Suicide attack in Pakistan side of Wagah border, 40+ killed

thethinker

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Pak rangers requested BSF to suspend the border ceremony for 3 days but in the last minute today they informed BSF that they intended to go ahead with the ceremony complete with spectators. Speaks volumes about professionalism.

PS. I am not contesting the idea behind it. But the way it was done. When it was decided at local flag meeting to suspend it for 3 days.
Not hard at all to understand the Pakiness behind it.

It is a sort of "victory" for them and a leg up over India by depriving of the ceremony.

Here is how the Paki media is spinning this event :

Despite threats, Pakistan goes on with ceremony at Wagah - Pakistan - DAWN.COM

"The decision came at a time when rumours were floating in political and media circles that the ceremony had been postponed for at least a period of three days and according to some until the situation normalised."

The suspension was apparently a rumour after all and the brave Paki Rangers went ahead with the event!
 

ladder

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Not hard at all to understand the Pakiness behind it.

It is a sort of "victory" for them and a leg up over India by depriving of the ceremony.

Here is how the Paki media is spinning this event :

Despite threats, Pakistan goes on with ceremony at Wagah - Pakistan - DAWN.COM

"The decision came at a time when rumours were floating in political and media circles that the ceremony had been postponed for at least a period of three days and according to some until the situation normalised."

The suspension was apparently a rumour after all and the brave Paki Rangers went ahead with the event!
And now we know why calm doesn't return after flag meeting which succeeds cease fire violations at LoC. If decisions taken at a meeting is colored rumor, then flag meetings are automatically reduced to 'chai samosa' meeting.

And readers from Pakistan will never reason as to why India would want to suspend the ceremony when blast happened on Pakistani side. The empty gallery on Indian side will be interpreted as 'coward Indians chickened out' while brave Pakistani were unfazed and turned up in ever greater numbers. ( I applaud at-least the crowd turn-out)
 
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Srinivas_K

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I agree with Pakiness.

This event is not a ceremony but a parade/march to install confidence among the citizens of that area.

Not hard at all to understand the Pakiness behind it.

It is a sort of "victory" for them and a leg up over India by depriving of the ceremony.

Here is how the Paki media is spinning this event :

Despite threats, Pakistan goes on with ceremony at Wagah - Pakistan - DAWN.COM

"The decision came at a time when rumours were floating in political and media circles that the ceremony had been postponed for at least a period of three days and according to some until the situation normalised."

The suspension was apparently a rumour after all and the brave Paki Rangers went ahead with the event!
 
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Voldemort

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WAGAH: Indian and Pakistani intelligence agencies both picked up plans for an imminent strike on their Wagah land border ahead of a suicide blast that killed 57 people on Sunday, and heightened security, possibly averting a more devastating attack.

Pakistani police on Monday said they had recovered a "huge" cache of weapons and explosives near the border, where thousands of Indians and Pakistanis gather at dusk every day to watch a flamboyant ritual parade by their security forces.

Pakistani police spokeswoman Nabeela Ghazanfar said the latest death toll was 57 after the bomber detonated explosives in a car park 500 metres (yards) from the border gates and parade ground, just as hundreds of spectators were returning from the ceremony.

Pakistani and Indian agents, who are arch-rivals and do not share intelligence, gave conflicting accounts of whether the bomber's true intention was to cause casualties on the Indian side of the border and stir up tensions between the nuclear-armed nations.

"It appears the bomber wanted to target ground zero where Pakistan and India border officials stand together to perform the flag ceremony but he could not enter due to tight security at the last gate," a Pakistani intelligence official told Reuters.

"Had he managed to reach the place, the scenario would have been worse on both sides."

If successful, such an attack would likely have severely tested ties between India and Pakistan, already frayed after weeks of shelling further along the border that has killed 17 people in October.

Another source said a second suicide vest had been found in a field near the explosion site, suggesting there might have been another bomber.

"The target — the border facility that symbolizes trade and interaction between India and Pakistan — is a tempting one for extremist Pakistani groups that want conflict with India and oppose any detente or cooperation with New Delhi," said Bruce Riedel of the Brookings Institution, a former adviser on South Asia to US presidents.

Every day, thousands of Indians and Pakistanis flock to watch the elaborate show where border security officials kick their feet high and grimace in mock aggression in a peacock-like display of patriotism. It is one of the only chances regular citizens from the two countries get to observe each other.

India said the daily flag-lowering ceremony would be suspended as a mark of respect for the dead, but a spokesman for Pakistan's paramilitary Rangers said later they had decided to go ahead with the parade to send a message to the militants.

