500,1000 Rs Note no longer legal tender!!

[Razor]

Temporary.................................

This sounds great. Hopefully it will target the whole gamut of NGO-types fifth columns.

 

[Screambowl]

Today I bought a point and shoot camera by ATM-cum-debit card for the first time in my life! Yeahhhh.........Please Govt. cancel free transaction cost plan which will be valid till Dec 31 and make it permanent.

transaction costs will reduce as the usage increases.

 

[OneGrimPilgrim]

Love the conspiracy theory. However where it does not add up is the assumption that Pakistan was going to pump in the 15trillion FICN all at the same time.

i dont see any reference to this assumption being made. what it meant was that pak was already printing FICN of that worth, to be pumped in through its various regular channels in the manner as has been the trend. the percentage of FICN here has been steadily on the rise (22% increase reported last year). last year NIA & ISI (Indian Statistical Instt.) had revealed through a study that 70cr. worth of FICN is being pumped in & circulated here every year (and 400cr. FICN in circulation at a given time). so this gives an idea.

 

[sayareakd]

motivate him towards attaining a stature further like that of parasmal lodha. just make sure you bail out just before its HIS time to stand in line.

Lot smarter that you think. He is top most lawyer for a nationalised bank. Saw bankers lining up at his home many times for legal work. Even CMD of the bank comes.

 

[OneGrimPilgrim]

some old, but gold!

(as expected, sicks like congtards were takleefed-in-tashreef that 'maino'rity institutions were being targeted, while troll.in were surprised that only a day was given to the goan archdiocese to furnish details of cash-in-hand).




from 1978:

and R.K. Laxman's cartoon on the 1978 demonit:

a convo between an Odiya banker & a journo:

 

[OneGrimPilgrim]

Lot smarter that you think. He is top most lawyer for a nationalised bank. Saw bankers lining up at his home many times for legal work. Even CMD of the bank comes.

perhaps your time to play 'kick-ass' with him then with the email addr the public has been newly gifted with, if he has undeclared booty?
who knows; he may just follow suit after rohit tandon.

 

[VIP]

Today I bought a point and shoot camera by ATM-cum-debit card for the first time in my life! Yeahhhh.........Please Govt. cancel free transaction cost plan which will be valid till Dec 31 and make it permanent.

Usually merchants bear the cost of transactions...................

 

[Kshatriya87]

Scrapped Rs 500, Rs 1000 notes can be used to pay tax under new govt scheme

 

[Kshatriya87]

most of the 'critics' who have rued the 'implementation', pretty much none could elucidate a cogent idea of *how* it can be or could be planned better. it seems like a superficial argument repeated like a rhetoric (much like what the cricket-fans are wont to do when watching a match - "abe yaar aise karta / abe udhar set karta"). the oft-repeated response is that "its the job of the GoI and RBI to figure that out" --> indicator that its not a meaningful criticism but an egoistical thought that it could have been planned better, even if s/he has no idea or any interest in explaining it, that leaves room for criticism in response. cccepting such criticism means we agree not to bother about understanding what was wrong, how it went wrong, and what measures could have fixed it. rather, a conclusion has been established and no leading facts are required. Is that fair?
the claim that "Govt. should've figured things out beforehand" is also a reflection of profound lack of experience at the issues associated with leading enormous new initiatives. this initiative here is the single biggest such, much larger in magnitudes in scale and scope to any such attempt in any nation's history. and no prior plan survives initial contact with the enemy. the best plan isn't one that figures out everything beforehand as a grand strategy, because they can't. It's one that has a basic strategic structure, and which can be adapted to immediate tactical requirements effectively. GoI has/had been going by this. now check this:

Demonetisation: Pak’s Sinister Designs Forced Modi’s Hands

The e-mails had been going round and round for some time carrying the supposed facts regarding the reasons for the sudden demonetization but one couldn’t really believe all that was conveyed in them. True, Modi had in his election campaign assured that he would fight the menace of black money and bring back all that was stashed away in banks abroad. But, two and a half years had gone by and yet nothing was seemingly moving on that front. He was, therefore, being baited and mocked at by the Opposition inside and outside the Parliament for his extravagant unfulfilled promises.

Perhaps, they were all wrong. It seems to have always been at the back of Modi’s mind, only he was waiting for an opportune moment. What the e-mails contained was indeed alarming and, if things would have been allowed to be left as they were the country would have been in serious trouble. There is a furor over the problems created by demonetization of high value currency notes at every level of Indian society, more so for the poor and deprived classes. But, one cannot really imagine the consequences had no action been taken on what Pakistan was plotting for economic and financial destabilization of the country. A report in the Hindustan Times (HT) on 10th December 2016 carried some of the facts but not all the facts of the matter. According to it, Modi had said while campaigning in 2014 in Bahraich in Uttar Pradesh on the Indo-Nepal border that he would fight the ISI designs to destabilize this country.

