Possible solutions for J&K issue?

[Navneet Kundu]

Creating this thread for some practical solutions for the J&K issue. Please desist from philosophical BS like 'we need to win the hearts of the people'. That time has gone; Let's talk about actionable strategies which could be undertaken in a timebound manner.

 

[Ancient Indian]

Scrapping article 370 is the first step.

Before that we need good GOI owned infrastructure in that state. It should cover all the strategic places int the state. And also we need good Indo-Pak relations, at least on paper.
More than that we need to spam that place with our people. And more than The valley need to be filled with shit load of Indian activities.

 

[Navneet Kundu]

Scrapping article 370 is the first step.

Before that we need good GOI owned infrastructure in that state. It should cover all the strategic places int the state. And also we need good Indo-Pak relations, at least on paper.
More than that we need to spam that place with our people. And more than The valley need to be filled with shit load of Indian activities.

How's this for a plan :

We resettle retired army people in Jammu inside dedicated retirement quarters based on a sprawling campus. When army starts buying large swathes in Jammu, the Jammu citizens, loaded with new cash could (should be encouraged) to move west into Kashmir valley and start buying new homes there. Property prices will go up, and cost of livelihood increases, the valley snakes will automatically migrate to other regions of mainland India, leaving Kashmir valley for pro-India folks. Once this is done, and it is amply evident that Jammu is amenable to be a part of India, do a sham plebiscite and abrogate 370 from Jammu and Ladakh region. Kashmir can be taken once the pro-India settlers become a majority there, but for now, we must take Jammu, it's long overdue.

One thing we have been doing wrong, which defies all logic is that we have given special status to J&K to remain a separate state. Anyone who understands status quos will realize that if it is more lucrative to remain a separate state then they have absolutely zero incentive to be a part of the union of India as that entails giving up all privileges. We need to reverse this trend if we want favorable outcomes. The status quo should be reversed such that being a part of the union of India is more lucrative and being a separate state means living in misery.

To this end, we should stop giving them all the material aid that we currently give, like subsidized food and fuel, medicines. At the same time, freshly unified state of Jammu must be given all the facilities so that when the chopped-dicks in the valley look at their own misery they realize that they will need to become a part of the union if they wish normal facilities, connectivity, schools, hospitals and jobs. This doesn't even require amending 370, this can be done by passing normal legislative laws in our parliament. The constitution also allows us to partition a state so taking of Jammu shouldn't be a problem.

These people have been sucking our blood in the name of 370. We can't take this any long, farmers in mainland India are dying and our tax money is being wasted in feeding snakes from Kashmir. We can harass them using normal legislation without even touching 370. I don't know why we don't do it. Impose an unofficial blockade on Kashmir like we did on Nepal. It needs to be made amply clear "If you need our resources then you need to be on good terms with us".

Once the valley snakes understand that the status quo has changed, the ball will be in their court. The same 370 which they used to blackmail us for so long will become a liability for them and they will have to get it abrogated themselves.

 

[anoop_mig25]

Remove population bomb that aera with diretiest bomb

then wait and let see which country claims that ist there aera

OK

Seriously there is no solutions.

Only solution is either of country beat hell out of each other and capture whole aera

For pakistan its just simpler they have to just recapture valley region

for rest i donot think they are really interested .

And if china gets involved then forget ladakh too

For India too complicated too capture whole of G&B now given terririan,current local population and highly militrialised area

that why babus of north-south blocks are parroting converting loc into IB as solutions

there is one famous BBC 7 series solution for j&k

 

[Ancient Indian]

How's this for a plan :

We resettle retired army people in Jammu inside dedicated retirement quarters based on a sprawling campus. When army starts buying large swathes in Jammu, the Jammu citizens, loaded with new cash could (should be encouraged) to move west into Kashmir valley and start buying new homes there. Property prices will go up, and cost of livelihood increases, the valley snakes will automatically migrate to other regions of mainland India, leaving Kashmir valley for pro-India folks. Once this is done, and it is amply evident that Jammu is amenable to be a part of India, do a sham plebiscite and abrogate 370 from Jammu and Ladakh region. Kashmir can be taken once the pro-India settlers become a majority there, but for now, we must take Jammu, it's long overdue.