"The top Rangers leadership has decided to continue with the flag ceremony to convey ... to the terrorists that we are not afraid of them," spokesman Major Mohammad Ijaz said by phone from the border. "I can see a large number of people, including women and children, and they are extremely enthusiastic today."

Under Prime Minister Narendra Modi's government, India has stepped up its response to perceived aggression from neighbours Pakistan and China, with which it has long-standing border disputes.

Modi, who is reviled by some Islamist groups, condemned Sunday's attack as a "dastardly act".

"My condolences to the families of the deceased. Prayers with the injured," he said on Twitter.

India, Pak spy agencies 'averted a more devastating attack' at Wagah - The Times of India
 

ladder

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I agree with Pakiness.

This event is not a ceremony but a parade to install confidence among the citizens of that area.
I am not getting into whether it is a ceremony or just a parade.
What do you have to say about the fact they requested cancellation and then went ahead with it at the last minute? Where is the professionalism? Even better courtesy?

The very fact that the decision was taken at a flag meeting.
 

Srinivas_K

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I am not getting into whether it is a ceremony or just a parade.
What do you have to say about the fact they requested cancellation and then went ahead with it at the last minute? Where is the professionalism? Even better courtesy?

The very fact that the decision was taken at a flag meeting.
At the last minute they have realized that they are brave and so might have went ahead with the ceremony with out mourning !!

Seems the decision making done involves many people who suggest many things and things will end up in confusion.
 

ladder

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At the last minute they have realized that they are brave and so might have went ahead with the ceremony with out mourning !!

Seems the decision making done involves many people who suggest many things and things will end up in confusion.
At the last minute they might have decided that mutually agreed decisions can be refereed to as rumors isn't it?

The ceremony/ parade/ march whatever you call it (it is ceremony as it involves the ceremonial flag folding along with bugle) is isn't Pakistan's decision alone to make.

India has been asking the Pakistani for a couple of years to tone down the ceremony ( for various reasons) but had to continue with the old fashioned way, as Pakistani always opposed any change.

Decision making should follow a certain laid down procedure.
 

Srinivas_K

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Any logic infront of Pakiness fails, simple as that !!



At the last minute they might have decided that mutually agreed decisions can be refereed to as rumors isn't it?

The ceremony/ parade/ march whatever you call it (it is ceremony as it involves the ceremonial flag folding along with bugle) is isn't Pakistan's decision alone to make.

India has been asking the Pakistani for a couple of years to tone down the ceremony ( for various reasons) but had to continue with the old fashioned way, as Pakistani always opposed any change.

Decision making should follow a certain laid down procedure.
 

Srinivas_K

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India, Pak spy agencies 'averted a more devastating attack' at Wagah

WAGAH: Indian and Pakistani intelligence agencies both picked up plans for an imminent strike on their Wagah land border ahead of a suicide blast that killed 57 people on Sunday, and heightened security, possibly averting a more devastating attack.

Pakistani police on Monday said they had recovered a "huge" cache of weapons and explosives near the border, where thousands of Indians and Pakistanis gather at dusk every day to watch a flamboyant ritual parade by their security forces.

Pakistani police spokeswoman Nabeela Ghazanfar said the latest death toll was 57 after the bomber detonated explosives in a car park 500 metres (yards) from the border gates and parade ground, just as hundreds of spectators were returning from the ceremony.
Pakistani and Indian agents, who are arch-rivals and do not share intelligence, gave conflicting accounts of whether the bomber's true intention was to cause casualties on the Indian side of the border and stir up tensions between the nuclear-armed nations.

"It appears the bomber wanted to target ground zero where Pakistan and India border officials stand together to perform the flag ceremony but he could not enter due to tight security at the last gate," a Pakistani intelligence official told Reuters.

"Had he managed to reach the place, the scenario would have been worse on both sides."

If successful, such an attack would likely have severely tested ties between India and Pakistan, already frayed after weeks of shelling further along the border that has killed 17 people in October.

Another source said a second suicide vest had been found in a field near the explosion site, suggesting there might have been another bomber.

"The target — the border facility that symbolizes TRADE and interaction between India and Pakistan — is a tempting one for extremist Pakistani groups that want conflict with India and oppose any detente or cooperation with New Delhi," said Bruce Riedel of the Brookings Institution, a former adviser on South Asia to US presidents.

Every day, thousands of Indians and Pakistanis flock to watch the elaborate show where border security officials kick their feet high and grimace in mock aggression in a peacock-like display of patriotism. It is one of the only chances regular citizens from the two countries get to observe each other.

