Seems Russia is still sulking from getting ousted from the MMRCA tender

Discussion in 'Foreign Relations' started by black eagle, May 30, 2011.

  1. black eagle

    black eagle Senior Member Senior Member

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    Russia Snubs India

    Russia has cancelled both its 'Indra' series of military exercises with India. Last month, a flotilla of five warships from the Indian navy's eastern fleet that went for joint naval exercises to Vladivostok in the Russian far-east, was turned back without any manoeuvres. The warships-which included the missile destroyers INS Delhi, INS Ranvir and INS Ranvijay-were warmly received by the Russian navy, but when asked about the exercises, they were told the Russians had no ships to spare. On a request from the Indian fleet, a face-saving 'table top exercise or a land-based simulation, was carried out. What rubbed salt in their wounds was that Russian warships sailed out for an exercise of their own, apparently belying their earlier claims. The cancelled exercise was hushed up even as the warships returned to Visakhapatnam. A befuddled Ministry of Defence (mod) was groping for answers when they were snubbed again. Last week, Russia informed the mod that it had cancelled the upcoming joint army exercises scheduled to be held in Russia in June. One of the reasons given was that the mod had not informed Moscow of the army exercises in advance. Petr Topychkhanov of the Carnegie Moscow Centre says the cancellation of the exercises does not reflect any change in relations with India. "One of the reasons could be the hard process of military reform in Russia. The Russian armed forces are unready for an international exercise at this stage," he says.
    Since 2003, India and Russia have conducted five of the Indra series military exercises between the armies and navies of both sides. The last such exercise was held between Russian and Indian army units in Uttarakhand in October last year. In sharp contrast, India has conducted over 60 military exercises with the US. Indian defence officials admit that exercises with Russia are largely symbolic but are an important barometer of healthy ties between the two sides. The strategic partnership with Russia still holds.
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    Indian and Russian soldiers​

    Defence Minister A.K. Antony says that Delhi's proximity to Washington will not be at the cost of ties with Moscow. On the ground, however, ties have been on a roller-coaster ride. Russia is unhappy at losing a lucrative $10 billion contract for 126 multi-role medium combat aircraft. The iaf narrowed its choice to France's Rafale and Europe's Typhoon, ejecting US and Russian contenders. Topychkhanov does not rule out cancellation of the military exercises as a retort by the miffed Russians. Air Chief Marshal P.V. Naik visited Moscow recently to inspect progress on the joint Indo-Russian Fifth Generation Fighter Aircraft (fgfa). The visit was also meant to mollify Russia and indicate India's commitment to the futuristic fighter which is expected to replace the most current fighter aircraft in the iaf's inventory when it is ready for squadron service in 2017.
    Relations between India and Russia soured in recent years over the extended deadline for the refit of the aircraft carrier, Admiral Gorshkov. The refit slipped by four years and the its cost doubled to $2.3 billion. The carrier will now be delivered late next year. Deadlines for the acquisition of an Akula-II class nuclear-powered submarine have slipped by over three years. India paid $670 million for completing the submarine under a 2003 contract. This month, a 100-man Indian crew that had gone to Vladivostok to bring the vessel back returned empty-handed. There is no word on when the strategic submarine, which the navy desperately needs, will be transferred to India. Russia is reportedly keen that India pay for the completion of a second unfinished Akula hull at the Komsomolsk shipyard. This has been turned down by the navy.
    The real issue is the poor sourcing of components for Russian-made equipment operated by the Indian armed forces. Over half the inventory of the three armed forces comprise equipment of Russian origin. "It takes nearly a year for us to get even export permissions from Russia. This severely impacts force preparedness," says a defence official.
    Some of India's consternation over these delays may have spilled over at a meeting between navy chief Admiral Nirmal Verma and the visiting Russian navy chief, Admiral Sergeevich Vysotskiy, this January. Various department heads of the Indian navy read out the riot act on the poor serviceability of warships, aircraft and submarines to the Russian naval delegation. After the meeting, Vysotskiy privately conveyed his dismay at the ambush. The warning signs appeared at a recent joint meeting in Moscow when Russian defence officials refused to discuss military exercises. Evidently, it was a portent of the chill to come.
     
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  3. black eagle

    black eagle Senior Member Senior Member

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    REPORT: Russia Snubs India, Cancels 2 Joint Exercises

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    In a thumping sign that "relations between India and Russia [have] soured in recent years", it has come to light that Russia abruptly cancelled an INDRA-series naval exercise with India last month and has now cancelled an INDRA-series army exercise scheduled for June, reports India Today magazine senior editor Sandeep Unnithan. The Russians apparently notified the Indian contingent of its decision on the naval exercise inappropriately late -- well, after the five participating Indian warships (including five destroyers) steamed into Vladivostok.

    Via: Livefist
     
  4. Phenom

    Phenom Regular Member

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    Pretty childish thing to do, their plane got ousted because they were not good enough. Russia needs to start acting more mature. All the more reason for India to diverge away from Russia in the future, God knows how many problems India is going to face with Pak-Fa
     
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  5. nitesh

    nitesh Mob Control Manager Stars and Ambassadors

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    Why desperately find an unrelated reason when the answer is given in the article:

    As Russian forces are in realignment mode, so decision might have been taken to cancel the exercises for the time being
     
  6. A.V.

    A.V. New Member

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    Its not anything to do with India , Russia is finally tightening up the screws on those loose ends of its armed forces machinery this process is to continue for next 2 years where we can expect a more lighter , modern and disciplined armed forces.