One thing we have been doing wrong, which defies all logic is that we have given special status to J&K to remain a separate state. Anyone who understands status quos will realize that if it is more lucrative to remain a separate state then they have absolutely zero incentive to be a part of the union of India as that entails giving up all privileges. We need to reverse this trend if we want favorable outcomes. The status quo should be reversed such that being a part of the union of India is more lucrative and being a separate state means living in misery.

To this end, we should stop giving them all the material aid that we currently give, like subsidized food and fuel, medicines. At the same time, freshly unified state of Jammu must be given all the facilities so that when the chopped-dicks in the valley look at their own misery they realize that they will need to become a part of the union if they wish normal facilities, connectivity, schools, hospitals and jobs. This doesn't even require amending 370, this can be done by passing normal legislative laws in our parliament. The constitution also allows us to partition a state so taking of Jammu shouldn't be a problem.

These people have been sucking our blood in the name of 370. We can't take this any long, farmers in mainland India are dying and our tax money is being wasted in feeding snakes from Kashmir. We can harass them using normal legislation without even touching 370. I don't know why we don't do it. Impose an unofficial blockade on Kashmir like we did on Nepal. It needs to be made amply clear "If you need our resources then you need to be on good terms with us".

Once the valley snakes understand that the status quo has changed, the ball will be in their court. The same 370 which they used to blackmail us for so long will become a liability for them and they will have to get it abrogated themselves.

Don't feel bad if I say your plan sound like some ektha kapur dialy serial script.

Settling retired people there is like kicking people who had helped you.
These military people need some break. We can't use them as lambs.

We need more business activities controlled by vested interests in that valley with hand with GOI.
Money is the only thing that speaks in this world.
We need to see the state as asset which can generate some profit to GOI or vested Indian interest rather than playing some stupid people game.

 

[Navneet Kundu]

It's okay sir, I never feel bad, after all the forum is like a boxing ring where ideas fight with other ideas, may the best idea win.

The military retirement plan is actually being pursued right now, if I am not mistaken. I've heard several senior people mention it. I think central govt has also asked the J&K state government to allot land. I hope someone with more detailed knowledge sheds some light on it.

"We need more business activities controlled by vested interests in that valley with hand with GOI."

This is definitely a good thing to do. Hope we start seeing some concrete outcomes. This issue has been stagnant since 6 decades now. That is unacceptable.

 

[Navneet Kundu]

Seriously there is no solutions.

Only solution is either of country beat hell out of each other and capture whole aera

Should we, at least, not try to consolidate our hold on the portion which is on our side? Let's not bring BBC into this, Britain is the reason for that problem, they are not our well-wishers.

 

[Screambowl]

The solution is the instrument of accession. That's all. Those who do not accept it are occupying the land illegally. Neither they belong to the Kashmir demography. Hence the solution is Pakistan backing off due to destabilisation in their country.

 

[Ancient Indian]

It's okay sir, I never feel bad, after all the forum is like a boxing ring where ideas fight with other ideas, may the best idea win.

The military retirement plan is actually being pursued right now, if I am not mistaken. I've heard several senior people mention it. I think central govt has also asked the J&K state government to allot land. I hope someone with more detailed knowledge sheds some light on it.

"We need more business activities controlled by vested interests in that valley with hand with GOI."

This is definitely a good thing to do. Hope we start seeing some concrete outcomes. This issue has been stagnant since 6 decades now. That is unacceptable.

This kind of romance got us to this state of affairs.

Never involve common people in any of state agendas. It will destabilize the country in long term.
Only business and tourism is allowed for common citizens. They should live normal life.
Pursuing romance is the biggest weakness to a country. Loads of generation will lose peaceful life if the countries affairs are given to common people in all matters.

Look at the organizational failure i.e. our country. No coordination b/w any dept. All people fight among themselves even about smallest issue. Our forum is biggest proof of organizational failure.

 

[maomao]

Demographic superiority / repopulation or Hijra!

 

[Navneet Kundu]

Never involve common people in any of state agendas.

Disagree with you on that point. Sikkim was a success.

The solution is the instrument of accession. That's all. Those who do not accept it are occupying the land illegally. Neither they belong to the Kashmir demography. Hence the solution is Pakistan backing off due to destabilisation in their country.

On those lines, which, according to your opinion, will break off first? Baluchistan, Sindh or POK?

 

[Ancient Indian]

Disagree with you on that point. Sikkim was a success.



