Pakistan's desperation: Modi-led India rising evoke LoC attacks

Discussion in 'Foreign Relations' started by Kshatriya87, Oct 7, 2014.

  1. Kshatriya87

    Kshatriya87 Senior Member Senior Member

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    Pakistan's suicidal desperation: Modi-led India rising evoke LoC attacks - Firstpost

    It would be a mistake to simply dismiss Pakistan's 11th violation of ceasefire norms in October, which killed five civilians in villages close to the international border in Jammu, as just one of those things.

    The period before winter sets in, when infiltration into Kashmir becomes difficult, is normally the time Pakistan ups the ante as it tries to push more jihadis into the state.

    However, India should not see this purely in that light.

    The fact is the rise of Narendra Modi and India's growing prestige in global affairs is actually going to make Pakistan's behaviour worse than ever. Pakistan is not a rational state. Its purpose is not its own growth and rise, but the prevention of India's rise. Pakistan defines itself as "anti-India", an Islamic state fighting a "Hindu India" to the finish, by fair means or foul.

    Rational states know how to understand their own strengths and weaknesses and try and get the best deal with larger powers without sacrificing their own interests.

    Pakistan is not a rational state, it is a suicidal one: PTI
    Pakistan is not a rational state, it is a suicidal one: PTI

    But despite two indecisive wars (1948 and 1965) and two stinging defeats (in 1971 and 1999), Pakistan has, if anything, expanded its antagonism towards India. The only thing Pakistan has recalibrated after two defeats is how to wage war with India. It will use its nuclear umbrella to fight low-intensity jihadi warfare, including economic warfare, to damage and thwart India's economic and political rise.

    With Modi as Prime Minister, Pakistan will thus try more desperate things in future.

    Consider previous episodes of Pakistani daredevilry on Indian soil. Pakistan used the nuclear parity achieved in 1998 to internationalise Kashmir through Kargil. That, unfortunately recoiled on Pakistan as the world saw it, for the first time, as an irresponsible power. Then it sent jihadis to attack Parliament - if any top leaders had been killed in that attack, India might have gone to war in blind rage. But luckily that didn't happen.

    In 2008, as Pakistan was spiralling downwards, India was rising continuously, notching up year after year of rapid growth. India was about to leave Pakistan in the economic dust. This is why it attacked the symbols and citadels of India's economic rise - the Taj and Oberoi hotels.

    The intention was to damage investor and business confidence in India - as 9/11 did in America. Of course, routine circulation of fake currency goes on endlessly - both to finance jihad against India at the cost of printing currency and damage the credibility of India's money

    The best way to look at Pakistan's bad intentions towards India is through C Christine Fair's book, Fighting to the End: The Pakistani Army's Way of War. Fair is an expert in south Asian military and strategic issues, and she makes the following points about Pakistan.

    One, Pakistan is an ideological state, an Islamic state that puts its Islamism above commonsense strategic thought. This means even repeated failure to achieve its strategic goals with war or near-war does not deter it from pursuing suicidal policies. Jihadis are mere suicidal individuals. Pakistan is a suicidal state.

    Two, it is not just a joke that Pakistan is an army with a state - and not the other way around. The Pakistani army, despite allowing periodic reversions to weak democratic governments, has complete control over foreign affairs, defence and strategic decisions. When it comes to India, the army decides the policy not the government. And the army is in unremitting hostility to India. Defeat only leads to more desperate forms of aggression. The Pakistani army is thus little better than an ISIS - an ideological power with a state to provide it with the resources to endlessly prosecute its ideology. The existence of the state is merely a support for its ideology.

    Three, since the battle is ideological, it means even a deal on Kashmir will not solve anything. In fact, it will assure the Pakistani generals that their policies were right. Writes Fair: "Pakistan's antagonism with respect to india cannot be reduced to the bilateral dispute over Kashmir... Pakistan's defence literature clearly maintains that Pakistan's army also aims to resist India's position of regional dominance and its slow but steady global ascent."

    Further, she notes: "The likelihood that Pakistan's military or even civilian leadership will abandon the state's long-standing and expanding revisionist goals and prosecute a policy of normalisation with India is virtually nil."

    By revisionist, Fair means a state that is fundamentally dissatisfied with the status quo and will fight to the bitter end to achieve its goals, even if they are manifestly unachievable.

