t_co
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nice catch. Poor Anand.
China tops the world in number of new Navy ship launched in 2012
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nice catch. Poor Anand.CMS has got an additional budget allocation of some 10 billion yuan to build tens of surveillance vessels for use in the South China Sea and the East Sea。WC，amongst the many shipyards which won orders，has started on 9 ships totalling 350，,000 tonnes：5X3000-tonne and 4X5000-tonne。
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Given the US initiative to forge some sort of a defence shield and tighten the noose around China, it is absolutely a prerequisite of China to expand its Navy as quickly as feasible so as to keep these nations of the US initiative at bay.
A greater flurry in construction of military naval vessels of various sizes and capabilities will be seen in the near future.
It is also in the US interest to ensure that China spends in a massive way on defence so that it has a slowdown in the other sectors of China's growth story so that China slows down as a competitor in the world markets, cannot spend on urgently required social needs and thereby leading to greater inequality and adding to the social disharmony.
The US should never be underestimated in their designs.
A greater flurry in construction of military naval vessels of various sizes and capabilities will be seen in the near future.
It is also in the US interest to ensure that China spends in a massive way on defence so that it has a slowdown in the other sectors of China's growth story so that China slows down as a competitor in the world markets, cannot spend on urgently required social needs and thereby leading to greater inequality and adding to the social disharmony.
The US should never be underestimated in their designs.
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satish007
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well done, what's the source, Anand's pictures are too small to read.
Dont worry. China still spends less on military than India does as percentage of GDP.
SIPRI Publications
With an annual GDP growth rate of 7 % they can still afford double digits raise in military expenditures.
t_co
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FYI, a large part of the reason why China is making so many ships right now is because the freight charter rates are low and a lot of shipping lines are canceling orders. Chinese, South Korean, and Japanese shipyards are running at combined averages of only 50% capacity. The shipbuilding program of the Chinese Navy is one part taking advantage of that empty space in the dockyard schedule, and another part using the military budget to keep Chinese shipyards more profitable than their Korean and Japanese counterparts.
Because shipyard capacity is inflexible while demand for cargo ships is very volatile relative to global economic health, the navies of large shipbuilding countries tend to expand heavily in economic recessions. (For example, see how the US, German, and Japanese navies each saw the launch of numerous new battleships, cruisers, and aircraft carriers in the 1930s).
This effect does not apply to nations which must import their ships from overseas shipyards, though.
One thing that does impress me, though, regarding the Chinese shipbuilding program is how quickly they're able to integrate new technologies into mass produced ship models. Their newest AESA radars, for example, only came out of prototyping a few years ago, and now they're going to go to sea on 4 new ships at a time. In terms applying technology to mass production, I think Chinese shipyards are hitting world-class levels. The Russians and Americans have nothing to teach China in that regard.
Because shipyard capacity is inflexible while demand for cargo ships is very volatile relative to global economic health, the navies of large shipbuilding countries tend to expand heavily in economic recessions. (For example, see how the US, German, and Japanese navies each saw the launch of numerous new battleships, cruisers, and aircraft carriers in the 1930s).
This effect does not apply to nations which must import their ships from overseas shipyards, though.
One thing that does impress me, though, regarding the Chinese shipbuilding program is how quickly they're able to integrate new technologies into mass produced ship models. Their newest AESA radars, for example, only came out of prototyping a few years ago, and now they're going to go to sea on 4 new ships at a time. In terms applying technology to mass production, I think Chinese shipyards are hitting world-class levels. The Russians and Americans have nothing to teach China in that regard.
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Impluseblade
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Anand, tell us your real name and let's play the name game:
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China's defence budget is not really disclosed.
It is a fudge.
China's real defense budget almost double official figure, military sources say
BEIJING--China's actual defense budget for fiscal 2011 was about 1.7 times higher than the officially announced figure, according to a high-ranking Chinese military officer.
There have long been suspicions that Beijing was spending much more on its defense than the official figures released annually.
