What North Korea did to South

[Rage]

by whose criteria are those countries judged as bad or good? a rogue or angel?

if by Chinese standard N. Korea is a 'GOOD' ally.

Why? I'd like to defend our neighbor who has long been demonized -

1) economically N. Korea was once prosperous, far better than S. K.. but collapse of Eastern Bloc in 1980's wrote off its reserves in Rubbles and got rid of her vast foreign market. but even today NK's GDP is almost equivalent to Bangladesh while her population is only 20+M

2) N. K is rich in mineral resources which China needs. NK economy is complementary to China's

3) N.K. can offer China a gateway to Japan Sea which is just miles away from China's Northeast-most point.

4) NK is always strongly opposed to SK's military excercise on the disputed water on Yellow Sea. But SK insists on conducting it and shooting there. It was SK who fired first despite NK's warning. From China's point of view it's outrageous for SK to bring in the USN onto Yellow Sea which is close to China's heartland!

It's irrelevant to ideology etc. Even if China were a 'democracy', would have China been happy to see anybody showing muscle at her threshold in realpolitik??

I agree with everything you said. But what 'vast reserves' and 'large foreign market' are you talking about. You are aware that N. Korea's real capital a/c is severely inflated. Owing to the fact that their very system is a system of expenditure demonstration, not productive expenditure usage.

 

[ace009]

I am really surprised to hear some people defend NK here. Even if you are from China, you have to admit that NK is a socio-politically backward, militarily bullying country in the region. The so-called NK communist regime, is nothing but a monarchy of the Kim dynasty. They have one of the worst human rights records in the world, torturing, imprisoning and murdering people who do not agree with the regime. The regime holds its own population and SK population hostage against international pressure, while sealing up the country against any and all foreign contact (including Chinese). The only reason China defends NK is for strategic reasons - as long as NK is there, SK (and even Japan) will be busy with NK and to some extent overlook Chinese military buildup.

 

[redragon]

except for Pakistan and N korea how many allies do you have ? USA has a mixture of good bad and ugly allies but all china have is Ugly .

You are wrong, Pakistan is a good ally of the USA, you can check what President of USA have said on that

 

[SHASH2K2]

You are wrong, Pakistan is a good ally of the USA, you can check what President of USA have said on that

I would gladly accept that . That leaves only you and N Korea. almighty China is not able to find even 2 country as its ally ?

 

[redragon]

So you suggest we should continue supporting this so called "Ally", "Friend" North Korea till its final collapse. If so, good luck China, We are officially kidnapped! 1.3 billion People are hold hostage and will continue paying a decent price for dear leader Mr. Kim's family since 1950's.

Can't you see how eager China wants the N. Korean to reform and take the Chinese way to develope its economy??????
Can't you see how harder China has been trying to convince dear leader?????
You really think it's as simple as press an on and off button to achieve these and still keep China's interests in mind????
Please, Please really do some research about history about the real life

 

[Ray]

South Korea fired artillery near the waters that divide North and South Korea.

Given the psychotic attitude and paranoia that prevails in the North, the reaction is but natural, and to some extent, expected.

There was no reason for firing so close to the Korean waters, even if it was in the international area.

There is a school of thought that it was deliberate so that the US could move in some large ships/ flotilla in the area to show a 'threat in being'. It was more for China than North Korea since the US' recent moves in Asia, indicates that it is capitalising on the rancour caused by the Chinese claim over Japanese islands and China's gunboat diplomacy therein.

The moving of the US aircraft carrier for exercises with the South Korean Navy is to send a message to the fence sitting SE Asian countries that the US is a reliable friend and will come to their rescue. This is an important issue for the US since they haven't been very reliably friends in the past!

 

[redragon]

I would gladly accept that . That leaves only you and N Korea. almighty China is not able to find even 2 country as its ally ?

Seriously, that is what China will work on, but not now, when China becomes stronger, many will be allies proactivly. :happy_2:

 

[redragon]

OHimalaya I know a good canadian officer of Chinese origin ,Who says the Chinese prefer US bases in Korea and Japan because that is what preventing a war between korea and Japan

Yes, I know that guy too, his ID is some engineer expert, but he had way too many wrong comments or conclusions on Chinese military.

 

[SHASH2K2]

Seriously, that is what China will work on, but not now, when China becomes stronger, many will be allies proactivly. :happy_2:

The way china is foolishly supporting rogue regimes and America is coming openly in support of their allies thats a distant dream. I would suggest you to come out of your dream and think logically .

 

[tarunraju]

OHimalaya I know a good canadian officer of Chinese origin ,Who says the Chinese prefer US bases in Korea and Japan because that is what preventing a war between korea and Japan

US Bases in Korea and Japan are more of a deterrent for conflict between Japan and China (at least that was the original purpose of large-scale US military presence in Japan after WWII). The Empire of Japan committed many atrocities in China during the war, for which the average Chinaman wanted to kill every Japanese he could lay his hands on. In the decade following WWII, you had an extremely fragile Japan which was in tatters. China was also in tatters, but the PLA was in a much stronger position to wage limited war against Japan (limited, only because PLA's naval capabilities were very limited at the time). US military engagement increased in the region with the Korean war. So what US intends to achieve with its presence in Japan and S. Korea is:

• Deterring DPRK
• Protecting Japan and S. Korea against China

 

[civfanatic]

except for Pakistan and N korea how many allies do you have ? USA has a mixture of good bad and ugly allies but all china have is Ugly .

The ones I can think off the top of my head are Sudan, Zimbabwe, Burma, Bangladesh, and Sri Lanka.

If you notice, all these countries are in Top 20 failed states. It seems a criteria for becoming a Chinese ally is to first become a failed state....

