To solve Kashmir, see LoC as border: PM’s special envoy Lambah

Discussion in 'Defence & Strategic Issues' started by Vishwarupa, May 14, 2014.

  1. Vishwarupa

    Vishwarupa Senior Member Senior Member

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    Former diplomat and PM Manmohan Singh’s special envoy for Pakistan S K Lambah Tuesday said India and Pakistan will have to look for ideas that are “practical, workable and acceptable” to resolve the Kashmir issue and redrawing borders is not one of them.
    “In view of past history, emotions, disagreements, violence, wars and failure of negotiations, it is not easy to specify the outlines of a solution. However, as the past six decades have clearly shown, the Kashmir issue can’t be settled by war, force or violence,” Lambah said at a seminar organised by the Kashmir University’s Institute of Kashmir Studies. “A solution will also remain elusive, if we keep harping on positions that have failed to resolve the problem in the past.”
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    “After three wars and long periods of disagreements, it is essential that any agreement must ensure that the Line of Control is like a border between any two normal states. There can be no redrawal of borders,” he said. “That is why we have to look for ideas that are practical, workable and acceptable. We can also learn some useful lessons from the Shimla agreement and Lahore Declaration.”
    Rejecting the idea of redrawing borders, he advocated free movement and trade across the LoC, reduction of troops and self-governance for internal management on both sides of the LoC. Pushing for a solution to the Kashmir problem, Lambah said it would help India focus more on “rapidly emerging long-term geopolitical challenges”.
    “It is true that the Kashmir problem has not stopped India from forging its destiny as a secular, pluralist democracy and one of the world’s major economies and a military power. However, a solution of the Kashmir issue will substantially enhance India’s security, strengthen the prospects for durable peace and stability in the region and enable India to focus more on rapidly emerging long-term geopolitical challenges,” he said. “It will herald a new era of peace and prosperity for the entire region.”
    CM Omar Abdullah said Lambah’s position was a “marked departure from New Delhi’s stated position” on Kashmir. But he said the dialogue process between India and Pakistan would face a “challenge” if BJP’s Narendra Modi becomes PM.
    “We have seen a strengthening of back-channel dialogue process with the change of administration from Musharraf government to Nawaz Sharif government (sic),” he said. “Now the challenge for this process is what happens post May 16. Assuming the worst case scenario and you have a Narendra Modi-led government with an almost brutal majority of his own in parliament. To what extent does he convert his stated policy on Pakistan to his actual policy? Because, if his stated policy is going to be converted into official policy, then this dialogue process is going to die a very swift and very unlamented death….”


    To solve Kashmir, see LoC as border: PM’s special envoy Lambah | The Indian Express

    Firstly India need to kick this Abdullah family & Separatist families out of India....Why no one in UPA is a taking about taking back POK.
     
    Last edited: May 14, 2014
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  3. Ray

    Ray The Chairman Defence Professionals Moderator

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    Let terrorism stop and the terrorists and their organisations in Pakistan defanged.

    Then we can talk turkey.

    We cant dream of Gah without ensuring our own safety.

    Drakes Drum
    Slung atween the round shot, listenin' for the drum,
    An' dreamin' arl the time o' Plymouth Hoe.


    Slung between Sonia and Nawaz sharif Joe
    An; dreaming arl the time ó' Gah ho?


    Lambah is also a Punjabi refugee from Peshawar and so he sure would love to sell his soul without ironclad guarantees.

    One should not forget Pakistan and its chicanery that did the bus talks and stabbed simultaneously at Kargil!
    This is just another round like the Lahore Bus Talk.
     
    Last edited: May 14, 2014
  4. Neo

    Neo Senior Member Senior Member

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    Yes, terrorism should be eliminated from both sides and Kashmiris should be given the first choice to decide their fate.

    Btw, before Kargil there was Siachen.
     
  5. ladder

    ladder Senior Member Senior Member

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    There is no both sides as far as terrorism is concerned, keep harping on it and let half a century more to pass for all I care.
     
  6. Bhadra

    Bhadra Defence Professionals Defence Professionals Senior Member

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    Invalid, impractical and lose India propositions :

    “practical"

    Why is that solution practical when the LOC as existing today will continue to provide safe centuries to Jihadi terrorists for their infiltration into J&K all along and near the valley, Kargil, Punch and Rajouri ??

    Why is that solution practical when by accepting it India will be accepting a permanent threat to our Srinagar - Leh Road as in Kargil Pakistani positions are dangerously close to the road ??

    By accepting LoC as border do we accept permanent and with in very easy military reach and existing military threats to Jammu, Akhnoor, Rajouri, Punch, Srinagr, Kargil and Partapur ?

    By accepting LoC as border do we accept Pakistan ceding our territory of J&K to China ??

    Do we accept Chinese hegemony in Karkoram ??

    By accepting LoC as border do we legitimise Chinese presence in Northern Areas and their right to establish land link with Pakistan and their grand access to Gwadar port or Karachi ??

    By accepting LoC as permanent border do we forget about, Punchies, Sudans and sudatanese and Gujars across Punch who are in all sense Indians ?

    By accepting Loc as border do we forsake our claim that our natural neighbour is also Afghnistan and future possibility of establishing a land link with them after getting back our areas ??

    workable

    Is not the LoC workable ?? Are not we working on it for last 67 years ?? For what is the emergency to accept it as border ?

    Ok, after it becomes border :

    Wont there be infiltration ??

    Wont there be terrorism ??

    Wont there be firing on it ??

    Would India be able to reduce defence expenditure ??

    would there be reduction of forces ??

    Would Pakistan dismantle her nuclear weapons ?/

    acceptable



    Acceptable to whom ? India ?? May be yes because we have people like Malhotra, MMS and Gujral who can reach the post of Pm of the country ? But even if it is acceptable to Pakistan, it should never ever be acceptable to India.