India said the daily flag-lowering ceremony would be suspended as a mark of respect for the dead, but a spokesman for Pakistan's paramilitary Rangers said later they had decided to go ahead with the parade to send a message to the militants.

"The top Rangers leadership has decided to continue with the flag ceremony to convey ... to the terrorists that we are not afraid of them," spokesman Major Mohammad Ijaz said by phone from the border. "I can see a large number of people, including women and children, and they are extremely enthusiastic today."
Under Prime Minister Narendra Modi's government, India has stepped up its response to perceived aggression from neighbours Pakistan and China, with which it has long-standing border disputes.

Modi, who is reviled by some Islamist groups, condemned Sunday's attack as a "dastardly act".

"My condolences to the families of the deceased. Prayers with the injured," he said on Twitter.

India regularly alleges the involvement of Pakistani security agencies in militant attacks on its soil, including the 2008 Mumbai attacks in which 166 people were killed when Pakistani militants went on a three-day rampage in India's FINANCIAL capital.

The two countries have fought three wars since they were carved out of British India in 1947. They fought a limited conflict in 1999 and were again on the brink after a militant attack on Parliament led to troop build-up in 2002.

Forces on 'red alert'

An official from India's foreign intelligence service, the Research and Analysis Wing, said the blast at the border was squarely aimed at Pakistan's security forces, a version in line with several Pakistani Taliban splinter groups that claimed the attack as revenge for an army offensive against militants near the Afghanistan border.

"It is reprisal attacks against the establishment there. It's been a long time coming, ever since the TTP (the Pakistan Taliban) has been under pressure," he said.

He said the attack may have been an attempt by al-Qaida's new Indian subcontinent wing to demonstrate its potential at a time when the network has been overshadowed by Islamic State, which anecdotal evidence suggests is gathering support in South Asia.

"They have tried to focus on large casualties and a sensational incident," he said.

An Indian official said the home ministry received two intelligence warnings in mid-October of possible attacks along the border or at the Golden Temple in the nearby city of Amritsar, the most sacred site for Sikhs.

"Based on these reports the BSF was ordered to upgrade security and a red alert was also issued," said a senior home ministry official, who declined to be named because he was not authorized to speak to media.

"Warnings from intelligence departments are a regular feature but this time we had a clear input that the retreat and Golden Temple could be prime targets. This message was conveyed to the local police."

Jagdeep Singh, a superintendent of police in Amritsar who is involved with security around the Wagah border, told Reuters he had installed checkpoints at two spots 3 km (two miles) away from the flag ceremony venue after the warnings in October.

India, Pak spy agencies 'averted a more devastating attack' at Wagah - The Times of India
 

Android

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Re: Suicide attack in Pakistan side of Wagah border, 40 killed

I am not getting into whether it is a ceremony or just a parade.
What do you have to say about the fact they requested cancellation and then went ahead with it at the last minute? Where is the professionalism? Even better courtesy?

The very fact that the decision was taken at a flag meeting.
It was indeed a very unprofessional behaviour from the pakistanis,it was probably done to save their faces from their own people who consider their Army as a massiha, because it was slap on the face of ISI ,PA & Pakistani rangers ,that such an attack took place just meters off a very sensitive area,which in a way shows how secured their side of wagha border is in comparision to the Indian side.
 

ladder

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Re: Suicide attack in Pakistan side of Wagah border, 40 killed

It was indeed a very unprofessional behaviour from the pakistanis,it was probably done to save their faces from their own people who consider their Army as a massiha, because it was slap on the face of ISI ,PA & Pakistani rangers ,that such an attack took place just meters off a very sensitive area,which in a way shows how secured their side of wagha border is in comparision to the Indian side.
Probably yes, but it is surprising because one suicide vest and one IED was found today near the blast area. Hope they knew what risk they were taking.

In Karachi airport attack, there was some gunfire even the next day, though it was hushed up as there was no casualty.
 
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Srinivas_K

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I was contesting your agreement with the Pakiness. Hope you don't want to put across that you and logic are out of phase.
As I have clarified in my earlier post, I said the reason why they went ahead with the ceremony. I am not debating the Pakiness here.
 

ladder

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As I have clarified in my earlier post, I said the reason why they went ahead with the ceremony. I am not debating the Pakiness here.
You have clarified nothing.

I said the reason
But, what you have stated is 'you thought it might be the reason'. But, then again it was absurd.


I am not debating the Pakiness here.
I too am not interested in that, but only
I was contesting your agreement with the Pakiness.
only because you wrote
I agree with Pakiness.
Pakiness may defy logic, but again does your agreement with it also defies logic?