On those lines, which, according to your opinion, will break off first? Baluchistan, Sindh or POK?

Sikkim was never success. There are lot of vested interests running in NE states.
NE is lot more cluster fuk than pak issue. But they get less coverage.

 

[Screambowl]

Disagree with you on that point. Sikkim was a success.

On those lines, which, according to your opinion, will break off first? Baluchistan, Sindh or POK?

new development , it should be an eye opener to those who are not trying to create political rift and agitation to destabilize Pak.

Pakistan mulls elevating status of Gilgit-Baltistan on Chinese insistence

http://www.dawn.com/news/1231394/pa...tus-of-gilgit-baltistan-on-chinese-insistence

ISLAMABAD: Pakistan is mulling to elevate the constitutional status of northern Gilgit-Baltistan region in a bid to provide legal cover to the multi-billion-dollar Chinese investment plan, officials said on Thursday.

The move could signal a historic shift in the country's position on the future of the wider Kashmir region, observers have said.

The proposal would see the mountainous region mentioned by name for the first time in the country's Constitution, bringing it one step closer to being fully absorbed as an additional province.

Islamabad has historically insisted the parts of Kashmir it controls are semi-autonomous and has not formally integrated them into the country, in line with its position that a referendum should be carried out across the whole of the region.

Sajjad-ul-Haq, spokesman for the chief minister of Gilgit-Baltistan Hafiz Hafeez ur Rehman, told AFP: "A high level committee formed by the prime minister is working on the issue, you will hear good news soon."

Know more: ‘Almost’ Pakistan: Gilgit-Baltistan in a constitutional limbo

Rehman, who arrived in Islamabad on Thursday, was working on the finishing touches to the agreement, a senior official said, adding the document could be unveiled "in a few days".

In addition to being named in the Constitution, Gilgit-Baltistan would also send two lawmakers to sit in the federal parliament — though they would be given observer status only.

A third top government official from Gilgit-Baltistan said the move was in response to concerns raised by Beijing about the China Pakistan Economic Corridor, the $46 billion infrastructure plan set to link China's western city of Kashgar to the Pakistani port of Gwadar on the Arabian Sea.

"China cannot afford to invest billions of dollars on a road that passes through a disputed territory claimed both by India and Pakistan," the official, speaking on condition of anonymity, said.

The corridor plans have been strongly criticised by New Delhi, with India's Foreign Minister Sushma Swaraj in June calling the project "unacceptable" for crossing through Indian-claimed territory.

India and Pakistan have fought two full-scale wars over Kashmir, and any changes to the status quo could prove a further setback to hopes for dialogue that were revived after Modi made the historic Lahore visit.

Those efforts were already seen as fragile following a deadly attack on an Indian air base near the Pakistan border Saturday that was followed by a 25-hour siege on an Indian consulate in Afghanistan on Monday.

But according to Pakistani strategic analyst Ayesha Siddiqa, the move could also signal Islamabad's desire to end the Kashmir conflict by formally absorbing the territory it controls — and, by extension, recognising New Delhi's claims to parts of the region it controls, such as the Kashmir valley.

"If we begin to absorb it so can India. It legitimises their absorption of the Valley," she said.

 

[Ancient Indian]

Problem is Islam

Solution is also Islam

With 70% Muslim population we can expect at-least 80-90 terror acts/deaths per annum.
Hindu cowards have no guts to copy Israeli/jew settlements.So 80 deaths means ahhhhh just a routine number.

BTW try to minimize security force causalities and kill more Pigs(pbuh).

It is not the main cause.
Capitalism is main problem here. Islam is just scavenger who eats whatever left by Big Cats.

 

[Navneet Kundu]

new development , it should be an eye opener to those who are not trying to create political rift and agitation to destabilize Pak.

Do you remember that someone, *ahem, ahem* downed two Paki helicopters in 2015? one was carrying European parliamentarians and their wives on a scenic tour of POK. I am sure Europe got the message. There was also something known as Nanga Parvat massacre in 2013.

Link : https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2013_Nanga_Parbat_massacre

So it seems, someone, *ahem, ahem* is active in POK and doing all these nice things. Chinese engineers were also attacked while working on the CPEC highway. If people (China, Europe, USA) still don't get the message then I pity them.