    In this way, as Fair points out, Pakistan is more like Nazi Germany or imperialist Japan, "both of which pursued their revisionism until they were destroyed." Unfortunately for India, the option of cutting down Pakistan cannot be dealt with this way, as it is a nuclear power - an irrational one at that.

    We need a more calibrated and fine-tuned strategy to thwart the designs of Pakistan. The only lever that may restrain Pakistan is China, but currently their strategic goals are congruous.

    Fourth, it is foolish to pretend that Pakistani civil society is fundamentally opposed to the army's ideology.

    Fair notes that "states like Pakistan vacillate between autocracy and weak democracy. Part of the Pakistani army's ability to defend its pre-eminent position stems from the success of its ideology, which permeates Pakistan's varied institutions and societal groups. Even during periods of (invariably weak) democracy, civilian leaders and citizens alike embrace the elite ideology of the military: its strategic culture."

    The rise of Modi, and the expected return of India to a higher growth path over the next few years will convince the Pakistani army (and state) further about the existential nature of its struggle with "Hindu India".

    The mere fact of India's rise - and not who rules India - makes the Pakistani army, which feeds itself on the weakening udders of the Pakistani state, see enough justification to cause mayhem in India. Pakistan can attack an India ruled by a weak Manmohan Singh as well as a stronger Modi.

    Modi and his National Security Adviser Ajit Doval should read Christine Fair's book on the Pakistani army's way of war and ready themselves for a regular and long-term onslaught on India, Indian politicians, the Indian economy and everything Indian.

    This is not a problem that can be sorted out in a year or two. The end will depend on two things happening: Pakistan ceases to be an ideological state, and the army loses its heroic status in that country and becomes subservient to civilian rule. It is not going to happen in this generation.

    We have to grit our collective teeth and be ready for repeated onslaughts.
     
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  3. Dhairya Yadav

    Dhairya Yadav Regular Member

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    Re: Pakistan's suicidal desperation: Modi-led India rising evoke LoC a

    To show Pakistan what India can do , India must start an economic assault on Pakistan. Completely bankrupt their economy beyond repair.
    The army goons already dont care about their spiraling economy, but without money, they wouldnt be able to maintain a force capable of fighting a conventional war.
    Their terrorism needs to be controlled by much stronger intelligence agencies. The only reason I dont advocate waging a full scale war against Pakistan is due to Nukes.
    They dont care if we kill millions of their people but they would be happy to see India suffer. They are a rogue state like North Korea, which will use nukes if given opportunity.
    However, if they perform another serious terrorist assault on India, burn that land of shit.
     
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  4. jus

    jus Senior Member Senior Member

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    Re: Pakistan's suicidal desperation: Modi-led India rising evoke LoC a

    :pop: Pork!s deserve this,i'm ready with my popcorn :pop:
     
  5. Ashutosh Lokhande

    Ashutosh Lokhande Senior Member Senior Member

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    Re: Pakistan's suicidal desperation: Modi-led India rising evoke LoC a

    @musalman what does pak media has to say about current situation at LOC? are you being told that india is continously breaking ceasefire to give cover for indian infiltrators into pakistan?
     
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  6. Kshatriya87

    Kshatriya87 Senior Member Senior Member

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    Re: Pakistan's suicidal desperation: Modi-led India rising evoke LoC a

    I completely agree with this. We must launch black ops regarding infusion of fake Pakistani currencies worth billions of Paki rupees. This will crumble their economy if successful.
     
  7. Kshatriya87

    Kshatriya87 Senior Member Senior Member

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    Re: Pakistan's suicidal desperation: Modi-led India rising evoke LoC a

    As a matter of fact, they are. Not only their media but even Pervez Musharraf commented yesterday that "India should stop ceasefire violations and test the patience of Pakistani Army". These were his words.
     
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  8. musalman

    musalman پاکستان زنده باد

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    Re: Pakistan's suicidal desperation: Modi-led India rising evoke LoC a

    Media only says that Indian forces have done indiscriminate firing on the civilian population of Azad Kashmir. Indian infiltration we all know is done on our western borders i.e. from your consulate in Kandhar :)
     
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  9. ladder

    ladder Senior Member Senior Member

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    Re: Pakistan's suicidal desperation: Modi-led India rising evoke LoC a

    Really, for sometime back ( probably during last cease fire violations) your media was saying that India was resorting to cease fire violation to enable infiltration of Baloch separatists. Well that made me think if there is a Silk route from LOC to Baluchistan that those rebels use to travel 1000 km. ( from eastern border to western border).
     