There was a specific reason for this statement and this was mentioned in the Hindustan Times report rather cursorily. The Police had in 2009 seized Rs. 4 crore in fake Indian currency notes (FICN) from the currency chest of a nationalized bank. These notes were supplied to the nationalized bank by none other than the Reserve Bank of India. The detection of FICN in the currency chest of a nationalized bank was a serious matter. But the newspaper did not report how it was dealt with by the Reserve Bank or the Centre. This is where the newspaper became part of the secular press as it would have exposed the erstwhile Sonia Gandhi-led United Progressive Alliance government.

The facts are contained in the e-mails that have been in circulation for some time. One did not pay attention as one thought it was probably a prank of Congress baiters. Now that the HT, an unabashed Congress supporter, has reported it howsoever cursorily, it seems the whole thing was true and very alarming and the congress government at the centre chose to put a lid on it. It did not take any action and in bureaucratic rigmarole the matter seemed to have been suppressed and buried.

This is where these identical e-mails come in which tell the entire story and the huge ramifications in India of further lackadaisical approach to this sinister design of the ISI and Pakistan government. The story of demonetization begins 2009-10 when seventy-odd nationalized banks along the Indo-Nepal border were raided only to find counterfeit Indian currency notes and what was shocking was these were supplied by the Reserve Bank of India. That only meant that even the Indian Central Bank had been compromised and it was circulating FICN pushed into India by Pakistan. On inquiries by the CBI it was found that the FICNs were so close to the genuine currency that an ordinary mortal could not detect it. It was only some foreign labs which confirmed that those notes were fake. The minute detail that proved that those were fake currency was reportedly inserted only to distinguish them from genuine Indian currency notes.

Investigations in the matter had proved that the mischief was being done at the UK based company De la Rue from which the RBI was buying 95% of the currency paper. The company was also supplying paper to Pakistan. Blacklisting of the company reduced it to bankruptcy. Later printing of currency notes was outsourced to three foreign companies but soon there was an anonymous complaint somewhere in 2011 from officials of the Ministry of Finance who seemed to have said that it was not De la Rue alone which was compromising the security of the bank notes, other foreign companies also were doing the same. One does not know what action was taken by the government but it seems this information was withheld from the Finance and Home ministries of Government of India.

Sometime later, on Modi’s initiative in 2015 another foreign company – Louisenthal, a German company – was found to be supplying currency paper to Pakistan which was printing high quality fake Indian currency notes and pushing them into India from all directions over land and by air. The Home Ministry barred it from selling bank note paper to the RBI. Pakistan had jacked up the printing of FICN and pushed them into India with vigour and confidence that its economic and financial sabotage would go undetected.

If one goes by what Gen. GD Bakshi, a security expert, has to say one would get an idea of the extent of damage that could have been caused by unchecked infiltration of FICN from Pakistan. He says that India had around Rs.16 trillion worth of Rs 500/- and Rs. 1000/- currency notes in circulation. Pakistan was already printing 15 trillion of these notes to smuggle them into India. Pakistan had established five sophisticated presses for the purpose. This, as Gen Bakshi says, would have “unhinged” the Indian economy with runaway inflation, steep price rise and unlimited terror funding.


In fact, under these circumstances demonetization came rather late. Nonetheless, it came before much damage could be done. With the ban on high value currency notes frequency of terror strikes have gone down and the stone-pelters of Kashmir are out of business. Even the Hurriyat which used to distribute (counterfeit) money received from Pakistan has now invited tourists to visit Kashmir as it is fearful of losing relevance in the absence of the old and now-banned high value currency notes. Even the Pakistani kingpin of FICN committed suicide the other day finding himself in a tight corner after demonetizations.

It is unbelievable that Manmohan Singhs, Rahul Gandhis and Gulam Nabi Azads of Congress were not aware of all these goings on. It is during the reign of the UPA-led government that the RBI was found to have been compromised. Only they did not take the serious breach of security seriously enough. Now that Modi has caught them on the wrong foot they have raised merry hell and have disrupted virtually the entire winter session of the Parliament. Even Rahul Gandhi, popularly known as Pappu, has been threatening of an earthquake were he to be allowed to speak in the Lok Sabha. He should thank his stars that Modi has been pretty decent about it and has so far not made political capital out of the then government’s inaction subsequent to detection of major security breach.