This latest revelation only serves to cast doubt on Beijing's March 4 announcement about planned defense spending for fiscal 2012.
China announced it will spend 670.2 billion yuan (8.7 trillion yen, or $106.4 billion) in fiscal 2012, an increase of 11.2 percent over the previous fiscal year.
That would mark the second straight year of announced double-digit increases in defense spending. However, the actual amount earmarked for the Chinese military is almost certainly considerably larger.
The increase in defense spending will exceed the 9.2 percent rate at which China's gross domestic product increased last year.
In dollars, it will exceed $100 billion for the first time this year.
China's defense spending exceeded that of Japan in 2007. Now, China is expected to rank second only to the United States in defense spending for the third straight year.
The discrepancy in the official defense spending figure and the amount actually allotted is due to the cost of research and development of new weapons as well as the procurement of special equipment from overseas, which are not included in the defense budget, the Chinese source said.
Those costs are often included in the budgets of other government ministries, such as the finance ministry, sources said.
Because China has not been forthcoming about its overall government budget figures, there is no way of knowing how much in the budgets of other ministries is being set aside for defense purposes.
A key member of the China Institute for International Strategic Studies, a military-affiliated think tank, divulged the 1.7 figure during a closed-door meeting in February in Beijing involving defense officials of a foreign nation.
The individual, who holds the rank of major general, said, "There are differences in the budget structure and the definition of national defense expenses in comparison to other nations such as the United States."
A researcher at another military-affiliated think tank noted that the United States "also does not include development expenses for nuclear weapons in its national defense expenses."
Because of these differences, a number of military sources said that some of the expenses for the development and manufacture of weapons systems such as the next-generation stealth fighter Jian-20 and the Dong Feng-21D anti-ship ballistic missile, also called a "carrier killer," are not included in the defense budget.
Costs to refit the Soviet-era Varyag aircraft carrier, as well as expenses for developing the technology used to build China's first flattop, are also not included in the defense budget.
The actual cost of constructing China's first domestically-made aircraft carrier--an estimated $20 billion (about 1.6 trillion yen)--is also not included in the defense budget.
The Chinese Defense Ministry has explained that defense spending is equally divided into three parts, composed of living expenses for military personnel; training expenses; and military equipment expenses.
Li Zhaoxing, a spokesman for the National People's Congress, said, "Expenses related to research, experiments and purchase of all weapons are included in the national defense budget announced every year and the degree of transparency is high."
However, other experts cast doubt on that claim.
The International Institute for Strategic Studies in Britain has estimated that actual defense spending is about three times the official figure.
Ryo Asano, a professor at Doshisha University who is knowledgeable about Chinese politics, released calculations last year that said the actual defense spending by China was between 1.5 and 2 times the official figures.
Asano said, "There are many aspects about which we know very little, including why is it possible for the military to use the budgets of other ministries and the names of the officials who are truly in charge of managing the national defense budget."
China's real defense budget almost double official figure, military sources say - AJW by The Asahi Shimbun
It is a fudge.
China's real defense budget almost double official figure, military sources say
BEIJING--China's actual defense budget for fiscal 2011 was about 1.7 times higher than the officially announced figure, according to a high-ranking Chinese military officer.
There have long been suspicions that Beijing was spending much more on its defense than the official figures released annually.
This latest revelation only serves to cast doubt on Beijing's March 4 announcement about planned defense spending for fiscal 2012.
China announced it will spend 670.2 billion yuan (8.7 trillion yen, or $106.4 billion) in fiscal 2012, an increase of 11.2 percent over the previous fiscal year.
That would mark the second straight year of announced double-digit increases in defense spending. However, the actual amount earmarked for the Chinese military is almost certainly considerably larger.
The increase in defense spending will exceed the 9.2 percent rate at which China's gross domestic product increased last year.
In dollars, it will exceed $100 billion for the first time this year.
China's defense spending exceeded that of Japan in 2007. Now, China is expected to rank second only to the United States in defense spending for the third straight year.