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  10. musalman

    musalman پاکستان زنده باد

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    Re: Pakistan's suicidal desperation: Modi-led India rising evoke LoC a

    Please quote which media channel?
     
  11. ladder

    ladder Senior Member Senior Member

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  12. Manas7

    Manas7 Regular Member

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    Pakistan's suicidal desperation

    Pakistan's suicidal desperation: Modi-led India rising evokes LoC attacks - Firstpost


     
    Last edited: Oct 7, 2014
  13. Blackwater

    Blackwater Veteran Member Veteran Member

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    Re: Pakistan's suicidal desperation: Modi-led India rising evoke LoC a



    Pakistan crying infront of UN observer group

    :laugh::laugh::laugh:


    RAWALPINDI: Pakistan has registered its protest with the United nation’s military observers group for India Pakistan (UNMOGIP) against India’s continuous firing at the Line of control (LoC).

    According to ISPR the military observer’s group would be visiting the effected areas.

    4 Pakistanis have been martyred in 2 days including a woman and 2 children on the Charwah sector in Sialkot due to firing by Indian troops.

    A resident was martyred and 2 women were injured today as Indian forces continued to use heavy artillery.

    Indian forces have also restored to unprovoked firing on the borders of Azad Kashmir where Pakistan forces replied appropriately.

    Concerns in this regard were initially raised by the foreign office and now Pakistan has registered a protest with the UNMOGIP.

    UN observer’s group to visit LoC | PAKISTAN - geo.tv
     
  14. Ashutosh Lokhande

    Ashutosh Lokhande Senior Member Senior Member

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    Re: Pakistan's suicidal desperation: Modi-led India rising evoke LoC a

    wtf man, ek toh chori upar se seena zori.

    ek bari final soulution nikalna chaiye pakistan ka.

    i feel we need to take around 25 km of pakistan and use it as buffer between them and our villages.
     
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  15. ladder

    ladder Senior Member Senior Member

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    Re: Pakistan's suicidal desperation: Modi-led India rising evoke LoC a

    Can anyone tell me what was UNMOGIP's stance on 1965 aggression by PAK, in 1965 Shimla Agreement wasn't signed.
     
  16. Blackwater

    Blackwater Veteran Member Veteran Member

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    Re: Pakistan's suicidal desperation: Modi-led India rising evoke LoC a

    beggers pakis knows they can not match india in conventional war and can not drag firing for so many days, so now ,they pissed in their pants and called for UN observer

    india should not stop . thokko pakistaniyo ko,


    lets halal pakis in this eid should be motto now
     
    Last edited: Oct 7, 2014
  17. maomao

    maomao Veteran Hunter of Maleecha Senior Member

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    Re: Pakistan's suicidal desperation: Modi-led India rising evoke LoC a

    Further disintegration of Pakistan is the only solution for Long Lasting World Peace!
     
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  18. Virendra

    Virendra Moderator Moderator

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    Re: Pakistan's suicidal desperation: Modi-led India rising evoke LoC a

    Threads have been merged. Please check for existing threads on a topic, before posting new ones.

    Regards,
    Virendra
     
  19. Kshatriya87

    Kshatriya87 Senior Member Senior Member

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    Re: Pakistan's suicidal desperation: Modi-led India rising evoke LoC a

    You are surprised with this? Check out the pakistan defence forum and see what all those people think there. Khud ke Baal noch lega :p
     
  20. Ashutosh Lokhande

    Ashutosh Lokhande Senior Member Senior Member

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    Re: Pakistan's suicidal desperation: Modi-led India rising evoke LoC a

    That forum is of the trolls,by the trolls and for the trolls :toilet:
     
  21. Mad Indian

    Mad Indian Proud Bigot Veteran Member Senior Member

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    Re: Pakistan's suicidal desperation: Modi-led India rising evoke LoC a

    So where are the bleed heart libtards now?
     

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