    It is the Parliament of India which has passed resolution on getting back entire area of J&k back. So who is this Malhotra who like Raja Jaypal (another khatri like Malhotra) wants to gift Lahore to Subkugtin or Gazani or Ghori !! The slave Turkish adventures who happened to gain a country like Pakistanies !!


    past history, emotions, disagreements, violence, wars and failure of negotiations, it is not easy to specify the outlines of a solution.


    If Malhotras knows it then why is he doing it and what would be the advantes ??

    BY doing that will Pakistani proxy war come to an end ??

    Malhotra has high hopes unless he is in love of Indi's tormentors !!


    past six decades have clearly shown, the Kashmir issue can’t be settled by war, force or violence,”


    1948, 1965, 1971 1nd Kargil have aptly demonstrated that the enire J&K can be won back by India.

    So why is Malhotra in a hurry to hand over legally POK ?? India has wherwithall to take back POK by military means inspite of Nuclear threats !! If not develop it rather than surrendering even an inch of Indian land .

    So why this Jaipal and Prithviraj syndrome ??
     
    Last edited: May 14, 2014
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  7. Neo

    Neo Senior Member Senior Member

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    AFSPA is a licence to spead state sponsored terrorism and genocide of poor Kashmiris.
     
  8. ladder

    ladder Senior Member Senior Member

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    AFSPA's strongest detractors have termed it as 'Draconian' but non have termed it as 'terrorism' as you have originally mentioned.

    You want to write a new dictionary, including ASFSA as a terrorist act, you can go ahead. You might find a few 'strategic experts' from Pakistan and a few western apologists to co-author it. But, till then spare us the diktat of accepting your convoluted theory of 'terrorism from both sides'.

    As it stands today, terrorism is from only one side and no matter if you cry, weep or wail for half a century more, our iron grip on Kashmir isn't going to change. The earliest there is acceptance of that fact on your part and act accordingly, it will be the beginning of your first and last favor towards Kashmirs.
     
  9. Voldemort

    Voldemort Senior Member Senior Member

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    Pakistanis should not talk about 'state sponsored terrorism'. It dosnt suit you.
     
  10. Voldemort

    Voldemort Senior Member Senior Member

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    Nothing short of reunification of PoK or at least abolition of Article 370 is acceptable. Nehru is responsible for the Kashmir mess in the first place.
     
  11. rock127

    rock127 Maulana Rockullah Senior Member

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    The terrorism today originates from just one point and that's Pakistan the land of Terrorists.

    or you want to claim OBL was found in NY :lol:

    Because of Kashmir you lost Bangladesh and now in a civil war.... sudhar ja Paki or else you are going to disintegrate further and we would claim all of Pakistan on the basis of history. :lol:
     
    Last edited: May 14, 2014
  12. rock127

    rock127 Maulana Rockullah Senior Member

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    Before Pakistan there was INDIA your real Abba. :lol:

    We claim all of Pakistan and since you claim to be Arabian you can go to Arabian Land but Arabs wont accept you so you have to jump in Arabian Sea. :rofl:
     
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  13. Neo

    Neo Senior Member Senior Member

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    AFSPA is terrorising the entite nation.of Kashmir and HRW widely condemns it,
     
  14. Neo

    Neo Senior Member Senior Member

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  15. rock127

    rock127 Maulana Rockullah Senior Member

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    Pak Army is the real TERRORIST who shelters world Terrorists like OBL.

    Now prove OBL was not in Pakistan and he was living in White House. :lol:
     
  16. ladder

    ladder Senior Member Senior Member

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    Where does it mentions ( the link you provided) that it's 'state sponsored terrorism' as you suggested?

    It merely states 'abusive' while I have used stronger word 'Draconian'.

    If I say my little niece wakes up at night 'terrified' ( another synonym for terror/terrorizing) over nightmare, can her nightmare be termed 'terrorist'?

    Similarly, everything that terrorizes citizenry can't be said 'terrorist' activity but, whatever a terrorist does do certainly 'terrorize' citizenry.

    Being born and brought up in a western country, I find it hard that you would err in usage of word. And present such a meek response through a link that doesn't even reinforce your point of view even if read in between the lines.

    Give it a better shot, will you?
     
  17. Mad Indian

    Mad Indian Proud Bigot Veteran Member Senior Member

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    Kashmiris who have problem staying with India can freely emigrate to Al bakistan
     
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  18. Bhadra

    Bhadra Defence Professionals Defence Professionals Senior Member

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    Come back to the thread and do not derail it . AFSPA has nothing to do with LOC.

    When India takes back POK, AFSPA will also extend to those territories.....

    In India one requires law not like Pakistan where the Army and ISI pumps in bullets on a journalist...
     
  19. laughingbuddha

    laughingbuddha Regular Member

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    If Pakistan is so concerned about the freedom of the Kashmiris, let them give up POK.
     
  20. rock127

    rock127 Maulana Rockullah Senior Member

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    And any Pakis who have problem with India can go to Arabian land or jump in Arabian Sea.
     
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  21. Ray

    Ray The Chairman Defence Professionals Moderator

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    That is not really correct.

    Please understand that unlike Pakistan which uses Arty and air to take on its own people in Balochistan and NWFP, Indian Army doesn't. It is counter productive in any case as Pakistan should realise.

    It is those who are the liberal bleeding hearts and who wish to ape the west who make all this hue and cry over AFSPA.

    AFSPA only allow detention before handing over the terrorist to the Police.

    In Counter Insurgency it is essential to obtain realtime information since any delay in not knowing the terrorists' plans and how many have infiltrated and where they are, will only lead to a catastrophe and who shall suffer? The very Kashmiris you talk about leading to greater criticism of the SF.
     

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