Eurofighter EF-2000 Typhoon

[Flame Thrower]

Typhoons were produced in large numbers and yet there is a shortage of spares.

We never had serious issues with Hawk, maybe because it is manufactured in house.

The worst part is other planes being cannibalised for spares. I hope once the spares are available those birds can be reviewed.

Another commonality between India and British. But we're hell lot better than British in this regard.

If the founders of EF are facing such spare shortages then what is the fate of buyers!!!

Kudos to Dassault in this(spare management) regard.

 

[Armand2REP]

Typhoons were produced in large numbers and yet there is a shortage of spares.

We never had serious issues with Hawk, maybe because it is manufactured in house.

The worst part is other planes being cannibalised for spares. I hope once the spares are available those birds can be reviewed.

Another commonality between India and British. But we're hell lot better than British in this regard.

If the founders of EF are facing such spare shortages then what is the fate of buyers!!!

Kudos to Dassault in this(spare management) regard.

India's Hawk trainers are not without their own spare issues.

http://archive.indianexpress.com/ne...for-want-of-spare-parts-says-antony/1046762/0

Austria was so angry over cost and delay of spares they sued... and won.

 

[Flame Thrower]

India's Hawk trainers are not without their own spare issues.

http://archive.indianexpress.com/ne...for-want-of-spare-parts-says-antony/1046762/0

Austria was so angry over cost and delay of spares they sued... and won.

Not a huge issue.

We had worse with our flankers....

But that's a thing of past(in both Flankers and Hawks)

 

[Immanuel]

Typhoons were produced in large numbers and yet there is a shortage of spares.

We never had serious issues with Hawk, maybe because it is manufactured in house.

The worst part is other planes being cannibalised for spares. I hope once the spares are available those birds can be reviewed.

Another commonality between India and British. But we're hell lot better than British in this regard.

If the founders of EF are facing such spare shortages then what is the fate of buyers!!!

Kudos to Dassault in this(spare management) regard.

Easier for Dassault, since they don't have as much orders or deliveries.

 

[Immanuel]

Keep in mind, Rafale in the French AFwith far less orders or deliveries has availability in the mid 40s, not that great either.

 

[Flame Thrower]

Easier for Dassault, since they don't have as much orders or deliveries.

It works in the opposite way.

C'mon man, numbers means cheaper production costs, consistent order of supplies from 2/3 tier vendors. Availability of spares, better prospects of MLU and all that. Better inventory management....so on and so forth

 

[Flame Thrower]

Keep in mind, Rafale in the French AFwith far less orders or deliveries has availability in the mid 40s, not that great either.

None of them are facing sevre shortages where other planes are being ripped for spares

 

[Armand2REP]

Keep in mind, Rafale in the French AFwith far less orders or deliveries has availability in the mid 40s, not that great either.

48.5% availability within 6 hours for Rafale is far better than the 5% availability of Eurofighter. Indian availability rates are not measured within 6hrs. According to Indian standards Rafale will have at least 75% availability at all times.

 

[Immanuel]

It works in the opposite way.

C'mon man, numbers means cheaper production costs, consistent order of supplies from 2/3 tier vendors. Availability of spares, better prospects of MLU and all that. Better inventory management....so on and so forth

Yes numbers can mean that but it also depends on usage, at the moment there is a crunch in F-16 spares due to much higher usage and parts going in for SLEP etc.

MKI's availability in the past of around 50% was due to higher usage with many aircraft flying well over 270hrs per year. Thus leading to more aircraft requiring overhaul faster.

 

[Immanuel]

48.5% availability within 6 hours for Rafale is far better than the 5% availability of Eurofighter. Indian availability rates are not measured within 6hrs. According to Indian standards Rafale will have at least 75% availability at all times.

Well Dassault will to deliver 75% availability, we'll see exactly how the finally turns out. I think for a small fleet such costs are bareble but once you have a big enough fleet, don't be surprised if eventual rafales spend most of their time sitting in a climate controlled shelter just like they do in France.