Shocking. This racket was deeper than I thought.

 

[pmaitra]

By the way, Amul has opened accounts for its milkmen. Others can do too unless they like to fudge the books and avoid taxes.

Agriculture is a state subject, and is non-taxable in many states.

It has nothing to do with fudging the books or avoiding taxes where legally no tax is owed to the government.

The government's stated objective was to clamp down on black money, but now it appears it is more about moving to a cash-less or less-cash economy.

Not everyone, I am sure there are plenty who wish to pay only in cash.

Can there be genuine reason for sticking to cash, perhaps. However, anything that goes unaccounted for is a loss to the government and consequently the citizens.

Are you against formalizing the informal economy?

Plenty of genuine reasons are there. Please read the thread.

 

[pmaitra]

In a cash-less or less-cash economy, most buyers will have to use a credit or a debit card. How that will impact the merchants in India is as yet unclear. However, we can have a look at how merchants in the US deal with the transaction costs.

3 Ways Your Small Business Can Save on Credit Card Processing Fees

Selected paragraphs:

Just as with any financial product, you can get the best deal by doing a little comparison shopping. Some providers charge more than others, even though they may offer the same level of service; others may advertise a lower rate, but they actually charge more in hidden fees and provide less service.

The solution is to swipe the customer’s card whenever possible. This could mean re-training cashiers to always physically swipe a credit card during a transaction, instead of manually entering the card. If you suspect fraud, you can also ask for the customer’s driver license and a photo ID, to check that the name on the ID matches the name on the card. If it doesn’t match up, you can then decline the sale.

If your business tends to handle smaller transactions, it might be smart to impose minimum amounts for credit card sales. For example, if you own a convenience store that gets a lot of small transactions under $5 and your profit margin on those products is just 10%, it’s probably not worth conducting the sale after factoring in credit card fees.

 

[Nicky G]

Agriculture is a state subject, and is non-taxable in many states.

It has nothing to do with fudging the books or avoiding taxes where legally no tax is owed to the government.

The government's stated objective was to clamp down on black money, but now it appears it is more about moving to a cash-less or less-cash economy.

How is agriculture being a state subject pertinent? Other sectors, not in state list are also moving to cashless payments to employees.

So you think government lied about BM being an objective? What do you think the numerous raids are about? There can be multiple objectives - never thought that was a hard concept to grasp.

Plenty of genuine reasons are there. Please read the thread.

Of course there can be genuine reasons in some cases. It would be silly to outrightly dismiss them all. However, that does little to take away from the broader urgent need to formalize the huge informal sector.

Apart from it being a loss to the exchequer, its grossly unfair on those whose incomes are taxed that so many remain outside the net.

 

[pmaitra]

How is agriculture being a state subject pertinent? Other sectors, not in state list are also moving to cashless payments to employees.

It is pertinent. You mentioned milkmen. It is included under agriculture. Hence, agriculture may be taxable in one state, but not necessarily in other states. So, a person engaged in agriculture using cash does not automatically become a person who wants to "fudge the books and avoid taxes," [sic.].

N.B.: This is not the first time I am pointing this out in this thread. Of course, not everyone gets to read all the posts.

So you think government lied about BM being an objective? What do you think the numerous raids are about? There can be multiple objectives - never thought that was a hard concept to grasp.

What do you think?

On a related note, let us assume going cash-less was one of the objectives. Well, then we should have made sure we are able to support that with domestically produced infrastructure.

Of course there can be genuine reasons in some cases. It would be silly to outrightly dismiss them all. However, that does little to take away from the broader urgent need to formalize the huge informal sector.

Apart from it being a loss to the exchequer, its grossly unfair on those whose incomes are taxed that so many remain outside the net.

There are always genuine reasons on both sides. On one hand, it is important to clamp down on black money, and on the other hand, it hurts the economy if cash transactions are restricted, especially in sectors that are tax free. Lack of liquidity reduces economic activity.

I am trying to look at it from both directions.

 

[Nicky G]

It is pertinent. You mentioned milkmen. It is included under agriculture. Hence, agriculture may be taxable in one state, but not necessarily in other states. So, a person engaged in agriculture using cash does not automatically become a person who wants to "fudge the books and avoid taxes," [sic.].

N.B.: This is not the first time I am pointing this out in this thread. Of course, not everyone gets to read all the posts.

Not necessarily, sure; but that hardly means anything. Large cash dealings must be always scrutinized to ensure there is no foul play.

An agricultural business dealings in cash is much more prone, by its very mode of operation, to avoid taxes in states where it must pay taxes.