    By the way the INDIA TODAY GROUP is as well as in the pockets of WHO you know very well . whatever parallel they draw , take with a pinch of salt.
     
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  7. Armand2REP

    Armand2REP CHINI EXPERT Veteran Member

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    Exercises do not happen on the cusp, they are pre-planned months if not years in advance. This is a snub by Russia plain and simple. French exercises are several times more frequent between India and their recent request for us to deny Pakistan weapons seals the strategic partnership. It is time for Russia to move aside, they are obsolete.
     
  8. Godless-Kafir

    Godless-Kafir DFI Buddha Senior Member

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    The US pulls back its ambassador for a single failure on deal, in Britian RR and BAE suspend sale to India, France is yet to Snub is us because we have not rejected the Rafael, Russia is like a leech and if you point that out they Snub you to. People here laugh at DRDO and talk of best friends i cant even begin to imagine the level of understanding some members have about foreign relations. This is like calling your car dealer your best friend, there is no problem in that but you sure do look stupid saying that.
     
    Last edited: May 30, 2011
  9. SHASH2K2

    SHASH2K2 New Member

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    I dont know why but I am not able to buy this argument that this excercise was cancelled as Russian forces are trying to streamline themself and are cutting excess fat . If that was the reason why didnt they pre informed the Indian armed forces . Letting warships to come and then informing them about it is really humiliating . Even if its unintentional its still shows how inefficient Russians are that they didnt realize they will land in such a situation.
     
  10. Kunal Biswas

    Kunal Biswas Member of the Year 2011 Moderator

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    Moscow cancels two military exercises with India

    Moscow cancels two military exercises with India

    Moscow cancels two military exercises with India : NATION: India Today





    Current upcoming exercises in Russia like "center" are occupying Russian mods attention at the moment.



     
  11. Godless-Kafir

    Godless-Kafir DFI Buddha Senior Member

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  12. A.V.

    A.V. New Member

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    Thread merged...............................
     
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  13. mayfair

    mayfair Elite Member Elite Member

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    Serves us right, as long as we remain dependent on others incapable of meeting the bulk of our own defence needs and developing a strong military industrial infrastructure we'll be treated like a syphilis infested lowlife time and time again.

    We invite this misery upon ourselves- be it US, UK, France, Russia, China and even Pakistan, sab ghante ki tarah bajaa kar chale jaate hain. The scary part is that out national establishment seem to look forward to it.
     
  14. Parthy

    Parthy Air Warrior Senior Member

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    I don't see this article anything related to MMRCA deal.. They're just revising their defense wing and into a Major reform of all 3 wings. They wanted their forces capable enough to perform and compete with with other countries forces.. Russian defense is being hard hit by corruption, rusted work engines which hits in procurement, war equipments delays..
     
  15. debasree

    debasree Regular Member

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    dont act like arrogant,russian weapons are not chosen simply as they r obsolete compare to rafel or typhoon,when it related to our countrymans hard working money,we have every right to choosy and going for the best ,if u want urs weapon in future buying list of our country,try to be the best in those sector.
     
  16. black eagle

    black eagle Senior Member Senior Member

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    It may not be related to the MMRCA at all. But the question is, what were they doing for all these months?!! An exercise takes months of planning before it can take place. Why didn't they let the Indians know before??!! Why the Indians were told about this development after the ships entered Russian Harbor??!! It can only be two things. Either it is a snub or it is plain incompetence on part of the Russians. I think its the former.
     
  17. pmaitra

    pmaitra Moderator Moderator

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    The European fighter planes were better than the American or Russian ones, at least as per technical evaluation by India and therefore, they were chosen. Neither US, nor Russia should take it as a snub, if the news articles are to be believed. They need to grow up.

    Fighter deals should be, and have rightfully been conducted, on technical basis and not on goodwill.

    This should also be an eye opener for Russia about maintaining professionalism in signing deals. Let them concentrate on Gorshkov first. We can take things one at a time.
     
  18. JBH22

    JBH22 Senior Member Senior Member

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    Damn man you sure lobby for your country
     
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  19. pmaitra

    pmaitra Moderator Moderator

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    You read my mind buddy! PRC is not the only country that is defended by online commentators and bloggers. :)


    We definitely want good relations, friendship, exchanges and ties with France, but not at the cost of Russia. That ain't happening.

    France should extend friendship unconditionally. If they say 'We will be your friend but you need to distance yourself from Russia', then we will have to politely reply in the negative.
     
    Last edited: May 30, 2011
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  20. LETHALFORCE

    LETHALFORCE Moderator Moderator

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    Russia does not need to sulk the PAKFA order we gave Russia is almost 3 times the amount of MRCA.
     
  21. Tolaha

    Tolaha Senior Member Senior Member

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    Russia is supplying jet engines and various weapon systems to China. US supplies military aircraft to Pakistan. India has been sulking all along due to these supplies. Its an oppurtunity for these 2 countries to get back at India by sulking at us!
     
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