 

[Armand2REP]

Well Dassault will to deliver 75% availability, we'll see exactly how the finally turns out. I think for a small fleet such costs are bareble but once you have a big enough fleet, don't be surprised if eventual rafales spend most of their time sitting in a climate controlled shelter just like they do in France.

If availability rate of Rafale is measured in Indian terms it is over 80%, much higher than anything in IAF which is why Dassault has no problem paying fines if it drops below 75%.

 

[Immanuel]

Do you really believe this news!!??

Germany spends €38.5 billion.

Something is definitely off, but I doubt availability is definitely more than 10 planes or no.of missiles available as stated in the article.

Well the report could be true or probably is. But, you see it's all about context or the way the message is delivered. This issue if true, seems more due to a faulty IFF system which thus results in the grounding of the fighter for combat. But, even without it I am sure most if not half of the fighters can fly, being flight worthy or being combat worthy are completely different things.

After 2 Mirages crashed in a matter of couple of days, IAF too grounded the aircraft thus availability at that point was 0.

 

[Immanuel]

If availability rate of Rafale is measured in Indian terms it is over 80%, much higher than anything in IAF which is why Dassault has no problem paying fines if it drops below 75%.

Please, already MKI has attained an availability of 75%. Rafale can match that easily for 36 aircraft, the problem of operational costs really only come in when you speak of a fleet of 100+ I am sure Dassult can easily maintain 80% for IAF for 36 or 100 aircrat, doesn't matter much really as far as Dassult is concerned. I am more concerned that IAF will stockpile a lot of spares and keep a few flying in every sqd while the rest in hangers tucked away for a rainy day.

 

[Armand2REP]

Please, already MKI has attained an availability of 75%. Rafale can match that easily for 36 aircraft, the problem of operational costs really only come in when you speak of a fleet of 100+ I am sure Dassult can easily maintain 80% for IAF for 36 or 100 aircrat, doesn't matter much really as far as Dassult is concerned. I am more concerned that IAF will stockpile a lot of spares and keep a few flying in every sqd while the rest in hangers tucked away for a rainy day.

According to CAG the 24hr availability rate of MKI is 55%, much lower than Rafale. Even if they were successful in getting all their spares it would still only be 66%. The smaller the fleet the harder it is to get percentages up as one fighter down carries far more weight and the less likely a stockpile of spares would be procured in numbers. Dassault doesn't stockpile spares as their supply chain would be disrupted with any gaps. The bigger the fleet size the better the supplier situation which is why we want to sell more and more. At the end of the day you can have all spares for all planes, Rafale will still have the higher percentage as it doesn't require such high maintenance hours as MKI.

 

[Sancho]

Typhoons were produced in large numbers and yet there is a shortage of spares.

The one has nothing to do with the other. Spare supply is dependent on orders of the customers, but governments tend to keep spares at minimum to reduce costs in the defence budgets. That then translates into shortages of available spares and we have seen the same for the MKI for example, that improved it's availability, after Parrikar ordered more spares, just as the F18SH availability got reduced in USN, when Obama reduced spending on spares.

 

[Sancho]

Some more EF news




And more beautiful pics

 

[Immanuel]

According to CAG the 24hr availability rate of MKI is 55%, much lower than Rafale. Even if they were successful in getting all their spares it would still only be 66%. The smaller the fleet the harder it is to get percentages up as one fighter down carries far more weight and the less likely a stockpile of spares would be procured in numbers. Dassault doesn't stockpile spares as their supply chain would be disrupted with any gaps. The bigger the fleet size the better the supplier situation which is why we want to sell more and more. At the end of the day you can have all spares for all planes, Rafale will still have the higher percentage as it doesn't require such high maintenance hours as MKI.