Besides, merely being tax free should not be a justification for cash transactions for business.

There is also the matter of businesses that must pay taxes and do not as they get away dealing in cash. That must be curtailed entirely.

What do you think?

On a related note, let us assume going cash-less was one of the objectives. Well, then we should have made sure we are able to support that with domestically produced infrastructure.

I think it's a clampdown on BM. Look at these:

http://m.timesofindia.com/business/...h-value-transactions/articleshow/56129941.cms

http://m.timesofindia.com/india/kol...-ripples-in-delhi-tn/articleshow/56130915.cms

I'd most more and elaborate but I am on my cell. Maybe later tonight.

Of course there needs to be the infrastructure to support digital payments. However, that needs to happen in parallel. We can't wait for the entire infrastructure to be in place before we push for digital. That might sound great in theory but rarely pans out in the real world.

Most Indians will only change when forced to. Perhaps that's true of all people.

There are always genuine reasons on both sides. On one hand, it is important to clamp down on black money, and on the other hand, it hurts the economy if cash transactions are restricted, especially in sectors that are tax free. Lack of liquidity reduces economic activity.

I am trying to look at it from both directions.

Liquidity is not restricted to cash in hand. It's any liquid fund.

Neither am I restricting myself to one aspect. In short, there might be limited damage. That however is justified by long term benefits.

 

[Khagesh]

some old, but gold!

Continuing on the godly things.

We have a strange situation you see today where a PM is confident on one day, boastful a day later only to begin crying 2 days later and then gets his swagger back again only to do policy flip-flops yet again and again and yet again.

Could it be that all this is the result of him having dipped his hands into the God's gold. Modi's gold monetisation too is working quite well hidden well under this daily din.

Have the gods spoken to him in last few days, in their own cryptic manner. Will Modi listen?

Sirji, yeh sab dikhawa hai. Dikhawe par na jao.

 

[pmaitra]

Not necessarily, sure; but that hardly means anything. Large cash dealings must be always scrutinized to ensure there is no foul play.

An agricultural business dealings in cash is much more prone, by its very mode of operation, to avoid taxes in states where it must pay taxes.

Besides, merely being tax free should not be a justification for cash transactions for business.

There is also the matter of businesses that must pay taxes and do not as they get away dealing in cash. That must be curtailed entirely.



I think it's a clampdown on BM. Look at these:

http://m.timesofindia.com/business/...h-value-transactions/articleshow/56129941.cms

http://m.timesofindia.com/india/kol...-ripples-in-delhi-tn/articleshow/56130915.cms

I'd most more and elaborate but I am on my cell. Maybe later tonight.

Of course there needs to be the infrastructure to support digital payments. However, that needs to happen in parallel. We can't wait for the entire infrastructure to be in place before we push for digital. That might sound great in theory but rarely pans out in the real world.

Most Indians will only change when forced to. Perhaps that's true of all people.



Liquidity is not restricted to cash in hand. It's any liquid fund.

Neither am I restricting myself to one aspect. In short, there might be limited damage. That however is justified by long term benefits.

So, I assume we both agree that we should not assign labels (such as "fudge the books and avoid taxes") onto people just because they are dealing in cash. That was the primary reason why I responded to your post in the first place.

 

[OneGrimPilgrim]

Continuing on the godly things.

We have a strange situation you see today where a PM is confident on one day, boastful a day later only to begin crying 2 days later and then gets his swagger back again only to do policy flip-flops yet again and again and yet again.

Could it be that all this is the result of him having dipped his hands into the God's gold. Modi's gold monetisation too is working quite well hidden well under this daily din.

Have the gods spoken to him in last few days, in their own cryptic manner. Will Modi listen?

Sirji, yeh sab dikhawa hai. Dikhawe par na jao.

The souls of moltke & lee jun fan would call those 'flip-flops' as 'improvisation and adaption'.
But ofc one is free to choose his own choice of dikhaava, either the haay-tauba type,

Or the swagger type

 

[OneGrimPilgrim]

PM Modi’s big ‘Christmas gift’: Here’s how you can win up to Rs 1 cr with digital payments
Now, digital payments can not only save you from the hassles of standing in an ATM queue but also help you win a whopping prize of Rs 1 crore.
By: Rajeev Kumar | New Delhi | Updated: December 15, 2016 9:09 PM
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The Niti Aayog today announced two schemes to incentivise digital transactions across the country. (File photo/narendramodi.in)
Now, digital payments can not only save you from the hassles of standing in an ATM queue but also help you win a whopping prize of Rs 1 crore. In a bid to push the cashless economy agenda of Prime Minister Narendra Modi in the country, Niti Aayog has announced a number of prizes for people adopting one of the many modes of digital transactions made available by the government.