 

[amoy]

Japan committed many atrocities in China during the war, for which the average Chinaman wanted to kill every Japanese he could lay his hands on

no, pls don't mix up history with reality. in fact we (me) don't have any ill feelings towards present-day Japanese. We have a bad taste in mouth only when Japanese politicians pay homage to war criminals in Yasuguni Shrine or ramming trawlers on waters off Diaoyu Island.

Don't forget Dr Sun Yat-Sen once exiled in Japan during his endeavour to overthrow Qing Dynasty. Chiang Kai-Shek studied in a Japanese Artillery School. And Lu Xun the greatest contemporary writer also studied in Japan. Japan was a lighthouse for China after Meiji Restoration.

Chinese were captivated by JP technology, and culture including icons like Ninja, Samurai, and Shudo, Karate and even pornography.

Once a foe, now Japan is a competitor, but at the time a partner for pragmatic and lenient Chinese. Korea, Japan and China (CJK) are in cultural affinity.

The ones I can think off the top of my head are Sudan, Zimbabwe, Burma, Bangladesh, and Sri Lanka.

ay? what has made them failing states? could u explain why there're 3 Burma, Bangladesh, and Sri Lanka out of them happening to be India's neighbors sharing her cultural heritage?? :happy_2:

 

[Tshering22]

You are wrong, Pakistan is a good ally of the USA, you can check what President of USA have said on that

Don't be so sure about what a puppet temporary government in Pakistan that is only a superficial government believe so. Check this link out; you will see something quite contrary.


http://www.***********/forums


Here Pakistanis worship Chinese as the only hope of the world while curse USA as if they are the scourge of this planet. Pakistan was US ally only till US agreed with its version of jihadi terrorism. The moment US termed that as wrong, they became "Zionist, evil India supporters". Trust me, its a pretty popular line on this forum that has more religion and prophecies on it than about weapons and foreign policies.

 

[redragon]

It does not matter how Pakistan feels about USA, what matter is how USA feels about Pakistan, I am sure USA likes Pakistan very much, it's giving F-16 to PAF, so Pakistan is a good ally, :happy_2:

 

[Tshering22]

ay? what has made them failing states? could u explain why there're 3 Burma, Bangladesh, and Sri Lanka out of them happening to be India's neighbors sharing her cultural heritage??

Burma has no anger or hate against us. They just are more closer to you due to your direct support to Junta. While we keep a neutral policy. In fact, Burmese army helped us capture many drug trafficking/terrorist outfits from northeast having bases in north Burma and our border. So we do have some sort of untold friendship with Burmese as well.

Bangladesh is a Islamic-wannabe country killing its Buddhist and Hindu population especially under the Jamaati/BNP Taliban party through its current ruling government is friendly to us as well and helped us numerous times. We share little in terms of culture with them being an Islamic wannabe country. Though if it retains its current government, we do have chances of warm but neutrally decent ties with us.

Sri Lanka is also neutrally positive to us. In recent years, former grudges have been forgotten and there's a good move for trade development. We don't mind the neutrally friendly approach of SL as long as it doesn't help an enemy out. Every country has the right to frame its foreign policy.

Just FYI:

Pakistan; I don't think I need to tell you about your biggest trusters as you can see clearly what they are and what they have become.

Nepal is an otherwise India friendly country barring the Communist/Maoist hatred towards India and warmth towards you. They are the closest to India culturally and religiously and we share a lot with them.

Bhutan Same as above; only difference being that it has always been our close friend and trusted regional neighbour.

Maldives is another friendly state for India and so is Mauritius.

Anything else?

 

[Yatharth Singh]

It does not matter how Pakistan feels about USA, what matter is how USA feels about Pakistan, I am sure USA likes Pakistan very much, it's giving F-16 to PAF, so Pakistan is a good ally, :happy_2:

US is the ally of all those nations who satifies its fate. Once Pakistan will stop supporting the US then you`ll see how "deep" ally will US become of Pakistan.

 

[Yusuf]

It does not matter how Pakistan feels about USA, what matter is how USA feels about Pakistan, I am sure USA likes Pakistan very much, it's giving F-16 to PAF, so Pakistan is a good ally, :happy_2:

The same "ally" stopped all supplies and slapped the Pressler amendment on it.. Its a matter of time when Pak will be back to where it was in the 90s.

 

[Tshering22]

^^ No it won't come back to 90s now. It has another wagon to jump into and for its existence as a country it won't mind even donating FATA to PRC for resources just like how it illegally gave our Shaksam Valley. Pakistan has no ethics. It exists without any conscience and hence we must understand and accept that it is a North Korea where even its people are like that of its tyrant mullas.

 

[civfanatic]

ay? what has made them failing states? could u explain why there're 3 Burma, Bangladesh, and Sri Lanka out of them happening to be India's neighbors sharing her cultural heritage?? :happy_2:

They are failed states because they are losing physical control over their own territory, are losing the legitimacy of their own government over their population, and they are increasingly unable to provide services to their citizens. So what if they are culturually similar to us? The Pakistani people have almost the same culture as us, but that doesn't prevent them from being No.9 failed state.

Here is a Top 20 list of failed states (2008):
1. Somalia
2. Sudan
3. Zimbabwe
4. Chad
5. Iraq
6. Democratic Republic of the Congo
7. Afghanistan
8. Côte d'Ivoire
9. Pakistan
10. Central African Republic
11. Guinea
12. Bangladesh
13. Burma
14. Haiti
15. North Korea
16. Ethiopia
17. Uganda
18. Lebanon
19. Nigeria
20. Sri Lanka

I bolded your so-called "allies" in case you couldn't find them

Long live Chinese diplomacy

 

[Yusuf]

SL is doing better now after the war. Bangladesh under the current dispensation is doing good as well. Its that Zia and her islamist goons who are a problem for them.