The discrepancy in the official defense spending figure and the amount actually allotted is due to the cost of research and development of new weapons as well as the procurement of special equipment from overseas, which are not included in the defense budget, the Chinese source said.
Those costs are often included in the budgets of other government ministries, such as the finance ministry, sources said.
Because China has not been forthcoming about its overall government budget figures, there is no way of knowing how much in the budgets of other ministries is being set aside for defense purposes.
A key member of the China Institute for International Strategic Studies, a military-affiliated think tank, divulged the 1.7 figure during a closed-door meeting in February in Beijing involving defense officials of a foreign nation.
The individual, who holds the rank of major general, said, "There are differences in the budget structure and the definition of national defense expenses in comparison to other nations such as the United States."
A researcher at another military-affiliated think tank noted that the United States "also does not include development expenses for nuclear weapons in its national defense expenses."
Because of these differences, a number of military sources said that some of the expenses for the development and manufacture of weapons systems such as the next-generation stealth fighter Jian-20 and the Dong Feng-21D anti-ship ballistic missile, also called a "carrier killer," are not included in the defense budget.
Costs to refit the Soviet-era Varyag aircraft carrier, as well as expenses for developing the technology used to build China's first flattop, are also not included in the defense budget.
The actual cost of constructing China's first domestically-made aircraft carrier--an estimated $20 billion (about 1.6 trillion yen)--is also not included in the defense budget.
The Chinese Defense Ministry has explained that defense spending is equally divided into three parts, composed of living expenses for military personnel; training expenses; and military equipment expenses.
Li Zhaoxing, a spokesman for the National People's Congress, said, "Expenses related to research, experiments and purchase of all weapons are included in the national defense budget announced every year and the degree of transparency is high."
However, other experts cast doubt on that claim.
The International Institute for Strategic Studies in Britain has estimated that actual defense spending is about three times the official figure.
Ryo Asano, a professor at Doshisha University who is knowledgeable about Chinese politics, released calculations last year that said the actual defense spending by China was between 1.5 and 2 times the official figures.
Asano said, "There are many aspects about which we know very little, including why is it possible for the military to use the budgets of other ministries and the names of the officials who are truly in charge of managing the national defense budget."
China's real defense budget almost double official figure, military sources say - AJW by The Asahi Shimbun
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Good excuse.
The 'idiot' countries of the world are duty bound to debate and discuss the Defence Budget in their Parliament because it the the Peoples' money and not the money of the Party as in China.
The only no idiot country is China.
But then who are the idiots is the issue - those who make it incumbent on their representatives in Parliament to account for the tax payers money.or the ones who have no right to know anything of governance including spending like Chinese, who are kept clueless.
DivineHeretic
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Well Sir, it is not completely true that we disclose our full defence expenditure followed by the western nations according to the UN recommendations.
Below is an article which though not completely accurate is an estimation of just how much our true expenditure is.....