Well it seems, I wasn't off-target when I mentioned

Hope you don't want to put across that you and logic are out of phase.
 

Android

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Re: Suicide attack in Pakistan side of Wagah border, 40 killed

Probably yes, but it is surprising because one suicide vest and one IED was found today near the blast area. Hope they knew what risk they were taking.
That sounds wierd though because that would mean the suicide bomer has abondend the mission and flew the spot for reasons well known to him,why would a suicided bomber do that who's aim is to kill & get killed.It was also said that they had prior intelligence of something as such happening near wagha border, so if we go buy that report, than i wonder if the warning was in any way taken seriously.
In Karachi airport attack, there was some gunfire even the next day, though it was hushed up as there was no casualty.
karachi attack was shocker,that was one attack which brought global attention,which made it feel like how unsafe the airport was. When you have bullets & MPM kinda things fired at comercial airlines there very little you can do than to hush up the matter.
 

Srinivas_K

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You have clarified nothing.



But, what you have stated is 'you thought it might be the reason'. But, then again it was absurd.




I too am not interested in that, but only only because you wrote

Pakiness may defy logic, but again does your agreement with it also defies logic?

Well it seems, I wasn't off-target when I mentioned

What is this all about??

stop arguing for the sake of nothing, are there any prizes or titles DFI is going to give if you win a small logic ??

Do you want to prove anything to me ??
 
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ladder

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What is this all about??

stop arguing for the sake of nothing, are there any prizes or titles DFI is going to give if you win a small logic ??
Only when you stop 'agreeing' for the sake of nothing with Pakiness.

What is this all about??
I don't blame any poor soul for not getting the drift, especially if that poor soul is in agreement with Pakiness. And can't reply why.


Yes, there are prizes and as I am good at guessing, I know which one you can win.
 

Srinivas_K

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Wagah Border attacker's target was India but exploded in Pakistan due to miscalculation

NEW DELHI: The carnage at Wagah may have announced the arrival of the suicide bomber to the westernmost tip of Pakistan, deep inside "safe and secure" Punjab, but for India, it was a close call as the bomb exploded just a day before hundreds of Sikh pilgrims were to cross over from Amritsar to Lahore for Guru Nanak's birthday.

Nanak Dev's birthplace, Nankana Sahib near Lahore, is one of the holiest shrines of Sikhism, and despite the air of distrust between the two countries, Pakistan had gone out of its way to issue visas to the pilgrims.

Meanwhile, a day after the suicide bomber killed 59 and injured 200, Pakistani authorities said they were still ascertaining which group among the dozens of extremist outfits active inside the state would have carried out the act. While the Pakistani media speculated if the Wagah bombing marked the beginning of shifting of the theatre of terror from Pakistan's eastern border to the west, experts in New Delhi suspected the bomber may have India in mind before he detonated the 12 kg of explosives strapped to his vest.

Lashkar-e-Toiba, the group that carried out the 26/11 attack in Mumbai, Jaish-e-Mohammed led by militant cleric Maulana Masood Azhar, and the newly-formed South Asian affiliate of Al-Qaeda all are potential non-state actors preparing to operate along the Indo-Pak border.

Sources in the Indian security establishment told ET that the attack could have been a fallout of internal differences within the Pak establishment.

"That the attack occurred in such a high security zone points out that it could have been a fallout of schisms within the Pakistani apparatus. This section of the Pak establishment wanted to create further mistrust and rift between Delhi and Islamabad. It appears the target of the bomber was India with collateral damages across the border, but he exploded due to some miscalculation," a government source said.

The sound of the explosion was heard well 2 km inside the Indian territory. Sources said the aim of the attack was to vitiate the atmospherics between the two countries and Delhi does not rule out more such attacks in future. Its timing is also under the scanner coming close on the heels of Muharram celebrations on Tuesday. Sources said Hafiz Saeed-led Jamaat-ud-Dawa had taken this opportunity to provide relief to the injured of Sunday's attack with a view to gaining sympathy for the group.

Wagah Border attacker's target was India but exploded in Pakistan due to miscalculation - The Economic Times
 

Virendra

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That sounds wierd though because that would mean the suicide bomer has abondend the mission and flew the spot for reasons well known to him,why would a suicided bomber do that who's aim is to kill & get killed.
Perception. If the fidayeen thought that security was too tight or there was some other fallout in the mission which makes him/her believe that objectives would not be accomplished to desirable levels; they would obviously pull out.
In suicide, they consider killing 100 while dying as better than killing 5. If the number drops, plan gets aborted for better opportunity in future.
Live to "die and kill more" another day.

Regards,
Virendra
 

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