Thats more than 4 years ago, today MKI's peace time availability has already hit 75%, the desired level. Gagan Shakti excercise was primarily a test to see what the availability can be in a war time scenarios and IAF was able to demonstrate well over 80% throughout it's fighter fleet. MKI availability was over 90%. Tejas 100%. Rafale is indeed less maintainance but Rafale also doesn't have TVC and can't do the things an MKI aerodynamically can. MKI also has a higher top speed & a higher flight cieling. All such only adds to more wear & tear on the aircraft.

MKI are also being used like a workhorse. If more Rafales are ordered, I think IAF will soon realize what a financially painful experience it is to operate them at over 70% availability, over time IAF will probably have only 50% availability for Rafale.

 

[Armand2REP]

Thats more than 4 years ago, today MKI's peace time availability has already hit 75%, the desired level. Gagan Shakti excercise was primarily a test to see what the availability can be in a war time scenarios and IAF was able to demonstrate well over 80% throughout it's fighter fleet. MKI availability was over 90%. Tejas 100%. Rafale is indeed less maintainance but Rafale also doesn't have TVC and can't do the things an MKI aerodynamically can. MKI also has a higher top speed & a higher flight cieling. All such only adds to more wear & tear on the aircraft.

MKI are also being used like a workhorse. If more Rafales are ordered, I think IAF will soon realize what a financially painful experience it is to operate them at over 70% availability, over time IAF will probably have only 50% availability for Rafale.

It was not four years ago and at last count it had only reached 63%. Aircraft availability during any exercise is only measured among flight worthy aircraft that partake in the exercise and those will be the ones at the highest state of readiness.

MKI is an air-superiority fighter, the bomb trucks are the workhorses. Rafale will always have a higher availability unless no spares are ordered.

 

[Immanuel]

It was not four years ago and at last count it had only reached 63%. Aircraft availability during any exercise is only measured among flight worthy aircraft that partake in the exercise and those will be the ones at the highest state of readiness.

MKI is an air-superiority fighter, the bomb trucks are the workhorses. Rafale will always have a higher availability unless no spares are ordered.

Not true, nearly 4 year old news. Problem came to light in 2014, 2015 corrective steps were started and there was an increase in availability of around 7-8% every 8-9 months. By Jan 2017, it was 60% with over 16 months since then and a gradual increase we are easily at 75% today. Gagan Shakti was planned from 9 months ago knowning many aircraft apart from just the MKI will also get in the 70% availability range by early this year. Actions taken were meant for fleet wide and not just MKI.

http://www.defenseworld.net/news/18...To_60_per_cent__Manohar_Parrikar#.WvA_bssUncs

http://ajaishukla.blogspot.de/2014/10/government-takes-note-of-su-30mkis-poor.html

You seem to forget the MKI will always be a bigger bomb truck in the IAF more than the Rafale, it has virtually all air launched weapons in IAF inventory strapped onto it

 

[Armand2REP]

Not true, nearly 4 year old news. Problem came to light in 2014, 2015 corrective steps were started and there was an increase in availability of around 7-8% every 8-9 months. By Jan 2017, it was 60% with over 16 months since then and a gradual increase we are easily at 75% today. Gagan Shakti was planned from 9 months ago knowning many aircraft apart from just the MKI will also get in the 70% availability range by early this year. Actions taken were meant for fleet wide and not just MKI.

http://www.defenseworld.net/news/18...To_60_per_cent__Manohar_Parrikar#.WvA_bssUncs

http://ajaishukla.blogspot.de/2014/10/government-takes-note-of-su-30mkis-poor.html

You seem to forget the MKI will always be a bigger bomb truck in the IAF more than the Rafale, it has virtually all air launched weapons in IAF inventory strapped onto it

Don't post that Ajay Shukla garbage, he is a paid shill to bash the MKI and anything that isn't the F-35. Your most recent source says it is only 60% and I just told you it is up to 63%. The availability during an exercise has nothing to do with fleet wide availability... I already told you so get it through your head. I don't like repeating myself.