Could it be possible that there was a deal between China and India that we would allow them to build CPEC in exchange China will throw their weight around in Pakistan and squeeze some concessions out of them? We need to have a detailed discussion on the CPEC on whether it really hampers India or whether it can be used as a pressure point to our advantage. Remember, if China reaches Gwadar port, it will basically put up its Navy there, it will choke US access to Indian ocean completely and also threaten Iran navy. The US and Iran are desperate to avoid this. To that end, we could ask for their commitment to break off Baluchistan as it is in their own interest. An independent Baluchistan looks more probable than ever.

 

[no smoking]

Do you remember that someone, *ahem, ahem* downed two Paki helicopters in 2015? one was carrying European parliamentarians and their wives on a scenic tour of POK. I am sure Europe got the message. There was also something known as Nanga Parvat massacre in 2013.

Link : https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2013_Nanga_Parbat_massacre

So it seems, someone, *ahem, ahem* is active in POK and doing all these nice things. Chinese engineers were also attacked while working on the CPEC highway. If people (China, Europe, USA) still don't get the message then I pity them.

Could it be possible that there was a deal between China and India that we would allow them to build CPEC in exchange China will throw their weight around in Pakistan and squeeze some concessions out of them?

This CPEC is the deal between Pakistan and China. Every projects related to this will be built within Pakistan and China with Chinese money and Chinese engineer, I don't how could India allow or reject them, unless these *ahem, ahem* is working under India's command.

We need to have a detailed discussion on the CPEC on whether it really hampers India or whether it can be used as a pressure point to our advantage.

Oh, yes, definitely. This an economic corridor, the Chinese products will flood through it to middle east. Do you know what that means? It will make those Arabian countries slide into Chinese economic circle potentially.

Remember, if China reaches Gwadar port, it will basically put up its Navy there, it will choke US access to Indian ocean completely and also threaten Iran navy. The US and Iran are desperate to avoid this. To that end, we could ask for their commitment to break off Baluchistan as it is in their own interest. An independent Baluchistan looks more probable than ever.

No one give a shit about the appearance of Chinese navy in India Ocean. Before they can dominate east Asian sea, the best they can in India Ocean is simply flag waving. Actually, US is welcoming Chinese boat in this area: every Chinese boat here means one less Chinese boat in East Asia.

 

[Ancient Indian]

Capitalism is the main problem in Muslim majority state Kashmir/Pakistan/Afghan/Gaza/Syria/Iraq/Burma and so on.

Problem was/is/will be Islam.Period

So you are saying that These have no capitalist threat.

They are all fuked up by Uncle Sam. West is hunting these places and Islam is scavenging the left overs.

 

[PredictablyMalicious]

Just keep pouring money into Kashmir valley and giving special perks to Kashmiri Muslims. Also, don't forget to favor Kashmiris over Jammuites and Ladakhis. Try your best to alienate pro-India folks and sleep with terrorists. The same policy that's continued since independence. Surely, it'll all work out, right?

 

[Ancient Indian]

Do you elaborate your own words of Capitalism/Islam is scavenging?

Gaza /Russia Dagesitan /Burma /Philippines /Thailand /India(kashmir) Muslims are majority in KAFIR lands and there is CIVIL-WARS.

Who started these wars?
Islam is always about fighting since their inception. What is new there?
West is using Islam for their own benefits. That is why it as on big screens.

You really think the world is la la land and Islam is ruining it?
Come on, fighting is common trait of man. Where ever he goes, violence goes with him.

Only people who are exceptional are Hindhus who are most peace loving people because of their culture and ethical values. The world is different from India. These people are fooling you from start about all human values and every crap.

 

[Ancient Indian]

Islam is always about fighting since their inception...... So we must allow/ignore it F* this logic.Islam is cancer must be eradicated and west is doing it.Karma.

btw don't ask how Islam be eradicated simple DIVIDE 4-8 Muzzie COUNTRIES ISLAM POWER WILL DIE completely.



Hindus are not exceptional we(hindus) fought them for 300-800 yrs.Khangress ruined it else we kicked them out of India.

When did I say we should ignore it?
We should treat them as we treat mafia and other crime organisation.

Islam will die when the oil dries up. Until then we have to deal with it.
Arabs have loads of money. They still have oil to sell. That is one heck of business setup. You can't do any thing until they run out of business.

Islam is cancer must be eradicated and west is doing it.

Islam is cancer because you are weak.
Get stronger, you will see how much cancer the Islam is.