This is 2008 article on defence budget of India (sorry if already posted), it gives a good insight in Indian defence budget. As per the article Indian defence budget is atleast 25% more than officially acknowledged-The defence allocation in the Budget that Mr Chidambaram presented on February 29 officially went up 10%, from Rs 96,000 crore last year to Rs 1,05,600 crore. But actual spending on defence had crossed the one lakh crore rupee Rubicon at least two years ago.There is no apparent reason for India to understate its defence budget. No IMF conditions constrain defence spending; military expenditure remains well below the politically correct level of 3%. But India continues to camouflage what other comparable liberal democracies transparently show as defence spending.-HOW THEY ADD UP(Figure in Rs crore)Declared defence budget 1,05,600Nuclear forces 1,300Paramilitary forces 7,632Paramilitary housing 555Border fencing 608Border infrastructure 504Pensions 15,564Ministry of Defence 2,370Actual defence budget 1,34,133Is there an international benchmark for identifying defence expenditure? In fact there is: a United Nations General Assembly resolution (35/142B of Dec 12, 1980) standardised the reporting of military expenditure. This benchmark is accepted almost globally; 115 countries have reported since 1981.Resolution 35/142B only legislated what transparent governments, defence economists and academics, and people with common sense already understood. Expenditure on strategic nuclear weapons, it says, constitutes defence expenditure; so does expenditure on paramilitary forces that are organised, armed and employed for guarding the borders and which could be used in combat against another country. All expenditure on military personnel, including pensions for retired soldiers, is to be reported as defence expenditure. The construction and repair of structures and facilities used for defence, says Resolution 35/142, is military spending. Command and communications systems for defending the country should be financed from the defence budget.New Delhi, however, distributes a hefty chunk of this spending across heads other than defence. Within India's nuclear arsenal, only the missiles that carry nukes to their targets are paid for from the defence budget. The bill for the nuclear warheads themselves is picked up by the Department of Atomic Energy. It is impossible to determine how much of the Rs 3,908 crore allocated (through Demand No 4) to the Department of Atomic Energy goes into nuclear power generation and how much goes into bombs. But even if one-third of the DAE's budget goes into warhead production and research, Rs 1,300 crore must be added to the defence budget.India's plethora of paramilitary forces are allocated money from the Home Ministry budget (under Major Heads 2055 and 4055), even though forces like the Border Security Force (BSF), the Indo-Tibet Border Police (ITBP), the Sashastra Seema Bal (SSB) and the India Reserve Battalions (IRB) are deployed on the borders in defence of the realm. The Home Ministry also pays for the Assam Rifles (AR), even though it is commanded by army officers on deputation, and operates largely under the army. The same is true of the National Security Guard (NSG), the army-manned Black Cat commandos, charged with special missions like anti-hijack, hostage rescue, and anti-terrorist operations. The bill for these forces comes to Rs 7,632 crore. This does not include the Rs 4,219 crore budget for the Central Reserve Police Force (CRPF), of which an estimated one-fourth is engaged in counter-militant operations in J&K, Assam, Tripura, Nagaland and Manipur.The Home Minister picks up the tab not just for these forces, but also a Rs 608 crore bill for fencing the Pakistan and the Bangladesh borders this year. Shivraj Patil also pays Rs 555 crore for housing the paramilitary forces while they perform military duties. And his colleague, Mr P Chidambaram, flouts UN Resolution 35/142B by making him pay another Rs 504 crore for a high-tech surveillance and infrastructure network for the borders with Pakistan, China and Myanmar. Another Rs 100 crore is allocated for "critical infrastructure within extremist affected areas", which is used largely for security-related construction.But the most glaring exclusions from India's defence budget are the Rs 15,564 crore allocated for pensions (Demand No 20), and an allocation of Rs 2,370 crore for the Ministry of Defence (Demand No 19). The MoD allocation funds a regular army regiment called the J&K Light Infantry, the Coast Guard, and the MoD secretariat itself; it is impossible to argue that this is not defence expenditure. And even in countries as opaque as China, pensions to retired soldiers form a part of the military budget.Factoring in these hidden expenses, India's defence budget really amounts to Rs 1,34,133 crore, rather than the Rs 1,05,600 crore that the government declares; that is a little over 2.5% of India's GDP.While this article seeks to set the record straight, India remains a country where even experts, top government officials, and the legislature do nothing to debate defence expenditure and how to get more bang for the buck. Allocations that are a fraction of defence are discussed threadbare, but widespread ignorance of defence planning means that even an allocation of Rs 1,34,133 crore would probably have been passed by Parliament without a word of debate. In a land of holy cows, defence remains the most blessed of them.Ajai Shukla: How much is the defence budget?applying the same logic in 2012-13 defence budget which has been officially acknowledged as 1.93lakh crore ($ 38 bn) has to be at least around 2.35 lakh crore ($ 47 bn)!!!
Source:-http://www.-----------/forums/indian-defence/182442-ajai-shukla-how-much-defence-budget.html
