i don't care about jehad.i am sick and tired of all blames on us.they aren't true.

What type of share you wanted in india bro?
Poitical ? So that even after mughal rule you guys keep converting? Ever seen minority rule majority in country? Why dont you guys give pm seat to a hindus then? What if hindus suddenly start demanding separate state in pakistan? This is what you will feel what we feel now...

 

[itsme]

pakistan exist today.why do you think that you deserves all land? there is no logic.there were different groups living in india and even today,muslims can't speak anything against major indian political parties.is this fair? and you know about food problems and religion problems.british took india from muslims and not from hindus.you are lucky to have a big country and we are unlucky to have such a smaller country.british did injustice in partition but that's okay.that's fine.i think with kashmir,everything will calm down but not on indian terms.there are also people living in pakistan.we can't think about india every time.so much corruption unemployment here but at least we can do whatever we want in our country.you are making fun of jinnah but he did a great job.nothing happened on 1991. do you want pakistan to abandon kashmir just like bangladesh? this will not happen.i don't care about jehad.i am sick and tired of all blames on us.they aren't true.

First bolded part- Have you been following Indian politics? Muslims have enough rights in India don't you see the things they say about our current govt? Don't you see the support they enjoy? Saying Muslims don't have enough rights or voice is India is purely a Pakistani thing.

Second, bolded part- Not true, I suggest you look up history, Maratha and Sikh empire was the dominant one during the British colonization, Mughals were in super decline.