The Niti Aayog today announced two schemes to incentivise digital transactions across the country. In a PIB release, the NITI Aayog said, “The primary aim of these schemes is to incentivise digital transactions so that electronic payments are adopted by all sections of the society, especially the poor and the middle class.”

The two schemes are a) Lucky Grahak Yojana for consumers and Digi-Dhan Vyapar Yojana for merchants. “It has been designed keeping in mind all sections of the society and their usage patterns,” the release said.

Even the poorest citizen of the country can benefit from the scheme by using USSD. Rural citizens can participate in the scheme through AEPS. Here we present everything you need to know about the two schemes.

1. Important dates: The schemes will become operational from December 25, 2016, and a mega ‘lucky draw’ would be carried out on April 14, 2017 (Babasaheb Ambedkar Jayanti).

2. Lucky Grahak Yojana for consumers

• It will have daily rewards of Rs 1000 for 15,000 lucky consumers for a period of 100 days.
• Weekly prizes worth Rs 1 lakh, Rs 10,000 and Rs 5000 for consumers using “alternate modes” of digital payments will also be distributed.
• The scheme will include all transactions made through UPI, USSD, AEPS and RuPay Cards.
• Private credit cards and digital wallets users are not eligible for the scheme.

3. Digi-Dhan Vyapar Yojana for merchants

• This scheme will award digital transactions by merchant establishments.
• It will have weekly prizes worth Rs 50,000, Rs 5,000 and Rs. 2,500.

4. Mega lucky draw on April 14

• A mega draw will be held on April 14, 2017
• Three people will be eligible for prizes worth Rs 1 crore, Rs 50 lakh and 25 lakh respectively for digital transactions carried out between November 8, 2016, to April 13, 2017. The result will be announced on April 14, 2017
• Three merchants will be eligible for prizes worth Rs 50 lakhs, Rs 25 lakh and Rs 12 lakh for digital transactions between November 8, 2016, to April 13, 2017.

5. The incentives will be restricted to transactions within the range of Rs 50 and Rs 3000.

6. All transactions between consumers and merchants; consumers and government agencies and all AEPS transactions will be considered for the incentive scheme.

7. The winners shall be identified through a random draw of the eligible Transaction IDs [which are generated automatically as soon as the transaction is completed].

8. The National Payments Corporation of India (NPCI) will develop a special software for selecting the winners.

9. The NPCI will also be responsible for ensuring technical and security audit for maintaining technical integrity of the process.

10. The government will spend Rs 340 crore for rewarding people under the two schemes.

(Inputs from PIB)

 

[OneGrimPilgrim]

The only reason people here are trolling this much government for a few month inconvenience is that they know that Government cares about them.

Gone are days of INC which has been rarely out of power in these 70 years and probably, will again get the vote of these fools. No matter of scams, hiding casualties of soldiers, strategic and economic blunders and to through the nation again in the league of socialist shitholes.

On relevant note, primary purpose of demonetization first is to boost long term GDP. Freezing the currency causes deflation and slowdown for a short term (from 6-7 months to one or two years) but a significantly higher growth for long term as black economy backing white economy also gets documented and becomes white.

Other thing,

I think I have discussed earlier with a super long article on this or another thread that how digital transactions and consumption can boost growth from 0.6 to 1%.

congress is almost on the verge of 'BeingConGrass', ie, eating grass. have halved the expenses for their candidates to be fielded in elections. and dont have the money to pay to a chaiwaala (how could monkeyshankar have paid the supreme chaiwaala then?!)...the KDPs (KaalaDhanPatis) wont see the kind of returns by investing in congrass now it seems.

BTW, link to that post of yours pls.

 

[armyofhind]

http://www.timesnow.tv/india/video/two-villages-go-cashless-to-combat-cash-crunch/53091

http://www.thehindu.com/news/cities...ges-will-soon-go-cashless/article16914597.ece

http://www.financialexpress.com/india-news/three-villages-in-patna-go-cashless-patna/463648/

http://indiatoday.intoday.in/story/maharashtra-village-cashless-economy-demonetisation/1/824697.html

http://www.newindianexpress.com/sta...o-cashless-in-visakhapatnam-dist-1551535.html

Leave aside these, these are still "normal" places in the country.
3 Villages in J&K have already gone cashless.

Some food for thought for those mindlessly opposing the initiative and creating much hullabaloo about villagers being ignorant and illiterate and thus having problems in adapting to a new system.